Yesterday I was shooting at an 8-point. I watched him coming from about 150 yards and pulled the trigger on him at about 50 yards. Nothing happened so I pulled my eye away from the scope to look at the safety. As soon as I noticed the safety was on "F" the gun went "bang." Naturally, I missed.

I dry-fired a couple of times and noticed a faint "click" and then a heavier "click." So I came home, disassembled the bolt, cleaned it, lubed it lightly, and reassembled it. The double "click" was gone. Today I fired it, and the first shot hit dead center at 50 yards, with no hesitation. So, I'm ready for tomorrow.

I was shooting handloads, and I've been a handloader for almost 50 years. I've had a few duds in the past (all from the same set of primers). I don't think this hang-fire was because of my handloads, although everything I look up on this subject tends to blame primers. I think it was because the firing pin just didn't release as normal.

What say you? Thanks.

Steve.

Sounds like the firing pin was gunked up, this can happen after years of no cleaning, oil can exacerbate the problem as it gathers dust and grit over time. If you use WD-40 you can just expect it as the stuff solidifies like varnish given enough time.

I expected to see rust, or caked-up gunk, but it was much cleaner than I expected. That's actually why I'm asking the question. Before I wiped what little gunk was on the pin I noticed a shiny spot on the side, so I'm guessing there was a little stress put on one side, maybe causing drag. Once the season is over I'll be paying a visit to my gunsmith. Seems to me it might be a good idea to polish the pin and the hole to prevent any drag and give you a slightly faster lock-time. But then, what do I know?

The only lube inside a bolt should be something that doesn't gel or dry out,, like break-free, and it doesn't need much. I'd recommend nothing on the spring.

Thanks.
Steve.

I was thinking the same as jnyork. Ever clean the bolt with a degreaser or take the bolt apart?

Similar happened to Austin last year because the bolt was gunked up with cosmoline. Combine that with cold weather = missed opportunity.

Guess you were writing as I was.

What primer?

I've had hang fires & misfires with Remington primers, so much that I won't use them. I've also had a couple of hang fires with CCI's, but it's been rare. The only one I've never had a hang or misfire with has been federal. Supposedly federal uses a more sensitive priming compound than the others, I don't know but I do know they've never not gone bang so I tend to use federals for hunting.

Here's the load:
Cartridge: 7mm-08
Case: Remington (deburred flash holes).
Primer: Winchester.
Powder: W760, 48.o grains.
Bullet: Hornady 139 grain SP

Steve.

That's a good load.
It does not take much oil/gunk in the firing pin to slow it down.
I would take it back apart and remove all the oil and run it dry.
The oil just claims lint and dust.

How cold was it?

Ball powders like 760 can be hard to ignite in colder weather, but I doubt it was THAT cold in PA yesterday, but then again, I haven't checked your weather reports, so I might be wrong.

A hang-fire or miss-fire can be caused by several things.

I have a like new 308 bolt action that had miss fires. The firing pin made light hits on the primer.

The brass was new WW handloaded with winchester WLR primers. The load is a normal one with Varget powder and 150 grain Bergers.

I made a no go headspace gage and it went in!

A no go gage is not supposed to chamber! "Excessive headspace"!

The rifle has been sent back to the manufacturer.

You say it's like new but how old is it? Grease can get gummy with age whether it's fired or not. The bolt might need a good cleaning.

Sounds like it was probably the powder that caused the "hang". I really doubt the primer is going to 'spark' after it has been struck if it doesn't go on impact. (I have seen quite a few powder hangfires, generally when a powder is either not well matched to the application, or the powder volume is less than ideal.) I have had sluggish firing pin failures, but never hangfires from that cause.

Was that a standard or magnum primer? I've used that same load quite a bit with CCI 200s, and it will work, but I trust it more with a magnum primer on board.

Call Sierra bullets some time and ask about some unbelievable long hang fires. Some were fifteen minutes when they were on a shelf. Now they lay them down so the primer can fly out instead of ignite the powder.

So cartridge on its side will allow primer when it goes off to pop out the back, and keep the brisance from igniting the powder against it?

Good guess, The rifles manufacturer asked me to clean out the bolt where the firing pin goes.

The bolt and firing pin were both clean and free of anything that might restrict the pins fall.

The rifle is on its way to them.

Not cold. Not sure exactly, but it was above freezing, prolly mid to high 30s.

Colder yesterday when I test-fired it. About 30 degrees.

Steve.

It was a standard primer. I prolly ought to test magnum primers.

My opinion so far is that the firing pin hung up. Dropping the pin on an empty chamber I could hear two distinct "clicks." First a faint one, then a more distinct one.

Steve.

"My opinion so far is that the firing pin hung up. Dropping the pin on an empty chamber I could hear two distinct "clicks." First a faint one, then a more distinct one."

I agree.. Sounds like first the sear/ striker spring tripped then the striker hit at it's forward point. The shiny spot would induce me to think there was a bit of grit or contact in there - maybe a metal shaving or sand grain, kink in the spring, slightly bent striker shaft or a rough spot. Or some sticky gunk as mentioned by others. If the spring is a bit weak, it doesn't take much.

If your cleaning seemed to solve the problem, it was the latter, maybe with some help from others.

I use only dry to touch lubes (Eezox or Corrosion X) for these applications, extra strength springs, and never ever store the rifle cocked - always with the striker spring tension relieved by dry fire.

I may have had a similar problem(s) somewhere in the past......

Moisture frozen in there can do the same thing, but you said it was above freezing.

Good advice, I've always felt better using mag primers with ball powder in cooler temps.

Is it possible that the powder next to the primer was somehow contaminated by moisture or chemicals to cause a slow burn until the "fire" hit good powder?

It sounds like you had only the one cartridge hang fire? Did you test fire any other rounds after the hang fire?

Just curious, as I once had a situation with a misfire - primer dented, but didn't go off the first round, while subsequent rounds did. This occurred twice after a period of several days or longer storage. In that case it was a combination of weak spring and gummy gunk on a rather rough striker shaft. I initially and wrongly blamed moisture in the bolt in cold weather, and/or faulty ammo.

Polished the shaft smooth and fixed the other two, and all is good!

I’ve had hang fires and delayed ignition a few times. Needless pulling the trigger, hearing the click and thousand one, thousand two… bang is un-nerving.

Assuming the fire pin strike was not retarded, some powders are harder to ignite and more so at lower temps. It doesn’t have to be super cold, I’ve had loads that worked well in the 60’s give me a click, pause, bang in the 40’s.

Happened to me many years ago . I was with some friends at a Shooting Range testing some Reloads in a large Case . Seems it was about 30 Degrees . I don't remember any double click , but I got several hang-fires in a row . One of my friends switched Primers and Reloaded some of my empty Cases with my Powder and no more problems . It was long ago and I can't be sure but I think I was using CCI BR Primers and switched to his Remingtons.

Yes. I tested it and the primer leaves so fast there is not enough flame at the flash hole to ignite the powder.

I've had hang fires with both of those. I use Federal 215 for almost anything now.

HOW did you test it, Rich?

Took the gun to my gunsmith yesterday and he immediately suspected the trigger. He took it apart and it had lube in it -- thick, waxy stuff that slowed everything down. He removed it, cleaned it, put it back in, and everything is perfect now. Just got back from shooting it and even after having it out of the stock it never changed zero.

I never lube my trigger. The only thing I can think of is that some Hoppes or something ran down into the trigger. But even that seems odd because I store my rifles upside down. I hang the trigger guard on wooden peg in the wall, and rest the barrel on another peg. They're at an angle with the barrel downward.

Anyway, problem solved. Thanks for all your input.

Steve.

He mentioned it was a Winchester primer. The WLR is pretty strong among standard primers.

The mechanical issue made this moot anyway.

Guess you could call this a tale of two rifles, but actually three. Two rifles chambered to the 7x57 with test loads using Re17 and WLR primers. The third rifle a .280 Rem. using IMR7828SSC and WLR primer. Bullet for all three rifles was the Nosler 150 gr. ABLR. In three days testing there were two failures to fire from the .280. The rifle is a 1909 Mauser and firing pin fall makes a very solid thump. In both failures, the rounds fired on a second try.
With the two 7x57s, One an FN Mauser, the other a Winchester M70 Featherweight, one failure with the Mauser and three with the Winchester. The failure with the Mauser did not fire after three tries. Two on the Winchester failed to fire after three tries and one did go bang.
Groups from the rounds that did shoot were slightly erratic, usually two close together and one way out. No specific pattern as the which one was the one out of the group.
Primers were stored indoors in the house, not my reloading shed.
About the only good thing was after the FTF, the crosshairs were still where I was holding which eliminated me flinching.
What I did note was the firing pin fall from the Mausers were a good solid clunk while the M70 sounded quite light yet the primer indents from the M70 looked just as deep as those from the Mausers. Primers were seated with Lee hand priming tool.
I've never had those primers fail before and have used them in cold weather on elk hunts in Northeastern New Mexico without problem With loads using Re15 and W760. Temps running around 25 degrees during most hunts. Brass was brand new unfired.
Paul B.

I don't particularly care for WLR primers after a go-round with them in my Garand. They kept popping at the radius and didn't do my bolt-face any good.





That's a load only running 42 Kpsi, I wouldn't want to light up a 58.5 Kpsi load and admire the divot.

Yep, there have been a few leaky lots of WLR's out there.

The unplated WLR & WLRM primers I have are undersize on their diameter.

When WW left off the plating they forgot to allow for the diameter that plating gives metal.

They fit loose in good new pockets.

Good question, how would you test that?

I know they make kind of a pistol type thing to watch how they work as far as the flame goes, but not sure how to test a live round?