With which cartridges have you observed (notice I said observed not theoretically conjectured or google searched) the quickest kills on big game (i.e. deer and larger)?


Mine are all on whitetail deer:

1. .300 Winchester and 165 grain Sierra or 165 Nosler BT all bang flop DRT

2. .280 AI with the 120 grain Nosler BT All Bang Flop DRT

3. 6MM Remington with 80 grain Remington PLHP longest blood trail job about 50 yards.

4. .257 Roberts with 100 grain Winchester Silvertips longest blood trail job 50 yards


5. .25/06 with 90 grain Sierra GKHP and 100 grain Hornady longest blood trail job 75-80 yards

6. .17 Remington with 25 grain Hornady HP longest blood trail job 100 yards.

7mag with 160 TSX on coues... DRT 401

7RUM 140 accubond 531 yards on coues. DRT

270 wsm, couple different times and distances... all over 350 yds.

The one that the shooter can put an adequate bullet where it needs to go every time with. Take your pick.

I've seen bull elk drop at the shot from one 100 gr 6mm partition and I've seen antelope run 300 yds after taking two 180 gr partitions from a .300 win.

It's where ya hit 'em that counts.

I've always liked 165 partitions in a .308 or '06 myself. 165 xlc worked well too. Never tracked an animal more than a few yards with either combo. I'm hoping the accubond performs as well. I'll find out this fall. Going to try some 150 tsx too.

7mm 160 gr partition killed everything like lightning when I was shooting a 7mm rem mag.

.270 140 gr. partition, x, and xlc, was the same.

...this should really be interesting.....popcorn?

In my experience there is a lot more detail to the topic that just naming some particular bullet out of a cartridge.

Here is the site that I like the best on the topic but even then I don't agree with it 100%.

Shooting Holes in Wounding Theories

Like Shaun said, I think it has a whole lot more to do with effective shot placement than it does choice of caliber.

here is a few speaking only from personal experience -

30-06/180gr partition, elk, 40 yard broadside shot, elk moved about 3' then fell over.

270 win/130gr partition, whitetail, 180 or so broadise shot, deer fell right there.

243 win/95gr ballistic tip, whitetail, 120 or so yards coming straight at me, dropped his heaf so shot him in the neck/spine, dropped right there.

i'm sure i (and you as well) could have made these same shots, with the same results using some other gun/caliber. all of this only proves it is where you hit em. good hunting.

In my experience speed DEFINATELY kills quicker with the smaller 'large' game animals. But only when COMBINED with a good deep wound in the right place. I have bangflopped several large mule deer bucks at ranges in excess of 400 yards with a .257WBY and 100gr TSX's. A truly impressive and amazing combination if ever there was one. I bangflopped a Black bear last spring at 409 Leica measured yards with my 300 RUM using 180gr TSX's. Also did the some on a couple of Impala and a KUDU with the same rifle and load. Another impressive cartridge and bullet combo to say the least. Impact velocity of over 2700fps with a properly placed Barnes TSX will get very quick results when using a caliber of reasonable dimensions and a good hit.

Whitetail/Mule Deer/Antelope/feral hogs:

1) .300 Win/Weatherby/RUM with 150-165 Sierra BTSP/Hornady BTSP.

2) 3 way tie - .270/.280/.30-06 with cup & core 130-165 gr

3) .300 Mags with premium 180-200 gr bullets

4) 3 way tie - .270/.280/.30-06 with premium bullets

Never killed a deer with a 7 mag and only a couple with .270 mags. .24s/.25s and the big bores I have observed (.338 WM, .35 Whelen) have tended to run a bit further with less bang flops than the above, but never had any real problems with good shot placement.

Lou

.460 Weatherby - any load.
The hunting stops when the trigger is pulled, or as Elmer used to say, "I prefer to do my hunting before the shot".

JW

Shot placement is my favorite cartridge ....

Seriously, I've had deer all go the same distance on heart/lung shot's (10-30 yards, fall over and kick a few times) with a 30-30, 25-06, 7WBY or 300WBY. I must say the 300WBY was the most impressive ... 10 yards and a chest full of jello @ about 175 yards with a 180gr SGK. Small go-insa and a quater-sized go-outsa with a wicked mess in between!

Finn Aagaard wrote that he saw more one shot kills with a .270 than any other cartridge, with his background that says a lot,, Myself I have had a good run of luck with the 7 mag running 140 and 150 Ballistics tips on both whitetail and Muleys as well as a bunch of T-lopes, the farther the better results.

That's been my experience too. The bullets that come out the spout at 3,000 fps + seem to have a more dramatic effect.

Quickest I've seen on deer around here is (fastest to slowest of the really quick) all factory ammo
All deer were alerted to danger and were getting ready to bolt
25-06 (100,115,&120 gr)
240 Weatherby (100gr)
6mm Rem (100gr)
.243 (100gr).

A twelve gauge slug to the head at five paces sure drops 'em quick. They do flop around, so I guess that wouldn't qualify as a "DRT" around here.

Generally speaking if the hunter does his part they will kill very well.
I�ve had more DRTs with small bullets (25 & .277 cal with 100 to 130 grain bullets) traveling very fast. (3000+fps)
I�ve also had a good many DRTs with large bullets (.323 to .458 cal with 200 to 405 grain bullets) traveling very slowly. (1800 to 2400 fps)
Calibers I have used to kill deer size game and larger are:

45-70, 35 Rem, 30-30, .308 Win, 30-06, .270 Win, .25-06, .257 Roberts, 8x57, 9.3x62, .300 Mag and .300 WSM.

My experience has been that a 30-30 and .54 smokepole always drops them on the spot, even with lung shots. All the other gee-whiz rounds I have shot deer with, double punch the lungs and they seem to run a few yards.

Dont know how many deer I have shot with a 30-30, it always drops them right on the spot. Maybe I have just been lucky.

My best results have come on whitetails using a 300 win mag with 150 grain Hornady flat base interlocks. Over thirty kills with this combo,nothing has gone anywhere,some were shoulder shots and some were just lung shots but the deer were dead right there.(I did have one big nine point go about 10 yards but he was hit a lttle too far back and still died very quickly.)


The other caliber which has been just as good on deer is a 270 Weatherby with 130 grain hornady flat base interlocks. Took over thirty with it,all dead right there with various lung and shoulder shots.

I have had good results with lots of rifles but these two were the best with a large sample size of more than a deer or two.

Britt

I once owned a 7mm/08 that shot 140 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips like a singer sewing machine. It nearly ruined my tracking skills. I killed 12 straight deer with it that were DRT's, and loaned it out twice to two seperate hunters that had the sme results. Ranges from 10 feet to around 225 yards. I got a little bored and started experimenting with other bullets, the first deer I shot with a 130 grain Speer Hot Cor ran about 40 yards before piling up. Thought for sure something was terribly wrong...

Those 140 grain Ballistic tips moving at about 2750 fps were absolutely like a toggle switch on deer.

My only experience has been with 280's, 7 Wby's & 7 Rem Mag. I could not see either of the 7 Mag's outrunning the 280 in the bang-flop category. I just happen to like the big 7's better. Don't need them just like them.

If I had it to do over: I would have kept my original Rem 700 in 308 Win I purchased in 1976 and would still be hunting with it today.

223AI

If deer are the "big game", then my pick would be my .22 CHeetah - shooting 53 grain Barnes X's @ 4285 fps.

I've had fast kills with about everything I've used.The faster cartridges,when coupled with Bitterroot bullets have demonstrated more dramatic effect than anything else.That goes for the 375 as well as other cartridges.

But in the end,placement and proper bullets are more important than caliber and cartridge in producing quick kills.

It does seem to me that (assuming proper placement) the heavier the bullet, the more certain the animal's demise.

But, having said that, I'd opine, the faster the bullet - the more dramatic the animal's demise.

.358 does a bang-up job for me... I like how it kills fast, but with minimal bloodshot.

Sample size of 6 is all though. Weight the info appropriatly.

#1 for me is the 6.5 Rem Mag shooting 120 gr. Ballistic Tips.

#2 is the .250 Savage with 100 gr. Partitions.

Oddly enough the farthest I've had deer run after good hits where with the .358 Winchester and the .350 Rem Mag.

I'm a heart / lung shooting type guy so the big slower bullets may not open as fast on these small southern deer....

My 30/378 with a 165 grain Barnes TSX did a bang up job on a mulie spike at 200 yds on the nose.
I hit the thing low in the chest and literally gutted the lungs and heart as they were laying on the outside of the deer when I got to it.

7-08 140 partitions. Best killing performer I've owned yet.

IME ... NBT's on most deer = DED deer

25-06 120 Hornady Hollowpoint

270 Win 130 Speer Hotcor flatbase

7 Rem Mag 139 Hornady S.P. flatbase
7 Rem Mag 160 Speer Hotcor flatbase

300 WSM 165 TSX

The .257 Roy, is a friggin' lightning bolt on deer.

I've killed a bunch, and been 'round a bunch killed, but I don't think there's anything out there that just ZAPs deer, like the .257Roy.

Agreed, but I am hoping to see how a deer reacts to a Barnes original .348 220 gr bullet at 2600-2700 out of my newly aquired model 71 so chambered. Should put 'em down pretty quick like if the range is not too far.

I've only shot 2 deer with my Savage Muzzle loader, but they've both gone straight down with double lung shots. I run a 250 grain XTP (.451" dia) at 2300 fps (Savage's #'s not mine as I've never chronied it.)

Just a guess, but maybe it is because that rifle is the one in your hand most often. Practice makes perfect.

On large "deer" - moose, I've had three bam-flops which relates to about 10%. They have come with cup-n-cores (2) and a double shoulder socket (X). Otherwise, the rest have all died rather quickly with anything from 7mm-08 and up (through 340 and 45-70).

On caribou, I once looked all day for an approachable band of animals. Then, close to dusk, I got right into the middle of a cooperative band. A 7mm-08 and 139 SP Hornadys put four animals down without an struggle at all in under a minute.

All that said, if you poke a long enough hole in the right enough place, things are going to get dead pretty quick. The cartridge is barely relevant to the discussion.

Bullets, on the other hand...

270 win. 130 nosler partition

quickest kills I've had were.

8x57 and 30-06

338 ultra mag pushing 225 gr accubonds at 3210 fps

30-06 green Remm 150 grain I have never had to track a deer with this combo. Bang down.... All of the deer where hit in the vitals and I have lost count of the deer some where near 30 deer both mulies and black tails. The only deer I ever had to track was a mulie 4x3 shot in the heart with 243 he ran about 60 yards right to me and died about 20 feet away oh that was a 100 grain green remmy..grin!

Ruger M77R "pre-warning" 7x57, 160 grain Speer Hot-Cor, 200 yards, DRT.

Winchester M70XTR featherweight 270 Win, 130 grain Nosler partition, 400 yards, blood trail 10 yards.

Remington 740 30-06, 150 grain Sierra Pro-Hunter, DRT.

Pro-Line Typhoon XT, Easton Gamegetter 2219, 125 grain Rocky Mountain Razor, DRT.

Darton Lightning, Easton XX75 Ultralight 2512, 75 grain Wasp Hi-Tech Ultralight, DRT.

Oneida Aero-Force X80, Easton XX75 Ultralight 2512, 85 grain Thunderhead, DRT.

Parker Buckhunter Pro, Easton Gamegetter 2117, 100 grain Rocket Steelhead, blood trail 40 yards.

Bear Montana longbow 50#, 23/64" cedar w/natural turkey fletch (from bird I killed), 125 grain Zwickey Eskimo, blood trail 30 yards.

"One in the chest or one in the head and even the Jolly Green Giant will fall down dead."

-

4 deer 300Win 180gr Sierra Pro-Hunter DRT

[quote=chromeOddly enough the farthest I've had deer run after good hits where with the .358 Winchester and the .350 Rem Mag.

I'm a heart / lung shooting type guy so the big slower bullets may not open as fast on these small southern deer.... [/quote]

Shot a 75 pound doe once with the .350RemMag, 200gr PSPCL, double lung. She turned left in a 360 degree circle. When she was broadside to me I shot her again in the same spot. Third verse was the same, but she did fall down. Three shots at 100 yards you could cover with a 50 cent piece. Plenty of power, but wrong bullet for the game at hand.

Shot a water buffalo with the same rifle at 20 feet straight on right above the sternum. 250 PSPCL. Bang-flop. Good thing, since it was dark and I was still halfway in the sleeping bag. Enough power and right bullet for the game at hand.

The fastest "killing" bullet without a CNS hit, is the one that causes the most tissue damage. The more tissue a bullet damages the less it will penetrate, all else being equal, and vice versa. There is no free lunch.

Given the same impact velocity- what does more damage to a prairie dog, a 53gr Barnes or a 50gr V-MAX?

Shooting a couple of deer shows you very, very little about terminal performance. It takes at least 10 or so to even have an inkling of an idea about what a certain bullet and impact speed will do. Around twenty-five and you can have a general idea. 50 or so when one can start to have a real idea about a particular bullets terminal effects.


In my experience the bullet that causes the most tissue damage while having enough penetration for deer is the 178gr Hornady A-MAX. At 3,000+FPS it damages A LOT of tissue. Kind of like the 50grV-MAX and prairie dog deal. Out of around 70 deer shot with that bullet out of 300WinMags, only four have moved after being hit. The first was at 860yds that entered just behind the onside foreleg and exited through the offside foreleg, with the buck running on his face for about 40yds downhill.
The second a buddy shot broadside at 160yds (I believe) and landed mid body three inches behind the nearside front leg. It too traveled approximately 30yds downhill without the use of his front legs.
The third was 30yds head on and centered his right front leg at about elbow level. The bullet did not penetrate the chest cavity. There was also no evidence that any fragmentation penetrated the cheat cavity, never-the-less the deer only went about 40 yards before dropping. Below is a picture of the wound from that one-



Notice the entry on the right and the exit on the left.

The last is a buck my friend shot at 374 yards. The bullet entered mid body on the right and exited just in front of the left hip. The deer went about 70yds.


It's trade off. The more tissue that is destroyed the faster the animals go down, all else being equal. The more tissue that is destroyed the more meat loss there will be. There is no bullet that lets you "eat right up to the hole" and yet produces a huge wound cavity.

The head count for me is 40+ for the .300 Winny, 100+ for the 6MM & .17 Remington.

I've shot and seen a few deer shot before.

Moose hunting with a friend's father(who was not from Alaska) in Alaska. He's never shot a moose before and is hunting with a pre-64 Mod 70 .270. We came upon a nice bull standing chest deep in a small pond.

Me: "Don't shoot until he's out of the"
Him: Boom
Moose: SPLASH
Me: "water"
Me: "aw, crap"

That sounds like a lot of "fun"...if you're the Marquis de Sade

165gr Barnes TSX out of 30-06. Like electricity this past season for me. 4 shots.. 4 bang flops. Impressive!

For me .257 Roberts 100gr. Sierra GK
and 7mm Remington Magnum 150 gr. Nosler BT
these were used on whitetails though.

GreggH

On Caribou, antelope, bighorn sheep, WT deer, and mule deer I've had DRT kills quite consistently with the 160gr TSX out of my 7mm Rem Mag.

EDIT: Oh, and I forgot coyotes, badgers, and gophers

In this part of the world, I've taken a 260 up against everything from gophers to elk. In one season ('05 IIRC) I shot 3 antelope, 6 deer (5 B tags and a nice Muley), one elk (late season "game damage" cow) and a black bear in the spring. It killed schitt as well as my -06 always did. I had a lot of respect for the "pop gun" then. Ironically, the only critter that went more than 10 feet was a doe antelope. I double lunged her, and she took off on a dead sprint that lasted for 150 yards or so, with a 60 MPH pile up at the end of it. The goats were all shot with 125 grain Partitions, all the rest of the critters were shot with 140 Partitions.

I think that the Partition is still the best hunting bullet on the market today. You guys don't have to worry about me buying up all the fancy new crap that comes along... When that front core blows up inside a critter, its causing tissue damage where the critter lives. I don't really see the wisdom of using oober super bullets that retain 99% of their weight, not even in oober super wunder magnums.? Now I just wish Nosler would make a polymer tipped partition, that would be the greatest hunting bullet of all time

Hornady Interbond 150 grain Light Mag in 30.06 Awesome!
Hornady LeverEvolution 150 grain in 30.30 Awesome as well.
Deer don't like either one when hit just behing the shoulder. The most amazing of the two is the 30.30 LE. The difference between it and traditional soft points has been significant in my experience.

I have had the best success with 30-30 Leverolutions as well.
4 of the last 6 deer have DRT and the others did not go more than 25 yards. All shot distances under 75 yards. Just my .02 worth.

It sounds like shot placement and bullet construction are winning the race here with caliber size coming in 3rd.