Thinking about buying a new rifle in semi-auto, looking at Browning BAR and the Benelli R1.
Anyone have any recommendations?
thanks

had a browning Bar 30-06 shot lots of crows with it. older Belgium made ., also hard on deer.

Either is a good choice, but my preference is toward the BAR styling.

I’m a fan of the BAR. The Mark 2 Safari .243 I have is really accurate. I’ve also had great accuracy with the BAR Aluminum receiver guns in .270 and .243.

The accuracy will surprise you.

Find them in the metal at a shop if you can. I have handled both, and I suspect one will appeal to you more than the other. Which one that will be, only you can say.

Also, talk about your intended use.

The R1 can be hunted with flush mags, then if you're in an area where bears may come and try to claim your kill while you are working on it, you can have the pregnant guppy 10-rd mags loaded. .30-06 is available.

The Browning flush mag versions don't have extended-capacity options.

The BAR DBM is only available in .308. It has 5-, 10- and 20-rd mags available (only10 in current production, and 20s are stupid expensive lately), but none of them are flush the way you'd want for carrying on the hunt. DBM barrel is also only 18 inches.

Can't speak for the benelli but I have several bar safari rifles. 243 308 25-06 270 30-06 270 weatherby 7mm mag 300 win and 338 win They all shoot very well for a semi auto the magnums are heavy but again mine all shoot very very well

I have an R1. Mine shoots well with the ammo I have tried. R1 is easy to take apart for cleaning. Most people prefer the Browning.

Both are good choices. I have not owned a R1 but they are typical Benelli quality, I own a Bar MK3 and it I beautifully made.

How difficult is it to field-strip a BAR; they've always intrigued me.

RLA

I don't own any semi auto rifle but I would choose the BAR also.

Jerry

I've not owned either, but I used to clean a friends BAR (Belgian) for him. If I remember correctly, on this version of BAR, to remove the bolt assembly, the barrel needs to be removed. To remove the barrel, a heavily torqued barrel nut (or bolt), has to be removed. when removing and replacing the BAR barrel. you need to check zero because the scope is mounted on the receiver proper. A lot of BAR owners just remove the trigger assembly and flush out the bolt/receiver with solvent.

I have several friends here in Romania that hunt with the Benelli semi-autos. The barrel is made to be removed when cleaning the rifle. the scope mounts are on a rear extension of the barrel which forms the upper part of the receiver. No zero check necessary after disassembly for cleaning. For this reason, If I was to buy a semi-auto it would be the benelli, since the already have a reputation for excellent accuracy. RJ

They are simple to field strip.

Belgian BAR's first generation you needed to remove the stock to get the bolt out. They also had a habit of shooting loose.


Safari II's and MK3 are very similar. Remove the foreend, remove the gas piston rod , remove the two action bars and punch out the trigger group and you are good to go. Piston is removed by taking off the front bolt on the assembly. if it is stubborn(carbon caked) drop some Kroil and let it sit and it should come out easily. I have owned a dozen or more BAR's and have never seen the barrel removed. Barrel on all BAR's are chrome lined and also cut rifled. They are accurate F....ing barrels.

If you get a early R1 your chances of getting a dog in the accuracy dept are increased. Benelli has updated their attachment system but I don[t think they will equal a BAR in the accuracy department. Gunshop I know of took in 3 R1's from the same guy a year ago, he was done screwing with them and could not get good accuracy and their duratouch finish on the stock was gummed up. 270 WSM 30-06 and a 338. They were offered at 849 each but I would have to restock them and that would be more then the price of one new. The dealer finally sold them all.

My MK3 is the best feeling auto I have handled in a long time. It is 7 lbs 2oz on the scale and points like a really good semi-auto shotgun. Challenge is finding a light scope with good twilight performance for it . I think some sort of Z3 or Z5 would be perfect on it.

Thanks guys.

Oldelkhunter, I am sure you must be correct. My limited experience with the BAR was a long time ago. I was probably thinking of the disassembly of the 742 Remington. RJ

The complete disassembly of a Remington 742 is a pain.

RJ no problem. I have zero experience with a 742 , the first one was owned by a Friend and it was a trouble free gun. I then bought a 7400 in 270 winchester and within a box of ammo broke the extractor. I bought it back to Walmart and exchanged it(Hard to Believe I know) and then sold the new gun to a guy that had to have it. I bought a BAR right after that .

My experience is with the Remington 740, the first of that series and the BAR in 7mm Remington Magnum. They both worked, but the Remington, after five rounds, slow fire, would shoot 5-7 inches higher at 100 yds. The Browning was very heavy, too heavy.
One of my current BG rifles is a Springfield M1A Squad Scout. Puts four 130 gr. TTSX handloads into under 1.5 MOA every time. Very reliable, tough rifle. Wears a Leupold Scout Scope. A little on the heavy side, but caries well with a 5 shot, flush magazine in place. Better trigger than either the Remington or the Browning. E

Bar Mark 3 7 lbs 2 ounces.

Springfield m1a squad scout 8.8 lbs, yeah I would say it is a little on the heavy side . I would like to see if it has a better trigger , really doubt it.

Browning is not worried about losing sales to Springfield.

Curious as to why no AR-10 type 308s mentioned. Life Below Zero Sue seems pretty handy with one, severe conditions and all.
Got a Saiga 308 that is heavy and poorly balanced while the M1 is heavy
but sweet. So sweet.

I've owned both, but only one of each. A BAR MKII in .270 Win. (used) and an R1 in .30-06 (new). I've also owned an LR308, Saiga .308 Win., and M1A Scout.

The BAR has a chrome-lined chamber. Someone mentioned a chrome lined bore earlier, but I don't think that is an accurate statement. The chambers are lined with chrome, but not the bore. And I think all of the barrels are hammer forged, and not cut rifled as claimed. Maybe earlier models had those features, but Browning isn't listing those today.

Personally, I think a chamber lined with chrome is a plus with a blued barrel for this type of action. Maybe I am an idiot, but I've seen corrosion in the chambers of blued barrels. To the point where you can feel the resistance of chambering a round on a bolt action. Granted, I am in the PNWet but corrosion can happen rapidly under the right conditions. And I have never had an issue with stainless or chrome-lined chambers under the same conditions.

I also haven't seen corrosion in the bore region of blued barrels with Bore Coat, but that product isn't ideal for chambers. But so far, Gun Shield has been doing well in the chamber of one rifle that I have which is prone to corrosion.

In terms of accuracy/precision, the R1 in .30-06 was only mediocre for me. I tried various handloads with 150gr and 168gr TTSX, along with factory rolled Core-lokt 150gr and 180gr. None shot that well. And there were noticeable amounts of copper fouling just by peering down the bore from the muzzle end. I didn't have a borescope at that time, but the copper fouling seen was worse than any rifle I had previously owned.

I sold the R1 to a friend who was fully aware of the accuracy and fouling concerns. He liked the R1 design, especially the magazines but he said that the copper fouling was an issue for him as well. I've lost track of the round count.

The BAR on the other hand, shot lights out. I had worked up a load with the 140gr NAB that was under 1" for 5-shots. But that was after modifying the fore end which had hard contact on one side of the barrel. I don't know how large an effect it had on accuracy, but I removed the contact.

The real surprise with the BAR was when I sold it to a friend who does not reload. I suggested that he try 130gr and 150gr factory ammo. And he did, but what was surprising was the fact that the two bullet weights had similar impact at 100 yards. Basically one big hole. And they shot noticeably better than my handloads using the 140 NAB. Very humbling experience!

One last comment. The trigger on the BAR was horrible, but the geometry of the grip made it bearable. More closed, as opposed to an open grip, which makes it seem more tolerable to me. I thought the trigger on the R1 was a bit nicer but not necessarily a great trigger.

There doesn't seem to be many aftermarket solutions for either but there used to be a few gunsmiths that would work on the BAR. Timney has an trigger fix for the Remington pumps and autos that use the 870-style trigger mechanism.

I agree the BAR MkIII trigger suhcs. BAR MkII hammer and sear are surprisingly inexpensive from Browning. They don't yet have inventory, or even part numbers assigned in the US system, for hammer and sear for the MkIII. I recently spoke with a CS rep who said the MkII parts do NOT carry over, but that they expect to have stock sometime in the fall.

4th Point

Thanks for the correction on the rifling and chrome lined bore, for whatever reason I read or was told that was the case.

I have no complaints about my current (3 month old Mark 3) and the trigger I have is certainly a good serviceable trigger. I am pretty certain that Neil Jones can do magic on one if needed. He does a heck of a job on BLR's .

OEH,

Glad to hear that the MK3 is working well. I'm considering one to replace the R1 and MKII that I sold.

Jason

A friend of mine has a nice Belgian BAR, a Grade 2, I think, in .300 Win. Mag. for sale on consignment at a local gun shop. PM me if you might be interested in it.

I had Remington 742's and Belgium Browning BAR's, they both sucked. If I was going to buy a semi auto rifle it'd be a HK 770 in .308 or a AR-10 in .308. Preferably the HK, it's expensive but buy once and cry once.

Thanks for all the good info.

Have an old 1969 BAR Grade II in 338 WM, a hell of an accurate Cadillac with 71gr IMR-4350 under 250gr Partitions, a beautiful blonde stocked basher, most hate em, but i love em.

That for sure is a Elk Assault Hammer. My only complaint with the old ones is the weight , but that is needed with a 338.

I’ve had a couple of BAR’s. About the only thing I could complain about was their mushy triggers. However they weren’t that bad.

I own 3 Browning BARs in 243, 06, and 338, all 3 are MK II black stalker models wearing scopes and iron sights. All 3 are sub 1" guns....all with factory loads.

Two things helped gain this accuracy. First, the magic number on forearm torque in 65"/lbs. And second, send the trigger group to Accuracy Systems, for a trigger job. All 3 guns break at 2.75 lbs, with zero creep.

They did a great job on each one, with quick turn around and great communication. https://www.accuracysystemsinc.com/

Andy3

Thanks for that tip.

Not with the synthetic stock. My M1A Squad Scout with a 15.-4X Leupold Scout Scope with the heavy steel rings goes 8 lbs., 11 ozs. E

You bet OEH, but, truth be told, most of us could take a good crap and clean our boots and lose 15 pounds; ]

The first time i fired a BAR i was hooked, Marine Unc got back from 'nam in 1970, bought a new BAR in 300 Win Mag, let me shoot it, i could feel/hear the workings just like i could Dad's A5 shotgun, i appreciate that level of Craftsmanship, near 50 years later, it doesn't go away.

BAR are notoriously famous in the southern deer woods amongst hounds men. Equally notorious for being hard on their equipment, these men only trust the best. Many of them cannot or most accurately could not afford many of life’s necessities and surely didn’t afford themselves luxuries, but they shoot Browning BAR rifles with open sights at deer.

Having grown up around this group of men, I have several myself. My daughter shoots one in .270 Winchester and has since a very young age. It’s had the stock cut down to fit a young girl lop, but it is still heavy enough to absorb a lot of the recoil. I have a 3006 that I have a ghost ring on and I shoot deer in front of hounds with it. It’s accurate and reliable. Performs much better than the traditional buckshot. 180 grain or 165 grain core loks are generally fed to it.

Point of this post…… they are tough as nails, accurate, and reliable weapons of choice. I love Benelli shotguns, and I’m sure the R1 is a fine rifle, but my roots won’t let me put my old BAR’s aside to try one.

Chambered in .30-06...?

Only one.



8>)




GR

When I was a kid, the much maligned Remington 742 and all it’s off shoots was the most popular rifle around. Generally it was chambered in either 30-06 or .243 and skads of deer were killed with them. If they were still available, I wouldn’t buy one on purpose. But, I wouldn’t feel terrible if someone handed me one and told me to go forth and slay bambies either.

My dad hunted with a late60s 742 in 30-06 with a Redfield 3 x9. I watched him sight it in to go Elk hunting. He set up a target walked off 100 yards. Wrapped the sling around his arm fired 3 shots standing offhand. All 3 holes were in his 1" bullseye. I shot it a few times to check the scope when I was older. The rifle would really shoot. Irritating because it would shoot better groups than my 700. I think it was an unusually good 742. I have seen other people shoot them and were happy with 3" groups.

My Dad had a good one as well. He passed it on to me and I hunted with it for years until it started having mechanical issues.

It was a 742 Carbine, 30-06. It would hold groups of 1-1.5" @ 100 yards with factory ammo.

Thoroughly enjoying a first generation Sig716 in 308 win. Immediately developed a cast bullet gas-checked load and have never had this much fun with a bolt 308, or burned this much ammo. Good thing i can make my own bullets. The rifle is a tad heavy with the piston design, but a lighter weight hand guard should help. It's been completely reliable and consistently begs for more ammo. Accuracy is completely acceptable. I highly recommend a first generation patrol rifle if you can find one

742's had an issue with bolt battering the internal rails, the 7400 design somewhat remedied it . For the guy that goes to the range once a year to check sight-in they are fine if they are kept clean and the magazines are not fubared.

That is correct.

Saw a 742 BDL in .3006 yesterday ( folks running 180s or heavier in the .3006 the reported rail chewing culprits ).

It still had hang tag. Orig owner, unfired.

Dunno what it was going to be priced at.

Even of pristine and to be shot little, that gas block weld/ location could end up causing Mini 14 itis.

Had a minty carbine 3006 so afflicted. Cold bore was 1" high at 100 yds. Next couple werr in decent group 7 inches or so lower.

Let it cool snd itd repeat the cold to hot jump.

No wonder it was in such great shape LOL
I traded it back where I got it.

My semi is a w
WIN. pre 64 Model 100, reliable, sleek, and no match for deer or coyotes.