In a big bore pistol, like a Glock, between the 10mm, the 45acp and the 45 GAP, which one do you prefer - and why?

I've heard it said, that of the above three, the 10mm is the one that suffers the most as barrel length comes down from full size to compact. The two 45's suffer less, depending on thier bigger bore size (11.5mm vs 10mm) and less speed for their power.Of course if the full size pistol is bought, then that would be irrelevant.

I see that the shorter GAP 45 is almost up to equalling the 45acp, with the top loads better than the regular 45 ammo, but slightly under the +P loads. Other than a smaller grip, does the Glock cartridge offer anything else over the older 45 that I should be thinking about?

In the Glock, I see that the 10mm and the 45acp have bigger hand grips than the other calibers. I have hands that are about average for a 6ft 200lb guy. I also would probably like to reload whatever I end up getting.

Which cartridges do you prefer - and why?

I've got two Glock 21's & I'm hunting for a Glock 20, or I may just buy an aftermarket barrel & 10mm mag & convert one of my 45's to 10mm. They are both such sweet shooters that I'm afraid to mess with them.

Although the brass can be expensive, IMO the 10mm gives you more flexiblity in reloading. Full house loads can safely give you approx.1200fps from a 200gr bullet.
I don't know about Canada, but in the US, 10mm ammo can be difficult to find at the local gunshop, and is rather expensive.
No other drawbacks of the 10mm that I can see.

I had a G37 untill about a month ago. Nothing wrong with the pistol BUT the .45GAP is really hard to find in my area, not many brands being made or loads, and didn't feel like reloading for another round, soooo if I had a "do over" I'd get a G22, 23, 27 or 21 30, 36 in that order. Like full size carry guns.

+ 1. That's my take as well.

If not the 10, then certainly the .45ACP. The GAP is an answer to a question VERY few asked.

Brian;

FWIW, I have average size hands, am 6'1", and about 180; roughly your size. I find the G20 to fit me well, and the 10 to be VERY controllable in that platform. If I had it to do over again, I'd get the Glock 20 and 10mm, stock up on Winchester 175 gr. STHPs, and call it good. Which, btw, is what I have done.

Thanks for the replies!

Being a total neophyte to center-fire handguns, I know nothing about the characteristics of the penetration vs expansion of the differing makes of bullets.

Which handgun bullets are extreme "expanders" (say like a Nosler Ballistic Tip in rifles) verses the brands that are extreme "penetrators" (like a Barnes "X"'s in rifles) and what other factors make you choose the bullets or brands of cartridges that you choose to go with (like the affordability of Hornady Interlocks in rifles) for the various types of shooting you do? Do you practice with the same brands that you would pack for self defence?

Thanks

Brian;

In the big bores, you don't want an "extreme expander". You want a quality JHP that will expand reliably, repeatably (round to round), and penetrate well.

In the 10, as far as factory loads go in the 10mm, the Winchester 175 gr. STHP is excellent, as are the Hornady JHP/XTPs. The custom factory loads from Buffalo Bore are simply superb. As far as reloads go, stick with Speer GoldDots and Barnes Xs, and you're golden.

Personally, I practice and carry the Winchester STHPs in my G20. They shoot great, expand and penetrate incredibly well, are relatively cheap and easy to find, and give me .41 Magnum ballistics, with 15 rounds in the magazine. I can like those traits.

Another option to explore for the deep penetrating bullets would be 200 grain and up hard cast lead bullets. However, I would want an aftermarket barrel(in the Glock) since they(Glock) warn against shooting lead as they say it builds pressures to potentially unsafe levels.
There is a company in Utah by the name of DoubleTap that makes some HOT 10mm ammo,and they have some pretty stout hunting loads that I would love to try on deer or perhaps even elk.

All that being said, I have no idea about the availability of aftermarket Glock barrels in Canada.

rockinkz. Be carefull swapping barrels and slides. IIRC the 20 slide is thicker(internally) than the 21 slide, thus making it a "stronger" platform for the higher pressure 10mm. I know the frames are the same size, but check particluars on the slides. I've seen photo's but do not rememeber where.

I have read the same thing, and that the Glock 20 Slide is actually several ounces? heavier than the slide of the G21.

I'm trying to find the pics. It was plain as day that the insides were thicker. I'd believe ounces worth.

I have never heard that a 10mm and 45ACP were interchangeable in a Glock and don't believe they are.

I'd stay away from the GAP. It offers nothing a 45ACP won't do ballistically.

There are lots of good bullets for either pistol. Hornady XTP's and Remington Golden Sabers are good too. I'm sure there are more, but those are what I have experience with, along with some already mentioned.

If you want a high intensity pistol round with out going to a Desert Eagle, a 460 Rowland might be worth a look. It will kick a 45 caliber 185 out at 1350+ and a 230 at 1200+ but is a reload only proposition. It uses unique brass but the dies and bullets are the same as any 45ACP uses.

The 460 Rowland is quite the cartridge. I read about it in my "Glock" book. I wonder how difficult it is to modify a big Glock to shoot them? I'm also wondering what the damage would be in $ to my wallet too.

Not worth it, IMHO, considering the trade-offs and the ready availability of the 10mm.

I've never heard of a Glock/Rowland conversion. Did your book mention if someone did one?

Mine is based on the 1911 and was supposed to be a drop in, but my Kimber didn't think it was, so Clark did the fitting free of charge. They're very nice folks.

It's got a larger frontal area, with a bit more energy, and a good variety bullets are easier to find than with the 10mm, but you won't find any loaded 460 Rowland on the shelf, either. One day that might change, but I'll load my own anyway.

Ever hear of the 45 Super? Used to be a smith out of Texas that converted the 1911 45ACP to the super. The super is the same size as the 45ACP. Would shoot so the smith said a 230 grain bullet to around a 1,000 to 1100 FPS. Certainly have to reload although +P loads should work okay. Just thought I would throw this out here.

Brian planning on moving to the States soon? Your one legal immigrant we wouldn't mind.

To heck with it, I'm going with the 400 Corbon, basically 10mm Power from a 45 ACP cartridge, only thing is that it is a bottleneck like the 357 Sig. Les

357 Sig never has taken off much out here. I can like a 10mm though.

The 400 Corbon is a 45 ACP necked down to 40 Cal, get about the same performance from it that you do with the 10mm, puls the grip isn't too big for my hand in the XD-45 Tactical. Also notice the ft pounds.

400 Cor-Bon

Corbon Factory Ballistics
135 GR. JHP 1450FPS/630FTLBS
150 GR. JHP 1350FPS/607FTLBS
165 GR. JHP 1300FPS/619FTLBS


10MM

Corbon Factory Ballistics
135 GR. JHP 1400FPS/588FTLBS
150 GR. JHP 1325FPS/585FTLBS
165 GR. JHP 1250FPS/537FTLBS

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_25&products_id=45

Caliber : 10mm

Bullet : 135gr. Nosler Jacketed Hollow Point.

Ballistics : 1600fps / 767 ft.lbs. - Glock 20

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_25&products_id=38

Caliber : 10mm

Bullet : Gold Dot Lineup

Ballistics : 155gr. @ 1475fps / 750ft/lbs- Glock 20

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_25&products_id=35

Caliber : 10mm

Bullet : Gold Dot Lineup

Ballistics : 165gr. @ 1400fps/ 718ft/lbs- Glock 20



your comparison is FLAWED to show the 400 corebon to be supperior to the 10mm when proper ammos used, which ITS NOT

these are DOUBLETAPS FIGURES I regularly EXCEED those velocities with that ammo in my 6" JARVIS barrel glock 20s

http://www.lonewolfdist.com/products.asp?prod=4&curRecIdx=41#Jarvis


BTW

http://www.lonewolfdist.com/products.asp?prod=4

a 16" barrels available if you want a 7",10" ETC.

These were right from the Corbon sight for their factory ammo, and you know Corbon laods hot most of the time anyways. So no, it isn't that flawed, biased yes, flawed no. Les

I'd suggest you re-think the 400 Corbon. There are scant factory loads available and reloading a bottle necked case in an autoloader is problematic at best.

In that neck of the woods 10mm would be my choice hands down.

Les;

I just remembered that you (also, like me) are a 1911A1 slut.

Take a look at what Dan Wesson has to offer in 10mm...

Will do VA. But you know I'm a sucker for oddball caliber's too. Les

The 10 is an oddball...

I called the fellas over at Lone Wolf & they said they've got a KKM barrel that is a swap for my Mod 21 barrel, no need to swap slides. Think they might just be trying to sell me a $180.00 barrel??

ask more questions, before spending your cash,but Ive always been treated right and given good info by them.
BTW one of my LEO friends owns a 10mm glock but his department gives him 40 S&W ammo to practice with, he obviousy can,t use 40 S&W in a 10mm but he got a 40 S&W barrel that dropped right into his 10mm from lone wolf he uses to burn up free ammo and he ocassionally carries it as a 40 S&W caliber back-up to his swat supplied arms (MP5)since he qualified with it

KKM-G20D1 KKM Glock M/20 40 S&W $179.95

http://www.lonewolfdist.com/products.asp?prod=4&curRecIdx=61#KKM

Here's some load data for the 450 SMC, which can be fired in a 1911 pistol after a recoil spring change.

165 gr HP: 1450 FPS / 770 ft/lbs 5" 1911.

I used to have a G20. There's no real reason for it after getting this ammo for a 1911. A side benefit is that you can fire "standard" 45 ACP loads in the same pistol without any problems by just changing the load. MI VHNTR

No VA, how many Factory pistol come in 400 Crobon, and how many come in 10MM, you know what I mean about obscure, guess it is a sickness. But Am looking at the Dan Weeson in 10mm.

My next 1911A1 will be a Dan Wesson Bobtail in 10mm.

Oddball is one thing. Wildcat only is another...

That said, wait 'til you get the next PM...

If you want ODDBALL get a 40 super. 135gr @ 1800fps.


I'd get the 10mm. Strictly because I like shooting things @ 100yds+. For me to hit a bowling pin @ 100yds with the 45acp I had to aim over the pin about 6inches. 10mm I can aim just around the neck portion of the pin and knock it flat.

I've got a Springfield LongSlide V-16 factory built for 45 Super. I get 1200 fps with 230g Golden Sabres. Since it's ported the recoil isn't much more than a regular full house 45. Hits like a truck on the other end, no FTFs either. Too bad they don't make them anymore ...



(not a picture of my actual gun, mine's prettier lol, I'll have to take a picture)


Chuck

Glock 10mm all the way, I have been shooting them for years and can find nothing that suits me better. That said, I am looking to add to the stable by adding a Dan Wesson commander bobtail in 10mm in the very near future.

I like 10mm but my 1911s are in .45.

It's .45acp for me all the way in 1911 platform. If I want more power, the .460 Rowland has been calling my name so I'll likely build 1 in the near future.

colorado i built my 45 super on the colt gov't frame i personally love the round

The Cor-Bon is an interesting round, but it has one severe limitation (to my way of thinking at least). 165 grain is the max bullet weight. Because of the cartridge shape, any heavier bullet will not stay within the maximum OAL.

Brian,

Give real consideration to the Dan Wesson in 10mm; I think they're the way to go. Especially if you plan on handloading. Handloaded ammunition is a serious no-no in a Glock and can lead to ka-BOOM!

I'm a big fan of both the 10mm and the .45 ACP. I am not a fan of the Glock pistols. Crude triggers is one, and no ability to pass the "frissbee test" is another. I also handload. I suspect there is something to this handloading caution concerning Glock pistols.
On the 400 Cor-Bon, I don't like the idea of a pistol being loaded to 10mm pressures, i.e. 37,500 vs. the 18-20,000 lb. pressures of the the 400 CB. Not a good idea. The 10mm is fussy and pressure sensitive enough. But at least it was designed with a very strong case.
To me the major advantage to a 10 is that you can shoot the longer heavy bullets at good velocity for both penetration and range. I can't get that much out of any reasonable .45 ACP load. My favorite handload in the 10, for instance, is point blank to well past 100 yds. Hitting something at 200-400 yds. is quite possible.
But, in the .45, the same pistol that shoots my all around 200 gr. SWC or 185 gr. HP's is also a very nice, very accurate target pistol. Plenty of power for self defense and an excellent small game load. Step up to the 230 gr. Hydrashoks, it will take a back seat to nothing in a gun fight. E

Kevin what is the problem with reloaded ammo in a glock???

http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/glock-kb-faq.html

Could be exciting.

BMT

2 - SV's .40cal;
2 - STI's .40cal
1 - Nighthawk .45cal
1 - Bren Ten 10mm

I like the ten so much I'm going to rechamber one of the STI's in it

With that in mind, I'd say the 45ACP would be the best place to start. I was never "into" handguns until I started shooting the 45ACP (in a 1911). I now do quite a bit more shooting with handguns than anything else and still shoot the 45ACP but in a G21SF. The 10mm obviously has an edge in ballistics but, at least to me, the 45ACP makes shooting a lot more fun which trumps ballistics every time IMO.....

gbp - that's a nice set of irons ya got there.....Welcome to the 'Fire!!

Ab-sooo-lutely LOVE that Bren Ten; almost give my left nut for one of those.

Damned shame they're outta production.

MM

My 1911 is currently in 45 Super. 200 gr RNFP @ 1285 fps. IT rocks on both ends. It is accurate, fast and hits like a truck as Colorado said.

Love the .45 Auto, am goo goo over the 10mm. Favorite is Kimber Custom Target II, new night sights, checkered front strap at custom shop. Wicked accuracy and reliability. I shoot stout load of 2400 w/ 180 gr bullets, mostly Nosler and Speer. I get over 1200 fps.

The first mistake to avoid, and the mistake made most often by rifle loonies, is to select the cartridge before than handgun.

Model 700's, 70's, and 77's have their differences, but nothing like the differences in the handgun world. The same rifle is available in a dozen or more chamberings, so the proper cartridge can be debated.

With a handgun, select the platform first and then the cartridge.

I have been shooting Glock 45 ACp for twenty years. I am about your size and chose the 21 because of the grip size. Ilike the G21 over the G 20 because of CONTROLABILITY I am looking for a G 30 for CCW becuae it is controlable and a 45ACP

The 45 acp is the best of the three, especially for self defense. The 10mm and 45 GAP are basically dead ducks. Besides you can't argue with longetivity.