Seriously? A guy was saying the nitrogen helps keep the tires from getting flat spots after sitting. I have heard people carry a nitro tank in the rough country to pump up a tire in a pinch, but to do this on a regular basis?
What N2 does is not vary by temperature as much due to being an inert gas. It doesn't do any other magic besides that really. I use N2 in my fast cars just because I have a bottle. I carry a nice ViAir compressor for the FJ 4x4 type stuff. What the off road guys use a lot is CO2 because it has more volume for the tank size.
Lots of reading to do on the FJ Cruiser Forum on airing up after rock crawling if you are really interested. The Jeep Forums and Pirate too have a lot of threads.
The air I breathe is around 76% nitrogen--I always thought this was a tire store gimmick.
Foolish, pure marketing foo foo to get into your wallet. What kkahmann said.
We used to use propane to air up tire on construction jobs
I never noticed any "out of round" going on since nylon belted tires were gone.
They already have nitrogen in them.
I never noticed any "out of round" going on since nylon belted tires were gone.
^^^THIS^^^
Flat spots happened on Bias Ply tires during cold weather. Once the tire heated up, the "thump..thump" would go away. It's a structural issue with the use of nylon cord apposed to steel belts as in radial tires. Radial tires don't do that and even if they did, nitrogen isn't going to make any difference. I believe that they use nitrogen because it doesn't expand or create "build up", as known in the NASCAR world. This is why it's illegal in NASCAR. They want them to have to play the tire pressure game. As the air heats up it expands and increases tire pressure mainly due to humidity. For your average passenger vehicle or pick up truck, 2 to 5 lb. difference in operating pressure ain't gonna make a hill of beans unless you're planning on driving 200 MPH into a left hand turn. It's a total gimmick.
For the average driver, N2 has no advantage and its highly unlikely that you'll ever notice a difference. It can cost quite a bit to switch because the tire will have to be purged a couple times to remove the O2. It's necessary to get the N2 up to about 95% to be effective.
If a tire sets a long time, it will lose less pressure with N2. The molecules are larger than air so they're slower to seep through microscopic holes.
If you really want N2, I've read a number of times that Costco tire shops will switch it for free if you're a member. I've never checked to see, though.
Money making gimmick for car dealers and tire shops.
For the average driver, N2 has no advantage and its highly unlikely that you'll ever notice a difference. It can cost quite a bit to switch because the tire will have to be purged a couple times to remove the O2. It's necessary to get the N2 up to about 95% to be effective.
If a tire sets a long time, it will lose less pressure with N2. The molecules are larger than air so they're slower to seep through microscopic holes.
If you really want N2, I've read a number of times that Costco tire shops will switch it for free if you're a member. I've never checked to see, though.
You got me curious. How much bigger is N2 than a molecule of air? This oughta be good!
N2 has a smaller molecular weight than O2 so I assume, with a higher concentration of N2, the overall weight of the tire would be less and the rotating inertia would be less. Maybe they claim better gas mileage. As far as the molecular size, the difference between the two molecules is so small that the leak in the tire would almost have to be nearly an exact size to make any difference imo.
For the average driver, N2 has no advantage and its highly unlikely that you'll ever notice a difference. It can cost quite a bit to switch because the tire will have to be purged a couple times to remove the O2. It's necessary to get the N2 up to about 95% to be effective.
If a tire sets a long time, it will lose less pressure with N2. The molecules are larger than air so they're slower to seep through microscopic holes.
If you really want N2, I've read a number of times that Costco tire shops will switch it for free if you're a member. I've never checked to see, though.
You got me curious. How much bigger is N2 than a molecule of air? This oughta be good!
An O atom has 8 protons while N has 7. The pull of the + charge with the extra proton will pull the electron cloud in closer. That's what the scientists say, anyway. I've never put a a mic on them to verify it.
When I bought my last set of tires for my Ram 2500, I did so at Costco. They filled them with nitrogen which they do as a standard, no charge practice. The only practical advantage is that in really cold weather, you don't loose as much air pressure. Pretty important when carrying a truck camper and towing a Jeep in below zero weather. There is also the fact that nitrogen doesn't oxidize nearly as readily as oxygen. For whatever that might be worth.
I no longer hunt places with really cold temperatures so I don't concern myself with this. E
Nitrogen is dry compared to compressed air. Moist air expands and contracts more than dry air.
I guess I have a lot more important things to fine tune in my life before I worry about replacing the 80% nitrogen air in my tires with 100% nitrogen air.
I do the Nitrogen thing on my bike but not on my truck
When I bought my tires at Cost Co they filled them with nitrogen. If I heard right, I can not just top them off myself, I have to take them back (45 minutes away) to cost Co to get them topped with nitrogen.
Does that sound right? I don't know what it would hurt to mix regular air from my pump and the nitrogen in the tire.
When I bought my tires at Cost Co they filled them with nitrogen. If I heard right, I can not just top them off myself, I have to take them back (45 minutes away) to cost Co to get them topped with nitrogen.
Does that sound right? I don't know what it would hurt to mix regular air from my pump and the nitrogen in the tire.
If you want to maintain them like Costco did them with the N2, you have to add more N2, either from Costco another tire shop that has it. Mixing N2 with air doesn't hurt anything. It just doesn't leave you with an N2 filled tire any more. To get back to the N, you'd have to purge the tire and start over.
I have N2 tanks at home. Costs about the same to fill them up as CO2 or whatever. I used them when I service accumulators and landing gear struts. It is moisture free and less sensitive to heat. A lot of people use it in their airplane tires. It doesn't hurt a thing but it is amazing when you ask a salesman about "Nitro fill" they have some pretty outrageous claims.
I know some of the PCP air rifle competitors run Helium in their rifles because it expands quicker than compressed air or even N2. Have you priced Helium lately??
N2 doesn't have any downside except it is expensive compared to compressed air and inconvenient for most folks. It's easy for me as I always have a cylinder or two on hand.
That's from Australia, though. South of the equator, the molecule size difference between N2 and air is reversed.
I use a special mixture that is 78% N2. I have a patent on it, but for a small fee I will PM the method - no paypal.
When I bought my last set of tires for my Ram 2500, I did so at Costco. They filled them with nitrogen which they do as a standard, no charge practice. The only practical advantage is that in really cold weather, you don't loose as much air pressure. Pretty important when carrying a truck camper and towing a Jeep in below zero weather. There is also the fact that nitrogen doesn't oxidize nearly as readily as oxygen. For whatever that might be worth.
I no longer hunt places with really cold temperatures so I don't concern myself with this. E
Tires lose about 1 psi for every 10* temperature drop.
I just pop a gauge on the tires about once per month.
Right after changing my valve cover gaskets.
A molecule of air? Seriously?
I have used r-22 to inflate a flat.
But, it was taken, immediately to a tire shop for repair.
Nitrogen in tires, by a tire shop, is, imo , a scam
They charge for N2O
I think bicycle racers have used helium. Had one neighbor who got a new car with nitrogen, it still leaked and he had to drive way back to the dealer to get it filled. One trip costs more than the savings in mpg.
A run flat tire would be worth more to me.
They tried to sell me nitrogen when I bought my 2011 Z-71.
Crazy. I declined.
DF
My wife's Porsche came with nitrogen. When I replaced the tires the local shop filled them with nitrogen at no cost. They also add when needed at no cost.
I used them when I service accumulators and landing gear struts. It is moisture free and less sensitive to heat. A lot of people use it in their airplane tires.
I fly for a living and the tires in every jet I've ever flown have always been nitrogen filled. An airplane tire can go from 150+ degrees F to -50 in the course of a flight so the nitrogen keeps the pressure swings lower than regular air would.
In a car tire it's just a scam to make money, there's no other reason for it.
I just pop a gauge on the tires about once per month.
Right after changing my valve cover gaskets.
You drive 50K a month? HFS...
They tried to sell me nitrogen when I bought my 2011 Z-71.
Crazy. I declined.
DF
I just pop a gauge on the tires about once per month.
Right after changing my valve cover gaskets.
You drive 50K a month? HFS...
What N2 does is not vary by temperature as much due to being an inert gas. It doesn't do any other magic besides that really. I use N2 in my fast cars just because I have a bottle. I carry a nice ViAir compressor for the FJ 4x4 type stuff. What the off road guys use a lot is CO2 because it has more volume for the tank size.
Lots of reading to do on the FJ Cruiser Forum on airing up after rock crawling if you are really interested. The Jeep Forums and Pirate too have a lot of threads.
Totally false.
Avogadro's Hypothesis
Avogadro's hypothesis states that two samples of gas of equal volume, at the same temperature and pressure, contain the same number of molecules. Avogadro's hypothesis allows chemists to predict the behavior of ideal gasses. Amedeo Avogadro made the hypothesis in 1811 in an essay submitted to Journal de Physique. Elaborating on this hypothesis, he asserted the volume of a gas is not dependent on the size or mass of the molecules of the gas. Avogadro's hypothesis was applied in Avogadro's law to show that the volume of a gas (V) is equal to a constant (k) times the number of moles of gas (n), or V=kn.
Or perhaps more simply,
What is the Avogadro's law?
Avogadro's law (sometimes referred to as Avogadro's hypothesis or Avogadro's principle) is an experimental gas law relating volume of a gas to the amount of substance of gas present. ... Avogadro's law states that, "equal volumes of all gases, at the same temperature and pressure, have the same number of molecules".
When I bought my last set of tires for my Ram 2500, I did so at Costco. They filled them with nitrogen which they do as a standard, no charge practice. The only practical advantage is that in really cold weather, you don't loose as much air pressure. Pretty important when carrying a truck camper and towing a Jeep in below zero weather. There is also the fact that nitrogen doesn't oxidize nearly as readily as oxygen. For whatever that might be worth.
I no longer hunt places with really cold temperatures so I don't concern myself with this. E
Quite possible. Your tires might last a few weeks longer with no Oxygen inside.
Nitrogen is dry compared to compressed air. Moist air expands and contracts more than dry air.
Absolutely. A tire filled with pure water vapor would not stay inflated very long. Hopefully the tire store has an inline dryer on their air compressor.
I never noticed any "out of round" going on since nylon belted tires were gone.
come spend a winter in Fairbanks
take off in the a.m. at -40 clunk, clunk,clunk
until that air gets warmed up or the pressure from rolling makes the tire round on all sides again.
Higher end race cars (Indy Cars/F1) commonly use nitrogen as it doesn't heat up during a race. The heating causes a pressure increase that affects the desired contact patch and therefore the handling of the car. We tried it on lower end race cars (Formula Fords, Sports 2000) and couldn't tell much difference and it was a pain to have multiple purgings of our tires to make it really work.
Higher end race cars (Indy Cars/F1) commonly use nitrogen as it doesn't heat up during a race. The heating causes a pressure increase that affects the desired contact patch and therefore the handling of the car. We tried it on lower end race cars (Formula Fords, Sports 2000) and couldn't tell much difference and it was a pain to have multiple purgings of our tires to make it really work.
Once again, a myth.
You can fill the tire with Helium, Hydrogen, Argon, Nitrogen, Oxygen, Carbon Dioxide, Nitrous Oxide, Methane, Propane, or any other gas. Unlike solids and liquids, gases all expand identically with change in temperature. And whatever the gas is, it will assume the same temperature as the tire it is contained within.
Sorry folks, this is basic High School Chemistry.
PV=nRT
N2 is "inert" because it does not react chemically.
Nitrogen has become old hat - helium is the new rage, especially for the expensive sports car folks. Reduces unsprung weight.
I use a special mixture that is 78% N2. I have a patent on it, but for a small fee I will PM the method - no paypal.
Wow. No takers?
The air I breathe is around 76% nitrogen--I always thought this was a tire store gimmick.
IMHO, you thought right..
N will do what they say but not to the extent advertised. The difference is so minimal that it's of no practical value to the average driver. It's an expense you can't recover. While some tire shops add N for 'free', they recover it by increasing the price of the tires. Nothing is free in the business world.
Nitrogen is dry compared to compressed air. Moist air expands and contracts more than dry air.
We have a winner!
"Absolutely. A tire filled with pure water vapor would not stay inflated very long. Hopefully the tire store has an inline dryer on their air compressor."
I don't know if Discount Tire has an air dryer on their compressor or not (I assume they do) but the only time they fill my tires up with air is when I buy new tires or have them fix a flat. The compressor I use at home to air my tires up doesn't have a dryer on it. About the only advantage I see for using nitrogen in your everyday vehicle tires or trailer tires is it might help prevent steel wheels from rusting.