I have several rifles with 24" barrels, and I'm thinking I really need to have one of them trimmed to be ideal when hunting from small tight whitetail blinds.

Have any of you regretted getting the barrel too short, for whatever reason? What length does the campfire feel is ideal length for a .308 Win. deer blind gun?
Thanks,

Nope.

Hint................

18" to 20 " for me but YMMV. Who knows what is right for you other than yourself?. Be Well. Rusty

I've used a 20" Ruger 77 Ultralight in .308. Mean kicking little devil. What ranges do you have out of your box blinds? Woods, food plots, bean fields? Hard to beat a leveraction 30-30 for close shots and handy.

Most whitetail shots from a blind average from 20 to 150 yards for me but could be much farther if hunting over a burn or a pipeline right of way. Not really concerned about velocity loss, as much as getting a large loud muzzle blast.

Short on many aspects

I don't care much for barrels over 42".

Random thoughts......




270 Win, Merkel k3 Extrem, 20" Bbl.




6.5 Grendel, 18" Bbl.




338 Federal, 18" Bbl.






Any of the Steyr Pro Hunters w/20" bbls. Have them in 260 Rem as well as the 308 Win and the 376 Steyr pictured above




Merkel K3 Jagd Stutzen, 308 Win., 20" Bbl.

I'm told that they will kill deer also?


just sayin'

GWB

20” would be handy for that

I like 22" barrels for blind hunting.

20" and 22" (308 Win)



376 Steyr ( 20" bbl)








Steyr Mannlicher Classic, 270 Win. 20" Bbl

ya!

GWB

What he said. My BLR .358 Win is a 20" barrel. I haven't found muzzle blast to be an issue while hunting. I don't hunt from a blind though.

I had a 20" LTR and I thought it was just about perfect for a deer stand. I've never been unhappy with 22-23" though

20" for a 308 basically lost nothing in handloads, yet was handy.





Jim, that's exactly what I had and that was NOT my experience. Maybe it was stock fit ? WISH I had not gotten rid of it.


Jerry

I’ve had 308’s with 18.5, 19, 20, 22, 24, and 28” bbl’s... I prefer 22”, and if I wanted a carbine wouldn’t go less than 20”, and I think 21” would be just right.

I prefer 21”

I actually really like my GSR , I think it’s 16 inches. Now it is loud, but I always wear hearing protection.

This is about where I'm at now, not really unhappy, but I've been in some blinds that I've worried I was going to bump the rifle against the tight walls at the wrong moment. Also, don't like taking my eyes of of a moving buck to look at clearances inside the blind. 20" seems really handy, I'm sure 24" is more than I need for this.

I've chopped lotsa them on the fly,to pinpoint balance. Congratulations?!?

Bless your hearts for trying though.

Hint.

Laughing!...............

I have shot a few deer out of box blinds and the little tents. As long as the end of the barrel is outside the blind it isn't any different than shooting outside out of a blind. Barrel inside a blind it will make you wish you had it outside long or short barrel.

Spare parts rifle, Sako S491 Action, 223 AI

10/4 on that,

ear plugs work for short barrels with or w/o muzzle brakes!

Ask me how I know!





and a bit of evening entertainment!


ya!


GWB

I'm not afraid to have a barrel chopped, but as Stick mentioned, bear balance in mind. I can only suffer a 24" barrel on something like a 7RM. Everything else gets cut from 20" to 22". I have a few factory 18-18.5" guns, but I'd honestly prefer 20" on a carbine. It's short enough for "handy" but not terribly loud if burning under 50gr of powder.

I'd go 20" and maybe a heavier contour.



BTDT . . . and my ears are still ringing

Kimber Montana chopped to 18”

22” - 24” is all I care for. Had a Sako 85 with a 20” barrel & just could not warm up to it.

I think I may have one of the only Sako 85 Finnlights 308 Win with a 22” barrel in existence.

22 inches for most. I've had a few 20" barrels and liked them alot. I did put a 23" barrel on recent and wish I'd gone 22.

Not a fan.

Don't do any rifle hunting out of a blind. Did start my kids out on 20" .308 bolt guns just because they were short in the arms at the time. Most every rifle I hunt is a 24 or 26. Wish I had 28's on an STW and a .300 Wby. My flinter is 32, so...............

I won't go under 20" in most cases, too dang loud for me. Smaller, quieter, rounds can go shorter, provided the balance is good.

I think 20" is about ideal for 308 as an all around length. I have 2 with 22" barrels, but can't see enough difference to justify cutting only 2" off of them so they will stay at 22". I have one of the Ruger Predators with an 18" barrel. It is a little shorter than I'd prefer, but since I already have others with 22" barrels it fills a niche. If it were 20" it wouldn't be enough different than my 22" guns.

On 30-06 class cartridges 22" is perfect. I want no more, or less. I can deal with 24" on magnums, but I no longer own any and if I needed 26+ to get the performance I'd just have to pass.

If I had 24" to start with and wanted something shorter I'd probably compromise at 21" just to be unique.

Love my .208 Ruger Scout with 16.1" barrel. Pur a synthetic stock on it, with which Ruger says gives it a weight of 6.25 pounds. Added a muzzle break. Mot much recoil and very handy. 2699fps with 150g BT, 2805fps with 130g TTSX, both over Varget.

At 300 yards, twice what OP was concerned about, those loads retain 2135fps/1518fpe and 2099fps/1271fpe respectively.

22 and 24 for me. Had a few magnums with 26 but they went down the road years ago.

I don't do any magnum calibers so 22 inches Ive found to be universal. I do have one rifle with a 24 inch Bbl. but its for looks more than function...


But it looks good!

Light matters to me more than short these days, and a longer barrel helps with anything that might get used with irons.

I have a RU77 .30-06 Tang at 17", with stock shortened fore and aft, and slimmed for looks and fit to my wife. Decelerator pad. Handy little thing, 1.25 MOA - good to 400 yards ( first game taken was a ram at 330, later a caribou at over 375) if range is known. It came used with a bulge at the muzzle, hence the barrel chop.

I don't shoot it off the bench much, and then with double hearing protection, usually no more than 5 rounds at a time, if that.. I do carry it hunting a lot, with a slip on pad over the Decelerator for better me-fit. It has killed sheep, black bear, caribou, and moose.

Most all of the 308 rifles I use deer hunting are 22 inches long. I do have one that is shorter, but it is cut for suppressor use.

All but one of my 338 WM's and both my 375 H&H's had 22" bbl's. For those two, 22-23" was just right for me.

I really appreciate everyone's opinions. This thread has been a big help in my decision, and I'm going to enjoy taking this 21" stainless M700 with me.
Happy Hunting

Yes, a 21" would be about perfect. I climbed a lot of trees with a 24" on my 7 mag and that barrel caught on near everything. The 18.5" on my 742 carbine was better for tree climbing, but a little loud on the back side. I cut a .35 Remington down to 19" for a walk around rifle, but when I built up a custom 7mm-08, it has a 20" with a #1 taper. If I built it again it would have a #2, but that 20 or a 21" would be about ideal.

I'm love my 16.5" Ruger frontier. Its extreme handy in the stand or blind. Rides perfectly on that dash of my Jeep and easy to grab for a quick shot on a hog or coyote.

straydog- how did you decide on 21"? Is you Mod 700 a standard 700 sporter? I see where the Mod 700 comes in a 20" heavy barrel model ( as do many others, tacticool) that would be a sweetie in a box blind. Since I am tall, I don't mind a longer rifle barrel, with 24" feeling perfect and a 22" feels "almost" short to me.

Jwall- stock fit had to come into play on that Ultralight 308. I had a Savage 99c 308 that felt just fine to me, yet it slapped my friend every time he shot it!

yessir

stock fit can make a world of diff.

Jerry

I was very happy with the 700 LTR and then traded them off in a fit of lunacy. Now I want to go back to a 20 inch heavy barrel for shooting at the bench and hunting from a ground blind. I am going to give a Tikka T3X CTR in .308 Winchester with a GRS Berserk stock a try. It shoots well and I only have to tote it to the blind.

I have a 16inch barrel 30/06 Columbian Mauser (carbine). I've been meaning to take it hunting but have too many other firearms in preference. I've also been meaning to find out what velocity I get out of it. Accuracy is acceptable considering it is standard ex-mil configuration with the horrible spire front sight and V rear - my aging eyes have trouble with those.

The last time I went to Kansas, I was in a plywood box blind that was small and short. It was almost impossible to get my Tikka 30-06 moved without bumping. So, I decided I needed to whack the barrel on one of my rifles.
The .308 is a better candidate, and most on this thread are saying 20" as a minimum preference. I'm thinking 3" shorter at 21" will help a lot, and I may not need to go any shorter. If so, I can always take it for another trim. My M700 is a stainless SPS.

well, let's see.

Rem. M7MS (Mannlicher) in .257 Roberts wears a 20"
Rem. M7 AWR in 7mm SAUM wears a 22"
Rem. 700 SPS in .308 wears a 20"

Merkel K1 in 7mm Rem Mag wears a 24" (*Note: the K1 is a break action single shot...so it is amazingly short given the reduced action length.)

Montana 1999 in .375 H&H wears a 20".

Yeah, short barrels work.

I was just about to say something similar. For a given barrel length a break action (whether single, double, combination or drilling) makes for a significantly shorter OAL than a bolt action. I have a little drilling with 22" barrels, and a double with 23.6", and they are very handy. A falling block single shot is nearly as compact too, for a given barrel length.

I agree with those who say 20" is a good minimum for a .308. Much less than this and they get a bit blasty - really blasty at 16" I've found.

.....................................I have a 16.5" barreled 300 WSM Ruger Frontier. With a rifle 35.5" in OAL, I find it to be extremely handy and quite a joy to carry around. Not too many rifles can you carry around by the pistol grip with the barrel pointed down towards the ground and still have a good amount of distance between the barrel end and the ground. That is the main advantage of the shortys......

Most would cringe at such a short barrel length for a 300 WSM. However, I welcome it! Ballistically, a 26" barreled 30-06. A compact, but a long range rifle if needed too..... BUT!..Very LOUD with stout recoil which I can easily handle....

So keep in mind the added noisy report even from a 308..

The ideal 308 barrel length for you would depend on your carrying and hunting conditions (in blinds, in brush etc) as well as your desire as to what a shorty rifle should be. The shorter the OAL, the easier the carrying around and handling will be.....................

Yeah, a 16" barrel 300 WSM isn't equaling a 26" 30-06 ballistically. Sorry.

I have two Encore ProHunters with 26" barrels. They are only an inch longer than my Ruger Gunsite Scout Rifle with the 18.7" barrel plus the flash hider. One is in 35 Whelen and the other is a 300 Win Mag. These are great for hunting from blinds.

Browning Abolt2 7mm rem mag has a 24" with Boss so its almost 27" and its tuff to get in and out of tower stand windows. Had a 20" .308 built on Rem 700 action and i like the feel of the shorter barrel in our towers. Even at 20", hand loads pushing 125 gr Nosler BT's at 3180, so i'm happy.

A local shop has a Ruger American Predator 18” barrel .308 win. Anyone have any input on those? I don’t think I’ve seen the short barreled Predators mentioned much.

Having 10" less barrel to carry around and beating 24" 308 performance doesn't sound like a bad place to be.

I've had a couple. My 1st had the original rotary magazines. When the versions that take AI style mags came out I bought another and gave the older version to my SIL. Both of mine were MOA or better with most loads. Velocity is about 50-60 fps slower than my 22" 308's.

Thanks. This one has the rotary mag. I think the 18” would be quite handy.

For non magnums, I think 21 inches is perfect.

Just had a 700 sps 243 rebored to 358 win by JES and barrel chopped to 18”. It handles just about perfect, for my hunting in PA and NY where 200 yards is the absolute limit and most ranges are 100 or less I can’t think of a handier little thumper. Now I need to decide on a 3-9x40 or a compact 2-7x32 scope to complete the package.

You're talking to a man who has risen from the dead, so anything is possible.

To me, 20” seems about perfect. Both of my 308s have a 20” barrel. Never chronographed loads out of my BLR, but my Model 7 pushes 150gr TTSXs to about 2860fps. Very handy in the woods, and still good velocity. Most other cartridges I wouldn’t go below 22” but the 308 seems to be very efficient in shorter barrels than most.

........................Oh yeah?? Well Moosemike. Sorry but my particular rifle does.. You have a 300 WSM Ruger Frontier that you happened to have chrony'd? And you shortened my barrel by an additional 1/2 an inch...LOL....

You are familiar with RL17 I presume?.... Well,,,, A 180 gr Hornady with 66.3 gr of RL17 (max load) from my compact Frontier chronys at 2917 fps. Also using RL17 (max load), it will propel a 150 grainer just over 3200 fps. And, those #s were backed up with another friend's chrony for added verification.

Also for your further edification, you can go to gunblast.com and go into the archives section and review Jeff Quinn's article on this same 300 WSM Ruger Frontier dating back to Feb 2005. His best MV was 2794 using 180 gr factory ammo. As a test, that same identical 180 gr factory ammo which I acquired chrony'd at 2830 from my Frontier. Now lets tack on some max doses of RL17 shall we?? LOL.....UH oh!

And if ya look at the 300 WSM loading data from Alliant, 66 gr of RL17 can move a 180 grainer at about 3180 fps. Compared with two other buddies 24" barreled 300 WSMs, I am running roughly 4.3 to 4.5% behind in total MV using identical hand loads.. .......Not losing all of the velocity that you might wish to believe......And, if you do some research and pull up a Guns and Ammo article dating back to 2005-06 by Dick Metcalf entitled "Short Barrel Long Reach" he does a review on a 7/08 Ruger Frontier verifying only a 4.5% in velocity losses compared with 24" barreled 7/08s.......I am aware that common opinion is a 50 fps loss per inch of shorter tube length. With modern powders,,,not so! Try 15 to 25 fps per inch.

So! If you happen to have anything that proves or shows otherwise, perhaps you could pass it along??

I'd go with the 2x7 in standard. It is what my Stub wears.

I did have a 6X Burris compact on a '98 in 30-06 , 22" bbl, tricked out in a Brown Precision stock, replaced iron bottom metal with Parker-Hale aluminum, light weight sling. With 10 rounds it went 7 1/2 lbs. Did not blind hunt with it, but did stand and alpine. 1 1/2 MOA. Worked fine.

Lacked a little in low light, but never found that a disadvantage in my hunting. For 200 yard shooting, in low light, a straight 4 or 6X in standard might be the best.

No 308’s in my house but 20” sounds just right.
375 H&H = 21”
416 Rem = 21”

For a .308 based round and especially for maneuvering in and around tight areas, I prefer 20" barrels and no more than 22", assuming the contour allows the rifle to balance well.

From a powder efficiency standpoint, no more than 20", though as mentioned earlier noise and blast can be a factor especially in a blind. For burning 40-50 grains of powder, longer barrels don't have any advantage, IMO. Even more so for .378" rounds.

That said, two of my three main hunting rifles have 25.5" and 26" barrels. I need to have them chopped at some point.

^^^Yep, what the gay homo says !^^^

Hey, if I was a real homo, I'd like the longer barrels because......uh......uh.......never mind.

My kids shoot a 7-08 Frontier with the 16.5" barrel. I have not noticed muzzle blast to be excessive and we hunt without ear protection on big game hunts. Never fired it inside a blind though. I just picked up a 700 CDL in 7-08 with the 24" barrel. Methinks if I keep it it will become a 20 or 22" gun.

2 corrections regarding my last post to Moosemike....I typed that the Alliant MV for 66 gr RL 17 for the 300 WSM using 180 grainers was about 3180 fps. Correct # is 3082.....I also typed that my hand loads 66.3 gr of RL17 was used to get 2917 fps with a 180 gr Hornady......Actually was 66 gr of RL17..The 66.3 was used for a 168 VLD.......

Out of curiosity, have you chronoed it?

I love the shorter firearms too. I normally shoot from out of my vehicle and need the short length to swing the rifle from the passenger seat and out the window without fouling with the gearshift, mirror etc. My side mirror makes a handy rest. (My hunting tactics are to roam the paddocks or drive up quickly to the dams to catch the pigs unaware. I've got an arthritic toe so walking around isn't much fun. I'll have to get into the long range stuff too I guess.)

What do you reckon your load would do in a 24" barrel, all other things being equal?

I have three 308's with 20" barrels and they are my favorites to hunt with. 400 yards would be a really long shot at one place I hunt but I wouldn't think twice about it.

I don't like going above 22" unless it is on one of my Encores or target guns.. For them, I will go up to 24". I have a .308 Encore barrel that is 18". Even with a suppressor on it, it handles like a carbine.

As for blast on shorter barrels, I run suppressors on just about everything I shoot now days, so I don't worry about it all that much.

.....................Yes! Has been chrony'd many many times using many different handloads.......

.............................Well!..... Alliant shows 3082 fps from a 24" barrel using 66 gr RL17 behind a Speer 180 gr. Other 300 WSM bores may vary either way or come very close. I am running 2917 using that same load behind a 180 gr Hornady IB. About a 5.2% loss vs Alliant..Do not know what a Speer would do as a comparison. Don't use them.

Oops I missed your earlier posts on chrono data. Those are pretty healthy velocities. I'll bet you get singed eyebrows though.

Too hot...

When RL17 first hit the shelves I ran some of Alliant's max 180 loads in my 300 WSM and darn near locked up the bolt. Nothing I loaded above 65.0 RL17/180 made me comfortable, and I finally settled on 64.5 gr's RL17 with a 180 for 3,035+ fps. Breathes easy, no ejection hitches, and generally produces fine accuracy. At last count I've used the 64.5 load in four 24" 300 WSM's over the years. It works well and consistently give 3,035+ fps in all rifles.

A 300 Mag is about a 180 at 3,000 fps. give or take. Pushing one of the smallest of them to 300 WBY velocities is not solid thinking...

........LOL.......Not in the least. No singed eyebrows......Muzzle blast not as bad as many think.....Many from the get go under estimate the MVs that can be had from the shorter barrels. Todays modern powders close the gap.

..................Interestingly, using 66.0 gr of 17 does not lock up my bolt. No ejection problems and no primer issues either. For my Frontier though, no need to go past 66 grains....In fact, my more accurate loadings are less than 66 gr....

16,18, 20 max.

Do you have access to Federal Power-Shok 180gr ammo (blue box stuff)? If so I'm getting a 5 shot average of 2509fps at the muzzle from my 17 1/2"bbl for you to compare to.

18" to 20" is great.

That's not bad - I've got a max. listed of just under 2800fps for a 180gn in a 24inch barrel (from ADI reloading data). I think I gotta buy a chronograph now - too many unanswered questions starting to pile up.

This.

You are right, and that is especially true when using heavy for caliber bullets. With light bullets, short barrels are often down on velocity just as much as people expect, but heavy bullet speeds can be a lot closer to what long barrels do than most expect. With short 308 barrels for example, I've found that 175gr bullets are often not too far behind 150gr, while there is a considerable gap between the same loads in longer barrels.

I went out and bought a chrono and could only get the 150gn Federal Power-Shok ammo. I think it might be loaded a bit light because it wasn't all that loud and most primers were backed out a little bit. 2600fps was the average, so that's equivalent to 300 Savage velocities, and down from the 2900fps on the Federal website (22 or 24 inch barrel?).

I'll look for the Federal 180gns but will try my reloads (much noisier) and maybe also Winchester 150gn factories, for some sort of comparison.

With my handloads using 150gr Nosler Solid Base bullets,56gr IMR4350,Federal casings,and CCI250 primers I'm getting 2545fps from a 5 shot average. Judging from numerous references I'm guessing it would get 2800fps or so out of a 24"bbl.

I just realised that those loads are still equivalent to what a 303 will do will a "normal" barrel. I think I use 62gns AR2209 (equiv to IMR4350) behind a 150gn - I'll have to check, and crono.

I've never had any deer complain that the load doesn't work. lol

I've been downloading cup and core bullets for a long time. I'm just not at all fond of processing a bloodshot excessively damaged animal. I even run my .270 Win 130's at 2763fps.

I tell a lie, my loads are:

144gn FMJ, 61gn AR2209
150gn spitzer or 155gn PALMA, 60gn AR2209

My reloading spreadsheet says I've got some of the 144gn FMJ's loaded up in the cupboard at home - I guess these will be coming out to the range this weekend.

They'll probably be doing around 2600fps too I suspect. I think AR2209 is too slow for the short barrels - I use it mainly because of the impressive boom and flash that it makes. I have AR2208 loads that shoot as well (50gn) but don't flash as much. I like spectators to enjoy the short barrel as much as I do. AR2208 is sold as Varget in the USA.

Tried some Winchester factory 150gn Super-X - same velocity as the Federal factories: 2600 fps.

My 144gn FMJ reloads did 2625 fps average, but with the added boom and flash. I had the crono about 2 m (6 ft) in front of the muzzle but it got knocked about a bit from the blast, and the first 2 readings were in the order of 6400 fps! I shifted it out to 3 m (9 ft) and it worked alright there.

Move it out to 15' and just add 10fps to the reading. Close enough for government work and no worrying about muzzle blast.

Those velocities are good to go. I had thought about bumping my 150gr load (2545fps) up to around 2700fps but there's no real field advantage ballistically or trajectory wise.

Brought my newest 20" 308 out today and shot the same load that I shoot in another 20" and got sub moa with it. Same drop at 250 yards so the velocity is very close. This was the first time I shot it since cutting it down from 24" . I really like having 2 guns that shoot the same load , one is blue with wood ( blue bird weather gun) and the other SS and synthetic.