What type of game would you feel comfortable hunting with a .257 Roberts? Who makes ammo for them? Jeff

I shot one for a long time, wondering why everyone else found them so terribly lethal... I never found the cartridge to be a spectacular killer and stopped using it quite a few years ago. I have shot many deer, black bears, caribou, a few wolves, a mountain goat and some other assorted stuff with it.
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<br>Some tell me I need to chrony what I was using and see if I really had it loaded up to potential and to be honest I have not done that yet... I stopped using the round before I got a chrony, but I did try a LOT of different bullets with marginal results. At the same time I have found the parent case round, the 7x57, to be a far more effective poker...
<br>art

I've owned two and used them on game up to the size of deer. IMO, the 257R is an ideal "dual purpose" IE deer and varmint rig. This is especially true if one desires a short, light rifle with light recoil. I think that it is a better killer on deer sized game than the 243-6mm without losing effeciency on varmints.
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<br>But!! It is not a terribly popular caliber, therefore rifles are hard to find when you want one, and hard to sell when you decide to play with something else.
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<br>But #2!! Much of the factory ammo is loaded very light and does not optimize what the cartridge can do. There are some full power factory loads available but availability may be sketchy in your area.
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<br>So....it's a gun nut/reloader cartridge that is superb at it's job, but may not be the ideal choice for a casual shooter who relies mostly on factory ammo.
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<br>JimF
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Ngrumba
<br>I have used and built several Roberts over the years. I have taken several deer with good results.......all one shot kills. Luckily , I have never made a bad shot with a Roberts. I always take lung shots. I have used just about every bullet available. My favorite is the 120 grain Partition. The most accurate has been the 100 grain Sierra matchking. In my experience it is plenty for deer and animals under 300 pounds. Light recoil , accurate, feeds good, easy to handload for . Factory ammo is usually down loaded quite a bit. Handloads will give at times 200 fps faster velocities. Hornady Light-Mags are loaded on the uper end. I am building one now for myself so I maybe able to give you some specs tomorrow afternoon if all goes well.
<br>Charlie

OK, this is good....always wondered what the heck I would do with my 700 Mountain Rifle 257 Bob.I'll keep reading this thread and maybe I'll find a use for it.Give us the goods Charlie.....

Rembo
<br>Use it for Whitetail, Mule deer, pronghorn, sheep, groundhogs,prarie dogs, gophers, all kinds of exotics,coyote,fox,wolf,goats, or it makes nice little small holes in paper.
<br>Charlie

Well, I can tell you I'll be using mine to hunt Antelope in October here in Montana, and maybe even a Muley buck.
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<br>Hudge

It would be all the rage in the rags. It would be billed as the answer to the varmit hunter who also needs a great deer and antelope round. All rifle mfgs would chamber for them and load the ammo the way it should be.
<br>David

The Roberts suffers from a bad design and is strapped with unrealistic limitations in factory ammo.
<br> It was originally designed/throated for 100 gr. round nose bullets and mild pressures.
<br> Modern powders, and techniques, when used by knowledgable handoloaders, will make it hum. But, like the .308/30'06 debate, modern bullets makes this a pretty acedemic argument. We have the .243 on one side, and the 25-06 on the other. The "Bob" is in the middle. E

Ngrumba,
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<br>I used to shoot the 257 Roberts and 257AI a lot, before I became a .260 Remington convert. Like Charlie, I'm a lung shooter and never had a problem killing deer or antelope.
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<br>In short action rifles, like the Remington Model 722, I used the lighter, shorter, bullets so that I didn't limited the powder capacity of the case. I like the 75 grain Sierra and the 87 grain Speer TNT for varmints. I like the 90 grain Sierra HPBT for small deer and coyotes that you aren't shooting for the fur. Very explosive expansion! The Barnes X bullets might be a good choice, but I have not used them enough to offer an informed opinion.
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<br>In long action rifles, like the Ruger Model 77, I like the 100 grain Nosler Partition and BT, as well as the 120 grain Partition that Charlie is fond of.
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<br>I did find that the heavier bullets showed their best accuracy at, or close to, the maximum recommended powder charge. So, if you buy a 257 and can't get it to shoot, try pushing it hard. Besides, if you decide that you don't like the 257 Roberts, you can easily rechamber to 25-284 and gain a couple of hundred FPS.
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<br>Sincerely,
<br>
<br>Bearrr264

I've had 4 - 3 standards and 1 A.I.. I've used them for deer, moose, black bear, wolves and coyotes. Not the most spectacular cartridge but it will do the job if you place the bullet where it needs to go. Mostly use Sierra 100's and Nosler B.T's.. Several moose were taken with Speer 120 grain blems. Can't recall ever using a second shot but I may have.

I've only killed one animal with mine. A mule deer doe last year. Heart shot she lived for about five seconds after impact. The ammo was Hornady Light Mag with their 117 gr BTSP bullet. Chrono's between 2900 and 3000fps out of my 24" barrel.
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<br>Light recoil and more oomph than a .243/6mm makes this a great dual purpose cart as mentioned in the other posts. I won't use 6mms for big game, but I will use the Roberts.
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<br>I have licenses for four does and one buck this year. The Roberts will likely get a workout again along with the Whelen and the .45-70.

In reply to the title of the post--I bet it was good for Mr Roberts......
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<br>Blaine

To second what Eremius said and mention that Ned Roberts did not get much satisfaction. Remington did not use his cartridge, the .25 Roberts but instead necked down the 7mm Mauser! Ned was a Schuetzen shooter of note and later a successful experimenter. He developed the .25 Roberts which was shorter than the .257 REMINGTON ROBERTS and had a more gradual shoulder. It' looks like a .243 Win, just a little longer. It would have fit the Rem. 722 just right unlike the .257 RR.
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<br>Just another screwup by Remington. It never had a chance anyway compared to the outstanding .270 Win.

Mine is good for frustrating .243 Win owners.....

Rechambering to 25-284.

Ouch!...........(grin)

My wife and I have used the .257 for many years, at first my grandmother's Rem. 722 which she used for everything up to and including cow elk, with the wimpy factory loads yet. Here in Montana have killed umpteen pronghorn and deer (both WT and MD), as well as a few wild turkeys that got in wht eway, with no problem as far as we care to shoot. I have three now (722, and a custom Ruger #1 and Mexican Mauser) and my wife has one, an Ultra Light Arms Model 20.
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<br>If you load Partitions up to .270 pressures you get over 3200 with 100's and 2900-3000 with 115 and 120's in a 24" barrel. These have killed everything we've shot quite neatly, including my biggest pronghorn at 430 yards (one shot with 100 P.) and my third-biggest muley (one shot with 120 P.) Tried the .257 Ackley and found it could get another 100 fps, which made no difference in the field. Have not really been able to tell much difference between handloaded .257 and .25-06, in fact have begun to have doubts about claims that 200 fps more velocity makes much difference in real life, other than SLIGHT flattening of trajectory. Sight in a handloaded .257 2" high at 100 and it shoots about 3-4" lower than a .25-06 (or .25-284) at 400, with noticeably less recoil.
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<br>It's also a great large-varmint round (rockchucks, coyotes) with any good 75-87 grain bullet. Too much for prairie dogs! Kicks too hard and barrel heats too fast in a dog town.

Mule Deer........This was a very good post in my mind. I also own both rifles, and like you I can't tell a whole lot of difference in their performance.
<br>Both of these rifles were used by my wife on many occasions and she displays a strong preference for the .257 Roberts. I still carry the 25-06 as a back up on most Deer Hunts. The 25-06 is, in my mind, a bit more accurate than the Robert's using their best loads but that is really splitting fine hairs. They both shoot as good as I can shoot them as I have only occasionaly fired the sub. MOA groups that most people seem to be doing on a regular basis.
<br>Although I take the 25-06 along for it's "rangeing abilities" the longest shot was actually taken with the .257 Roberts at just over 280 "paces". Not too far by some standards, but a heck-of-a-long-way for Mamma, at age 56. Both of these rounds are good to great. Both are "shootable". and both create a lot of useless arguments. What one can do, the other does just as well for the average hunter.
<br>I am a long time "lurker" on these boards without much to say, but this time I thought I should speak up in defense of these two wonderful rounds.
<br>I have owned the 25-06 since it was still a wildcat and I grew up with the .257 Roberts. A choice between the two would boil down what "fits" best in your hands.
<br>Respectfully, Russ

I have a 25/06 never owned a Roberts.
<br>Now saying that, if I had a choice, I would buy the 25/06 before I bought a Roberts, but if I owned a Roberts, I would feel no need to sell it for another.

Mule Deer,
<br>
<br>Very interesting!
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<br>If a 257Roberts is only 3 to 4 " lower @ 400 yds than the 25-06 or 25-284 when all are sighted in 2" high @ 100 then why bother with the bigger cases. I would have thought the difference was more.

Mule Deer,
<br>
<br>Are any of your .257 Roberts rifles chambered for the AI configuration? You indicated that you had tried the AI, which I read as an inference that you no longer use it. If you don't use the AI, why not?
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<br>Do you use the same OAL for your four (4) rifles? Your famous Model 722 would be a short action, but the other three (3), or at least the Ruger and Mauser, would be longer actions. Clay Harvey's writing showed that he was not a fan of the .257 Roberts and he was particularly critical of it in the Ruger #1. I have always thought that a #1 in .257 Roberts would be a great antelope rifle. Since you have one, what is your experience with that rifle and cartridge combination?
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<br>Sincerely,
<br>
<br>Bearrr264

OK, I'm convinced.
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<br>The reason I asked was that I found a used left-handed Model 76 Dakota in 257 Roberts and it is gorgeous. The wood makes me drool, and the metal/blueing is perfect. It has conetrol mounts, but no scope. I'm thinking of a 1.75-6X Leupold. I've always wanted a Dakota, but never thought I could afford one. I got a great deal on this one - (I bought it yesterday), but the only thing that was making me hesitate was that it was chambered in 257 Roberts and I didn't know squat about that caliber. Now....I have to wait 9 more days for the 10 day waiting period in California.......
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<br>Thanks for all your input. Jeff

Ngrumba,
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<br>Dakota sent me an Alpine (LH) in .257 Roberts about 12 years ago, my only regret was that I didn't buy one (they were under $1500) at that time. My friend bought a standard 76 for his son (LH) that was an absolutely beautiful, very accurate rifle. I believe that he put a 2.5-8 Leupold on it.
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<br>Regards,
<br>JB

first centerfire rifle that i ever held in my hands, or shot was a .257. it wasn't much to look at even then... it had been carried it's share, and it looked it. i shot it pretty well too. never got to hunt with it though. the uncle who owned it didn't have a lot to do with the rest of the family. he came by about once a year to see my dad. dad had some stories to tell though, about both uncle joe and his rifle. the guy who owned the sporting goods store in town always asked dad about him and they would swap stories......
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<br>i think that my dad always planned to own a rifle like uncle joes some day. i do too...... john w
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Just sold my .257 AI because couldn't really see a difference in killing power, or practical trajectory in the field. It was a custom rifle, very accurate, but why have to fireform cases if you don't have to? (In general have pretty much decided that "improved" cartridges are a waste of time and energy, after experience with several.)
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<br>My Ruger #1 was a factory original 1B, but had such a long throat that only 115-120-grain bulets would shoot. It was super accurate with them, but weighed 9 pounds with scope. Had it rebarreled with a slim Wiseman; it now weighs under 8 scoped, and shoots almost as well, under 1" with any good bullet. Because of throat OAL length is 2.9, as it is in the the Mauser and Ultra Light, which buys you nothing in extra velocity. Can get the same velocity out of the old short-action 722. You simply don't gain enough extra powder room when seating .257 bullets out to gain significant velocity.
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<br>Forgot to mention that both Hornady Light Mags and Federal 120 Partition Premiums are great. Both get the advertised velocity in most rifles, and have seen the Federal exceed the listed 2780 (which is plenty) in many, including a Dakota that grouped them under an inch. Wouldn't use the Hornadys on anything bigger than pronghorn on small deer, though, as the 117 BT will come apart on deer shoulders. Or at least it did on one muley doe, which was enough for me.

Mule Deer
<br> I think I will be a big tough Texan (transplanted) and come right out and say it. I like the 257 Roberts just because I like it ! In the same group as some of my coon hounds and old girlfriends. They aint anything special and all but I just have a "hankering" (that is a word here) for them. Got a real "hankering" for the 6.5 x 55, 7 X 57, 8 X 57, and 9.3 X 62. And a 45-70. I like 30-06 too.
<br>I agree on the Ackley being a little more trouble than its worth. I guess if you have plenty of time to fireform its ok but I never seem to have time. With a 200 yard zero, 100 fps is only worth about .6 of one inch at 300 yards. I cant shoot that well in the field so I dont worry about it. But you know it sure does make a good looking case after you blow out the shoulder !
<br>Charlie

Charlie, good for you! I agree.
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<br>I've been trying to talk myself into rebarreling an M70 243 to 260 as opposed to rebarreling to the Roberts... it makes "sense"... the 260 is a sort of "better Roberts" (i.e. 85-140 grainer's with a 1-9" twist... yeah, I know this is nearly blasphemy)... still, I can't get my gears engaged. 260 Rem? Boring! 257 Roberts? Ahhh... blessed nostalgia! Besides, I've got Ned Roberts book, Big Game Hunting (circa 1947) on my shelf... that book needs a rifle to go with it (talk about filling your "niches")! The Roberts, ballistic "fact" aside, has a certain aura that's undeniable no matter what my "practical self" says.
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<br>Funny story, I was at a rifle range one time some years back and got to talking to a gent about the Roberts (I was shooting one of several I've owned over the years). This guy related a story when he saw I was using the Roberts. Seems he operated an air cargo service and had to make an emegency landing in ranch country down in, if I recall correctly, Texas or Oklahoma. Anyway, he landed on a country road and pretty soon up comes a pickup... guy gets out and asks if he can help. This fellow nearly swallows his tounge as the bloke in the pickup is Gary Cooper! Mr. Cooper takes him to his ranch house where he lets him use the phone to get someone to service the plane, then he takes him into his gunroom. Seems Gary Cooper had a "thing" for the 257 Robets too as he had nearly twenty on an upright wall rack, including many very fancy custom jobs from the Winchester custom shop! The Roberts, he told the pilot, was his favorite cartridge! So, Cooper liked the Roberts and was from Bozeman, MT... must have been alright for a Hollywood guy!
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<br>Brad
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<br>BTW, I can't imagine a more shootable, practical and nostalgic battery than a 257 Roberts, 30-06 and 375 H&H.

Brad
<br>You must have read my mind because I am working on a 30-06 and a 375 for my collection. Or I may go with a 8 x 57 in place of the 06. Either way I will be covered. I have an Interarms MKX action and a Brown Precision stock just itching to be a 8mm.
<br>Charlie

Charlie, wow, that's a little spooky! As a guy who works on rifles for "fun and profit" and can chamber for anything, your choices for a personal battery are really interesting. Nothing new, ultra, beltless or named with tostesterone in mind... hmmm.
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<br>Brad

Brad:
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<br>You leave Charlie alone! You guys can't play together any ... MORE!
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<br>Charlie, it's OK. That .17 RUM I wanted is plenty practical, no matter what BRAAAAAAD says!
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<br>(Can I get a little help here?)
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<br>Rick

Suprised that when wishing for a soft shooting little rifle,more don't bring up the 250-3000. It will certainly get you to the 400yd line. Even in Noslers newest Manual(#5),the difference between it and the Bob,is less than 200fps,with 100's.
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<br>After playing with more than a couple 25's,my preference in a short action,is the 25-284. Recoil is a non issue(regardless of rifle weight),accuracy has been superb and performance is rather amazing. She's the pick of the crop,in my estimation.................
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Back when men like Norman Brockway, Jonathan Browning, John Selvridge, Meredith Wolfe, W. S. Blankenship, D. C. Addicks and others were building rifles one at time, by hand, a rifle was so unique it was named. Some times the name of the rifle ( Killdeer, Long Tom, Fool Killer, Castor Oil, and Sudden Death are some of the better known rifles from that era.) was applied to the barrel or other prominant place on the gun.
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<br>I have often wondered if I am not attracted to a caliber because it has a "name" that rolls off of the tounge easier than a group of numbers?
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<br>Rifles should have a name. Davey Crockett's rifle had a name. I did not miss an epsiode of that TV program when I was growing up. Could that be why my gun cabinet houses a Swift and a Triple Deuce insted of a .223 or a .22-250?
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<br>Might that be why you like the Roberts "just because you like it"?
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Charlie--
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<br>Now you and I both know I have a .250-3000, which is another favorite cartridge. Plus I have two 7x57's, and a custom .260--which is the only cartridge I've found to come close to the .257 for all-around varmint/deer use.
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<br>I've tried some of the wildcats, but like many of the hot new cartridges, all they shoot is bullets. Nothing magic, and re-forming and fire-forming cases is more trouble than it's worth. Like you, I want a cartridge with some history, not just hype.
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<br>

I seriously considered a Roberts when it came time to select the round for my first full custom rifle. It was to be a light Mtn. Rifle, 7-7 1/4 lbs. What swayed me to the .25-284 was the extra capacity and velocity. I wanted a minimum of 3100-3200 fps. with the infamous Barnes XLC.
<br> With that case, it can be easily obtained w/o strain. Actually mine clocks 3340 fps. But, it may well have not been able to give me the MOA, or less, accuracy I demand for my hunting loads. It's most accurate load, with that bullet is right at 3100 fps., BTW.
<br> Same reasoning applied to my other custom. I wanted 3000-3100 fps. and real accuracy, with the 120 gr. XBT out of a 7X57. I went with the .280 round, not the 7X57. I get 3160 fps., and .2-.5 MOA groups with that one.
<br> These loads also produce less pressure than the equvilent Roberts loads would. They will recoil harder-thanks to the heavier powder charge-but, at that level, it isn't an issue.
<br> As to brass forming issues, what issues ? A pass through the die, and out comes the .25-284 case.
<br> There have been some concerns over reliable feeding. I haven't seen any. My gunsmith did nothing to the feed rails, etc.
<br> I did loose one round in magazine capacity. Since I'm not the kind of shooter/hunter that first dumps a box of cartriages into his hat before opening fire at his buck, this doesn't concern me either. E

What folks are describing,is why I was never warm to the 270Win. Just something about the cartridge,that doesn't appeal to me personally,despite it being a fine round(I've had five of them). It has no luster,to my eye. Same goes the '06,despite it too,being a sound choice.
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<br>The rifle that a man uses most and is the happiest with,can earn that position by a myriad of reasons. I have nostalgic pieces,some are even what most would consider "pretty",but they don't excite me the most. Everybody should own at least one such rifle. The one he grabs,when he knows the chips are down. "Old Reliable",if you will.
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<br>Besides a specific rifle warming the heart,most look upon specific chamberings the same way. The 7x57 is one of them,that is often maligned. A pard summed it up nicely,when he related that "he wouldn't own a rifle,that had a damn times sign in it". He calls it the "7 times 57",despite his understanding both the bore diameter and case length in millimeters. Funny how guys see the same animal differently.
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<br>I've a warm spot for the 7-08,in fact I'm much more keen upon it than I've related here and I've talked it up a bunch. There's a comfort factor in that chambering for me,because I have shot it so much. Trajectory tables and energy retention figures,can't begin to measure that. It is a Giant Killer in my eye(and hands),but most would overlook it as a mundane offering,with little or no flash. I guess that leaves more for me and I greedily welcome that.
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<br>Choosing a cartridge,then a specific rifle to house it in,is a thought provoking process for some. Others barely give it a second's thought. I'm a "thinker",regarding the selection/building process. I weigh heavily,the role that both cartridge and rifle will play and try to marry one to the other. I've dabbled enough,that I can consistently make myself very happy with the final outcome and I'm the ONLY guy that matters in that equation.
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<br>This has been an interesting Thread,to learn what others crave and why....................

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr><p> all they shoot is bullets <p><hr></blockquote>
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<br>5 words that pretty much say it all. Jeff Cooper took three or four pages to make the point in his classic article "The Caliber Game".
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<br>I found it pretty illuminating to read the article in Peterson's Rifle Shooter on the Lazzeroni cartridges, which mentions that when someone pointed out to Lazzeroni the ballistic and physical similarity between one of his creations and some older item, he admitted he'd never heard of the older round.
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What Big Stick said is one of the reasons I love the .270....When I was a young man in the early 80's I was reading Bob Milek talking about his Ultralight Arms .270 and it seems several others at the time were really talking the cartridge up...I was saving my cattle feeding and grass cutting money for a woodstocked ADL in 7-08 when I saw my .270 on the rack at a local pawn shop...Went and dumped my Lipton tea jar and bought my first centerfire rifle...It's been a love story every sense...I believe the .270 Win is the most performance the average guy can get in a soft kicking rifle, anything more begins to get on people in my opinion and my experience.
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<br>I had a friend of mine whose brother had a BDL or Cassic in .257 Roberts and at that time he didn't reload so he fussed over finding ammo for it...Now that's no longer an issue he loads for it..
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<br>Mike

P.S. I kow O'Conner gets credit for the .270 win, but all I ever read of his was a few months back somebody on the board posted a link to some of his old stories so I went and read a couple! He was before my time!!
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<br>mike

I'm still new to the 257 AI but the first 500 to leave my barrrel show very good performance. I'm not saying this extra will translate to much in the field but on paper it looks good.
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<br>The Sierra 100gr bthp matchking seemed like a good place to start. Using cream-of-wheat-fire formed winchester +p brass, the 257 AI has produced the following data using h4831 sc and cci 200 br primers out of a 26" Shilen barrel.
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<br>(five shot average 100 yrds - benchrest)
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<br>50 gr - 3244fps - .7" group
<br>51 gr - 3298fps - .7" group
<br>52 gr - 3329fps - .4" group
<br>53 gr - 3372fps - .2" group - been able to reproduce this more than once
<br>54 gr - 3408fps - .8" group
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<br>Presure looked ok untill 54gr here the primers started to flatted a little. Extraction is smooth and primer pockets are still tight after 5 shots. These loads heat a #5 contour barrel real quick.
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<br>The 257 AI seems to nicely meet the performance of a 25-06. I still need to test 117-120 gr bullets before that is my firm opinion though.
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<br>I probably would not have a 257 AI had it not been for the action I had to use. It is a intermediate military action that could not be (within reason) modified to handle a 25-06-length case. Since this was my first attempt at doing the majority of the work myself, I didn't want to put up too much money.
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<br>Overall, I'm not disappointed with the 257AI.
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<br>

Brad,
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<br>Although I have a number of .257 Roberts rifles, including my first "deer rifle, a Model 70 20" barrel carbine, I believe that the .260 is a better killer of deer and antelope then the .257 is. Base on what data? Based on my years of shooting the .257 and the 67 deer and antelope that I have shot since 1997 with the .260 Remingtion. Like Mule Deer says, the .260 is what the .257 Roberts would like to have been, with the added advantage of really good factory ammunition in the form of the 120 grain BT and 125 grain Partition loads from Remington.
<br>
<br>JMHO
<br>
<br>Sincerely,
<br>
<br>Bearrr264

Bearr I've actually been saying the same thing about the 260 since it first came out... it's a "better 257 Roberts"... despite the fact that's nearly blasphemous!
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<br>I'll defer to your experience with the two cartridges as you've definately used them both! I've only used the Roberts. Really (and I'm almost embarrased to admit this level of anal-analysis), my only problem with the "260 Remington" is that the name, well, sucks! It should have been the "6.5-08!"
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<br>Regardless, I'll probably re-barrel my stainless SA M70 to 260 as it'll make a perfect companion (with a 22" bbl) to my 22" bbl'd stainless M70 300 WSM.
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<br>
<br>Brad