FWIW, I was glancing through my newly-arrived Jan 2010 copy ( No.248) of RIFLE Magazine, and I spotted a pictoral ad for a new levergun !

The pic was a little dark, but the new levergun appeared to be a blued/walnut Winchester Model 92/clone, with a pistol grip/curved lever and a top-mounted peep that looked suspiciously like a Williams WGRS.

The gun is the "Model 89", and is said to be available in either rifle or carbine form - chambered to the powerful .500 S&W Magnum !

The offering/ad is from an outfit called "Big Horn Armory" of Cody, Wy - but when I tried their website, all I could find besides a trophy pic of an Elk was a "site under construction" notice.

http://www.bighornarmory.com/products/

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I wonder how big the receiver ring is, to be able to withstand the pressures that the 500 generates. It will be interesting to see...especially if the receiver has NOT been beefed up beyond that of a standard 92.

It appears to be a Win '86 clone. They were originally made in .50 cal., but it would have to be pretty special to take the rated pressure of the .500 S&W. If it really can, Cool!!

The rifle pictured in the Rifle Magazine ad didn't appear to have the 2-piece loading gate of the Model 1886/86, so I don't think it's a clone.

From a remark/reply from someone who lives nearby to the makers, made elsewhere, it "may" be a specially-made, slightly oversize Model 92.

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So does anybody know what the cost of this model 89 is? This sure will replace a lot of 45-70 Marlins. To bad it wasn't done as a Marlin flat top so a guy could hang a scope on it and not scare your kids to death with a case of the uglies.

I'll stick with the 45-70. It has all the power I'll ever need, and ammo is everywhere, from softball cowboy loads to the Garret loads that would shoot through an elephant.

Can't deny the 'cool factor' of the .500, but since I'm entering the Grouchy Old Fart part of my life, cool don't matter much to me anymore.

Another GOF and I agree, I don't think the 500 S&W can match the 45-70.

This rifle will be very popular in some states such as Indiana, that will not permit rifles for deer hunting unless chambered for a handgun cartridge. You cannot use a Marlin .45/70 but you can use a model 89 in .500 S&W.

Saw the same government logic in Australia years ago, when you could not have big game rifles in the Northern Territory to hunt buffalo but you could carry a Marlin .45/70 because it was considered a low powered cartridge.

Only the faces change.

JW

Also saw the ad for the Big Horn Model 89 .500 S&W in RIFLE and have tried the listed website with no luck. Concur with Rangr44 that the advertised rifle is not an 1886/86/71 clone - believe it might be a reworked 'Puma' 92 clone which started life as a .454 Casull. If that is indeed the case, I'd have to compare the pressures for the .454 and .500 before I'd squeeze the trigger on one but the Puma .454 that I had shot very well when it would feed. I'm intrigued with this new offering from Big Horn Armory as a hog gun - I like the handling of a 92 but prefer to have something a bit heavier than .44 Mag or .45 Colt for big pigs. Won't be giving up my 1895 45/70 anytime soon, but a 92 in the same power class sure would be hard to resist...

D

Too many ifs. I'll stick with my 1895 Marlin Cowboy 45-70.

Like the 454 casull in the Puma '92,the old reliable 45-70 matches or beats,by a large margin with a couple loads,the 500 Smith and Wesson.

Shot in a 22" Handi-Rifle in 500 Smith and Wesson.




Jayco

You folks that think the .45-70 is the last word in power have never actually shot moose with one. Regardless of what you may think or heard the .500 S&W is hands down more powerful than a .45-70, which without a doubt is one of the poorest choices many people make here in Alaska.


I have heard this same BS here in Alaska for years, to bad there's no truth in it.

I have a new .454 Puma in a 92 clone and this model 89 looks nothing like a model 92 clone, it looks like a 94 action and nothing else.

Yeah, the fact that the 45-70 pushes the same weight bullets as fast as the .500 does at lower presssures is a real bummer. What a schitty round!

So is the fact that the .45 slugs penetrate better since they have better sectional densities..And finally, the 45-70 is a real poor choice because you can get it in an realaively inexpensive factory lever rifle like the Marlin and brass ,bullets and load data a easy to come by..

I'm sure 400 grain 45-70 slugs freaking BOUNCE OFF Bull moose and Bears..

Well,there are atleast two Master Guides in Alaska that disagree with you and one is Phil Shoemaker where as he has written that both he and his wife packs one fishing for Bears..

The other Jerry Jacques a Master Guide in Alaska and a Licensed Professional Hunter in Africa.





You can buy 3 if not 4 Marlin 45-70 to the price on this new .500 S&W levergun.

Jayco

I own both Marlin .45/70 and S&W 500 revolver and would rate them reasonably equal in power. The ballistics are not too dissimilar and although I obviously don't have a high kill tally with the .500, I have killed a few hundred head with various .45/70's to know what 400 grain bullets can do in the high teens for velocity.

Let me explain it by saying that I do not believe you would pick one over the other for any particular hunting chore. You simply carry what please you. I know I would.

JW

The 45-70 achieves the same or better velocities with a Max pressure of 40,000 CUP or 43,500 PSI while the Smith and Wesson uses 60,000 PSI and the cost of beefing up a lever action to take 60,000 PSI in a .500 will be astronomic..My Guess is this particular new .500 Lever action will run over $1500 and probably closer to $2000.

I could be wrong but we will see.

Jayco

I guess the track record of the 45-70 since 1873 just don't count, 3sixbits? All those buffalo aren't really dead, they're just pretending...

Personally, I find this interesting.
My analysis of the photos concurs with the text, the receiver is neither from an 1886 nor an 1892, but more like a 92 stretched, with a little bit of Marlin 336 thrown in.
I think this 500 will do little to challenge the supremacy of the 45-70/450. However, assuming that this company can overcome the challenges of making a high end niche gun in our failing economy, it certainly achieves where others have failed. Did WWG ever get their 500 S&W levergun out of the experimental stage?
Ultimately, the appeal of .50 cal guns is strong. In my opinion, this gun has a good chance of securing "market share", mostly due to the strong S&W name.
In terms of the 1/2" bore, it was discovered way back in the 1870's that the 45 cal was superior in most real world scenarios to the 50 cal. The testing that went into the creation of the 45-70 was more extensive than words here can relate. Thus the 45-70 replaced the 50-70.
Still, the 500 is an impressive cartridge. In many ways it is far more sensible as a levergun cartridge than it is as a handgun round.
I wish them success.

The two prototypes still set in the rack in the back of the shop, they look well thought out and are a kind of clone of the Marlin, I don't know why the owner gave up on them, I can have the receivers and bolts reproduced loss wax for him, I just do not like the arrogant SOB to talk to, he does get under my skin.

The website is working and the price is just under $1900

GASP!! That is a whole lot of "folding green stuff"!!! And I just do not "buy it" that this type of action (lever) will withstand constant pounding from 65,000 psi (or whatever) pressure that the .500 round puts out. I recall many many folks of prominence proclaim that the REAR LOCK-UP of a lever action rifle, by design, would not withstand much over 45k psi (or thereabouts, I can't remember the exact pressure reading, but it was mid-40s). It is a beautiful rifle though, but for the money, I would rather find me a nice VINTAGE Winchester 71 DELUXE!!

I am not arguing with you Ken but know one thought the Puma '92 leveraction would take the constant pounding from full house .454 Casull(65,000 PSI) loads and it has so far.But the Puma is below or at $500.

Some knowledgeable people think this one will work..Time will tell.

Jayco

17-4 PH is tough stuff. Same material Freedom Arms uses and BFR uses on their cylinders. Build it tight and I suspect it will last a long time.