I have a new Winchester model 70 featherweight with accuracy issues that I have been unable to figure out. I have about 120 rounds through it at this point.

The problem is that it will group well sometimes and not others. Typically it will go like this. The first three rounds from a cold barrel will give a group of about 3" at a hundred yards. After letting the barrel cool, the next group will often approach 1 1/2" The third group from a cold barrel will open back up to about 4 or 5 inches.

I have switched bullets and powder, checked the scope mounts for tightness and then remounted the scope even though it was tight. The scope was placed on a 300 weatherby and it dialed in and held zero. Back on the Winchester I got the same sporatic results as before. The barrel is free floated. The action screws are tight. I even had someone else shoot the gun with the same results. The last time at the range I just shot it without and real time for the barrel to cool. If I had to make a general statement I would say it shot slightly better from a warm barrel but I can't remember a group under 1 1/2" @100 yards. Most will push the 3" mark. Any suggestions? I could accept the 1 1/2" if it was consistant.

Dont they offer an accuracy guarantee? If so, I'd go that route. Also, since the rifle has 120 rounds through it, make sure it isnt copper fouled. Usually when Ive had a sour shooting M70, it was due to bedding. Good luck, hope you get it to shoot.

The newer model 70s have one major and one minor problem, that when fixed will make them into 1 moa rifles.

1. the bedding is hot glue crap and the barrels are not free floated.
Buy a glass bedding kit from Brownells, scrape out the hot glue crap and glass bed the recoil lug and rear 1" of the barrel. Make VERY sure that only the rear of the recoil lug is touching. You can do this by putting tape on the sides and bottom or by bedding it as is and then opening up the sides, front and bottom with a Dremel tool. Keeping the glass from extending past 1" is a job for flexible removable rope caulk.

Next step is to get some dowels and 40 grit sandpaper. Open up the barrel channel so that a business card will pass from the muzzle to the 1" of glass bedding at the barrel's rear end.
Put a coat of spar varnish on the new raw wood in the bbl channel.

It also helps to put blue painters masking tape along the edge of the stock where it meets the barrel and action to avoid glass flowing over onto the wood.

This system was invented by Col T Whelen and I have done it on dozens of bolt actions of all brands.....it always works.

On a M70 the front action screw needs to be tight, the other two just enough to hold things together. I suggest blue locktite on them.

It will take a few shots to settle it into the stock at which time you will want to retighten (if necessary) the front action screw.

Finally adjust the trigger. most come from the factory at 7-10 pounds.... 3 is easy and safe.

My latest effort was on a new marlin XLC in 270 that was a 1.5 MOA rifle out of the box. It now punches bug holes.

typical oldman guy asks about a winchester M70 and he posts a pic of a group he claims he shot with a Marlin.

Seriously what is wrong with you.

Measure COAL for your rifle and particular bullet and load accordingly. I did this with my NIB M70 and was pleasantly surprised how things tightened up.

I use a 1/4" wooden dowel to check my COAL for a certain bullet.

I would make sure your barrel is not fouled. If so square that away first.
Action screws on a Model 70 cannot be over-tightened or of course it will affect accuracy.

I was raised shooting Model 70's and the following procedure is what I was taught and have always used. By no means an expert but a Model 70 Fanatic.

1) Loosen all action screws.

2) Snug the top external screw until you meet resistance.

3) Snug the screw behind the trigger guard in the same manner, and lastly do the same to the screw under the floor-plate.

4) Close floor-plate and tighten top action screw. Use common sense here and don't squeeze it down like most tend to do on an oil pan drainplug.

5) Do the same to the trigger guard screw in step 4.

6) Lastly, re-open floor plate and tighten the middlel screw in the same manner and then back the screw out 1/4 turn.

Shoot for accuracy.

I have never used Blue Loctite on action screws on a Model 70 Winchester.
Nor have I ever had to re-bed a Model 70 Winchester.
Accept the fact that you are shooting a lightweight rifle and don't expect Sub MOA groups. I have also learned that most accuracy problems are either scope or ammo related. Sounds like you have the scope factored out already so you may be ahead of the game. Try different ammo? Was it windy when you were shooting? Was it an a.m. shoot after drinking coffee?

Just trying to help, not be a smart***.

Please post back and see if anything improved after tightening action screws outlined above. I think you might be happy.

oldman1942, The new FN Winchesters are bedded with SteelBed and free-floated from the factory. The triggers arent 10 lbs anymore either.

Your diagnosis is spot on for the poorly bedded later M70's.

Well, more information's needed.. What chambering? How many rounds do you fire before cleaning the bore? How are you cleaning the bore? What cleaning material are you using? If you're scrupulous about cleaning, try NOT cleaning it for 30-40 rounds and test again..

If this is a new FN, have you tried a pressure point? How does it shoot factory ammo?

Here's my solution to accuracy issues with Winchester, Remington & Ruger rifles. Pack up rifle, drive to gunshop and trade for Tikka or Sako. Accuracy issues resolved.

I don't really agree with this statment. LW rifles should shoot MOA I have 4 and have found loads for all of them that will group sub MOA. Don't lower you standards for a hunting rifle and sacrifice wieght for accuracy

Chambering is 7mm-08
It was cleaned every few rounds the first three times at the range. The fourth time I just shot it.
Coffee was not an issue. I was shooting other rifles just fine and another person had the same problem while shooting the model 70.
There was no wind at the range on any of the four trips.
Three bullet weights and two powders and two brands of primers have been tried.
COAL is correct
I am not asking that this rifle become a long range target rifle,I just want it to shoot with some consistency and be reasonabley accurate. I don't believe that 1 1/2" at a 100 yards is asking too much.

I had good luck with leaving the center screw only finger nail tight to keep from stressing the center of the action.

This "Center" screw has caused many problems in Ruger and Win actions when it comes to shooting very tiny groups where you want all the bullets to go in a singe onle or enlarge a bullet hole.

Basically, if you really torque down on the center screw, you May bend the action in the middle where the action will not vibrate consistantly from shot to shot.

This is not a guarantee on every Action, but can be very problematic depending on the stock/action fit.

Not at all... Ok, now, have you tried a pressure point? Is this a new FN M70 or a NH? If the latter, has the trigger been adjusted? And last, what does factory ammo give you?

Sorry but I think I said I HAVE DONE IT ON MANY DIFFERENT BRANDS OF RIFLES AND IT ALWAYS WORKED.

Here's a pic of the one before the Marlin. Even with the BOSS it was a 1.5" rifle....afterwords, bug holes. You will note IT IS A NEW HAVEN M70!!!!!

As to "what is a M 70 featherweight", perhaps I made the error in assuming he had one of the very pretty late New Haven ones. Probably the best looking 70 ever made but still had the crap bedding.

Perhaps the OP could tell us if he has an FN or the earlier one?

BTW, just because the new ones are steel glass bedded, doesn't mean it was done right. If the recoil lug is touching anywhere but the back, it will impact accuracy.

I won't even get into how one can but a REAL FN or Husky/FN from the 50s-60s and have a superior rifle in every way...... for 1/2 the price.

FYI blue loctite is designed to be undone with no heat, all it does is insure the screws won't loosen, so no harm can be done.

Some more clarification here.

This is one of the new featherweights.
The barrel is floated
There is bedding at the recoil lug and at the rear action screw.
The trigger pull from the factory is set at 4 1/4 lbs.
So far I have been unable to get all of the 'gunk" used in and around the trigger adjustment out. I broke my last dental pick working on it the AM. Adjustments appear to be small allen heads but they are still full of the sealer.
Also, in refernce to the tightening sequence, there are only two screws. There is no screw under the floorplate.

Thanks for all the input. It has got me looking and rechecking.

BTW Oldman, I really like the wood on the rifle photo you posted.

Heavywalker,

What I meant was not all factory rifles shoot sub MOA groups. Many will but most won't. However, it seems most think that when their new rifle will only shoot 1.5 inch groups something is wrong with it or that it needs warranty work.

I have many rifles and some shoot better than others. The better shooters are normally the heavier rifles. Any Winchester Model 70 that shoots 1.5 groups is a dead ringer as far as I am concerned for hunting anyway. My experience is most will shoot better than that. SUBMOA groups have become the required standard for hunting rifles these days. I doubt anyone here can print these SUBMOA groups from offhand or any other method other than bench conditions.

All of the targets with tight groups posted on a forum with notes indicating they were taken at 100, 200 or any other range for that matter really don't impress anyone but at the same time are fun to look at.

I am sure every shooter has encountered the strange phenomenon while at the range of having to ask themselves "Why is this rifle grouping horribly this time? Last time it was dead nuts!" I know I have.

The original poster wrote that this was his problem:

"The problem is that it will group well sometimes and not others. Typically it will go like this. The first three rounds from a cold barrel will give a group of about 3" at a hundred yards. After letting the barrel cool, the next group will often approach 1 1/2" The third group from a cold barrel will open back up to about 4 or 5 inches."

In my opinion something is wrong but his rifle obviously has the ability to shoot 1.5 groups which is well within hunting standards. Is accepting a 1.5 group in a Featherweight rifle lowering you standards? I don't think so. Certainly does not make it any less efficient as a hunting rifle.

Mauser12,

Sorry, I didn't know the new Model 70's did not have a screw under the floorplate. I have yet to handle a new one. Still trying to wear out my old ones. Good luck with your issue, maybe try another scope from another rifle.

Mauser 12, thanks for the clarification. That wood is okay for a standard grade 70 but not like these factory wood Brownings and Winchester or 50+ year old Remington'.

That is what I thought also.

I have 2 New model 70 Featherweight and they don't group very well with loads on the upper scale of pressure. I don't know wich load you use but backing off 2 or 3 grains of powders might solve your problem. Like someone already said, the chambers are tight...

I am already three grains below listed maximum. I have found over the years that most of my guns are a little more accurate just under full loads. I was actually thinking of bumping the loads up a grain to try something different.

I would like to get the trigger pull to around three pounds but Winchester really does not want anyone adjusting the trigger. I was able to cut the majority of the stuff off with a pocket knife but the hols are completly filled. Any ideas for a solvent for the sealer?

Thanks again for all of the input. Sometimes frustration takes over judgement when I run up against this type of issue. I like the balance of the rifle and have until next deer season to get it right so I am willing to try about anything.

Wich bullet did you tried?

Absolutely.. Go up in half-grain amts and try again... Many of the 'more accurate' loads shown in a couple of my books run near the top fps.. You might be going too slow to get full stabilization.. You're running these over a chrono, right?


Doncha just love those MOA triggers?...

You could try Kutzit Paint and Varnish remover for solvent on the sealer.It might do the job.

The best way I find to remove the glue was to take a pair of cutter.I was able to remove almost all the glue in one pass that way on the 2 mod 70 that I won.I would also try the rifle with another scope before giving up on it.

Agree, the first step is ALWAYS to check mounts and swap out the scope to one you KNOW works 100%. A GOOD scope not some Chinese crap.

I would also invest in a box of factory Federal Premium ammo loaded with the Nosler� Ballistic Tip as that is a bullet that almost always shoots the best (along with Sierras) in factory ammo.

Clean the bore and CHAMBER well and see what happens.

Keep us posted ....mysteries are fun IF you are not the victim.

I still wonder why the great M-70 trigger was ever changed. All the 70s I have ever owned were easy to get to 2.5-3 pounds.

Mauser12
Is there a pressure point at the end of the forearm?? If so, I would remove it. You can also shim the action up enough for the barrel to not be touching the stock at the end. Then go to the range (truly free floated) and try it out again using same ammo as at the start.

Apparently you are using factory ammo??? If you are doing your own loading, make sure you are not mixing your brass. I helped a guy at the range who was having similar problems. When I sorted and shot his hand loads by brand of brass, most of his problems went away.
Also make sure you are using the scale correctly and that it is repeatable.

Don't bounce around with the bullets either. Coated vs not coated being mixed or shot alternately can be an issue also.
Same weight but different brand/style are not interchangeable either (usually).

Make sure you always set up the same on the sand bags. Also make sure that the sling studs are not contacting the bags.

If nothing else works, try starting with a clean (really clean) bore. Shoot one, clean, shoot again, clean, etc. See what a couple 5 shot groups look like doing that.

Just thinking out loud. Hope something here is worthwhile.

Tim

Not to hi-jack this thread but just wanted to thank Storker for his avice about tightening the various action screws on a Model 70. I just bought a used Model 70 Classic Stainless and, before going to the range today to shoot it, I followed his advice to a "T". The rifle shot great. Did it make a difference? I really don't know but it sure didn't hurt anything.

One of the dumbest things ever done by a rifle manufacturer - EVER...

Just my .05....

The scope is good. I tried it on another rifle. It is a Leupold VXIII.

So far I have used Nolser BTs, BarnesX, and Hornady SP bullets.

I am going to the range again on Tuesday. Hopefully the trigger will be adjusted by then. I'll pick up some Sierras this weekend.

I have one of the new FWt's in 270 but haven't shot it yet.........as someone has already said, the barrels are already properly floated & that can be either good or bad.

I'd take Lee's (Redneck) advice & try a wee bit of barrel pressure as IMHO, most light barrels shoot best with light to neutral pressure.

The bedding on the lug & the tang on my gun looks as good as I could do except that the bottom of the action is not bedded.

I'd also check the magazine liner & make sure it's not binding when the action screws are tightened. If so file some off the bottom until it's just free.

I've got 2 other 270's & had numerous others..........RL22 & either 140 gr Nosler BT's or AB's have always produced good results. Both 4350's are good as is H4831. If no combination of those bullet & powders won't shoot, likely the problem is something else other than the ammo.

I have noticed that the chamber on the new Win is definitely tight as I cannot get fired brass from either of my other 2 guns to chamber ( Rem KS & a Sako Fiberclass).

MM

Took the stock off and reinstalled it. The factory had it torqed like a diesel head gasket. I Played with it until the tightness seemed reasonable. Checked to make sure the barrel was still floated. I still have not adjusted the trigger. The local Home Depot has solvents in 1 to 5 gallon sizes and I likely need about 5 drops. I still had ammo loaded so I went to the range this AM. From a cold barrel, the first 3 shot group measured 5/8". I set the rifle aside until it was cold again. The second three shot group measured just over 3/4" I can certianly live with those results. It didn't start to open the groups up until five or six shots and then only to about 1 1/2" Thanks again for all the input on this problem.

Looks like you are well on your way to enjoying a nice rifle.

Glad it's doing better.. Yeah, I've had a few factory rifles in where they had the stock screws so tight I was afraid I was going to break a bit getting 'em loose.. Idiots..

If you get consistent 5/8" 3-shot groups from a cold barrel, I wouldn't mess with it any more.. By the time you may need a fourth shot, the deer (or other critter) could be in high gear and out of sight..

I love a happy ending. Especially an inexpensive one.

+1 with hw. It's horseshit that light rifles won't shoot. Guess some folks just can't shoot!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!