I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
Money can buy lighter weight shelters, ie. Dyneema/ Cuben Fiber. Less money = sil nylon/ polyester.
Less money = Tarp shelters akin to floorless tents.
Personally, If I was unaccustomed to warm weather tarp or floorless, I would go with a more traditional tent for late fall.
If you want to camp this summer with a tarp and get caught up on the learning curve and idea, go for one this fall.
I like hammocks for a couple reasons when still hunting deer.
That's not a decision most make, but I have unique situations and experiences. That makes my choice a tarp. With the additional underquilt, the weight savings is pretty much a wash.
For ground sleeping, experience with site selection is critical. You can imagine as rain can ruin your sleeping bag.
Pro’s are lighter. They tend to have condensation issues and are not good around mosquitos and other creepies. I have a Seek Outside DST tarp and moved on to a Seek Outside Eolus. Opening day of archery was a sit in the tent while it rained all day and it would have been nice to have a floored tent. I like them but they have limitations.
So many variables. If bugs, rain, snow, really cold nights, mice, snakes, scorpions are an issue, I’d go with tent with a floor. For those rare early fall nights in the mountains with none of those issues, you could sleep right on your air mattress. A simple tarp over your bag will keep the frost off you. I look at it, if I need a tent, I need a tent with a tent with a floor.
To the OP. I live in CO. I think in 20 years of archery and rifle hunts I’ve only had one where Mother Nature didn’t dump rain or snow on us. And it’s almost always snow in the mountains. A wet sleeping bag would cut the trip short.
One last thing.
Check out YouTube videos on different ways to set up a tarp.
Tarps can cost as little as you want to pay. That will give you an idea of whether or not you want to go with a higher cost and higher risk floorless tent for the weight savings.
The lower risk during the more predictable warm weather and experience with site selection should help you decide if it's for you or not.
I just noticed that you are in S Florida. I'm guessing that you want something with "doors" to keep skeeters out. Maybe someone can sew a section of no see-um netting on the length ends for ventilation. Against the ground will restrict air flow, so that's my thoughts for consideration.
So many variables. If...rain, snow, really cold nights are an issue, I’d go with tent with a floor. For those rare early fall nights in the mountains with none of those issues, you could sleep right on your air mattress. A simple tarp over your bag will keep the frost off you. I look at it, if I need a tent, I need a tent with a tent with a floor.
To the OP. I live in CO. I think in 20 years of archery and rifle hunts I’ve only had one where Mother Nature didn’t dump rain or snow on us. And it’s almost always snow in the mountains. A wet sleeping bag would cut the trip short.
Nah, good floorless shelters do just fine in driving rain, hail, snow, and deep cold. It does take some strategy to pitch them properly for the conditions, though. I'll leave the creepy crawlies out of my statement, since that's a personal and subjective thing to some extent.
Guys great info. Thank you.
Floor less is the only way I've went archery elk hunting. Spent nights in the teens. Your sleep system is more important than shelter for archery elk season IMHO.
A young lady I know bought a hammock and a bag made especially for it. The hammock goes right through the bag so it's both an over and under bag at the same time. Her biggest problem in this country is trees. She sometimes has to climb up some pretty steep hills to find 2 suitable trees to hang it.
So many variables. If...rain, snow, really cold nights are an issue, I’d go with tent with a floor. For those rare early fall nights in the mountains with none of those issues, you could sleep right on your air mattress. A simple tarp over your bag will keep the frost off you. I look at it, if I need a tent, I need a tent with a tent with a floor.
To the OP. I live in CO. I think in 20 years of archery and rifle hunts I’ve only had one where Mother Nature didn’t dump rain or snow on us. And it’s almost always snow in the mountains. A wet sleeping bag would cut the trip short.
Nah, good floorless shelters do just fine in driving rain, hail, snow, and deep cold. It does take some strategy to pitch them properly for the conditions, though. I'll leave the creepy crawlies out of my statement, since that's a personal and subjective thing to some extent.
The only thing I'd add to this is, if you set up in an area with grass it's a good bet you'll have mice in your tent at night so bring a few mouse traps. Some areas are worse than others but a few mousetraps will take care of the problem.
I've hunted the muzzleloader seasons in CO for the past 20+ years, always used a floorless tent (Golite SL-5). Never had a problem keeping my stuff dry, and almost never have problems with mosquitoes or other bugs. The good thing IMO about a floorless shelter vs floored is, for the same weight the footprint is a lot bigger and you can get all your gear in the tent, under cover. The downside is (at least for single center-pole tents like the SL) most are not good with a snow load but that's rarely an issue during the early seasons.
Personally, If I was unaccustomed to warm weather tarp or floorless, I would go with a more traditional tent for late fall.
Archery season here is not in late Fall, it's in early Fall.
Big difference. If you'd ever hunted here during Fall, you'd know that.
Personally, If I was unaccustomed to warm weather tarp or floorless, I would go with a more traditional tent for late fall.
Archery season here is not in late Fall, it's in early Fall.
Big difference. If you'd ever hunted here during Fall, you'd know that.
I was going to say something but you got it...
On topic, it depends as I use both.
I prefer floorless tipi tents...walk in, take of the boots etc inside and don't worry about tracking in mud, light the stove, and sleep is good.
For our mountain hunts we’ve equally used either a modified SL 4 with Tgoat cylinder stove or a Hilleberg Nalo 3 GT.
The benefits of tipi with stove is light weight with lots of floor space and heat. Easy in and out without having to take boots off. A big footprint but easier to make a suitable bedding spot with a mat of moss to even things up.
Condensation can be an annoyance if you rub against the side, but I’ve also had lots of condensation in the Hilleberg in certain conditions. Even wet ground dries up quickly once the tipi is set up.
Never had any issues with mosquitos and flies in the tipi because they all seem to end up in the very top. And I just have to ignore the fact that there’s spiders probably crawling around me when I’m sleeping.
The worst thing we’ve had in the tipi was a porcupine but luckily I was able to coax him out with a hiking pole without getting any holes in our sleeping mats. He was chewing on the plastic inflation valve but not long enough to wreck it luckily.
I don’t trust my tipi to handle a bad storm the way our Hilleberg has though.
my seek 8 man has been great. I usualy pitch it tight to the ground and cover the sod strip with dirt. mine is screened so I can manage venting that way i havent ahd much of a condensation issue with it but i have 2 liners tied in it. i have had decent luck with digging a trench around the sheter if it is going to rain
Sounds like an interesting concept. I will have to check them out.
I like my Kifaru 8-man tipi and stove for later seasons. I've packed both in for the muzzleloader season here in CO, which falls in the middle of bow season.
I stopped packing in that combo because I found that I rarely needed or used the stove to stay warm, and there's a definite weight penalty.
Anything will work...it's about your own tolerance for condensation dripping on you and also for bugs and how carefully you want to pitch (and adjust) your tarp.
Most people need a larger footprint with a floorless setup to keep their bags and bodies away from the wet insides of the tent. You can wake up squished against the sides of your double wall tent, or have your clothes squished against the sides, and they will be fairly dry. But esp in humid weather anything touching the walls of a single wall tarp/tent is going to be wet.
I use floorless in snow with a hot stove/tipi setup, but I will often use a liner in my tipi (actually a low wide custom cuben thing, not a kifaru style tipi). The stove really helps blow the moisture out of the tent, but even with a stove, you still get condensation in certain situations on the lower sides of the tarp/tent.
Bottom line is that light double wall tent requires way less effort and practice to keep you and your stuff dry, both from your own condensation and from any weather.
I always have a light tarp and it's nice to be able to string a line between two trees and quickly stake out the sides and fall asleep, but most of the time I'd rather pack a double wall tent and spend the week not having to think about condensation and weather.
Bottom line is that light double wall tent requires way less effort and practice to keep you and your stuff dry, both from your own condensation and from any weather.
That has not been my experience over the past 20+ years in Colorado during the bow season. But then again, it all depends on the single-walled tent. Some are well-ventilated, some are not.
The SL-5 that I use allows you to pitch it with 6-8 inches of space between the ground and the bottom of the tent walls, and it has mesh vents at the top. That allows enough air circulation that condensation is really not an issue. But a tipi style tent with the walls pitched tight to the ground and no vents does create condensation.
And I've never gotten my stuff in the tent wet in rain or snow.
Bottom line is that light double wall tent requires way less effort and practice to keep you and your stuff dry, both from your own condensation and from any weather.
That has not been my experience over the past 20+ years in Colorado during the bow season. But then again, it all depends on the single-walled tent. Some are well-ventilated, some are not.
The SL-5 that I use allows you to pitch it with 6-8 inches of space between the ground and the bottom of the tent walls, and it has mesh vents at the top. That allows enough air circulation that condensation is really not an issue. But a tipi style tent with the walls pitched tight to the ground and no vents does create condensation.
And I've never gotten my stuff in the tent wet in rain or snow.
Is that the same setup you use in 4th rifle? If so, I'm guessing you use a very large shelter. I've only hunted in CO a few times during bow season and the bugs were not bad and it was mostly dry and there were plenty of sunny days to balance out whatever weather came in. It was exceedingly pleasant.
That is just not the case in other areas, especially later in the season. 6-8 inches of space between the ground and the bottom of the tent wall is *huge* and necessitates that your sleeping bag be set back a fair bit from the tent wall or your bag (and other gear) is getting wet in any sort of driven rain, let alone if you get a half foot of snow.
I will often pitch one side of my single wall shelters with that sort of gap for ventilation but everything in that part of the shelter will have snow drift in on it.
Bottom line is that light double wall tent requires way less effort and practice to keep you and your stuff dry, both from your own condensation and from any weather.
That has not been my experience over the past 20+ years in Colorado during the bow season. But then again, it all depends on the single-walled tent. Some are well-ventilated, some are not.
The SL-5 that I use allows you to pitch it with 6-8 inches of space between the ground and the bottom of the tent walls, and it has mesh vents at the top. That allows enough air circulation that condensation is really not an issue. But a tipi style tent with the walls pitched tight to the ground and no vents does create condensation.
And I've never gotten my stuff in the tent wet in rain or snow.
Is that the same setup you use in 4th rifle?
No. The OP was asking about a bowhunt. During rifle seasons I'd go with the Kifaru 8-man and a stove.
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
Sleep,
Unlike those Jr high school special needs boys here, I did read that you asked about September. You were clear enough. How cold or wet is of course nature's call for that unpredictable month. I didn't belabor the month point for sake of the trolls on here. I mentioned late fall because common sense obviously would recommend colder weather shelter requirements. Hence the floor and extra half pound makes sense. Shelter wouldn't be my choice for weight savings without lots of experience. September in your location, etc. is a subjective judgement call.
Best to you in preparation for a safe and enjoyable harvest.
HC
We use some combination of a Kifaru Super Tarp, Kifaru 6 man Tipi or Eena Miner tent for many years. All are floorless. I like walking into my tent with my boots on. In these tents wind and weather has never been a negative issue - I would say that a personal size tarp, tyvek or that shrink window plastic under the ground pad is important tho.
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
Sleep,
Unlike those Jr high school special needs boys here, I did read that you asked about September. You were clear enough. How cold or wet is of course nature's call for that unpredictable month. I didn't belabor the month point for sake of the trolls on here. I mentioned late fall because common sense obviously would recommend colder weather shelter requirements. Hence the floor and extra half pound makes sense. Shelter wouldn't be my choice for weight savings without lots of experience. September in your location, etc. is a subjective judgement call.
Best to you in preparation for a safe and enjoyable harvest.
HC
How many times have you hunted elk in Colorado in any season?
And have you ever used a floorless tent or tipi with a wood stove in the late seasons in Colorado? I have, at down to zero degrees F. Floorless with a wood stove is the way to go in those conditions.
Of course, if you'd ever done it, you'd know that.
Careful not to dislocate your shoulder patting yourself on the back pole smoker.
Careful not to dislocate your shoulder patting yourself on the back pole smoker.
No, what I need to be careful with is dislocating my knee while I'm kicking you in the ass. My knees are pretty stout but your ass is a glutton for punishment.
Because your mouth keeps writing checks your ass can't cash.
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
Unless you are using a wood stove in your floorless shelter, a floorless shelter is just a real fancy tarp with all of the issues with crawling things and flying things that a tarp has. The potential pluses for a floorless are (a) wood stove and (b) more enclosed in the case of high wind or wind-driven rain or snow. Not being a fan of flying/crawling things, I'd have to use a nest inside a floorless just as I use a bug bivy under my tarp. Either would include a small section of floor to keep from drawing moisture out of the ground into my sleeping bag, etc. as well as keeping the bugs away. When you add all of the components, for a single person setup, there's no gain for floorless/nest or tarp/bivy over the best of ultralight tents .. and sometimes a net increase in weight. What you might gain is flexibility.
Tom
A young lady I know bought a hammock and a bag made especially for it. The hammock goes right through the bag so it's both an over and under bag at the same time. Her biggest problem in this country is trees. She sometimes has to climb up some pretty steep hills to find 2 suitable trees to hang it.
Could you tell me more about that? By PM if it'd be too distracting here. That's interesting for my applications.
Thanks!
Tom
I’ve had enough mice and chipmunks scurrying around the base of tents that and mosquitoes buzzing around inside during the warmer months that I’ll gladly not try to save an ounce or two in total weight on flooring material. To me it seems like there are better ways to save a very small amount of weight.
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
In september? So in general that time of year if ya like bugs go ahead get a floor-less.
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
In september? So in general that time of year if ya like bugs go ahead get a floor-less.
Man, I must be the lucky one. Bugs have not been a problem in mid-September.
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
In september? So in general that time of year if ya like bugs go ahead get a floor-less.
Man, I must be the lucky one. Bugs have not been a problem in mid-September.
Or early September
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
In september? So in general that time of year if ya like bugs go ahead get a floor-less.
Man, I must be the lucky one. Bugs have not been a problem in mid-September.
Or early September
I'm one of them lucky ones too.No bugs.
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
In september? So in general that time of year if ya like bugs go ahead get a floor-less.
Man, I must be the lucky one. Bugs have not been a problem in mid-September.
Or early September
I'm one of them lucky ones too.No bugs.
So you don't worry about creepers jeeper?
So many variables. If...rain, snow, really cold nights are an issue, I’d go with tent with a floor. For those rare early fall nights in the mountains with none of those issues, you could sleep right on your air mattress. A simple tarp over your bag will keep the frost off you. I look at it, if I need a tent, I need a tent with a tent with a floor.
Nah, good floorless shelters do just fine in driving rain, hail, snow, and deep cold. It does take some strategy to pitch them properly for the conditions, though. I'll leave the creepy crawlies out of my statement, since that's a personal and subjective thing to some extent.
The only thing I'd add to this is, if you set up in an area with grass it's a good bet you'll have mice in your tent at night so bring a few mouse traps. Some areas are worse than others but a few mousetraps will take care of the problem..
I never get mice in tents. They ALWAYS do get into vehicles. Even brand new ones.
Mousetraps, somethin' to consider when they're foraging in the rig.
I have done one trip and looking to back west to archery hunt elk in Colorado in September. Wanting to get a light weight tent or shelter. I see that floorless is lighter but never used one before. Any pros and cons for or against? Thanks.
In september? So in general that time of year if ya like bugs go ahead get a floor-less.
Man, I must be the lucky one. Bugs have not been a problem in mid-September.
Or early September
I'm one of them lucky ones too.No bugs.
So you don't worry about creepers jeeper?
Nope
bugs have not been a problem in 3 Alaska trips. 2 trips to the boundry waters were so so for the skeeters. a bug coil killed em all. rarely do the flying critters get in and when they do the go the to top.
now i will add that i worry about the chiggers here. i take a large tarp for a floor in warm weather here. but we have not had a problem with them.
if you get a liner for the tipi condensation will not be a problem. i have liners for both of my tipis but rarely take them.
i have never had a water issue because of the lack of a floor. even with a floor water can be a problem. it is very handy to just track in snow or mud and not worry about it accumulating on the floor.
I'm with Smokepole. Been running the same (SL5) for more than 15 years September through May in Idaho and Alaska. Floorless is not about weight for me, but functionality, and the colder the better it gets (I've been in mine down to 5 below). Wear boots into shelter, bigger footprint, taller center height, and heating option at little weight penalty. Notwithstanding some of the limitations mentioned above, I would much rather be shelter-bound in a tipi than similar weight floored shelter.
Get a Borah Bug bivy if the night creepers concern you.
I have an SL-5 with the “nest” floor and skeeter mesh option. I use it both ways… very simply, when it’s warm and there are bugs, I use the nest. When it’s cold and there are no bugs, I leave the nest out and use the Ti-goat stove. When it’s cold and there are bugs (it happens), I use the nest and also burn tri-tabs to warm up and dry out in the morning- it ain’t rocket surgery guys.
I make my shelters out of a tarp, poles, rope, and rocks. I always put a second tarp in for a floor. I do not like mice on my face when I am sleeping.
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