Another of one of my pistols is on the way back to the Manufacturer because the trigger won't work. This time it was my SCCY CPX-1. Last week it was my S&W Bodyguard. I am either bewitched by faulty triggers, or paranoid. Right after I shot the SCCY , (Or Failed to Shoot) I tried my S&W Shield and my Taurus G2 and both worked fine, so it isn't me. Is the failure to fire typical now day's or am i just unlucky?

You're not unlucky. You're buying cheap guns, and reaping the benefits.

Ever wonder how it might feel to get rid of all the cheap guns and have just a few good ones?

I told you to get a Hi-Point, but you didn't listen.

Ya get what ya pay for

Naw......Jimenez are the best.

Better than Lorcin?

i think the old Davis pockets were the best!

Try to find an old RG 22 revolver.

It happens, even to the best of them. One of the worst handguns I ever owned was one I paid over a grand for.

Buy an LC9 and be done with it.

Or a Glock 43.

Better than Lorcin?[/quote

And a Taurus...

This. I once paid well over a grand for a gun that didnt make it through the first mag without having to be sent back to the factory

A person in the industry once wrote this about the gun buying public, and their proclivity to buy cheap piece of crap guns:

"If you sold chocolate lollipops for $2 and dog [bleep] on a stick for $1.75, the American gun-buying public would suck a turd every time."

They were completely spot on.

90% of gun buyers will buy a cheap, sub par gun, and then brag about what a great deal they got on it. They will ignore the fact that every other magazine they have issues, or just don't shoot it much at all, and carry it anyway, and use it as some sort of talisman. Hope being a strategy.

It makes no sense to me why a person would buy 3 or 4 garbage guns, of questionable reliability, instead of one high quality gun, from a manufacturer with a reputation of building reliable guns.

I would rather have 1 K Frame Smith & Wesson Model 19, than 4 Taurus revolvers any day.

Roger that.
Bob

or better, maybe 3 or 4 k frames model 19's, about the perfect revolver.

I don't have any high dollar handguns, or any cheap stuff.

My handgun battery consists of only two brands, Ruger and Glock. Wasn't even a deliberate choice. Just practical quality at a fair price. No lemons among them.

Ruger and Glock are perfect examples of how inexpensive does not always mean "cheap." The value proposition from both brands is the best in the business, in my opinion.

Yep...

$550 for a glock plastic gun is cheap?

About right from my observations. I know a couple guys that brag about how many firearms they own, but when asked what they have they get defensive about their yard sale beaters. Having thirty $70 single shot Rossi's doesn't excite me much.

Zackly

For what you get? Pennies on the dollar for what it takes to get a "good" 1911 to work as well.

After thinning the herd I seem to be left with 3 Colt autos and 1 D frame revolver, 3 S&W revolvers, a Walther P22 and High Standard B1B .22. Calibers range from .45acp, .38spl, .380acp, .32 S&W, .32 H&R Mag, .25acp to the .22's. ALL are dead nuts reliable and all I need.

For no other reason than being what I can shoot well, and no problems shooting, I have ended up with 3 Smiths (M29, M38, M&P9c), 1 Colt DickSpec and a Ruger BH Colt, the latter 2 being bequeaths.

And I have been through a lot of pistols.....

Frankly, I'm still po'd at smith for the clinton gun thing, but I've had no problems with the guns and they hit where I aim. (None of them have locks)

I had a Hi-Point. Sold it because it weighed as much as an Elephant gun and I could barely work the slide. So far I'm down to four with no issues Two Taurus and two S&W's. I haven't put enough rounds through the Taurus' but so far my S&W SD40VE and M&P Shield 40 are working well. I also sold a Ruger LC9 because i thought the trigger was poor. Later I found out that they make a trigger kit for about $35 that you can install yourself. I'll give SCCY a chance to redeem themselves and if they don't get it right, it will be history also.

My cousin's husband was telling me about his SCCY CPX-1. I had never heard of it till then. They're real cheap, so hard to be surprised if they have quite a few lemons.

Who the f&ck is paying $550 for a Glock? Bought a G17 with 3 mags for $409 out the door.

You live in a better place than me. Gen4 G17 or 19 here is about $550.00

Best I've ever heard it said about cheap guns. The best fail occasionally. The cheap you can count on failing regularly. Hasbeen

Exaggerate much?

Seriously - who is SCCY? What kind of track record do they have?

You might get lucky with new entries to the market, but how can you reasonably expect the same service and reliability that you would from a S&W, Glock, Ruger, or the like?

This.

I have "several" hand guns in the safe. Some were top dollar, like the Wilson Combat CQB compact. Some were less expensive, like the Taurus 85 snubby. You do get a better hand gun when you buy 'up' but as others have pointed out, even the best can, and do, have problems.
Beating up a fellow who was asking for a little advice or help, or validation though, is not helpful.

Well said. $500-1000 for a handgun that could be called upon to save your or your families life is beyond cheap.

Think about how much you spend in just one year to insure a vehicle, and then try and put a dollar value on life.

Now you've gone and stirred up a hornet's nest!

If you are serious about protecting your family and your life then suck it up and buy a Glock

It's nor hard to find police trade-in Glocks in the $300-350. Most are 40SW. You can run with that, or drop a 9mm or 357 Sig barrel in them.

There's a quality weapon at a very reasonable price.


https://gun.deals/used-guns

https://www.sportsmansoutdoorsuperstore.com/category.cfm/sportsman/used-firearms

https://www.classicfirearms.com/glock-22-le-used-w-1-mag-night-sights

You don't buy many pistols?

I've only owned 25? 1911s and have replaced them all.

Getting a 1911 to run as dependably as a Glock is expensive. Getting any garden-variety Glock to run is a given.

If you actually use your everyday carry gun to fire shots in defense, wait until they "hold as evidence" your $2,300 WIlson Combat basic pistol. Not including whatever you have tied up in the holster, lights, grips with laser, etc., etc. True story with a friend who is retired detective, and still can't get his pistol back.

I'll just go out and buy another LE Glock 43 with night sights, add a laser and light, and still be under $600.

And the trigger will be exactly the same as the last one, and it won't need "tuning" to get it to shoot.

Wait, I already have a safe with numerous backups in it....

Savy?

He asked if he was 'just unlucky', seems many here were only explaining how to make your own luck.

I couldn't disagree with that if I wanted to. I gave up on 1911's in the late 90's.

I won't argue the point that you are very likely to spend considerably more to get a truly reliable 1911 than to do so with a Glock. But pennies on the dollar? That's a huge stretch. As I implied - you exaggerate.........unless you mean possibly 60 cents on the dollar. But then, why not say "half as much"?

I gave up on them in the late 80's, IIRC - but then I learned what it takes to make one work.

I learned what makes a Glock work too, pulling the trigger.

I'm not prone to drive a new car off the lot just so I can put in a new rear axle and transmission so I know I can get to work the next day with it.

YMMV

I hear ya. Not all 1911's need things fixed or replaced to rely on them. But it's a really good idea to check to make sure that axle will spin. Knowing what to look for really helps. The guy who isn't interested should look elsewhere. Nothing wrong with that - it just is. But that doesn't mean it takes moolah bucks to have a reliable 1911.

No, just a miracle...

Damn, I must have a few miracles....

I know you are probably talking about your Super Blackhawk, but it reminded me of my buddy's P90.


So many years ago, I want to say maybe 1993 or 1994 (ish) a college buddy bought a Ruger P90 .45 from the guy who owned the service station he worked part time at. It was as ergonomic as a 2x4 and goofy looking. I was giving him a hard time since I had a 70 series Colt ( I was hugely proud of). That weekend we went out and shot some of my USPSA loads. That P90 not only out shot my slicked up 70 series, it had less recoil. The DA trigger was mushy as heck but it was totally reliable and shot like a match gun. You rarely see them around these days, but I ended up playing with a couple more over the years, and the 45 versions were all the same. They were all stupidly accurate.

I picked up a P90 years ago, I don't recall exactly what I paid but it was too cheap to pass up. Perfect description, big, blocky and ugly with a mushy trigger, but 100% reliable and accurate. One of those guns that you never really like, but no way will you part with it.

This is one of my best shooting 45's but it is like packing a anvil on your hip.

You might be surprised to find that the S&W 645 specs at about an ounce LESS than a standard 1911.

There is something about them that makes them look huge though.




They are pretty awesome guns and solid shooters.

An Ed Brown "Kobra Carry" is $2,695. A Glock 19 is maybe $550

$550/$2695 = 0.204. Or 20 cents on the dollar.

And I'll bet the Glock is still more reliable.

True, I agree.

Although, I have had $500-$600 used 1911 pistols (all full size Govt models in .45) that ran flawlessly, but I mostly just use Glocks now.

Of course, we all know darn well the guy buying SCCY, Taurus, and S&W Sigma series pistols isn't going to even consider an Ed Brown. I'd bet if he sold all the junk guns, he'd have enough to buy one decent Glock, with enough left over for some good sights. Some get stuck on the "cheap" mindset though, and low price becomes more appealing than quality.

This mirrors my own experience with a P90 I bought around that time. I still have it and the high dollar Colt I got around the same time. The Colt has never shot as well as the P90.

That P90 is like an investment cast Glock.

The interesting thing is that there are some real bargains to be had for around the same price as your typical new Taurus, or new SCCY, if a person is willing to buy used, and shop around a bit, provided they are semi knowledgeable.

Right now there are literally thousands of 3rd Gen S&W Police trade in semi autos floating around at pretty decent prices. Many are cosmetically rough from lots of holster time, but mechanically sound, and for the average guy who is not going to put 10K through his CCW in the next 10 years (or lifetime probably) they would make more sense than an SCCY.

To a lesser extent the same holds true for metal framed police trade-in Sigs.

I would take a used, scratched up S&W 5906 9mm over a new Taurus Curve and Sccy pistol any day!

I saw a S&W 3913 Ladysmith with two magazines for $325 the other day; kind of regretting not buying it.

I've got 4 Glocks and 5 Rugers,

On the Ruger side, my SBH is the oldest and first handgun, going back to 1978. There's also a Security Six 357, Blackhawk 45 convertible, Single-Six convertible, and a 22/45.

Glocks include a 17, 19, 21, and 22.



Enough to cover most bases, but still a few like-to-haves.

Great value in a new pistol , Canik TP-9

I saw quite a few P90's at my LE qualifications for a few years and your experience with them mirrors mine. I'd probably have bought one but they fit my hand about as poorly as any modern pistol I ever tried.

Someone I used to work with was at a shoot where there was at least one Gunzine writer there.
The writer stated that in today's world, the purchaser/shooter seems to be the QA/QC for many companies.

I have a Charter Arms Bulldog that I literally threw to the back of the safe several years ago, were issues from the day I bought it til I thew it back there.

Fellow that used to shoot at the same range I used to attend, had a Colt 1911 that neither local Colt authorized person NOR Colt was ever able to make fire over one or two rounds in succession. Amazingly Colt would not replace it. That advertisement made several members that I know of decide to buy another brand.

A lot of good advice. What really gets me is the manufacturers' failure to test the gun before shipping it. I bought a S&W Bodyguard with a thumb safety that would not operate. How many minutes would it take for an Inspector to flip the safety off and on. Incredible! I just returned another weapon because there was no serial number on it. It was on the box, but not on the weapon. I chastised the Dealer on a gun that would not fire for not at least pulling the trigger. His response was that he sells so many guns that his people don't have the time to check them all. That may be true, but a cursory exam that would only take a minute or two is not out of order. Pulling the trigger and working the safety or slide catch does not take a lot of time. Sending it back to the Mfr. is a pain and it's almost like passing the buck. The dealer won't accept responsibility and the Mfr. just sits there with a nod and might fix the problem when they get around to it. The SCCY that I sent back for FTF had an empty cartridge with an inspector's name on it. How in blazes did he fire it when the trigger would not work? Truth be known, he had a pocket full of spent cartridges and he just threw one in the box during coffee break.

I guess I assumed that everyone does like I do and inspects the gun they are purchasing before sealing the deal. Guess I was wrong. I can't imagine walking out the door with a gun that has a non-functional safety or trigger.

You seem to have a lot of bad luck with firearms.

I do most of my range time during the week and shoot mostly alone. On any weekend though there are plenty of examples of pistols of all types that just don't function like they oughtta. And kudos to glock for the consistent quality of their build, but they still have their share of malfunctions on the range.

My personal sampling of 1911s is small. I bought a colt gold cup in 1979 and it ran without a hitch for many thousands of rounds. I eventually traded it. I bought a RIA govt model 10 years ago. I was surprised to find that ot would only occasionally fire a full mag of rounds without failure. Bought some metal form magazines a week after purchase of the pistol, and have not had a failure since, including a no-clean 3000 round test.

As a part of the 3000 round test I included CCI shot loads, and some french marked WWII surplus that looked like they were loaded with coal. I also threw in a mixed box of loads that I bought at an estate sale. Some handloads, some factory. Zero failures.

I did modify the RIA gun with better sights, but as for reliability it is as I bought it exept for the different mags.

And I paid $275 for the RIA pistol. Wasn't looking for a bargain, but an acquaintance was trying to trade it at a local shop and had no luck. Later that day, at the range we were talking and he offered it to me. Bought it on impulse.

One of my better such impulses...

MOGC, Bad luck isn't the word for it. Terrible luck is better. Seems like Taurus is the only Manufacturer that I have not had to send a weapon back to. Even Smith & Wesson has had to fix a couple of my pistols and they supposedly have good quality firearms. I think I'm done and I'm going to stick with what I have that functions.

ROTFLMAO... SOOOOOoooo, true..

Best post of the week... Thank you MS..

As someone posted earlier, you make your own luck with this stuff. Your Smith & Wesson sigma series pistols are cheap guns just like everything else you listed.

I think you're missing the correlation between price and quality control. If you buy bottom dollar products, you're not paying for quality control, you get to be the QC guy, as you've discovered.

A bunch of police trade-in Glocks are out there right now for $300-$350; just one of those would serve you better than all the other cheap guns you've mentioned here.

Very inexpensively manufactured and very reliable handguns with excellent Q.A. are currently being made - They don't sell dirt cheap, yet.
That's been the major industry development since the early 90s.
Beneath this manufacturing revolution, there's still a healthy market for junk firearms.

Glad to be of service!

Funny how the truth can often ruffle feathers.

I don't really need any service type semi auto pistols, but the 3rd Gen Smiths right now are really a bargain. The only long term issue is lack of spare parts. If a guy had a cigar box full of the most common spare parts for a couple of 3913s, 4506s, and 4516s he could really be set. I have literally watched some of those guns feed empty, fired cases, during malfunction drills on various ranges. Not always, but often enough to be impressed with how totally reliable the guns were/are.

At the zenith of the 3rd Gen series popularity in policing, I was already a rabid 1911 fan, and just starting to really appreciate Glocks. I did not care for traditional double action trigger systems. These days they are not nearly the handicap, shooting wise, as I thought they were 20 years ago. While I have a 2nd Gen 645, and a 3rd Gen 5906, I would really love to own a 4506-1. Unfortunately money is tight at the moment, so it will have to wait. That said, if I was smart (and nobody ever really accused me of that) I would stock up on used parts for one now. That would force me to buy one later. Kind of like buying a scope, them being forced to buy a rifle for it!

About 15 years ago, a group of guys I know bought a bunch of .308 Enfields for $89 a piece. They were griping that they could not get spare magazines. I told them they could get all they wanted for $89 a piece. One guy rubbed his chin and said, “Oh, yeah, it even comes with a free rifle.”

The prices these days on numerous types of guns, especially ARs are the lowest I can recall in decades. When the pendulum swings back the other way, and it will, guys will be crying saying "remember when you could get a real COLT 6920 for 8 bills!". Heck I have seen a couple places selling COLT 6920s minus the furniture (which makes sense since almost everyone swaps it out to what they like anyways) for under 700.

Cabela's weekly flyer is showing the DPMS "Oracle" - basic M4 style AR without sights - for $474.99 or $399.99 after rebate. Not sure what sights go for but with a bit of judicious shopping a fellow could probably be out the door for well under five bills for a decent, working AR.

I'm very happy with the FN15 you recommended for me last year and have no need of a stockpile of AR types, but for the prices they are now you might be right about stocking up for the inevitable swing of the pendulum. I still remember all you could buy genuine Colt Series 70's for $300 not to mention the $400 Pythons, and that was in the mid 80's.

For a defensive pistol, I don't even trust the biggest names. I typically won't buy a self defense handgun that hasn't been out on the market for at least 5 years. Because even the best of them put out pistols before they're ready. Most every name brand maker has a horror story in their past...and most in the not all that distant past.

So an un-proven pistol, from an un-proven manufacturer...and the OP's shocked and surprised at less than stellar results.

Dood, no kidding!!! I have a couple of AR's, but I've always kinda wanted a 6720 and I can't ignore what they're going for right now. But I also want the new Bren 805...decisions!!

Life is like a game of chance you pay your nickle and take your chances.....

Glock 9mm's and Colt AR15's seem to always work for me, I have a few of them. Lately I have been getting good results with SW shields, the 45 is surprisingly accurate, it shoots about like my Kimber 1911, maybe better.

I regret selling my 4506. Perhaps I need to focus on 3rd Generation S&W's this year....

For something that you can bet your life on? Yep.


mike r

FN and COLT being long time defense manufacturers are solid choices to keep for yourself. The budget guns make more sense for buying to sell later when the next disaster happens and people lose their minds,thinking the world is going to end, JADE HELM Operators are going to declare martial law, and take their guns, and the government is going to put everybody in FEMA camps.

Mackay.....I just now noticed the change in your sig line.

Keep that chair handy.....