Just suppose you had to compete with a pistol that met these requirements, what would it be?

Double stack
Minimum 5# trigger pull (DAO)
Completely factory-No internal or external mods

What would it be for fast accurate shooting, at a max distance of 25 yards?

SIG full size, in whatever caliber fit the bill.

I vote Sig also

S&W M&P.

Does Para make the LDA anymore? That might fit the bill.

That is a very good question. I need time to think about it.

But then again I would go with the Glock 41.

92F

STI 1911

H&K USP

That I already own:

Beretta 92FS Brigadier INOX - 9MM
Fabrique Nationale Hi-Power - 40 S&W

SIG P226

That's almost certainly what it'll be, unless I can find a significantly better option.



I had forgotten about the LDA, but that could work if I could find one.



If I can get STI to put a 5.5# trigger in a 9mm 2011 that would be the leading the pack. But dang that'd be expensive.

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Part of the hang up is "no modifications at all". Even an M&P Pro wouldn't meet the trigger requirement, they're too light. I can't even modify a gun to make the trigger heavier.

Glock 17

I'd choose the M&P for sure.

All the way

Walther PPQ Long Slide.

And I've owned or own every pistol mentioned in this thread except an STI.

One of the third generation S&W's would fit the bill.

I like 92; like this 92G Brigadier Elite:

Does the LDA have a 5 lb trigger? I would go with that or a Springfield XDM Competition.

�..what the heck kind of competition is this? Who set the rules and why in the world did they pick that mix of criteria? Just curious.

World Police Games, they'll will be in Virginia next year.

They specify 5# trigger and no mods. I added DAO because I can't think of a SA pistol with a pull that heavy and DA/SA messes with my head. I say double stack because I don't want to be reloading while everyone else is shooting, there's not a single stack division.

The rules aren't finalized yet and I won't know for a while that I'm for sure going on "work time", so there's still a lot up in the air. I'm just thinking out loud here.

M&P.



Travis

Walther PPQ M2. As ergonomic as an M&P, far better stock trigger, and I'd be willing to bet that a comparison with a machine rest would show it to have better mechanical accuracy.

(I'm talking 9mmP here....I have no idea what a comparison with .40 S&W would show.)

Or an HK with the light LEM trigger.

The early third gen (pre-TSW) Smiths have a really nice DAO trigger, plus you can get one in all steel to soak up the recoil.

I'm betting near all of these fellas throwing the M&P up as the best choice have never sniffed a PPQ M2, let alone fired one.

Just for the hell of it, I pulled out a Glock 19 3rd Gen, S&W M&P 9, Springfield XD 9 Tactical and Walther PPQ M2 and compared the triggers side by side.

I also compared the triggers to a Walther p99 AS and Glock 23 2nd gen which also meet the OP's specs, but since they are .40 S&W, I will keep them separate.

I dare say a 2nd gen Beretta 92 would possibly be the best of all, but its disqualified by being an DA/SA. A Glock 34 may have been a good choice as well, but doesn't meet the 5 lb trigger req.

Too bad I got rid of my LDA a few months ago or we could have included that.

The PPQ trigger won hands down. Even compared to it's brother the P99 AS, there was no contest.

In order of my preference based solely on trigger:

PPQ
*P99 AS
M&P
Glock 19
*Glock 23
XD Tactical (great ergonomics, shytty trigger)


* .40S&W

Based upon my just-completed testing, I'd have to go with the new PPQ M2 5-in. pistol. Great trigger, good accuracy and ergonomics, and nary a bobble. This model is, in fact, targeted specifically at competitive shooters.

I fell for the PPQ hype early on and got one. Positively hated the trigger action feel at the range. I traded it to a friend for his nearly new-in-box Sig P220 SAO. Still very happy with the trade.

I bet you are happy with a trade of a $600 gun for a $1100 gun.

However, you're comparing apples to grapefruit. Of course a decent SA can beat the trigger on any DAO.

Let's compare a Sako bolt action trigger to an AR next.

I recently had an H&K USP Expert in 9mm. I'm not sure about the trigger poundage, but otherwise I really liked that pistol. It came with 18 round magazines when fitted for the factory speed chute option.

I can love a Beretta Brigadier DAO.



Travis

I guess because it's been a few years since I spent any trigger time with one, but I can't believe I forgot a great design that would probably meet your requirements: A SIG (P229,P226) with the DAK (Double Action-Kellerman) trigger. I really liked the 229 I shot with the DAK trigger: Around six-pound pull, no stacking, decent reset. Also a double-strike capability. I never put a trigger gauge on the one I shot, but most published data I've seen lists a trigger pull of 5.5 to 6.5 pounds.

XDM

If the Beretta couldn't be used, then I think, for my taste, it's a toss up between as M&P 9L Pro C.o.R.E. or a Glock 17.

Not really sure how the weight of the stock M&P Pro trigger would come in, but the stock trigger on the G-17 could be tweaked & still remain fully stock...........but as I remember, you are not much of a Glock fan.

MM

Sig Tac-Ops 40.

Gunner

I really like Beretta D models, and a light loaded 9mm would not need the Brigadier slide, but I fear the OP would not like the long reset. The Sig DAK trigger is more forgiving because it has a shorter reset, although short stroking to the first reset point raises the pull weight a pound or so.

But, for a game such as this, it sounds like the rules were written for a Glock, M&P or XD, or Jerry Miculek with a badge.

I second that motion.

Oh,I had a Para LDA once. Although the trigger was not heavy, to me it seemed to stack a little.

a DAO rig in a "competition event" will make for some tougher sledding, but with concerted efforts, you could definitely play ball...

i've always felt that one of the sterling virtues of the dao rig is the absolute simplicity of the manual of arms with respect to the specific realm of lesser experienced ccw chaps--though occasionally, some experienced pistoleros utilize them too.

regarding shooting competitively, you can't go wrong with the da/sa system in the sig or usp platforms--in years past, i've used both in some matches, and have won some events using both of these rigs.

if the "da/sa issue" of the first shot being da as you then roll into sa "messes with your head", this can be easily overcome--always shoot sa in competition. on your draw and presentation, as the pistol comes into your support hand, the thumb of the support hand instantly and deftly cocks the hammer--just like in the two-handed usage of the colt single action army revolver--very efficient, and away you go with a consistent pull.

in my experience, there is more muzzle rise in the usp than in the sig, but i've also shot some of my highest scores with the usp--a stellar platform, and i especially like it in .45 acp.

one virtue of the usp is the ability to swing into different variants. if i recall, the variants 5 and 6--if you desire the control lever, or the variant 7--if sans a lever-- will fulfill your criteria of dao (though i personally prefer the variant 3--or 4, if a lefty--in conjunction with thumb cocking, equals great medicine).

I have an XDM9 that sounds like your description and is sweet to shoot. Try one.

A stock Hi-Power will have a heavier than 5 lb trigger. Probably more like 7 or 8.