I'm going to be deer hunting for the first time this year and I need a new(to me) rifle. I will be on private land in the heart of the Ozark Mountains in very heavy brush. I would prefer something on the lighter side of the recoil curve. I have promised my wife I won't spend over $400.00.

I'm leaning very heavily towards a used 336 or a 94 in 30-30. Around here used ones in decent condition go for around $280. They are light, quick, and relatively low recoil. It has plenty of power for the 50-75 yard range I will be hunting in. Plus the ammunition is less than most other centerfire rifle cartridges.

I was just wondering if anyone had any other rifles to suggest that would fit my criteria. I enjoy researching things like this and will happily listen to any suggestions.

No such thing as a "brush gun.". Get whatever rifle you can afford and set forth. In this day and age I'd skip the 30-30 unless you're an extra in a cowboy flick.

sounds like the perfect gun for that hunt. You might also consider a lever in 45 Colt or 44 Mag. more $$$ but some use them and say they are a hoot to shoot. My choice would be any lever I had and shot well enough to hit every time on snap shots.

Bloodworks what I meant by brush gun was something that was short, light, and quick to shoulder. I have access to a very nice 700 in .308 with a high power scope. This gun would not be appropriate for where I am going to be hunting because the woods are very heavy and the 700 would be more likely to get hung up. Also the scope would make for slow target acquisition at the 50 yard range.

ipopum Is a 45 Colt or 44 Mag enough to humanely kill a deer? If so I might look into that.

Trade the scope on the .308 for one of a suitable X range. I've not found an extra inch or three on a rifle to get me entrapped yet. After all 6'3" of me gets through the woods the rifle is of little consequence.

The 45 colt and 44 mag have killed many a critter over the years and are more than adequate to take deer sized game. I will tell you that it's easier to find factory hunting ammo for the 44 mag and is just as cheap as 30-30. Remington coreloc 30-30 box of 20 runs about $15-$20 compaired to Winchester white box 44 mag box of 50 runs $35-$40. A slick brush gun for your hunt would be a ruger 44 carbine. Might take some looking to find oe for $400, but it can be done. Good luck

336 in a 35 rem. I shot one for several years. Killed my first deer with it!! I shot the 200gr coreloct bullet. The only reason I swapped rifles was hunting property changed. I still have it and if I'm in the brush I still carry it. The 35 seams to have a lot better knock down than the comPared 30-30

..............I believe that for what you want to do within 75 yards and for the price you promised the wifey not to exceed, the used 30-30 lever might be your better practical choice. Slap a reasonably good quality "lower" powered scope on it with good FOVs and you should be in pretty good shape.

There is probably a number of rifles that could be suggested, but your price point really limits the choices.

You certainly don`t need 308 power for what you seek to do.

I'd still do a bolt action Stevens 200, or a Marlin XS7.. chambered in 7/08, and consider a 1.5 to 4 Shotgun scope on top...

for myself, I do that with a Ruger 77 in 260...

and handload it to about 2200 to 2400 fps...

129 or 140 grain bullets usually...

For your purposes a 30-30 sounds perfect. Shouldn't be hard to find a nice one to fit your budget.

Lots of choices to be had.
Off the top of my head, Marlin 336 in .35, or a Model Seven in 7/08 or .308.

The Savage 111 Hog Hunter in .308 would be nice. It's just a little over $400.00.

I agree...

If you are trying to keep the rifle low budget, then I would stick with a more common (inexpensive ammunition) caliber. 30-30 sounds great. The lever actions still kills game today as well as they always has. And as far as being an "extra in a cowboy flick" goes, ignore that and let "other people" be an extra in a "Mr. Know it All" flick.

Being from Maine I have to say this..

Used 760 or 7600 in 308, 270, or 30-06. Top end of your budget but doable.

That said, the 30-30 will be fine.

Well buy the 336 in 30-30, then put something like an Aim point on it. Zero spot on for 100 yards with what ever load your rifle likes and go hunt. I set up a Remington 7600 with an Aim point and well its going to be great for the kind of deer hunting I been doing the last 7 or so years. I have a bit more that 400 into the 7600 thou. You should be able to find a good rifle for the money you have to spend.

First off, if you go with the 30-30, you will do much better to buy a used older model 336 Marlin. As you said, you can get one for around 300 in your area. Ammo is dirt cheap, and you'd be well equipped to a 150yd shot if it ever presented itself.

Now, a Marlin 1894 44mag or 45Colt will absolutely smack the snot out of deer. I used one exclusively for 7 years and never had a hog or deer take a single step. I killed a 325lb sow at 70yds with mine and also my best buck at 60yds in East Texas. Ammo is a little more expensive, but the 1894 is even more handy and perfect for the woods than the longer 336.

Another option in your price range is the H&R Handi rifle. You may not find much support for these on this forum, but there is a huge support base over at Graybeard Outdoors. The nice folks there walked me through customizing a rifle myself, and there are plenty of people there who use them exclusively. The nice thing about the H&R is that the action is very short, so a full size rifle is still about the length of a Marlin. They also come with open sights on some models, so you could consider something like a 243, 30-06, or even a 45-70. My little custom rig is a chopped down 45-70 that's less than 30" long and weighs 5.25lbs. Talk about light and handy!

The 30-30 is a perfect choice for where you hunt, but don't overlook a 30-06 or other cartridge. A 2x scope will get you out to 200yds but won't hinder you in the thick stuff.

If you could find one ... Ruger 10/44 would be nice.

Get a Marlin 336 and put a low magnification scope on it. Watch the classifieds for a 2.5X Leupold with a heavy duplex. Shoot with both eyes open and it will be as fast to use as anything else.

Even though i've shot a Winchester 94 30-30 since the 50's. I recommend the Marlin 336. It's more user friendly in disassembly, and if you want you use a low power scope, it's much easier to mount.

The 30-30 is perfect for what you want. No need for expensive ammo. The 150gr or 170gr core-lokt is all you need.

If you should need a second shot. No bolt rifle will do it as fast as a lever gun.

The lever 30-30 is a classic for good reasons.

Here in the North east, mid Atlantic timber and overgrowth area, I do not think you can beat something in .35 Remington. That pretty much leaves you looking for a decent used Remington 760 or 7600.

Great for whitetail, and bear out to 150 yards.
I am currently building a .35 Remy on a model Seven action just for grins.

My go to heavy timber rifle is a Browning Model 92 in 44mag. Plenty of punch out to 100 yds,compact, quick to the shoulder and easy on recoil, plus the extra inches of the barrel really let the 44 mag shine.

A Marlin levergun in .30/30, .35 Rem. or .44 Mag. will be perfect for your intended use.

The Browning 92s are nice, but if you see one for 400 or under, sign me up. The last one I sold brought twice that and I wish I had it back.

A nice used Marlin 336 in .30-30 or .35 Rem. should be doable within budget, The 1894s in the revolver calibers, most likely not, unless you get really lucky. A well used 336 (not abused) might even leave room for a scope, if you want.

good luck, jack

336 30-30 or 35 Rem would be perfect for you.

Williams aperture sight on a '94 Trapper. The Marlin 336 is a better gun in many respects but a bit heavier. .30-30 or .35 Remington will do.

The various lever and bolt guns in .44 Mag or .357 will work as well but they are likely out of the price range you reference.

Put a low power scope on the 308 and go hunt for the first year and decide if its a issue ot not. I notice Walmart sells the federal 308 ammo for one more dollar more than the 3030 ammo! Now there are cheaper places and sales on 3030 ammo so Walmart isn't the gold standard.
I've never felt the my bolt action 3006 was a hinderance in the brush and needed a 3030 for those few inches of length savings. The 308 will have more recoil though and you could shoot remington managed recoil ammo to mitigate that.
Now if that 308 is a buddy's that you don't want to scratch up, then go with a 336 in 3030 because 35 rem can be expensive or hard to find in some places. The 3030 lets you put those hornady leverotions in there for longer range hunting in different places and you can mount a scope on a 336 (the one you tried on the 308 possibly after trying it one year...) easily. The 308 is a more universal gun if different terrain and hunting opportunities show up and it trumps the 3030 in my opinion.

He says he has access to the .308 ... Perhaps the rifle's owner may not want the scope swapped??

Some say skip the 30-30 ... Why? Hunted for many years in PA with a 30-30 & if I still lived and hunted there, it may still be my only deer rifle. In reality anything from .243 thru 35 Whelen and the multitudes in between would be "perfect".

Get what you like and can afford, enjoy the journey & good luck this hunting season!

45-70

Mod 7600 Rem in 308. Heavy 180's and a fixed 4x or a decent 2-7x

Remington pump, 30/06, 270 or 308- The Benoits haven't found anything better, and they have killed more big bucks in the woods than anyone I know.
Can't imagine a situation where a 45/70, 35 Remington or 44 mag would be an improvement over an 06 or 308.

Sort of agree with the ain't no such thing as a brush gun in terms of blasting your way thru branches e�c. As some have said I would probably look at something like a bolt action 308 over a 30-30 just to have a rifle that will work fine at short range as well as out a little further if you decide to hunt out west some day. I have a stevens 200 that is in your budget and if there is a sportmans warehouse in your area they have some of the older weatherby vanguards on sale for $349 which would make a fine hunting rifle. For a scope just save up a little or shop the classifieds and something good will show up. I saw a newer weaver K4 on there just last week for $70 and something like that would fit nicely on a 308. I hunt eastern Ky woods and a bolt rig such as I describe works fine. Having said all of that neither me or my hunting buddys have ever killed a deer that couldn't have easily been killed with a good marlin 30-30 with a scope and most w/o a scope. As a matter of fact we have used a 30-30 on several occasions and never been handicapped.

Two ways to handle the situation here...

Maybe the origional poster needs to tell us more about the 308 situation to determine if its suitable or not and what options exist to save his budget...

Or:

He has permision to buy a gun from his wife so he has a "hall pass" so get the marlin!

A lot of the Remington pumps will shoot with most off the shelf bolt actions, and never saw one that wasn't minute of deer to 300 yards. That second or third shot can be handy in thick brush. Why carry a rifle that will work most of the time when you can carry one that will more of the time?

If what you mean by "have access to" is that you own this .308, then an alternative is to pick up a lighter/shorter .308 like one of the pumps mentioned or a single shot like the H&R .308. .308 ammo is fairly cheap, recoil is light, generally very accurate, works at long or short range......just a great round that allows you to choose the rifle that meets your desire.

..but the 336 in a 30-30 would certainly meet your needs and I find no fault in it. I prefer the .35 Rem in the 336, but if you don't reload and/or ammo cost is a consideration the 30-30 is more available and lower cost.

With access to a 308 then by all means find a nice clean 30-30 is a very handy rifle and there is a current thread showing burris 2-7 scopes for $112 so that is a pretty neat idea. I have both a winchester and a 336 and do hunt with both of them. The marlin wears a 1.5-4.5 and the winchester a williams 5D reciever sight. They are handy in a tree stand.

Ruger 77/44 would work well with either a peep or low powered scope.

A Marlin 336 in 30-30 would be a fine choice for deer at ranges under 200 yards. I'd put a scope on it, something in the 1.5-5x or 2-7x range, something with a wide field of view at low X for moving shots and enough magnification at high X to pick a hole in the brush for standing shots.

There are lots of good and inexpensive 30-30 factory loads out there, I've had good success with the 170 grain Federal.

Jeff

+ 1 (from a fellow Mainah)

+2 (from a non-Mainah)

Pert near wet myself when I read this one.

The 30-30 will work fine.If you can't afford a good 1-4 or 2-7 Leupold get a Williams peep sight.I never could line up iron sights on a fast shot as fast as a low powered scope or a peep sight.I missed a bunch of running deer with a 30-30 and irons untill I switched to a 2X scope.

Very true. I love iron sights, but my eyes are crap now. My first year with a scope on my muzzleloader. I have a 1.5x5x32 scope on it, but just leave it on 1.5x. Very fast to get on target.

the whole 'brush gun ' thing is a joke. every thought for years a big round fat bullet would do better in brush,not even close to being true. study after study has prove pointed bullet against flat bullet makes little differents in the thickets. my 270 kills better than a 30-30 in the brush when the bullet is put in the right place.brush is no different than open country,you never try to knock trees or limbs out of the way with any bullet. a low power scope may make it easier for you to stay on target in the brush or in the open at close range. i hunt both places at times and i still like a 4x12 scope on all my deer and bear guns.

I thought we were talking about brush guns? Not bullets.

I didn't see anybody claim bullets go through brush without being deflected.

A brush gun to me is light, short, and shoots a bullet that will shoot flat to my distance without destroying a lot of meat.

A lever 30-30 fits that description perfectly.

The OP didn't ask for a do it all gun. He wants a short range brush gun.

To me a brush gun is this.

Quick shouldering in a chambering capable of large wound channels, through and through, via large bullets. And I find my 760 easier to hold minute of deer out to 300ish than a Lever. JMHO.

We have a different definition of brush. Lets see you take a 300yd shot in this.

Obviously, no 300 yard shots in brush. That's pretty open compared to NW Pennsylvania. Most of the time, seeing 50 yards is a LOOONG ways in the woods. Most of it is scrub trees, briar thickets, or beach tree stands.

I also hunt a field or two, I want that capability.

Love hunting those kinda wooods MH.Also find that my 20" barreled M700ADL Carbine in 30-06 will get 'er done there with the factory irons or Weaver bases and rings holding an old M8 4x Leupold or remove the scope in < than 20 seconds and pop in the staff of my Lyman rec sight staff all pre zeroed.I paid 220 for it so it comes under the $400 line or just pick up a used Marlin XL-7 in 06 or XS -7 in 308 for under $300 can't lose. Lot of options here and can't go wrong on most of them. Magnum Man

As others have stated, a 35 Rem lever gun would do nicely. That said, I have a 444 Marlin that I absolutely love. Every time I think I am ready to buy another 45-70, or the 35 rem for that matter, I remind myself of how well the 444 performs. I am testing 240gn Speer Deepcurls at the moment but have run 270gn & 300gn with fantastic results.

EDIT: Under $400 is tough on any gun worth your time but you should be able to get a used lever gun close to that. Good thing you don't need to spend extra on a scope......

Here is your Huckleberry, a nice old 760 with a Bushnell scopechief 4X scope. Ready to roll for a mere $399.00.

Sounds to me like the OP needs to take his $400 to a Gun Show and see what he can walk out with, getting the best bang for his buck!

It'd really suck to have only $400 to spend on a rifle. I think I'd just ask a friend to borrow one. LOL

Brush:



Iron sights, shotguns, bows....spears...rocks..

Brush: Alaska coastal area, full of Brown Bears.

Rifle: 30-378, Scope; Schmidt and Bender 4-16X50...

Pre-season "Deer Claiming" Paintballs and a slingshot!

For my money I'd be after a good used Marlin 336. A good peep sight, or maybe a low power variable. For a good scope that won't break the bank the Bushnell Banner 1.5-4.5 has served me well on a few different 45/70s and a 30-30 as well. Decent optically, tracks true and hold zero all for about $80.

I like talley mounts but to save money there isn't a thing in the world wrong with a weaver base and low weaver rings. The weaver base is part number 63B. I've used that before too.


If you don't want to go lever action the used 760 or 7600 would be great too, but will run you more money that the 280 for a used Marlin 336.

This is fast target aquisition:



And I agree with you on going to scope, or any sight, where you are not trying to line up two objects with the target.

As far as moving targets, the Burris FastFire II is very good at that. Field of view is wider than with a scope, too, but long range accuracy will suffer, though reasonable distances aren't a problem.

The only problem is that the sight would bust his budget.

I agree strongly with the .30-30 fans, and about as strong with the M760 guys, with the 760 being a far more versatile and generally more accurate rifle.

Matt, you musta been posting whilst I wuz typing.

30-30, 35 Rem or 44 Mag in a lever gun. I also saw a CVA Scout (single shot rifle) in 44 Mag, 444 Marlin and 35 Whelen.

Good luck

Yup, btw I still drool everytime I see your 45/70.

I was standing in a small creek. It was a little more open there. if you look ahead in the picture you can see it thickens up.

Yeah, I know. Why was I standing in a creek? I'm like that.

Thanks.... I have thrown far too much money at that gun. But, I got it like I want it now, and it's been knocking the deer down.

There are many good hunting rifles available in the $400 range, especially if you included used.

A .30-30 would be just about perfect for the conditions you describe. I had mine out at the range this last weekend and (with a scope) was able to smack a clay pigeon at 300 yards (I thought it took two shots, my hunting buddy says one) as well as a 10" gong at 600 yards. With the right ammo (Hornady LeverEvolution if you don't handload) a .30-30 makes a good choice for whitetail deer out to about 300 yards.

Any of these would work, especially if using low power scopes, iron or peep/ghost ring sights, red dots, etc. When hunting the thick stuff I just crank the power down to minimum on the variables.

From top to bottom:
Marlin 1895 .45-70, Leupold VX-II 2-7
Marlin 375 .375 Winchester, Leupold M8-4x
Marlin 336CS, Leupold Vari-X II 3-9
Browning B92, .44 Mag



I�ve hunted elk and mulies with all of them, the .44 Mag most often by far. I certainly wouldn�t hesitate to use them for whitetail. The three Marlins are all good to 300 yards but if you want low recoil and ammo costs the .30-30 is the way to go.

The most expensive rifle was the Marlin 375 at $350 in 2001. The most recent and second most expensive purchase, the Marlin .30-30, was $250 in 2005. (The Browning .44 Mag was a gift from Dad and I have no idea what he paid for it. Didn�t cost me a dime. )

Everyone should have at least one good lever action - 94 Winchester, 336 Marlin, 99 Savage - whichever you can find in your price range. Anything in 30-30, 32 Win Spec, 35 Rem, .300 Savage, 44 Mag, 444 Marlin, 375 Win, 356 Win, 308 Win, 308 Marlin Express should be perfect. Will probably be easiest to find a Model 94 Win in 30-30 or a 336 Marlin in 30-30 or 35 Rem.

And take a good look at a Williams receiver sight/peep sight. Much better than factory buckhorns. A low power scope will work, but you don't need one.

My brush guns are a Savage 1899 in 30-30 with a Redfield receiver sight, a Savage 99F in .308 with a 1.5-5x scope, and a Kimber 84M Montana in .308 Win with a 2-7X scope. Took my last deer with the 1921 vintage 30-30 - worked just fine!

What about something like this:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=299758802

just a thought. fast follow up shot, short bbl. 30-06 ammo will be on sale soon at the "big box" places. Crack in the stock can be taped or wired for your first season to see how you like it. Not sure on these things, but maybe one could even find a replacement butstock and still stay under your budget?

There were a few others around/below $400 on that site too I think.

I used one in S Central MO a number of years back, a loaner from the property owner who got her deer with it. (Not me, I missed, I blame it on the unfamiliar gun!)

Good luck with whatever you end up with. Whatever you do, get SOMETHING!. I'm with the one who says you got a free pass from the wife, use it!

Good luck hunting too.
Geno

What I use Marlin 336TS with Burris 2x7 & 336LTS

A .30-30 sounds about perfect � light, handy, inexpensive, inexpensive to shoot and more than �enough gun� at the ranges at which you will be shooting. Using Hornady LeverEvolution ammunition will extend the useful range considerably compared to traditional flat or round nose loads.

As to other options, a good used bolt rifle can often be found in your price range.

Although many cartridges will work, a .308 Win is hard to beat when to comes to factory-built inexpensive plinking/practice ammo and recoil generally runs around 18 foot-pounds (compared to around 12 for a .30-30 or 22-24 for a .30-06). Other good low-recoil options include .243 Win, .257 Roberts, .25-06, .260 Rem, and 7mm-08 for bolt guns, .357 Mag, .44 Mag, and .45 Colt for levers. The last three will generally be the least expensive to shoot as the ammo comes in 50-round boxes.

Don�t let folks talk you out of a .30-30 on the basis that they are just for cowboys. Leverguns are way more fun than bolt rifles, fast to reload, light and handy in the thick stuff. While my .30-30 is still a virgin, I�ve taken deer, antelope and elk with my levers. They are all keepers.

From top to bottom:

Marlin 1895 (.45-70)
Marlin 375 (.375 Win)
Marlin 336CS (.30-30)
Browning B92 (.44 Mag)

Save up some money and get a decent rifle and scope.

I get tired of these topics on what is the cheapest!

Ruger 44 Carbine... Have one and have not had the chance to use it yet.

May or may not be what you want...but buds has m77s in .358win. For 459.00...ships free...not a bad deal

An older Marlin 336 in .35 Remington, or if you're feelin' frisky, an older Marlin in 444 or .45-70. A good used Remington 760 or 7600 carbine in .308 or .30-06 would be nice, too.

You will not find a handier rifle for the thick stuff than a short levergun. I have owned and carried just about all of them and an autoloader or pump is not nearly as handy as a levergun. Bolt guns are not even close. The Marlin, Browning, Winchester etc pistol cartridge carbines are the handiest, but mostly out of your price range. That leaves the Marlin or Winchester 30-30 or Marlin 35 or similar. While I prefer the 35 for most of my hunting, the 30-30 works wonderfully and is easier to find ammo for and less expensive to feed. The Winchester is noticeably lighter than the Marlin, but has a lot more slop in the action and is not as easy to scope.

For $400, you could have a solid used pre safety Marlin 336 30-30 equipped with a Williams FP receiver sight and ivory bead front sight or topped with a nice older Weaver K2.5, K3 of K4 or Bushnell Banner 1.5-5 and maybe a box or two of ammo. Given $1000 it would be hard to draw up a better deer rifle for thick, wooded country.

I have a plain jane post 64, m94, in 30/30 with the 20 " barrel that you should be able to find for well less than your 400. More like 200-300 range. Spend the rest on a good williams reciever sight and ammo, than practice, practice, practice.

Far more deer are missed by bad shooting than the power of the round being fired at them.

If you look up ergonomics in the dictionary you will find a picture of the M94 next to it. (As quoted by T. Weiland)
I fully agree. I have had both Winchesters and Marlins. Only the Winchesters remain. They are harder to clean, but are lighter and faster to the target than their counterparts.
The lowly old 30/30 just plain works on game, period. It would not have lasted this long if it didn't.

I could not imagine a better gun for the money for your style of hunting than the pumps or leverguns.

Good luck with your search.

Has the origional poster made up his mind yet????

Get a 7600 in 270, 280, 30-06. Forget about 308 based cartridges since there is no short action variety 7600, they're all the same.

Find a used 45-70 and you can shoot birds to Elephants with Bird shot or Cast.You pick the load for your needs,it far surpasses the great 30-30 in what you can do with it.From mild to wild if you can hold on.

Jayco

You be right...not a bad option, and a great caliber!

I have a Ruger M77 in a 358 Win and it is absolutely one of my favorite and accurate rifles. I topped mine with a Leupold Vx ii 2-7x33 and it is my best brush gun. Even better in my opinion than my Marlin 30-30 which isn't a bad gun for the woods. The little 358 will be my backup elk rifle and/or primary if the area in CO we're hunting this year has dark timber.

This has been a really informative thread. Really appreciate what everyone has been offering. You guys have been helping me decide what to buy, but for a slightly different purpose.

I'm thinking about getting a "brush rifle" specifically for pigs in Hawaii. May have an opportunity to go hunting on Molokai, deep in the bush at a remote settlement where some friends have been living off the land. There's a lot of deer on the island but in the area I'm going there's primarily pigs.

It's quite rugged, thick with tropical vegetation and unlike other islands in Hawaii (like the Big Island of Hawaii) there's not a lot of wide open spaces.

Was planning to bring a hand gun (probably a .41 cal Freedom Arms or a 6" Model 57) and perhaps even pick up a rifle. The gun would have to be suitable for hiking in the bush where I doubt you'd ever be able to see much over 100 yards.

Took a look at a used Winchester 30-30 the other day for around $300 and that seemed (according to everything I've read in this thread)like a perfect gun for this purpose.

12 Gauge shotgun fed with slugs.

This would be my choice!

Exactly. And if moose, caibou or elk in the shorter ranges happen to show up and need killin', you're good to go.