I just picked up a Sako L61R in 300 Win mag. It's from 69 to 72. I have never seen a rifle with this much copper in it. Stock needed some work so I've been doing some deep cleaning while that's getting done. After 3 different solvents and a couple rounds of JB compound its cleaned up real good. While waiting on the stock I'm going to run some solvent through it daily. Then bore scope and treat with DBC. If it will shoot 200gr. Nos PT MOA I'll leave it as is. If it don't? It's either getting a Douglas and chambered in 7mm Mashburn or 7mm STW. Or I have been wanting a 35 cal. so the cheaper option would be a rebore to 35 cal and chambered for 358 Shooting Times Alaskan.

I know what the 7's will do and I have a fetish for .284's. I have no use for a 35 cal mag or for that matter a 7mm mag and I'm still sorta young so I enjoy getting the chit kicked out if me. I'm going to build both a LR .284 and a 35 cal something just don't know what I'm going to turn this Sako into. If it shoots real sweet as a 300 win mag I'll dump it and find another base to build off of.

So guys its your call. Talk me into a 358 STA. What brass can I use to get there? Loads? Experience? Anything I need to know? I'm up for all the info I can get.

Thanks guys

Look at the 358 Norma Mag

Will do. Thanks bud

Les I had a 358 STA....sort of... I sort of wildcatted it in the days when the STA was being developed but the details were not yet available. Layne Simpson was talking about it at this point.

I had Butch Searcy chamber a 12 twist 24 " Krieger for the 8 Rem Mag necked up to 35 caliber with no other changes. I used to FF the necks out to 35 caliber with COW and size back down with a 358 Norma neck die. Worked great.

I also formed brass from 375 H&H by running them into the 358 Norma neck die, then used a heavier COW charge to blow out the case body. Both methods worked well.

The only real difference between my cartridge and the 358 STA was that the STA was slightly more blown out for a bit less taper.

IIRC I worked up to a max charge of RL19 with the 250 gr Speer and Bitterroot bullets for a velocity of slightly over 3000 fps;about 3100 fps with the 225 gr bullets.

If you want to get kicked this cartridge will help you.

Should add...if I were doing it all over again,and with todays bullets, I would simply get a 375H&H or Ruger instead.

Thanks BobhinNH. That's the kind of info I'm looking for. The best thing I've ever done for my shooting ability was buying a Montana in 300 WSM. It was a brute with a max load of H4350 and 200gr. Partitions but it taught me a lot.

I looked at the 358 Norma Mag. If it was a hunting rifle that would work just fine. But I live in shotgun country so this is just a toy. A 225gr. Pill sounds like a blast at 3000. Plus if one of you guys invite me out for a elk hunt in Griz country I'll be ready.

I've been a fond of .358 bullets for hunting for a number of years. I've killed big animals (moose and brown bear) with the .35 Whelen and .338 Win Mag. In my experience, at ranges under 300 yards the only difference I witnessed between them was less recoil and gun weight from the Whelen. I had an L61R sitting around that was screaming for a rebarrel and thought about the STA for a long while. In the end I decided to go with the Norma for several reasons.

1. The extra velocity with of the STA does not increase it's LR potential over the Norma. Is the STA "flatter," yes it is. But the difference is really not significant at ranges out to 400 yards and there are better choices for LR shooting than .358 cartridges.

2. Cost was a factor. More expensive to load due to increased powder consumption and I've a ton of .338 Win Mag brass that requires only a trip through the sizer to become Norma fodder. The dies were about half as much for the Norma than they were STA.

3. If I'm going to handle the recoil from the STA, I might as well go get the whole enchilada and go .375 AI. I almost went that route (.375 AI), but decided the Norma would work just as well with less recoil for my purposes--primarily brown bear.

4. I'd never seen a Norma in the field or shot one at all. I've been around a couple STAs so there was no mystique going that route and the 375 AI is fairly common. The Norma was intriguing.

So I decided if the Whelen was as effective as the .338 Win Mag, then the Norma should be more. Less recoil and cost than its bigger cousin the STA and more intriguing than the .375 AI while proving to be its equal in the field.

Presently I've shot only one brown bear with my Norma, but it was everything you'd think on the bear. In my rifle it was easy to keep the weight right at 8.5 pounds (Mickey and a 6x42 in Leupold rings). From the prone position the Norma crushed the bear, just shy of 9 foot at 22 years old, at 173 yards without undue recoil or gun weight. I could have done the same thing with most of my other rifles, but none of them would have been any better..........

Kind of agree with 406SBC. About the same time we were playing some with the 375AI, and there is little difference between it and the STA.

I was also learning that the 375H&H would move a 250 Bitterroot at 2900+ fps with lighter charges of 4064,meaning less recoil than the AI or the STA wildcat....more manageable and leaving little on the table to the larger cartridges,both of which required heavier charges of slower powders.The AI gave over 2900 fps with a 275 gr BBC; the 375 H&H over 2900 with a 250.

I went with the 8 pound 375 and 250 BBC on brown bear and was pleased with that combination. I have had that combo ever since.

With the H&H and the 375 Ruger around, and modern bullets like Barnes,Aframe, NF,I would go with one of those and bypass the 35's.JMHO.

Actually a pretty cool cartridge. I built one as soon as they came out in a #5 Lilja cut to 26". Either 8 mag brass necked up, or 375 H&H necked down, and fireformed, as it's an "improved" case.

8 Mag brass - necked up loaded to FF - FF'd and ready to rock




I see no reason to compare it to a 375 anything. A 250 at 3000 with 5K of KE is no slouch anyway you slice it. It can stand on it's own merit, and will handle anything you care to tackle in NA.






250 Partion dug from the off shoulder of Mr Bear:

Nice bear aalf....

That's a dandy bear,,what part of Alaska were you in?

I agree with you on 35's, they are an ideal caliber for larger game in NA!
I like 225 Partitions and 280 Swift A-frames for my use.

I agree with this post. I found it no practical advantage in real terms over the .340 on one side and the .375 on the other.
I also found the abrupt shoulder tended to cause feeding issues in the Brevex Magnum Mauser custom I played with.
Some loads I developed about 20 years back as follows:

.358 Shooting Times Alaskan

Bullet Load Powder O. A. L. Velocity Energy Comments

200gn Hornady
91gn IMR 4931 3160
92gn IMR 4931 3183
93gn IMR 4831 3224
94gn Rel 22 3158
84gn IMR 4350 3.632" 2990

200gn Barnes
85gn IMR 4350 3.656" 3070 MOA Load
87gn IMR 4831 3.623" 3040
89gn IMR 4831 3091
90gn IMR 4831 3115
92gn IMR 4831 3246 Warm Load
90gn Rel 19 2979

250gn Hornady
92gn Rel 22 2960
93gn Rel 22 2997 Warm Load
78gn IMR 4350 3.660" 2649
80gn IMR 4350 2720

IMHO build a norma mag, its just cooler.

I longed for the STA when I was growing up. I saw a Jarret on an auction that went way too cheap, but I didn't have that kind of money. I did manage to buy the dies and some formed brass thought. Finally gave up and sold them here on the forum a couple of years ago.

We have so many cases to work with now. Have you considered Bryce Townsleys 358 UMT? It's a .35 based on the ultra mag case. I have an article he wrote about it somewhere, but i'm pretty sure it does everything the STA will do, just a little faster. I think there are some guys on the forum necking the 375 ruger down to 35 as well. I'm not sure what they're calling that one, but I think it would be a winner as well.

This is why I love the Fire. I think aalf has a pretty good chance at convincing me to go with the 358 STA. Man what a nice bear.

By "law" is there anything or anywhere I could not go and hunt with the 358 STA?

By looking at the Aussie's #'s and powder selections I would be all set to power it.

Around here if I go over 35 cal. bullets become mail order only.

Aalf, what is your ff load for the 358 STA?

Disregard if this doesn't apply, but if I wasn't after a hunting rig, I think I'd pass on the STA and look at some sort of .338 to take advantage of high BC bullets... RUM, Edge, WinMag, or .340 Weatherby.

I didn't realize I had so many choices. This is going to be a great winter project. My luck the 300 will shoot lights out and I won't have the heart to mess with it.
Anyway. More info on all your builds would be great.

Any of you all have any 8mm mag or 375 H&H brass for sale or 358 STA dies to get rid of? That would make my decision a little easier.

This all started with buying a scope as a extra to have around. And if you have a scope laying around you just have to get something to put it on. And now here we are.

Yep, and my 340 Tyrannosaur could just as easily have been called the 338STA if such a cartridge had been invented. But as far as I know I was among the first to neck a 8mm RemMAg case up to .338 and hunt with it. Mine has been to Alaska a couple times and Africa a couple of times. Velocity with the 225gr TTSX is identical to published loads for the 338 Lapua. This being 225gr bullets at a full, chronographed 3100fps. KILLER cartridge and rifle, in a big efficient way.

I merely use 340 WBY dies screwed out part of the way to correctly but not overly size my brass and rock on, killin stuff like my 375lb, 19 inch skull black bear a few weeks ago from 350 yards out. Not its first black bear, at all, and quite a few elk, including one this year, have dropped to its power. Eland, Kudu and many species of African game to its credit as well.

If I was going to build a 35, the STA would be my choice, but I sure do like my 340 Tyrannosaur! (338/8mm RemMAg wildcat) And mine also was a 300 Magnum (WBY, in my case) that was merely re bored and re chambered.

Thanks...200 miles north of Dillingham, just short of the cutoff for the Brown/Grizzly line.

Squared 9'3".

I've had 338WM, 338 Ultra, 358STA, 375 H&H. 375 H&H Improved, and a 416RM. They all fit the bill at the time, which was to scratch the current itch of the day.

They've all been sent down the road for one reason or another, but never for lacking. My "big" gun now is a 338-06 Ackley, which will cover anything I ever plan to chase again, not counting my 338-300 Ultra for LR plinking.

So if the 358STA blows your skirt the highest, no time like the present to do it.....

Here's a 'factory' .358STA:







Brass can be obtained with the proper headstamp from Quality Cartrdge. Ever since I first read about this round in circa '96 I had to get one.. The one pictured above has never been fired - it's NIB.

But I built one for myself out of a Rem 700 that was previously a 7mm RM... There's nothing in NA that it can't take with aplomb.. .338s and .375s are all over the place - but if you desire something very few others have - then this is the round..

I have a .358STA and a .338 Baer/.375-.358STA on either side of it. The .338's kick more for the same weight bullets but have higher BC bullets to choose from. I've kill numerous elk with both the 358STA and the 375-358STA and prefer the .375-.358STA although the bullet selection when I built mine was poor at best for the 35's. When I put it up 225gr ballistic tips had just came out. My .375-358STA will shoot 250gr Sierra's 3080fps (killed a elk at 650yds with it) and 260/270gr bullets from 3000 to 3050fps. Just like motors.....there is no replacement for displacement. The same holds true with punching holes in critters. I've shot quite a few elk with my .416 Rem. as well. It's hard on them. Of the dozen or so elk shot with my .375 and .416 only one went more than about 10 feet and it was because of poor shot placement. I had a cow elk go 80 yds or so that was shot through the lungs with my .358STA.