My buddy has a gun he's thinking about getting rid of. Its a SS New Haven made Model 70 in .300 Ultramag. Anyone know if this combo is very rare? The gun kicks the crap out of him and I thought he might be best served by getting it ported and putting a better stock on it, but I don't want to give him bad advise if it might be something more valueable the way it is. He's got plenty of other guns that don't blow his shoulder up.

They are not an easy chambering to find and are a good rifle if you are into 300RUM's,which are a biy over th top for me but many like them. I'd rather a 300 Weatherby myself or 300 Winchester...

I'd sell it and get something more manageable before I'd put money into it....I hate muzzle brakes and if needed,I'd prefer a more shootable rifle.He isn't leaving anything on the table.That's what I did with mine.

As-is.. Will never be worth any less.. And the more he puts in that gun the less he gets out...


W

Thanks guys,
I've got a .300 Ultra and I like it, but I'm not all that recoil sensitive and its pretty much the same thing as my .300 Weatherby. We all bought the Ultramags when they first came out and to admit, they are something of a ray gun.

I'm left handed and they didn't make the 70 stainless LH in an Ultramag. If mine was a Model 70 like my buddies I'd just put it in a McMillian or something similar and leave it. I think the reason his punches the shoulder so hard is that the plastic buttstock is unbelievably narrow for such a hard kicker.

And the factory recoil pad ain't nothing special. Mine wears a McMillan super grade EDGE stock and a fluted #3 pacnor barrel and it ain't bad. Hammers critters....

Gotta ask (and I like the 300 RUM) but what's he using it for that he feels a need for it?

If he had to keep it, I'd magnaport if and drop it in a new stock. It's a heck of a machine for those that can master it. Few can and even fewer can take advantage of what it brings to the dance.

Dober

Hey Dober,
To be totally honest, I don't think you need an Ultramag for anything. We hunt a lot of stuff, but Boar and Blacktail are the ever year deal and we all go to Wyoming and Oregon for Elk, Goats and Deer.
When I first got mine I was hunting all season with my .300 Savage for Blacktail buck that kept giving me the slip. I missed him in the thick stuff once because I hit a tree branch that I couldn't see. Another couple weekends he just got away before I could get a shot. The last weekend of the season I did something really unfair. I brought the Ultramag and sat on a hill across the canyon from where that buck lived all day. About an hour before sunset he fed out into the open at 392 yards. I shot him through the lungs and he dropped faster than anything I've ever seen hit.

Anyway, like I said.. kinda unfair looking back. This next year we've got a once in a lifetime Elk hunt going. I'm going to be shooting my M70 30-06, but I might bring the Ultramag as a backup gun anyway.

They're really not bad to shoot except sitting at the bench. Mine seems to bite the shoulder a little more than either of my .338's. Standing, kneeling or anything other than the bench you don't notice it a bit though.

Oh yeah.. prone, I forgot prone. They're a B$%#H prone.
My buddy shot a buck a little low in the front leg in Oregon a few years back. It got away from us and we tracked it for a few hours. Wasn't hit real hard, but clipped and wounded and we ended up getting another shot at him in some timber later in the day and both missed.

We split up and went back out on the quads about 2 hours before sunset. I found a group of does meandering around the hillside on the opposite side of the canyon about a mile from where he'd originally shot the buck. Sure enough.. there was a limping buck with them. I didn't want to risk trying to go over to the other side and spooking them off again and it was getting dark. Any closer down the hill I went toward him he was out of view. I backed up to where I could see him good enough. It was about 425-450 yards. I put the crosshairs a little over his back when he bedded down and squeezed off, prone, with the gun resting lightly in sage brush. I was trying not to wiggle the gun. I got scoped eyed bad!!! And then heard a wack. Ended up hitting him in the fold of the neck. No way in hell that deer would have died that night or my eye would have got bloodied with my '06.

Mike: Well so far, I have not seen you post a shot opportunity that could not have been pulled off neatly with a 270, 7 mag or 300 Winchester Mag,with less fuss and recoil...and without the scoped eyebrow,and the ridiculous amount of recoil from various positions and the bench.

When it comes to recoil and self inflicted abuse,to each his own as the saying goes;but if it's done in the interest of "quick kills",it rarely works out and the 300RUM is one of those cartridges that does nothing the smaller 300's do with a lot less of that sort of nonsense.Dealing with little blacktail deer this is doubly so.

If I were your pal, I'd trip the thing and get something that works.

Hi Bobin,
We didn't buy the .300's for Blacktail. We bought them for Elk. I just hunted mine for Blacktail because I could. Our Blacktail season is 7 weeks here and if you're not in a hurry you can run out a couple guns if you want.

We bought the .300's back in the 90's and you're right. No one "needs" one but sometimes you just get stuff you don't need when you like guns.

I'm not sure I could have pulled off that shot with a .270, or a 7mm of a .300 Win because I don't have one. I've got a bunch of 30-06's that do close enough to that kinda stuff for me. I just wouldn't have tried it with the '06. The .300 Ultra does something that my '06 doesn't. Maybe a 7mm would be ok, but like I said I don't have one. When I bought my .300 I did so because I liked that I could shoot a 200 Grain bullet about as flat as I could shoot a 150 out of my '06. In the end I actually ended up shooting 180's out of my .300 and with the 180's its a no brainer setup for me. I like the .300, I don't mind the recoil, only thing I don't like about it is the long barrel.

My buddy is different. He doesn't like the recoil from the .300 and is thinking of getting rid of it. If he can tame it a little I'm sure he'll shoot it some more and hang on to a nice gun.

Well Mike not having those others is a very good reason for not having used them...

I know they work for the shots you described because I have used them all for very similar shots.

I know the 300RUM is a fast,flat shooting cartridge but to me it is just too much of a good thing,and not for everyone.Other things shoot just as flat,kill just as well, and beat a guy up less,is my point.

They didn't make a ton of 'em.. I get a couple in every year to have a brake installed.. Guys think they need this boomer until they fire it a couple times.. The brake's added while the bruises disappear..

If he wants less recoil, either install the action in a heavier stock, add a soft, thick recoil pad or add a brake.. DO NOT get it Magnaported.. The brake's removable - those ugly slots aren't..

If/when he spends more money on this Ultra, he will find that he doesn't still really care for it,

too big, too heavy, too loud, costly ammo,

Sell it to the next he-man.

BigIron-best of luck with sorting this out.

Personally I'd say it's time for him to cut bait and rock with another round.

Now if he wants to commit to the Ultra no problemo with it. I've shot them a ton and don't find them overly caustic but it like a 340 is a round that I'd want to shoot a lot to keep in sink with it.

I'd stock it, magnaport it and rock on. And, I'd have a scope with some eye relief on it. Could consider a 168 NBT or TSX or something like that instead of one of the heavies.

If you'd of had your rig magnaported I doubt you'd of been scoped on that buck that you finished. And, 425 yds or so isn't very darn far and I'd of felt comfy putting the buck down with anything from my 22/250 or 6/06 on up.

Best of luck to him with this.

Where's the elk hunt at?

Thx, and have a super day!

Dober

Great round I have owned probably 20 different ultra mag rifles 300,338,375. They are both tolerable.Nice to shoot a 200 gr accubond at 3200 fps.I'm not into anything sub .308 cal. My 338-378 is putting 300 gr bullets into less than 1/2 inch 5 shots.The bigger magnums can be shot accurately you just have to work with them.

It sounds to me like you all need to get rifles you can shoot better, ie; not flinch when shooting them and can afford to shoo them a LOT. No offense meant at all, but you guys are missing a lot of critters. It takes a LOT of shooting to master the Ultras. They just don't bring much to the table that can't be done with an easier on the shoulder round. I'd dump it and get something he isn't scared to death of or rebarrel it to a 7mm magnum. Flinch

Hey Fellas,
Yeah, my buddy is kinda a rifle nut too and has a few different rounds. I think the deal with his .300 is the stock for the most part. Its a stainless/synthetic and the buttstock on the thing doesn't feel much wider than a 94 at the pad.
He shoots a .270 and a 7x57 for deer and a .338 for Elk usually. He actually shoots the UM well, he's just got messed up shoulders from working in the cold a lot. His bites more than mine. He doesn't want to cut loose with it yet, but doesn't shoot it anymore.
I've got a Remington LH LSS with the laminate stock and its heavier. I'm looking at putting a McMillian on mine. I'm not going to port it because I don't like blowing my buddies ears out and but mine doesn't kick all that bad.. except for that one time I shot it prone. My fault though on that one, it was freezing and I wasn't holding on to the the gun all that tight because I was shivering and trying to keep the cross hairs in the right spot on a bedded buck. I don't shoot mine a heck of a lot anymore as I've kinda gotten into taking some of my older guns along now.

Hey Dober, the Elk hunt is going to be in Oregon. I think you're right about shooting them a lot. I took mine out before the season this year and ran about 80 rounds through on ground squirrels. We've got a slew of them on the ranch and it always gets you feeling pretty confident about the deer season.

80 rounds on chucks,pds or gophs would be a good day no doubt...

I'd especially like the round for long range chucks.

Seriously though, I'm not much of a 30 cal fan but the Ultra is one of the few 30's that gets my attention from time to time. Each and every one I've been around has been super accurate!

Is the Oregon hunt a special tag or over the counter kind of deal?

I'd love to hunt Oregon one of these days in search of bruins.

Dober

I've never run across a Bear while hunting in Oregon, but we hunt the eastern part of the state and I bet there are more in the Northwest. We bowhunt deer and elk there a lot and every few years draw a rifle tag. The Elk tag is a special tag. We've been saving preference points for a few years and last year we knew we'd draw it and then they decided to sell the tags to an outfitter. Go figure how that works a week before the draw and you get a letter in the mail. This year I'm pretty sure we'll get it.

I have several model 70 300 ultras, if your bud wants to sell let me know....
FWIW everyone I have ever worked with has been very accurate and fed very well from the factory.

I know a lot of guys think it's overkill for a .30 caliber, but its an impressive round once you get used to it. We'll see if its around in another 10 years. I kinda doubt that there will be much ammo loaded for it. Sadly, it doesn't really seem that anything that's came along in the last 30 years or so puts down roots.
I read today that the average age of all American hunters is actually increasing by a year every single year and this is probably why.

One of my mentors once told me that over kill was when you walked up on your recently deceased critter and then...emptied your rifle into it.

Aside from that, he/I don't much believe in the overkill concept...grin

Dober

Dober.. I've gotta My 80 rounds of .300 on ground squirrels this spring might have been a little overkill, but how the hell else am I gonna be sure I can still shoot the gun. Still don't know for sure. Don't get to shoot that many Elk and they're the ones that will put me to the test.

Your mentor sounds a little like mine. God bless him.

I'm wondering what a 7mm Mashburn Super is? I bet I should know, but I don't!

I'm looking it up!

pm me your email addy and I'll send you info

Dober

Good one, Dober! I'm going to have to try to remember that one!

The black Winchester plastic stock ("Shadow" series with checkering) hurts even in 243.

Get a new stock with a good pad, and it'll make all the difference.

This gun is a CRF model, but I bet its the same type stock. I think I'm going to order a couple of McMillian Edges.

Tell him to sell the rifle and buy a range finder instead. There is just no need for that kind of calibre in a hunting rifle! The only rifles of that type that i have seen shot accurately enough to justify their existance were so heavy and cumbersome, that nobody was walking around hunting with them. Recoil is in excess of 30 foot pounds in a .300 RUM rifle light enough to carry around. Now some folks can learn to tolerate that level of recoil, but just about nobody can tolerate that amount of recoil and shoot acceptably accurately to utilise the long range ballistics. It is just compltely unnecessary within a thousand yards or so, and shooting those kinds of distances isn't hunting, it is ballistic ma$turbation.

I don't think he's going to get rid of it. None of my buddies like selling guns. Ballistics are a little better than the .300 Weatherby and I actually think that once you get used to it, it's not a big deal. The sighting in part is really the only thing that takes a little bit of a toll. We don't take 1000 yard shots for sure. Hunting deer isn't really why we bought them, but I've taken 5 or so with mine. I don't know many guns that would even allow a dumb shot like 1000 yards on a deer. I do know that making a 350-375 yard shot with the gun is easy given the right setting. I agree that the guns can be a little heavy and for that reason I don't prefer mine to other guns, but or deer and seasons vary a lot with regards to what you might find when you're hunting. With our hills and canyons sometimes its nice to have the added confidence that during a tough year you can take that gun and do it if you need to.

If i wanted to make 350 yard shots, i'd use a .308! My 6.5x.284 is plenty adequate far out beyond where i would ever consider shooting. If you have a look at the ballistics and retained energy figures, the 300 RUM just can't be justified short of 1000 yards. In fact, the little 300 WSM is perfectly adequate to 1000 yards from a ballistic perspective. Consider that for a 500 yard shot, the hold over differnce between a 300 WSM and the RUM is going to be a scant 6 inches in average - about 38" for the WSM to 32" for the RUM (for an average 180 gr bullet) - which is essentially completely practically insignificant. In order to achieve that 6" of reduced drop, you will have a rifle a few inches longer, more than a pound heavier, and generating more than 50% more recoil. It is an exercise in stupidity!

With modern rangefinding equipment, calibres like the RUM are just simply now obsolete for any hunting purpose. I cannot entertain any hunting scenario where the RUM could justify its existance. They are already dinosaurs! Sell the bl00dy thing while there is still a market for them.

Ok, I'll keep mine and keep shooting it. I'll also keep my obsolete 7 WSM and my obsolete .257 Weatherby too and for the 6.5x284's sake the obsolete .284 too. Somehow I don't think I'll have any trouble selling any of them for twice what I paid for them in 10 years. Since mine doesn't seem to bug my shoulder anymore than a 6.5lb 30-06 I'm good.

Yes, but i assume you can shoot the 30-06, 7WSM, 257 WM and .284 straight.

As well as the Ultramag. Only time the Ultramag failed me was on a really big boar at about 20 yards. I rushed the shot and instead of a shoulder or just in front I shot it through the ribs. He went a ways before we recovered him and it took a few hours to find him. It was a surprise when he didn't just drop.

The ultramag doesn't feel a lot different to me than the 7WSM because the 7 is lighter.

I thinks I got a bit in common with this gent. The ultra is hell on whiteys at 50 yards.

Dober and BWalker,
Agreed. There is no such thing as over dead. Almost dead, yeah, that's something else. Likely with a 6.5x284 on Elk at 300yds if the bull takes a 1/4 step while you're deciding when to finish up tightening the trigger. Likely with a .300 Win, .300 Roy or .300 UM too, but a little less so. That's what these guns are for.