12 yo daughter & I had an early June 5D/6N trip postponed by our lovely governess when it was announced that she’d extend out lockdown order into mid-May. Sleeping Bear National Lakeshore can’t hire people fast enough so transport company that boats ya out to North Manitou Island can’t run.

Fine whatever we’ll do Pictured Rocks. I call a spotting service but no call back. Of course Pictured Rocks is a Nat’l Lakeshore too and they’re not even giving out permits until June 25th at the earliest.

Seriously this is the biggest cluster of friggin retardation I’ve ever seen!!!!!

I know I’d not have this problem if I moved west and I’d love to do that but love my wife more so that’s a no go.

Not looking for a solution as much as just complaining. Sorry for being that guy.

Prolly just go up and walk in a few days and then walk back. Might make it more relaxing since we could stay at one site longer. If place is closed then who is gonna “catch” us in the “forbidden backcountry”??

Orwellian joke.

If anyone has suggestions for Michigan area I’m open.

I was getting really nervous when Washington and Oregon closed the majority of National Forests; campgrounds, boat ramps, picnic areas, etc- I can see some justification for areas that are high traffic, but they actually closed all trails within as well

Fortunately Montana didn't go that route. I'm not a law breaker, but I really couldn't see myself not getting into the backcountry- luckily it never came to that.

They did close Yellowstone National Park early on and Glacier National Park recently rescinded all backcountry permits (they may allow issuing permits first come/first serve in the future).

Fucque the commy dicks, go anyway.

Closing the backcountry makes no sense to me. Where else is it easier to maintain your distance?

Whole lot of draconian BS going on.

Control. The ultimate goal of the radical environmentalists is to close off everything and pack the people into a few large cities, turning most of the country into a massive wildlife refuge. If they can get away with this, it's a big step in their direction.

That’s what really puts me in a pickle here; I teach my children to respect the law and those who are put in place to govern over us (Romans 13).

As others have said this seems like one of those “unwasted crises” custom made for the Leftist. Nice play to remind us who is in charge and ultimately push their preservationist agenda on backcountry.

I told Marian I’d leave it to her; shorten my vacation time and move it later in the summer when we can do North Manitou Island and just do a weekend trip to a shorter, closer trail or go up to the eastern end of Pictured Rocks, walk west for 2 days, find a nice place to make camp and hang out for a day (which sounds great to me) and then head back to the car the way we came.

She went with the latter.

Makes me wonder how long it’s going to be before Conservatives have to seriously consider civil disobedience which keeps to the spirit of laws (I assure you, as has been mentioned, we’ll be ‘social distancing’!) rather than the letter.

Guess this is a good teaching opportunity?

Thanks guys!

Idaho is 60% public land and except for some campgrounds and boat docks, it's all open for recreation.

Shhh! 😉

I don't think there is big conspiracy to get ultimate control of the citizens or take away our rights. We hear all this clamor about this all being unconstitutional, when in fact there is nothing in the constitution about national emergencies which is what we are seeing now. In normal times, it would be unconstitutional, but not now. IMO it is just the stupidity of people the citizens put in office.Those people are too stupid to even figure something like that out. ( think of Pelosi and Maxine Walters). We have never had an experience like this since the Spanish Flu in the 20's . Government , federal, state, or local have no clue how to handle it so they take the most cautious steps.

Here locally parks are open, but campgrounds in them are closed, the rest is open. My wife had trip to Denali booked in mid June,but Danali is closed. Canceling everything has been a nightmare.

Being rural, nothing has changed much for us.I still go to the range, still go riding in open spaces, still get out and purchase what we need. Can't get into the back country until more snow melts and what is melted is all mud. Some smaller towns are still closed up to tourist because they have very limited medical care and can't take a chance on getting swamped.

This thing isn't going away anytime soon and we are going to be faced with it until probably 2021. People need to get use to what they are going thru now. The problem is also our present day culture. People now figure they can and should be able to do anything they want and the hell with everyone else.That is what happens when you raise an entire generation giving them participation certificates for everything they do.

That's my rant.

However, if you look at a red and blue map, the areas that are the most restricted are almost all blue. Last week I posted 2 maps, 2016 election, and current restrictions. They very closely matched. The 2016 red states are much more open than the blue states.

The Democrats/Left is loving this situation where they can have government ( them) control much of people’s lives. Never let a crisis go to waste. But like the old saying goes....don’t do as I do, do as I say ! The rules only apply to the unwashed masses. In Chicago, you cannot get a haircut, but the mayor can, in NYC you cannot go to parks, but the mayor and his wife can go across the city to go foe a walk in the park. In NYS, the governor orders you to wear a mask and social distance, but his Covid infected brother can go with a bunch of people , not wearing masks, to the Hamptonsto see how his mansion building is progressing. And while golf courses are closed in VA, Obama golfs on his now, private course.

So you are implying since EFW, Smokepole, mtwarden, RockChuck and others disagree with closing the backcountry they were part of a generation that were given participation certificates for everything they do? Never would have thought that to be the case.

I don't think saddlesore is talking about the backcountry being closed. More the general situation when you're around other people, just making some allowances.

OK, sounds better..
However, the extremes some are going to make allowances is getting absurd. Where I’m working social distancing is marginal to put mildly. At least one positive case in our specific hospital department that was quarantined for 2 weeks then returned to work. .

Where his generalization rubs wrong, is everyone I’m with right now is part of the generation he condemns, yet most every day they come to work and often are in close proximity- definitely not social distance-from a confirmed or unknown confirmed case.

Some need to get there ass out of the country every once in awhile and find out how others go about their day.

One could make a generalization re old farts who haven’t learned much, while being blessed with the opportunity to do so.

I didn't say I disagreed with closing the back country. I think some have a serious lack of understanding what constitutes back country.

I have lived "out of the country" and have seen how others go about their day which is the primary reason I live "out in the country". As for being an old fart, I am, but I learned enough that I don't want to live with the masses because in fact most all want to do what they think they need/want to do and could give a crap about how it effects others. The last 15 years I worked, I hired some of this generation I talked about.They think they get to decide when they come to work and go home, want 30minute breaks morning and afternoon, decide what work they want to do or not and want $60/hour for a $10 an hour job. I grant some of these dumb a$$es have gone to extremes, but as I said, they don't know what is going on so they take the most cautious approach they can. Thru all this and all the complainers I have not read or heard one viable alternative to what has been accomplished. As for learning much, I guarantee, the work I did before I retired would put most to shame and most would not do it on a bet.

Lot of smart people don’t figure things out.

You want to edit for clarification...You said you did the hiring...then you got what you brought in.

I define it as roadless areas where you have to walk or ride in on a four-legger. And you can get at least a few miles back in away from motorized access.


If you don't disagree with closing that kind of country, what's the rationale for closing it? It's not like any govt. employees have to be there to let you in or take your money. So who's being endangered by leaving the backcountry open?

Even people in the government who support all the restrictions will acknowledge that people still need to get outside for exercise. Where's a safer place to do that than backcountry?

Backcountry is relative....myself a Bud and two others were the only onesTurkey hunting on 1200acres. Bud and I drove up and back together....other than it was social distancing. One doesn’t need to be alone in the middle of the Bob Marshall.

I have 500 acres behind the house that most times I wouldn’t see another.

The extremes others are willing to think the rest of us should abide by are just that.

I agree 100%. IMO there's no rationale to shut down any land where you're not crowded in with other people. I was just using a roadless area as the most extreme example, as in WFT, over??

Makes absolutely no sense.

Meant to say I did not disagree with those saying the back country should not be closed.Bad wording on my part.

I'd say about 8 out of ten were of that ilk.You don't know until they are on the job several weeks or months after waiting for secret clearances to come thru after 3 months .

They're not worried about you, they are worried about themselves. They would still have to patrol and come in contact with you. Why patrol when the government will pay you to sit on your ass?

My wife and I have been going out on public land in Nv. about 4 days/week since this mess started. We have seen no restrictions or monitoring on BLM areas. NFS has closed campgrounds but not roads. Many parking areas @ trailheads are closed and have signs but folks are parking elsewhere and walking in. On Friday we walked about 5 miles up a semi rough FS 2 track and there were several folks camping in dispersed areas. No one said that they had been contacted or hassled.


mike r

Pretty much the same here.In fact getting out and recreating on open land is encouraged

You might want to hit your life alert button. You have fallen and can’t get up. It’s not unconstitutional but everyone should do it or not? Most older men that brag like you do about how hard they worked, usually aren’t as confused.

No worries, I've used a bad word or two on here before.....

I've never run into any sort of LE or forest service person on patrol in the backcountry. At least not out west. Plenty on work crews but it's easy to keep your distance.

Idaho has a number of large lava fields that the BLM has designated wilderness study areas. They're essentially wilderness but haven't been officially designated by congress. They're restricted like official wilderness areas are. You can hike a long ways out there without seeing anyone. The BLM and FS haven't closed any of these areas, just campgrounds and some boat docks.

[quote=HitnRun

You might want to hit your life alert button. You have fallen and can’t get up. It’s not unconstitutional but everyone should do it or not? Most older men that brag like you do about how hard they worked, usually aren’t as confused. [/quote]

I'm not the one confused that's for sure ,but a hell of a lot of you guys are. Most of you think plunking on a computer is hard work. It's not brag if you did it.

I have.

And what would they be checking? Your hiking permit?

They are patrolling, I imagine they check what ever they would like.
I have seen them a couple of times in the High Uintas.
I'm sure NFS/NPS in Colorado patrols their back country, and I'm pretty sure you are aware of that.

Alaska Backcountry Rangers
Yosemite Backcountry Rangers
Colorado Backcountry Rangers

Those guys are all Park Service. National parks are a small percentage of the backcountry here and there's only one park in the whole state with any real expanse of backcountry, Rocky Mtn. National Park.

The park is a tourist attraction. The park has people to take your money at the gate, gift shops and snack bars, public restrooms, crowded campgrounds, crowded "scenic overlooks," and such. Also, a metric ton of regulations to enforce, like no dogs on the trail, no camping within x feet of water, lots of special fishing regs, etc. Apples and oranges compared to forest service lands, as far as any need to patrol the backcountry.

Which is why I generally avoid the park and have never seen anyone patrolling the backcountry in my 20 years here.

I have encountered FS rangers on horseback in remote areas in Wyoming and Nevada, never been hassled, both seemed very happy w/ their jobs.


mike r

I was a Wilderness Ranger for two years in the Bob Marshall - great job for me, not so great for my wife and two young children, worked 10 days on and then 4 off.

I still wouldn’t trade those two years for anything

Well, my point wasn't to bag on rangers or say they don't exist. Just that interactions are very rare and not really a valid reason to close down backcountry. At least not in my experience.

I agree fully. Infractions were rare and most of my time was spent clearing trails and chatting with folks (well occasionally I'd have to throw a line in for biological studies :D)

I don't know much about MI, but here in MT we've been in the backcountry quite a few weekends during the CV19 lock-down, including a snowshoe this past weekend. However, it appears Glacier NP will not be opening its backcountry this summer:

https://www.nps.gov/glac/planyourvisit/backcountry.htm

"Glacier National Park has modified operations in accordance with the latest guidance from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and state and local public health authorities. Due to current and anticipated staffing and operational limitations related to the COVID-19 outbreak, combined with the uncertainty of trail and backcountry campground availability, all backcountry camping advance reservations for the 2020 season have been cancelled. This cancellation includes reservations previously processed. All advance reservation application fees will be fully refunded by May 31. The park will not accept or process advance reservations for backcountry camping for the remainder of 2020.

This web page will be updated when the park reopens and we can safely provide backcountry experiences. The park expects to issue overnight backcountry camping permits when conditions allow. Please monitor www.nps.gov/glac and park social media channels for updates on current park conditions."

The Nat. Park Svc is a bunch of liberal environmentalists. Some years ago we had a row with them in Idaho trying to shut down hunting in part of the Craters of the Moon Nat. monument where it was allowed. It literally took a special act of congress to open it up again.

GNP and YNP are both currently closed, but evidently with plans to open sometime soon????

The backcountry will be open at some point in Glacier, but all backcountry permits will be issued daily on a first come basis (most years they aside 30% of the permits to walk up- this year 100%)

Maybe this will be the year residents might actually visit the parks (other than winter)

Access restricted to public backcountry? As an American that enjoys pedaling a bicycle on singletrack, all I can say is

I was over fly fishing the bull river in NW MT recently. Didn't see another soul on the river. Ran into a forest ranger, great guy and I gave him a few flies. . Just said I quarantined for 14 days and he just smiled.

Yeah, this has been an incredible spring of fishing. Almost no tourists, plus quite a few locals that are too scared to go out.

But don't tell anyone, grin.

Are the trout wearing masks?

I wish the locals here were like your locals! They are all out here in full force.

Wish our woods were empty too. We are covered up with Washington [bleep]. Not a one been here 14 days

I wouldn't fish the popular waters until your Montana quarantine is ended. My county I think had one case and I gas up and shop before heading over and its about 90 min away. That's rude. Probably Seattle dooshbags!!!!! I go into the remote less popular areas others and typically see no one even the past few years.


Wish I could fish the fish the BF Rez now.

Wow good conversation here guys thanks.

So as has been pointed out the closure has to do with the staff’s ability to clean the facilities and to administer the backcountry permits. Permits were instituted several years ago to keep campsites from over crowding....

Anyway governess declared that starting this weekend the UP and northern LP is less locked down than the rest of the state, bless her heart.

Fortunately this means we may be able to get a shuttle and do the Pictured Rocks Natl Lakeshore from East to west as its meant to be done. Unfortunately the Natl Lakeshore hasn’t hired summer staff to clean the bathrooms in the backcountry area and won’t be open until late June.

So we’ll go. I can’t friggin wait. My 12 yo is really excited and she is such a joy to be on the trail with. We’ll be able to go nice and slow and practice leave no trace so our impact won’t be noticed by anyone else in the future.

I understand where the person was coming from who said that there are those who want to go wherever and do whatever (Stereotypical millennial) And I get it. That’s not my desire; I consider backcountry near sacred and don’t intend to abuse it.

Might get interesting if we run into the “all in this together” gestapo out there as we’re camping out (in violation of the rules) but I’m pretty good at lying low and going unnoticed.

Def will post up pics when we get back!

You have to realize there is no enforcement to these ridiculous rules. They are rules not law. However, you may still be sent before the magistrate at some point for non-compliance, but there isn't a judge in the land that could convict you of any misdeed from this unnecessary disregard of your civil rights.