Looking at browning bar's (probably 3006) and wondering if the beligiums are really better than the japanese version. I'm looking for a hunting gun and not a safe queen.
Belgium or Japan?
What do you watch for on Bar's?
I can't vouch for the Japanese made BAR, but I've had my dad's Belguim 30.06 for the last 18 years and it's one hell of a gun. Shoots great, low recoil and is just damn purty to look at.
I have a 270 Belgian assembled in Portugal. It shoots under 1 moa with Winchester Supreme Moly Silver 130's.
My Japanese 270 A-Bolt shot every bit as good with 150 Fusions but it had a Timney spring kit in the trigger to help.
Not exactly an apples and oranges to your question but all of the reference I can provide.
I have three Belgiums, 30-06, 308 and 300 WM, they all shoot great, I don't have any experience with the Jap BAR's. Like OO above I have several Jap A-Bolts and they shoot very good.
http://www.browning.com/customerservice/qna/detail.asp?id=90I've been told that all BARs are Belgium or Belgium/Portugal made. This link seems to support that. Shotguns and most other rifles are made in Japan but the BARs are still made in Europe.
I had two the were "assembled in portugal". They were great rifles and shot well. I really enjoyed them and they were very very reliable.
Me too. Japan BAR is news to me, but then, I never had but one that was not a 100% Belgium product. If Browning oversees the project, fit and finish is likely done right, no matter where it was done. Jack
I have owned a pile of them. They usually shoot well, no matter where there made.
They've never been Japanese. Started out made in Belgium til early 90's when they changed to "Made in Belgium-Assembled in Portugal". They are both excellent. Buy with confidence.
They've never been Japanese. Started out made in Belgium til early 90's when they changed to "Made in Belgium-Assembled in Portugal". They are both excellent. Buy with confidence.
People will argue with you till they are blue in the face but you are correct.....never has been a Japanese BAR.
They've never been Japanese. Started out made in Belgium til early 90's when they changed to "Made in Belgium-Assembled in Portugal". They are both excellent. Buy with confidence.
People will argue with you till they are blue in the face but you are correct.....never has been a Japanese BAR.
Interesting... So its the gunshow gun dealers hyping up the beligioum thing??? hmmm...
It's easy t tell new and old apart. The newer ones have a bolt release lever just behind the forearm. The old ones you had to either drop the mag or reach in with your finger and push down on the mag follower. Then there is the Longtrac and the Shortrac. These are the newest ones and use aluminum side plates. They are mucho lighter than the older BAR's. Still use the same mag as the newer Safari with the mag release. The older ones without the mag release used different mags.
Hunting buddy of mine has three of them (.30-06 SPRG for him, .270 WIN for his son, and .243 WIN for his daughter). Belgian made/Portugal assembled, all 25 years old +/-. I mounted the scopes on two of them; never seen one fail or heard him gripe about any of them. I can tell you they were far more accurate than you would think a semi-auto would be - just over a MOA with factory loads on the two I shot.
I have had probably about a dozen go through my hands over the years. The only problem I had was on one the pin on the bolt timing latch broke, which was a small fix. Most were hunting accurate with about 1.5 inch accuracy. The newer Shorttrac comes in at 6lbs 10 oz and comes in various calibers including the 7mm08. I seem to always have at least one in the safe. They also come in lefty. Right now have a 270 in a Longtrac.
I had a BAR in 300 Win Mag. Great rifle that shot lights out, but it was to darn heavy for the hunting I did. I am kicking myself for not getting a 25/06 I seen a few years ago. A friend of mine has one in 30/06 and 300 Win Mag and they both shoot great. The 06 is an older Grade II.
Dale
Humdinger, the gun show guys may be differentiating between those BARs that were completely made in Belgium and those that were manufactured in Belgium but assembled in Portugal. There is a difference. The Belgium models bring more money, but I have not found that they were any more reliable and they have not been more accurate the ones assembled in Portugal.
257ROBT, you are correct, those magnum caliber BARs are a different animal and they are very very heavy. I really like the standard caliber BAR with a Leupold 2.5x8 - makes a nice little package that is not overly heavy and great for the deer woods. The longest shot I ever made was with my BAR 270 - 428 yards - not bad for an automatic.
Browning also made an 18 inch carbine model a couple of years ago. I think they were only available in .308. I really wish I had picked one up then. They also used to make the lightweight model that had a 20 inch barrel but I don't see those on their web page any more.
You could not give me a 100% Belgian BAR but the assembled in Portugal model is a very very good rifle. I have one in 270. All told I have had at min 1/2 dozen of these rifles and everyone was a shooter. Most were 7mm Rem mags the others 06.
No BAR was made in Japan, the A5 in its latter years was made there with little to no difference in quality.
I also have had a good many. The only two parts that I ever replaced on mine or my cousin's and his tribe's were a recoil buffer and a gas piston that had been. Seriously neglected.
The magnum Type I guns were just too heavy. Most of the 7 mags I dealt with did not shoot well. Cousin left me a nice grade IV 7 RM that does 150 Remingtons at about 1 1/4. I also have an early grade III .06 that does very well.
Slidelkid, I also wanted one of the lightweight .308 short, fluted, hi-visibility sights (Zenith). I found them in 06 and .300 WSM. If any .308s were imported, I never found them. And then they were gone. They are still marketing a long action version in Europe. Jack
You could not give me a 100% Belgian BAR but the assembled in Portugal model is a very very good rifle. I have one in 270. All told I have had at min 1/2 dozen of these rifles and everyone was a shooter. Most were 7mm Rem mags the others 06.
No BAR was made in Japan, the A5 in its latter years was made there with little to no difference in quality.
Can you expand on your opinion on the belgium made Bars?
You could not give me a 100% Belgian BAR but the assembled in Portugal model is a very very good rifle. I have one in 270. All told I have had at min 1/2 dozen of these rifles and everyone was a shooter. Most were 7mm Rem mags the others 06.
No BAR was made in Japan, the A5 in its latter years was made there with little to no difference in quality.
Can you expand on your opinion on the belgium made Bars?
Yes you have to remove the buttstock to remove the trigger group. They have a habit of loosening up(buttstocks). A good friend of mine who is a bama gunsmith gives the nod to the safari for the reasons mentioned.
You could not give me a 100% Belgian BAR but the assembled in Portugal model is a very very good rifle. I have one in 270. All told I have had at min 1/2 dozen of these rifles and everyone was a shooter. Most were 7mm Rem mags the others 06.
No BAR was made in Japan, the A5 in its latter years was made there with little to no difference in quality.
Can you expand on your opinion on the belgium made Bars?
Yes you have to remove the buttstock to remove the trigger group. They have a habit of loosening up(buttstocks). A good friend of mine who is a bama gunsmith gives the nod to the safari for the reasons mentioned.
You do not have to remove the stock to remove the trigger group on the newer Longtrac and Shortrac. I don't think on the Safari either. Now, to remove the bolt and carrier you do have to remove the stock. I believe I just had to open the floorplate to remove the trigger group by removing the 2 push pins.