Since the 17th, FIL 81yrs old.
Only thing I can say if any of ya have family members
In really bad declining health
A living will made up with that family members actual
desires of a DNR or life is a must....
Don't leave decisions to family with torn emotions
Or the chance of guilt about a DNR decision up to them.
My FIL ever gets back to coherent semi independent mind and physical
abilities, a living will is gonna get put In place by him, per me and I don't care if I have to pay for the legal visit and what it takes. He needs to take this off my wife and SIL shoulders when I can lay out what has transpired to him.
He knows I will be totally honest and blunt with him. Always have been with each other.
Modern medicine can sometimes go way to far. JMO.

Living will with DNR intent or life saving measures is a must...

Absolutely!

Not just a DNR, but spend the bucks to have a Medical power of Attorney drawn up and get a Will done!

Leaving this stuff for our family to untangle is not the right thing to do. The consequences are not good.

Ed

Very much a must!

Sound advice. Tough times ahead, stay strong and lean on each other.
Miss my Dad every day...

The will is done , but it is vague as heck, the med power of attorney is gonna be addressed also along with his generic will,
down the line if his mental abilities become clear.
My Wife and her sister don't have the candor or heart to approach this with their dad for obvious emotional reasons.
I been thru it before with my family. Someone has to always have the spine and honest
approach to stuff like this in everyone's families.
I'm sure many of you all have had to be that person also.

Just finished our trust several weeks ago. There are DNR instructions.

We got it done several years ago.

Wife and I did a package of trust and such powers/instructions about 10 years ago. It felt good at the time, but felt far, far better at a time when the light went out for a spell and the aftermath was grim. Well worth the time and temporary hassle to get it done.

smother the old bastage and be done with it

next question

this is a very tough subject, and fraught with emotion as you suggest.

the law encourages us to euthanize pets who have gone the distance.

not so with humans. we don't see ourselves and loved ones as beloved animals.

it's so tricky that people will take sides, and shake pointy sticks at each other across the room.

i don't know the answer. but, to take all precautionary steps can't hurt. what we've got now is a developing national debate about what to do with the baby boomers.

An excellent book that deals with the issue of healthcare and assisted living is Being Mortal by Atul Gawande.

Gus in your cryptic way , you hit the nail square on the head.

We are 53. We did the will, power of attorney, medical power of attorney, medical advanced directives. And just recently put down that we want to be cremated and how to procede with all that.

Mom has had hers in effect a while, but not nearly at that young of an age. And she was just telling me her final wishes Tuesday as we went in to try to correct her new to her Afib.

These things are all good.

And as a first responder if you are at the point in life where you have and will use a DNR, PLEASE have it right there wherever you are, not in a safe or safety deposit box somwhere... we ran one the other day, I have it filed at the hospital. Well you are not at the hospital.....it doesn't count if I can't see it.

The issue is many people ignore the fact the are mortal and don't want to address the realty that one day will be their last day. It's not just the person that is facing their end, but family members that don't want to acknowledge their mortality.

It has nothing to do with whether one wants to face a "natural death" one wants extraordinary medical intervention to provide a few more days, weeks or months of life, or if someone wants to avoid suffering and take the big sleep.

Let me throw out an idea to y'all. First off, I'm all for DNR, living will, and all that. I've got one. My parents had theirs done up before I turned 21. My grandparents did as well.

Some things I'd like to float your way:

1) If you have an organ donor card or something like that in your possession, you might want to rip it up. Organ donors have about a 300% higher mortality if they show up an emergency room with head injuries. What I've done is let KYHillChick and the rest of my family know that I don't care what happens to my mortal remains after I've left them. I just don't want to be harvested, just because there's a donor that matches my type. I used to do freelance reporting. I've hung out in emergency rooms. I used to work for a company that sold computer hardware to the local organ bank. I carried a donor card from the age of 19 until I was in my 30's. I tore mine up.

2) I don't want a feeding tube, but I've asked for an IV if needed. With both of them, they can't be withdrawn once used, but here's the hitch. If I am lacking for sustenance, I've got at most about 3 weeks before I pass on. With water and fluids withdrawn, it's more like 72 hours. If I starve to death, I won't know it. I'll be off in some other place long before I hit ambient temperature. With fluid, it's a whole other thing. That last 72 hours is agony if you're aware of the dehydration. Now, I'm not saying everyone who has fluids withheld dies in agony. I'm sure most are in a coma and don't know what's coming. However, let's just say that I am cognizant. Now what? It'd be worse than trying to bang on the coffin lid from the inside.

3) If you donate your body to science, your family can elect to get the ashes back after everything has been done to it. It'll take a while to percolate through the system, but you can opt for them back. Meanwhile, you can save a ton on funeral costs. If you're looking for the cheap way out, this is it. Spend the money you save on a party for your friends, or set up a trust to have someone pee on your ex-wife's grave on a regular basis. I've stipulated that I want my remains used for rude practical jokes by first year med students.

yes, and we've had the discussion in the past here on the 'fire. it's only human to want one's dad, mom, spouse, or other loved one to live on. and if the doctors can get the meds just right, maybe they can. the end of days stuff is tough stuff, even on a good day.

not only do we have a mortal being in need of care, but we're enmeshed in a whole hierarchy of medical & legal jardon that can leave one feeling quite beleaguered in trying to figure out what to do next. meanwhile, the bills keep piling up. there's no simple fix, short of falling over dead from a heart attack while out bushhogging the back forty. and now there's a whole generation of people facing one side of the equation or the other.

rost - do you recommend putting a pic on your cell phone, or what?

I don't think I can accept picture of on the phone, I'll have to ask again, but as I recall it if you can't produce a paper copy signed etc... we have to do CPR.

That sucks if there is a DNR.

CPR is invasive so to speak.

I'm only volunteer, not full time, so I'll see if I can get an answer at some point, or others that know more may comment here.

I don't mind CPR at all, but only if it fits the situation.

?????

You claim not to care about your mortal remains, but yet you would deny their use in saving potentially 7-10 other peoples' lives?

Which is perfectly and freely your choice, but please do not come on here and encourage others to NOT donate. That's just f u cked up.

Be sure to have the paper that prevents them from putting a tube for breathing.

Found out that you need one of those as well as a DNR.

The other is called a dni.

The brother in laws wife had a dnr but while flying on the chopper they started a breathing tube.

She was not right after she got out and lived a few months,because most of her organs were without oxygen for to long.

Whatever you do...if you have a DNR (do not resuscitate) order....have it available at ALL times! My guys just went thru a very ugly experience where the son and wife couldn't provide a DNR for the husband/father who was in full cardiac arrest. We cannot abstain from CPR and life saving attempts in our State when called for assistance, unless we see the DNR.

Wife signed a DNR when she had a heart transplant. Her heart stopped for 30 minutes before they got it going again. What a fu-- up. In a comma for 13 months before she passed away. Tell what good is a DNR.

Sorry for your troubles, I wish you the best of luck.

Trying to do the right things currently and get the right things in place hopefully.

If I carried all the cards, and paper work to suit everybody - I'd need a Kenworth!
There's got to be a better way!

50 miles from the house - SOMETHING's gonna be missing!

C'mon peeps, it ain't that hard.

Jeebuz, that might be Safariman!

Or kenny rogers with all that bling

I just went through a war with some stepsiblings who were nowhere to be found prior to the death of the last parent.
Above all, DON'T WAIT to find out about POAs, wills, DNRs and other things. Don't ask how I learned that.

1. MAKE CERTAIN A TRUSTED OFFSPRING HAS MEDICAL AND NON-MEDICAL POWERS OF ATTORNEY IN HAND. If you are the spawn, MAKE SURE YOU HAVE POA's. You don't have to implement them, but when you realize you DO need either, it's too late and you have to wait for things to go totally to he// before you can get any control at all over what will be complete chaos.
2. MAKE A WILL, AS SPECIFIC AS POSSIBLE, AS SOON AS POSSIBLE, ESPECIALLY IF YOU HAVE ANYTHING WORTH PASSING ON OR FIGHTING OVER. THE LEGAL SYSTEM IS SET UP SO THE ONLY WINNERS IN A LEGAL DISPUTE WILL BE THE LAWYERS. KEEP THE WILL UPDATED FOR ANY "MAJOR" ITEM, stuff with a title, stock holdings, IRA's, and bank accounts. If there's ANY doubt, and you're faced with a greedy relative willing to pay an attorney, you will come out the other end seriously screwed over. If your relative doesn't screw you, paying your attorney will leave you feeling the same way.
2A. NEVER PICK MORE THAN ONE EXECUTOR. NEVER. ONLY PICK THE MOST WORTHY PERSON, NOT NECESSARILY A RELATIVE. PERIOD.
Even if everything is great, multiple executors require shipping multiple copies of multiple documents, it makes for utter paperwork he//, If you go to an estate planner, you should ask if you should have more than one executor. If he or she says, "if you want," that person should NOT be your estate counsel under any circumstances.

Your # 2 advice is a issue i gotta get my FIL to address and break it down between my wife and sister inlaw.
#1 is what needs to happen

I have never seen a will so vague

Almost like a single soldier will prepared by jag

Generic

I can swear the law firm that made it here in town
Downloaded it from jag on fort campbell via email attachment.

Looks like something i had when I was a 19 yr old pfc in the army.

I have not heard of a DNI order.

IF we have DNR why would we intubate. ? Maybe some states are different.

Simple fact that they were on a bird already though would tend to tell me that there was not a DNR, though I know circumstances could be different.

Ain't nothing in life or death simple it seems.

The medics on the chopper said that they had to do it even if there was a dnr.

Pissed off her folks as well.
Didn't find about it till he got to the hospital.
It was a sad time.

She died by herself at home between 10:00 and 12;30 am,he is a school teacher and came home for lunch but he got tied up with the fall show at the school.
He got home around 3:00.