I just picked up a new FirstEdge 5150 w/ an ELMAX steel blade. It's supposed to hold a good edge and be easier to sharpen and more corrosion resistant than S30V. Does anyone have working experience with this steel?

I listen and learn from this Japanese doctor, is into Bark River knives, among others.

Elmax vs S30V is like coke vs pepsi. I prefer S30V but Elmax is good steel.

ELMAX Gunny Hunter - Bark River - Field application

Great steel, but Elmax is definitely not easy to sharpen.

Interesting technique with his stones.....I've always rotated my blades which he said not to do as it straightens out the belly.

I have never used Elmax, but I have used S30V and CPM 3V. Modern particle metallurgy steels are amazing products, not just in performance but in how the stuff is made. That said, they are a product and the steel industry is in business to sell those products so they are continually developing and marketing new steels, usually in small, incremental jumps. As was said above the comparison between Elmax and S30v is pretty much a moot point in the big scheme of things.

The Spanish invaded a good portion of North and South America with what would be considered primitive steels by today's standards. They sailed back and forth over the salty Atlantic for decades and carved their way through numerous indigenous populations raping, pillaging and cutting up animals for their daily meals without even a tinge of chromium or vanadium in their blades. We should feel so lucky to have the choices steel technology of today offers.

I'm getting one made out of Nitro V stainless, knife maker told me it was comparable to S30V, anyone have any experience with it.

Haven’t heard of it Roger. S30V is pretty hard to beat, IMO.

stx, make sure it's heat treated to 62-63 hrc.

It'll be good there.

Its stainless properties are equal to S30, but it's better run at a harder rockwell.

thanks

I have several Elmax blades from Dale Howe and multiple S30V from Ingram and May. I find them very comparable. No issues putting a wicked edge on any of them with mostly just ceramic sticks.

Yep

Reminds me of the American white man conquering the New World after the landing at Plymouth Rock. . .

Blade steel ratings off of Blade Forums. Left to right is more cost. Vertical is overall steel performance. Roughly translates to you get what you pay for. Not a whole lot available that is significantly better than ELMAX.

Blade Forums Steel Ratings

That's a good reference.

Here's another:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads...-edge-retention-cutting-5-8-rope.793481/

I found that the better a knife holds the edge with use then harder it is to sharpen. Just my opinion.

Yep.

Entertaining how we as modern humans can stew and sweat over our hunting tools burning up 95% effort to solve 2% of a problem, deciding whether Cerakote is better than Black T for a stainless barreled action. Or whether 6.5 creedmoor is gonna have better balistics than 257 Roberts for hunting antelope when using 120 gr TTSX or...... Those pilgrims were happy to just have dry powder to load their muskets, let alone the magic of flint and steel to light the evening fire.

Mtnsnake, there is a lot of truth in what you just said. People keep looking for edge retention and ease of sharpening in the same knife and both attributes are part of the same function. Edge geometry does play a part in each function but can really make sharpening a problem if the edge geometry is not properly set up.

You can use a wooden knife to skin and cut animals. You have to keep the wood sharp as you cut and carve. Same with any metal that is easy to sharpen.

Depends what one needs or wants from a blade;

I have knives in all three of those steels. Frankly, I can’t tell any difference in performance . I do not use water stones on a convex blade though.

I've had all 3. All of mine were hunting/skinning knives. Aside from putting in a little effort to ensure the D2 didn't rust, I couldn't tell any difference. I think a getting a proper heat treat is more important than the real world difference between those 3

I have S35VN and D2. Both are razors and hold and edge, but the S35VN is better. D2 can be had as a powder, and naturally that is more uniform that old school D2. D2 was from WW2 times, S30V is from around 2000, and I think S35VN about 10 years later.

Neither is D2..................I'd much rather have a good SS of some sort that sharpens better & easier.

MM

Agreed. I’m a journeyman tool and die maker. I first started working in a machine shop in 1967, did my apprenticeship in the 70’s, after military service. I’m still working in the trade. I guess I’ve had more experience than the average person with regard to working with and using various steels. I think most of these whizz bang, space age alloys are serious overkill for knives, but if it makes one happy.... I also think that the performance differential between them, when it comes to knives, anyway, is more in the mind of the beholder than anything. D2 is about as exotic as I’ve ever gone as far as making a knife. Truth be known, most of us would be pretty well served with nothing other than plain old 1095 steel for a knife. I know I would. But then, what would we have to talk about?

+100.... Almost all of my knives are 1095 with a few D2's thrown in the mix but I try not to say that too loud around here.

This Jap doctor has a technique to remove the factory edge to a smooth rounded convex edge, suitable for feathering. Here is a three video series that demonstrates:

Rust. ;-{>8

I like S30V with a hollow ground edge. Sharp forever and wicked cuts.

The good doctor needs to reassess his carving skills. There is no need to convex a flat scandi grind bevel to make good feathers. You just need to sharpen correctly and understand the wood and the grain structure you're dealing with. The advantage of the flat scandi grind is that the "bevel" is flat all the way out to the edge. This creates a broader flat surface to ride on when carving. The angle is set and so there is less need to hold the angle you need to keep the feathers rolling off the board. The continuous arc (albeit shallow) of the convex bevel does not have near the slip face(broad flat surface) to glide on so you have to set the angle with your grip, where as the scandi flat grind allows the knife to do more of the work.

Another advantage to the flat scandi grind is the bevel angle is pre-set, so when you sharpen you just lay the bevel on the stone and have at it. The wide bevel makes it easy to keep the blade flat(proper angle) on the stone so no need for jigs or special technique to maintain that edge angle, its already built in.

The only real disadvantage to the scandi is having a thinner final edge that is not as robust as a steeper secondary bevel/edge like most western style knives are made with. This can be worked around by putting a secondary micro bevel on at the end of the sharpening process for a more general purpose edge rather than a strict wood carving edge, which helps with edge rolling when dealing with knots or cutting into heavy leg bones and joints.

Funny that

I don't see how anyone can think a steel that has superior edge holding ability is going to be easy to sharpen. The properties that allow a steel to hold an edge are the same properties that make it difficult to sharpen.

My amateur point of view is this---for an everyday use knife that I can resharpen whenever I want, I'll take a knife that doesn't hold its edge as long but is easier to sharpen. For a survival-type knife where I'm out in the middle of nowhere, I'd rather have a knife that stays sharp as long as possible since I might not be able to touch it up. Just my opinion...

If the blade geometry is good, once sharpened, a quality blade can be maintained shaving sharp for a long time with just a routine stropping after use. I have a Benchmade EDC in 154CM that I've carried and used almost every day for over two years and I just now needed to put it to a stone. I think the key with most knives is don't let them get too dull before you touch them up.

I must be doing it wrong, when cutting up a moose I find I have to touch up the blade during the process.

I use a speedy sharp for the task, best lil take with you sharpener I’ve found. It’s on a carabiner w my gerber tool

Course my back can use the break to stand up and sharpen so I don’t mind doing so at all.

But I don’t have really high end knives so that’s prolly part of the equation as well.

I love a beautiful custom/high-end knife but for deer hunting, I usually use the cheapies with a nice grip to help with my cold wet hands. Midway had Real Avid 440 SS knives and Saw/Gut Hooks on sale for $10/ea (reg $30/ea) which allows you to have one just about anywhere you'd want/need one (or even give them away as gifts) without breaking the bank.

Moki Banff medium, not a fancy custom but a good factory knife with VG-10 steel.



Made it through my moose without needing a touch up.

I didn't use the EDC for any of the four deer (2 bow, 2 rifle) we killed this past season. I did use a nice custom in 154CM from Tim Ott via manmadecustoms.com. The wife used a Benchmade Saddle Mtn Skinner in CPM-S30V. Both performed very well, both needed a couple of minutes on the strop when transitioning from skinning to de-boning and trimming.