Hi all-
I had a quick question. Did Winchester ever make a model 70 featherweight in .260 Rem? I am asking because I want to replace a win mod 70 feather weight classic that I sold a few years back. That one was a 30-06 and I really liked it, but had to sell it. I have since become a huge fan of the 6.5mm�s and in particular, the 260 rem.

Any help would be appreciated.

thanks

No. If they'd had, I'd own one.

Kaiser Norton

Nope, but they did chamber the Featherweight Classic SA in 6.5x55 Swede. Similar ballistics, way higher on "cool factor". Good luck finding one on the used market, and if you do, be prepared to pay about $100 more than standard chamberings are bringing.

Why dont you buy one in .243,7-08 or .308 and re-barrel it? You can find those used ones for around $400-500 (atleast around here). That way you can have a "custom"

Tim

Even if they didn't, you can...


Push feed Winchester, 23" Pac-Nor featherweight in .260 Rem, McMillan stock in the HCR pattern, Leupold 6x42.

I had one of the featherweights in 6.5x55. It shot extremely well but actually weighed more than my Ruger M77MkII in the same caliber. It also had the nasty characteristic of cartridges rattling in the magazine. This is not conducive to stealth in the game fields. The guy I traded it to sold it online at a handsome profit. It sold on GB for $1053 IIRC. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that someone who posts here bought it. The wood was special too, but covered-up with a horrible plastic finish. It's yet another one I wish I still had, but the M77 is a worthy substitute in all respects.

-

I don't believe that Winchester/USRA ever cataloged a standard production 70 in 260, but I think that they were listed in at least 1 cataloge as being available on special order from the custom shop.

It would be pretty easy to have a 70 short action rebarreled or rebored from 243 to 260.

Winchester/USRA did make a variety of cataloged and non-cataloged 70 long actions in 6.5x55 starting in 1986, so a short action 70 in 260 as a limited run for a wholesaler would not have been out of the questions, as they did a run of 70 Fwts in 6mm Remington in the early 1990s.

I did see a Winchester/USRA 70 Fwt with a Win-Tuff laminated chambered in 6.5-243 at Cabela's in LaVista, NE, a few months ago. Since I'm a 260 guy, I would have bought it, except the stock had been shortened and the price was (as is common with Cabela's) too high for the poor quality of work that was done.

Jeff

If I recall correctly, the 260 was a wildcat until Remington adopted it in about 1997. Isn't that a bit too late to have been chambered in the competitor's model 70?

I don't understand your comment.

Winchester/USRA was making short action 70s until just a couple of years ago, so I can't see any reason why they couldn't have chambered the SAAMI specs 260. Since Winchester/USRA and Winchester/Olin are seperate companies, I don't think that there was a requirement that Winchester/Olin make ammo for all of the cartridges that Winchester/USRA chambered.

Jeff

Ask Lee?

Yep,no doubt he helped Winchester design that model

As far as I know, Winchester never made the 260 available, except perhaps through a custom shop request, which they'd chamber up about anything you wanted for the right coinage......

Kinda wished the 260 would get picked up by someone besides Remington and get the availability of off-the-shelf ammo better. To my knowledge, only Remington and Federal run ammo for them and it's a bit difficult to find most times. Handloaded it's great, but for anything else, I prefer the 7mm-08.

I think that the majority of people who like the 260 are reloaders, since the variety of factory ammo doesn't really cover the full spectrum of the 260's usefulness. A factory varmint load with a 95 grain VMax might have added to its marketing appeal, but what do I know. I liked the Speer Nitrex factory ammo pretty well, but the 120 grain BTs that Remington used to load worked pretty well too.

I think that the 2 worst things that Remington did to the 260 were:

1. Their failure to offer it in their more popular rifles, the 700 ADL and 700 BDL.
2. Their failure to offer it through high-volume retailers (Wal-Mart, etal) in the lower cost, entry level, 700 ADL matte synthetic.

Jeff

I think the M70 Compact(but not the Featherweight) was available in .260, for a year or two, according to the catalogs. The M70s weren't/aren't marketed here very well (Louisville area), so I've never seen one, and the one shop that DID stock Winchesters has since closed up.

Another factor might be that Winchester was busy getting ready to market, and introducing their short mags. Why help out a competitor. 260Rem, agree on Remington's failure. It amazes me just how many lessons Remington has gotten over the years, and they continue to do dumb marketing moves. Of course the 260 should have been offered in the BDL, etc. They may be getting it somewhat right now as several 260 rifles are available now from them, and there seems to be more ammo choices becoming available. With the lull at Winchester, Remington better make hay while the sun is shining. We dont need all of those 260 s with 18 - 20 inch barrels either. Some of us shoot for distance out west.

I was mesmerized by the custom shop mannlicher stocked model, a 19" carbine IIRC, BELIEVE the 260 was inc. w/243/708/308/358 though had a 9 or 10 twist it seems.

Re: Rem, I just gave up and started buying Sako/custom actions, etc. as I lost the remaining 5-10% respect I had after MANY serious QC problems w/MY rifles as they came NEW from the factory, and the final straw was their COMPLETE lack of respect for me and any comments I had to say that were factual re: QC and lack of sensible product offerings at the SHOT show, 2006.

I still believe that Remington could make a go of the .260 Rem. if they would chamber it in the SPS with the synthetic stock and 24" barrel. I know I would buy one. Ditto the other posters that said they should have chambered it from the get go in the 700 ADL and BDL and offered it thru the discount stores. If they sold enough of the rifles, even Winchester might consider making some ammo for them. (I mean sales are sales, right?)

ruger does the 260, although the # of chamberings is in decline

To add to what Matt posted the 7-08 is better for hunting than the 6.5-08. But the .308 is way better than either one.

I built a pair of 6.5 and 7 mm rifles about 25 years ago: 6.5-'06 for hunting and a .280 Rem (7mm Express in those days) for shooting metallic silhouette. I used a #3 Shilen on the 6.5 and a #4 Douglas on the 7mm -- both in the same McM. synthetic stocks. Based on results since, if doing the same kind of thing now I would use the 6.5 for target work and the 7 for hunting but I would make them both short actions and use the 51 mm case.

jim

I don't know how anyone could really say that.

I used the 708 on elk in 1990 and the 260 later on. I killed my first elk with a 308 in 1971.

They all kill the same.

I prefer the 260 as it's recoil is less
and I find more hunting bullets with higher BC's with it.

At distance the 308 is sucking wind compared to the 26 and 28.

It's not about requirements, it's all about production costs and how many pieces they think they'll sell. They certainly could have; they chose not to. I don't think the 260 was popular enough to attract any attention over at Winchester, nor was the 7mm08. They already chambered for 6.5x55 and 7x57, so I doubt they considered it feasible to add the new chamberings.

It has proven to be difficult to find Winchester rifles in the Louisville area, as Remington seems to reign supreme. Whittaker's has stocked a limited selection of Model 70s in times past, but I don't know if they will do so again. Time will only tell.

IIRC, Winchester/USRA made some 70 Fwts in 7mm-08, but I don't know if they were cataloged, or if they were a special run ordered by a specific wholesaler. Winchester/USRA chambered a number of lower volume cartridges in a variety of 70 styles, including the 6mm Remington, a non-cataloged limted run, and 250 Savage, cataloged in the lightweight carbine during 1986. Winchester/USRA didn't do nearly as many special runs as Remington does, probably because the demand for Winchester/USRA rifle was significantly less than those offered by Remington.

Firearms manufacturers that are also in the ammunition business seldom chamber a firearm for a cartridge that they don't offer in their line of ammunition. For example, Remington has never made ammunition for the following cartridges that they didn't chamber rifles for; the WSSMs, 256 Win Mag, 284, 307, 356, and 375 Win. Winchester/Olin has never made ammunition for the 260, the SAUMs, and the 444 Marlin.

Jeff

I agree............I'd trade 3 308's for a just one 7mm or 6.5 308....Less recoil, better BC, the works.

All will kill just fine, but I've really grown to like the 7 and 6.5 on that case.

Well, no, they don't all kill the same. The .308 bullets from the various .300s are noticeably better killers on game if you compare apples to apples. The .264 and .284 do kill, but the .300s do it mo' bettah.

I observed this myself in Africa shooting various antelope and wart hog for leopard bait on three leopard hunts. Mike LaGrange also documented the effect of the jump to .300 from the smaller bores in his book on ballistics (itself documenting years of observations culling thousands of head of game in Zimbabwe).

If I was still target shooting now I would go with the 6.5s for lower accumulated recoil over a course of fire, but now I only shoot one shot groups on animals. I also have all the .300s I need, and I am selling other guns and putting the $ into hunting trips. I don't care what the BC is on a hunting bullet, I learn the trajectory and get an accurate range before shooting. YMMV if you are doing different things than I am.


jim

If you were able to shoot the same head of game through the lungs with a properly constructed bullet, launched at comperable velocities from the same basic 51mm long case, I doubt if there is $0.05 difference in meaningful performance regardless if the bullet has a diameter of .243", .257", .264", .284", or .308". For varmints and non-dangerous game, the proper placement of a properly constructed projectile is what counts, not its diameter.

Jeff

There are a gazillion variables in how effectively deer-sized game is killed. These include shot placement, game orientation, game alertness, bone/muscle/lung/CNS tissue encountered, etc.

Other variables associated with the gun/shooter/cartridge include, range, impact velocity, bullet construction, sectional density, and others.

IMO, one of the LEAST important variables, at least for deer-sized game, is a difference of 24 or 44 thousandths of an inch in bullet diameter.

So I would disagree that the 30's (all other things being equal) are significantly mo bettah, than the 7's or 277's or even 257's.

At least that's been my experience over the last 50+ years of hunting/killing deer.

When I want a jump in killing power, I go from the 6-7mm class straight to 338/358, just my preference as I believe then you get a definite noticeable killing power increase on larger game, but proper chosen bullets in 6.5-7mm will handle larger game, depending on shot placement they might or might not drop as fast but to me if you want to increase frontal area and mass, why not go to 338 or 358 even on a 308 case?

Yes, no doubt the 30's work, but I don't think there are many flies on a 338 Federal or 358 Win to 300 yds, or a 338/06, Win Mag, or 350RM/Whelen to 350-400 yds w/proper bullets.

If needing Longer range capability, more speed may be needed, but most of my hunting is whitetail and smaller game so I go with what I need on the majority of my hunting. If I were hunting big stuff in NA or Africa, I'd consider a mid bore vs my small bores. Just personal preference as I don't think one gives up anything using 33/35's over a 30 at normal ranges, but you gain more mass/frontal area which is all else equal, 'more is better' as I'd just as soon pop say an elk or bear w/a 350 Rem Mag as I would a 300 Winchester, actually preferring the larger bullet, assuming normal ranges. 338 Wins can stretch range and still carry energy at distances, you might want a larger case for a long range 33.

None the less, don't believe any 260s were ever standard catalogue items by Winchester.

Ruger I understand shipped some 6.5x54 MS to Europe, perhaps the mannlicher 77, maybe even the #1 single shots, but it seems they only went to the overseas market.

Winchester listed the short action M-70 in 260 rem in their regular catalog as a "Custom shop" chambering in the
Winchester custom shop section of the catalog.

It's on page 47 of their 2002 catalog covering the short action calibers.

Doc

If I had not thrown my cataloque out, I would have been able to have confirmed that, the 260 and 358 'Ultra Light' mannlicher carbine was my interest, but not at a price around 2,850 IIRC.

I could be happy w/a Sako Mannlicher custom BBL for half if not less, but the gun was a nice looking one.

I think had Win produced them as std. items for a reasonable price, they would have sold fairly well, esp. in staple calibers like 243/7-08/308 but again, the 260 and 358 piqued my interest.

Thanks Doc for looking that up.

FYI, Remington did offer the .260 in the M700 when the cartridge was introduced, but they offered with that abomidable (sp) detachable magazine they tried to foist on the shooting public. I've also seen at least one 700 ADL synthetic in this chambering, though that was probably for a limited run through a distributor. And lastly, My local funstore has one of the special CDLs (stainless, 24 inch barrel, etc) in stock that I've been all googly -eyed about but can't get past the $900 price tag.......

Kaiser Norton

If a guy pokes a well constructed bullet through the front shoulders of any North American big game with a 6mm-30cal inside of 400 yards(to be conservative), it drops like a rock and that my friends is not rocket science.

I like the 'minimalist' philosophy, "less is more", call me whatever, but it's nice to know you don't have to beat yourself up, while putting the hurt on the game we hunt. Not to mention I can shoot alot more at the range using 6BRs-7/08 sized rounds than T-Rex Magnums.

Oh, my ears thank me for sparing what is left, as my shoulder, and the pocket book does not mind using less powder to put all those practice rounds downrange. Heck I ever shoot/group and HIT my target better as well.

For Deer and under a 6-6.5mm bore using proper bullets and shot placement has alot to offer many shooters IMHO.

The 260 is quickly gaining popularity with the "practical tactical" crowd, as its ballistics can match the 300 Win Mag with much less recoil at long range, plus it is far easier on barrels than the 6.5-284.

That being said, there are some more companies loading for it, such as Cor-Bon, HSM, and Black Hills. All are offering either Lapua Scenars or Sierra MatchKings as the loadings.

With the growing popularity of the AR 15 platform, the 6.5 Grendel is making inroads as well, and hence is pushing some of the manufacturers to offer more bullet selection in 26 caliber.

If we could get Hornady to offer a 70 grain VMax, and Barnes to offer a 107 grain TTSX, we'd be cooking with gas in the hunting fields.

Robusto,

Buy one in .243 and have it re-bored. You can end up with the M70 you want and with the twist rate and throat to your specs. Cheaper than any quality rebarrel. Thats how I got into a Tikka T3 in .260

Please don't.