Does anyone have any field experience w/ these 2 bullets on game and/or accuracy between the them. It looks like the Scirocco is built "beefier" but not sure how much, if any, difference there is between them. I appreciate your input.

If this issue has been addressed before, please forgive.

Good post!I want to see responses;I've only killed coyotes and one deer with them,but can say they both shoot great;very accurate bullets IME from 7 RM and 30/06.Thanks.

I also am quite curious about the Scirocco II.
The original didn't shoot too well out of my 270WCF and 300RUM.
I however, would be willing to give the 'dash two' a whirl if somebody has some good results on game to report.

Does finding an enormous void in a Scirocco count as experience?

I intended to use the Sciroccos in a 7x57 I was building and ground one in half for display on the wall and found a void in the rear that measured .287x.104 or that was what I found was left in the remaining half. averege weight was all over the place on the remaining bullets so have gone off them completely now. Use the 160gn Woodleigh and think it is one of the best bullets going. Accurate and effective.

Von Gruff.

Wow!
That is interesting.
I know that on the original Scirocco's I fired out of my 270WCF(but only one box of 100) accuracy was pretty dismal.

However, I have had superb accuracy out of my 340Wby with the 225gr A-Frame.

Weird, as I would have expected the slick, boat tailed bonded bullet to shoot better than the A-Frame.

I use the 180 grain Scirocco IIs in my .300 Wby. I have taken 2 large bull elk with this rifle/bullet combination. Both animals were dead on their feet after the first shot. One faltered long enough for me to get a second shot through the lungs a couple of inches away from the first.

I use 200 grain AccuBonds in my .300 WSM, but have taken only one elk--the largest bodied bull that I have ever killed. It was a one-shot kill (the animal was quartering toward me and the bullet entered between the shoulder and the neck and exited behind the last short rib on the opposite side). I use the 250 grain AccuBonds in my 9.3x62 and 9.3x74R: one bull with each, both one-shot kills. I use 260 grain AccuBonds in my .375 H&H and have taken two bull elk, a 55-inch kudu, a very nice waterbuck, a 38-inch oryx and several small plains antelope. All the African animals were one-shot kills, but one of the bull elk stayed on his feet long enough for a second shot.

Accuracy in my rifles with both bullets is pretty much equal. The 200 ABs in my .300 WSM (a CZ Model 3 that has been professionally re-bedded) is best: 1/2-5/8 inch groups consistently at 100 yds. The Sciroccos in my .300 Wby are also a reliable sub-moa load, doing 1/2-3/4 inch when I do my part. The 9.3s both run from 1-1 1/4 inch. The .375 H&H was also a 1-1 1/4 inch rifle, but I had Hill Country Rifles do their accuracy work and put it into a McMillan Classic stock and it's now a genuine sub-moa shooter with the 260 ABs.

FWIW, accuracy with the first generation Sciroccos and the Scirocco IIs were virtually the same, as was the performance on game..

Mudhen,
Interesting report and thank you.

The .257 100's and the 130 .277 interest me in S2. I've been meaning to order some for awhile now.

Greebrier, here a a couple of threads you may find interesting.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth...&topic=0&Search=true#Post2603876

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth...&topic=0&Search=true#Post2597884

mudhen: That was a good post; thanks.

I shot both the 130g NAB and the 130g Swift SII into milk jugs at about 15 feet. Both were from a 6.5x284 at about 3100 fps.

The SII went through 6 jugs and was laying on the ground beside the jugs. The NAB went through 5 jugs and was stuck in the side of the 5th jug.

The NAB weighed 78.5g (60.4%), Maximal diameter -0.653 inches.
The SII weighed 122.9g(94.5%), Maximal diameter -0.692 inches.

A couple pictures:







I posted this back in December, so sorry if it is a repeat. Still working up a load for the SII with RL17. (Looks very promising)

100gr SSII's land sub-moa out to 500 in my Roy....couldn't be happier. Hope to report on game soon.

257Wby @ 100yds

I have not tried them yet, but this picture sticks in my mind as I'm really impressed with the frontal diameter for the Scirocco II's. I understand this is a water test, but I think the bullet would look similar if you where to recover one from an animal.


CLB

That's pic is a close cousin to the ones I have recovered.
I use the Scirocco exclusively for whitetail since about 2003 or 2004.
I hunt woods about 50% of the time and it retains about 74% weight close up and personal from a 300 RUM 180gr.
This year I will run them in the 25-06 and no longer have that nagging concern about close shots.

Accuracy has been excellent in the boxes I've bought.

Do the SII seem to get caught under the hide, or do they penetrate all the way through?

IIRC Mule Deer was testing some SII's in his rifles also, I think the 257 100 grainers.

I thought the S2 was gaining promise after three critters killed & bullets recovered. It was the third that really bothered me. It was a yearling Sika doe taken with a 150 S2 from a 7 Rem Mag at roughly 60 yards. THe first surprise was the recovery of the bullet. That really really troubled me. Once recovered, the bullet had fragmented into three pieces, second surprise. THis was from a bonded bullet. THe bullet was dug out of the scapula, thrid surprise. No way even that little bone from the little doe should have stopped that bullet.

I won't be using the remainder of my Scirocco's.

On the flip side of the coin I have seen over a dozen animals whacked with the Accubond in .284 & .308, none of which ran more than 4o yards. Only one was recovered from a 600 lb + Oryx shot with a 30-06 at 140 yards in the shoulder. The handloaded round was averageing 3080 fps. The big critter took off and piled up after a 40 yard dash. THe 165 gr AB weighed in at 148 gr's. The longest bang flop was a 250 yard head shot on an Elk cow from the 30-06.

Accubonds? Certainly.
Scirocco's? Certainly not.

S2's for me all the way.

I have complete confidence in them.

Good post. Looking for more replies.

I got to try the Scirocco II in my 25-06! Looks pretty interesting!

Correct!

I've not found Accubonds in general to be very accurate. A few have given good accuracy, but less so than many others, including Nosler Partitions.

I've killed several deer with the Swift from 223 up to 7mm Remington Mag.

Only killed one critter with an Accubond, a 6 1/2' bear with a 110gr from my 250AI.

Everything has died, [bleep] has been screwed up on the inside and I haven't recovered a bullet.

Reloder28,

I'm curious about the 600+ pound oryx. Where did you find that? I have shot a number of oryx, including scimitar-horned and gemsbok, and the biggest was a gemsbok from the Karoo region of South Africa that went 550, weighed on the accurate (commercial) scales on the ranch.

I've found just the opposite.
A 60 yard shot out of a 7mm Rem mag is gonna get interesting.
Sounds like your doe didn't make it.

I have used both AB's and Scirocco II's and have yet to have a problem with the Scirocco's. That being said I have only one deer that I have shot with the AB's so I'm trying to be open minded. It's easy to $hitcan a bullet after a bad experience, but one shouldn't expect every bullet to perform flawlessly in every application.

KC

Sciroccos have been found under the hide on occasion, after transiting rib, lungs, a packed gut and ended up just in front of the ham but still blew out a nice hole.
I don't fret as they all got sick pretty quick.

I developed loads for 165gr accubonds and scirocco IIs for my 30-06. Both shot well under an inch on the good groups and probably 1.25 inch when my equipment malfunctioned- couldn't have been me.

Anyway, I ended up hunting with the scirocco load and took this deer last year. The shot was ~275 yrds and entered behind the shoulder, the animal was quartering towards me. I recoved the bullet from the rear hind right underneath the skin. If the shot would have been broadside, the bullet would definitely have passed right through.

The deer fell so I'm happy with the performance. I've never actually shot anything with an accubond, but I'm sure it would do an equally good job.

I've tried to post a picture of the bullet and the deer, hope it works.


[img]http://www.facebook.com/editapps.php?ref=mb#/photo.php?pid=2841&id=1820494831&ref=mf[/img]
[img]http://www.facebook.com/editapps.php?ref=mb#/photo.php?pid=2842&id=1820494831&ref=mf[/img]

What load you shootin? What rifle? Thanks.

I don't have any on game performance with the Accubond. Last year I shot a buck at 30 yds with my 270 WSM using a 130 gr Scirroco at 3200+ fps at the muzzle. The bullet did not pass thru and was found on the offside shoulder just under the skin. Penetration was 10 to 12 inches. The bullet held together well considering the extreme impact speed. Penetration was not what I would have expected. Retained weight was 68 grains.

WinModel70,

That photo looks more like a .358cal bullet to me than a .277cal bullet. Man that Swift opened up wide...... I bet the buck didnt go far....

How's your girlfriend doing, Randy?
The one in your avatar?
(grin)

Tim,
She is big and butiful.....lol...and has been asking about you.....:GRIN:

One word of advice just dont stand behind her when she farts......

haha!
Nice rejoinder Mr. Randy!

Looks like a 'Whole lotta love there'

So you going to shot your H&H today or what....grins...

I may just do that,Randy.
I must admit I have been hearing this voice out of the safe lately...
"shoot me, you bastard!"
(grin)

You most obay the voice in the save! Your life could depend on it.... :GRIN:... Dont leave the 270win behind as the H&H will need a friend....

Ya know Randy,
If I had to pick two calibers for about any big game hunting I could imagine, I would choose the 270 and 375 ouch and ouch.
Or if I was in a european mood, the 6.5 Swede and the 9.3X62.
Great pairs, those two!

Very nice. My two would be 257Roy and 358STA.
Or maybe 243win and 325WSM.

If I was to go to Africa a 416 rigby would be my top choice....

Good pics, Randy.
I better get moving here, got to go hop on the bicycle for a bit.

Have a good Memorial Day weekend, my friend.

Talk at you later Tim....

What's the load on this one Guy.........pretty impressive!

I finally figured out how to post pictures. Below are some shots which I mention in my post above.

I went was shooting yesterday and found that the scirocco load I used last year won't shoot anymore, groups 3.5-4 inches, go figure.


This shot is 165 gr accubond 30-06 100 yrds 3 shots


This is 130 gr accubond .260 rem 100 yrds, couldn't get the 130gr scirocco to group 2.5- 3 inches



These two are of the 165 gr sicrocco that was pulled from the rear hind (oops) after quartering through the deer, entering at the front shoulder.






If anyone is interested in seeing the scirocco groups let me know, they are ugly.

100grSSII/Wby Brass/Fed215M/H1000/COL:3.195" = 3585fps Vanguard

I took my buddies' word for it. Guess he was over zealous. Did not intend to embellish. But, he was big for sure and the AB did it's job.

That's been my experience in my 270 as well with the S1's. I did get one that was a decent grouping but at about 200 fps less then I desired. The AB has been much more accurate for me.

One of the things I've noticed about the Sciroccos is that Swift doesn't recommend nearly as fast a load for them as they do their A-Frames. For instance, with IMR 4350, and the 165 gr. weight, they say 53.5 grs. is tops for 2761 fps. For their A-Frame, same weight, they say 58 grs. for 2882 fps. Nosler says their top load for their Partition and Ballistic Tip loads are 59 grs. of IMR 4350 for 2940 fps. All of these are 30'06 loads and all are for their 165 gr. bullets. Perhaps the alloy and thickness of the jacket on the Scirocco ? I suppose you could say that what the Scirocco lacks in intial muzzle velocity, it makes up for in higher BC.
As far as game performance, they apparently are pretty similar. They open very wide at high impact speeds but also open pretty well at very low impact speeds.
The AB was suppose to perform like a Partition. But from what I've seen, they work very much like the other bonded core bullets w/o a partition. They open very wide at high impact speeds which limits their penetration even if they do maintain close to 90% of their original weight.
I'm of the opinion that they are both at their best way out there. Up close, I'd go with either the NP or the SAF. E

It would be a hard job indeed to find an Accubomb that retained anything near 90% after killing a critter.

Ditto that. AB's are nothing but Ballistic tips and nothing more. Bonded my arse.

Oh don't get me wrong, I like 'em. They shoot the lights out in a few of my rigs, and killed a few critters with them nicely, but I'm not going to delude myself or anyone else into thinking they're something they're not.

How many grns of the h1000?

Popapi-

work up to 74grs

Will do bullets will be here on wednesday! Thanks

I hope they fly straight for ya


Good luck,

Brett

Brett I have a pretty good feeling they will!

I am sorta inclined to agree.....

At least ,they don't seem to be "bonded" the way I learned about "bonded".......

The recovered AB's and BT's that I've used to kill phonebooks look different. The lead 'clings' to the jacket noticably better on the AB's.

I'm betting they both work on deer...(grin0

Not if it runs 20 feet, and then it's a hellish tracking job and retrieval, an obvious bullet failure, and a 35 page topic on the 'fire...

TFF...

Those Torpedo's will kick a guy square in the ass.
Celebrating tomorrow's MIL departure a little early...

Nice!

7.2%, so it'll get the party started.. She invited?

I'm hiding out in the cave with some Joe Cocker on the headphones....(Feelin' Alright)

Peaceout.

So's your MIL gone now?? Did you take her to your dads to AI some cattle??



Well, back on topic, when I get Kimber #2 back from the smith as a 260, I intend to try out the 130 ABs and SII's. If'n they group SUB-MOA and chrono 2800+, I'll even bump off a critter or 4 with them

If you want to get rid of your MIL fast, go rent (actually I recommend buying it) My Best Friend's Girl. Has Dane Cook in it. Lots of funnies.

But back to the subject, I had a 180gr S2 full-length penetrate a brownie last Sept. at about 15 yds. I'm guessing impact velocity was about 3250fps or so.

Bearstalker,
I would say that is a pretty tough bullet!
!!!

Bearstalker, did the brownie die pronto?

Got the Scirocco II's today will be loading up tonight for the 25-06 to try out on the weekend Lord willing, anyone has a 25-06 load for these before I start!? Next will be the 257 WBY!!!!!!!!!

Just anticipate they may run a little higher pressure than most 100's. RE22 would be my first choice for powder or 4831SC.

I am very interested in your results.

To be fair, I have never run light Sciroccos and hope the 100/25's are built to perform up close if needed.

TenFour sawbuck RE22 was one of the powders I'll start with(53-54grn) being that the rifle does well with 55.7grns(No Pressure) behind a 100grn TTSX. Thanks for the advice!

I shoot Retumbo from my 700 in my 25-06. I use the 110gr Accubond and get really good (3/4") groups.

I'm in the process of whipping a 90gr Scirocco load for my 243, we'll see how they shoot.

How odd just last weekend I used Retumbo(59grns) as well with the 110grn Accubond and got alittle less than 3/4" groups myself!

I havent used a chronograph, but according to the Nosler book the Retumbo gets really good velocity. I do not remember what is stated right now. I am running 58 grains. My son shot a cow moose w/ it last season and it immediately fell at the shot!

GB here's tha data from Nosler. 59.0* 3267 fps 98% case cap. That's pretty stout if ya ask me I will be chronoing this load ASAP!

Please let me know what it does through your chronograph. Thanks...

Sure thang Guy!

I had accuracy issues with the Scirocco out of a 308, but it was a finicky rifle that turned out to love Fusions better than anything. Go figure.

I hope I don't have any issues with this bullet I feel it will do well with the .429BC atleast I hope so LOL(expensive rascals). Speaking of Fusions I bought a box(150grns) just to foul my 300wsm barrel, and shot the first round, which registered 1 1/2" to the right moved the windage 4 clicks to left and proceeded a 3 shot group to my amazement these jokers shot a .310 3 shot group........................I bout fainted, so these will be my backups IF I forget the reloads or if I don't feel like reloading.

I'm not surprised. Fusions have a habit of turning in excellent performance in a range of calibers. I think of them as the blue-collar premium bullet. In other words, you get performance approaching that of many premium bullets, but at a reasonable cost. I know some folks who have done some yeoman work with the bullets (i.e., Greg Rodriguez culling a ton of Kudu with them, with excellent results). It is, surprisingly, the most accurate factory round I've yet tested in my Kimber Montana 308, which doesn't appear to like much of anything else (total of nine different factory loads tested, including Rem. match ammo!).

Heck at 32bucks shooting like that you can't beat em, after I saw how they performed I was about to say forget reloading. I know one thing I'll for sure try them in my other rigs!

How about the Hornady Interbonds? They shoot way better out of my 280 than the Accubonds, but have yet to use them on game so know nothing of their terminal performance. Any input would be appriciated.