Following up on several earlier threads about the decline of the .40 S&W. I was in one of largest LGS last evening. He has perhaps 1000 handguns of various types, new and used for sale, and also has a range operation on the ground floor of the building. Over the used handgun rack, he had a sign offering "One month's free membership with each used handgun purchased. .40 S&W models only."

Seems that I might want to stock up on .40 S&W ammo before it disappears as obsolete.

I still like my .40. Easy to shoot and accurate as much as I can shoot. I notice there are some going pretty cheap. I may have to pick up another.

i don't know about obsolete, but with the police tradein's some pretty good deals. aim surplus sent me an email last night, $249dollars for a glock 22 cosmetically blemish, holster wear, with one magazine.
that's a pretty good deal.

There are lots of 40 shooters unmoved by fads or market trends; plus an enormous amount of .40 surplus pistols being sold and prices that make manufacturers think twice before they crank new ones out.

I don't think the cartridge is in danger of becoming obsolete.

To many people basing their decisions from other people’s opinions.

I read it the August edition of.... pick a rag.

I think 9mm ammo is just too cheap, and most buyers look at ammo cost as part of the purchase decision.
Discounted 40's are advertised here at attractive prices. I personally would pay more for a 9mm just to match my inventory.
The last thing I want is another set of dies, bullets, and brass laying around.
40 is at the top of a saturated market.

It’s a great round, part way in power between 9mm and 45 ACP, but allowing a capacity close to that of 9mm handguns. The only problem with it is that its recoil is snappy, even compared to 45 ACP. Not uncomfortable in the least, but round to round accurate hits, just on plain physics, are slower. I can even shoot my Glock 30 better than my Glock 22, for example.

I think the idea of the .40 S&W being "obsolete" is about the stupidest thing I've heard this year. There are SO many guns in SO many hands ... that's like declaring the .38 special obsolete because the cops don't carry it anymore. Obsolete is when ammo is produced in small batches every 4-5 years and the rest of the time unobtainable. The .40 is so established it will not reach that state in my lifetime and likely not in my kid's lifetime.

Tom

Its the least popular around my neck of the woods. Bullets have gotten better and the .40 can't compete with the 9x19s capacity, availability, and controllability.

People who own them will defend them to the grave because they own one. People buying new guns have spoken with their wallets.

Myself...i own neither...just un-biased observations

Pure gold.
Word.

Ordinally rank the top 3 major semi auto handgun cartridges. 9mm, 45 ACP, 40 S&W. Now what up and coming major semi auto handgun cartridge is going to put the 40 in 4th?

Now really, does anyone actually care about this at all?

Like the person who came in third in the last presidential election is bragging about it lol.

.38 Special is still hugely popular in compact revolvers popular for concealed carry.

I tried to make it clear for you to understand.

My 40's ain't going nowhere. It is the best option for the platform and the would be task at hand. I'll leave the 9's for the ladies and the tender men.

No need to apologize, just don't get over your head on the math next time and you'll be okay.

Fewer guns may be chambered for it in the future, but the ammo will be around longer than I will - or any of you for that matter.

I went to look at the most recent ATF stats to see how bad 40 is nosediving but unfortunately they lump 40 in with 45 (don't ask) so you can't really tell, but I found an interesting tidbit about 38. Whereas Smith makes a lot more 38s than 357s, with Ruger it's the opposite. I guess that's the single action effect.

Look at Rugers line.
They aren't really in the 38 business.

Not many 38 specific options.
LCR is the one that 38 makes most sense.
Why would you even want an sp101 in 38?

Exactly...

Just like the 9mm in, what was it, 1948?

Have patience. Another FBI report will come along.

LOL, JohnW.



http://www.thesixgunjournal.net/the-modern-9mm/

Eye roll.

The .45 was dead too. As was the 38. And the 9mm.

Yawn

Most people use their .357 Magnum revolvers as .38 Specials, in terms of what they shoot the most through them.

.40 is a good caliber IMO, and will be fine.
There's some "surplus dumping" going on these days, which is really just a good opportunity to buy.
Might be a good time to pick up ammo in bulk too. Some places will be looking to move inventory while there's a slump. I'm not selling mine that's for sure.

1000 fps with a 180gr, 1100 fps with a 165gr, 1200 fps with a 155gr. More fps for all with +P. The least aggressive bullet of the lot being a flat point with a wide meplate. Is there something I missed? Plus,some hollow points (Montana Gold) seem to have a fairly hard alloy. The one I checked in a non-desirable water jug expansion test looked 5-petal text book after penetrating something like 20" or more of water, blowing a .50 cal hole thru a 1/4" sheet of plywood and bouncing off a landscape timber. That with a 7.8gr Power Pistol load. Cases showed about a 10% instance of Glock Bulge so I have dropped the load to 7.7gr. Some innate presence tells me to never get hit center mass with such a load. In my G23 circa '92 this load is actually less snappy than the factory Winchester 155gr Silvertip.

Fads come and go. Red head, blonde, brunette. Don't want to get hit by any of the three. But in a dark time encounter.......does it matter?

Next they'll be coming after my .380 !

Powerwise, the 40 is not between the 9mm and the 45.
At Max. SAAMI Spec, 40 S&W power exceeds both the 9mm and the 45. That's why it's "snappy".

I'm glad that all the noobs are flocking to the 9mm - some really great sales on top-notch 40SW pistols because of it.

40 isnt going anywhere. I like 40 and 9mm. Personally 45 doesn’t appeal to me anymore, i find the .40 recoil more manageable than 45. Yea it may jump a bit more than 9mm but with proper training its not a problem.

One of my nicest 1911s is a 40..also the one I shoot the least...just like the 1911 to be a 45...recoil is way more comfortable ...

Bullets have gotten better for the 40 as well. And the 40 doesn't shrink, blah blah blah same old arguments. I don't GAF what other guys want or what other guys buy. The 9 will never be the equal of the 40, even with higher capacity, "controllability", etc. There is no replacement for displacement. Yes, the 9 is likely the most efficient case in existence for use in sidearms, but it isn't "better". There are always trade-offs, and in the case of the 9 vs 40, the trade-off is power.

2018 interim atf statistics on pistols manufactured:

TO 9MM 2,009,514
TO .50 502,317

Looks like 9mm is running 4 times 40 and 45 combined.

I haven't been a volume shooter for a long time but I am at the point where I usually see the sight picture and target through the muzzle flash. Recoil is mostly irrellevant to me. I got that way through simple repetition. Anyone can and the wave of new shooters will.
I figure .40 (& .45) will get popular again once people go through the same progression many of us have. It just isn't hard to handle a decent sized .40, at least no more so than a small 9mm. And the payoff is nearly the same capacity as 9mm with a lot more "pop" downrange. A bunch of people will figure that out and warm up to .40 again.
.40 is good stuff.

45 APC is a pretty weak round.

Be sure and keep us notified when the funeral will be. some of us will send condolences and flowers even though we may not be able to attend the funeral and burial.

There's no way I'm betting my retirement on that. As a matter of fact, if I had a safe full of 1911s I was going to finance my retirement with, I'd be dumping them now. As the old guys that are fixated on the 1911 leave the sport, the return on investment for those guns will almost certainly degrade. I'm thinking we're at "Peak 1911" or already past. 45 is going the same place as 40, just maybe not as fast. It doesn't need to make sense, these trends feed on themselves, an even greater divergence in ammo cost will finish the job .

I agree. The folks who love 1911s are dying off quick. The ones that will retain their value are the old, un-messed-with Colts (like my 1961 Government Model), or USGI. High end 1911s might be okay, too, like from Ed Brown or Les Baer. Standard, commercial, 1911s, though, are going to be hard to get rid of soon.

Rufus, there's a lot of sense to what you say and I agree with all of it. If Colt SAA's were more common I'd expect to have seen a drop in their value too. SASS helped there I reckon.
But I do think (OK, I'm guessing) that the number of new shooters that stick with the sport & also progress into bigger calibers will be noticeable. No real foundation for my opinion, just a hunch.

Now, if they developed a hot rod cartridge that was a 9mm bullet in a necked down .40 case, man that would fly off the shelves!

Oh, wait....


Yeah....

I like the .40.....and the 9mm and the 45ACP. Likem all. No fleas on the .40 just seems like many folks are in a rush to move to the 9mm.

This is a great time to be a buyer of .40's if that's in your list.

Seems like buying against the current trend is a great way to find great prices. Buying .40's now, buying vehicles in September/October, buying winter clothes in the Spring and summer clothes in the fall. Simple. It might make you out of sync with the popular trends but....................................

I like my two .40s. My Glock is light enough to carry, small enough to conceal and powerful enough to use for defense or to shoot a hog or deer. Works for me.

The FBI's insistence on re-inventing wheels is why the 40 was created in the first place and why agencies are ditching the 40 now.
It wont ever be far away, simply because the 9mm and 38's, despite over 100 years of use, fall out of favor with the same agency every other agency follows.