We are so privileged to have many, many cartridges to choose from, those from antiquity to the ultra modern.

IMO there are 2 cartridges that certainly qualify as "Most American Cartridges".

1. the 30-30 Win. It's not a fav of mine but I recognize it's history and qualifications.

2. the 30-06 is in MY opinion the MOST American Cartridge we have.


I'm not dismissing the 270, 250-3000, 300 Savage, et.al., et.al.
The 06 deserves high esteem for its Military beginning and usage PLUS it's hunting heritage.

I don't count ANY of the foreign cartridges > they don't have American ROOTS!


What do you think would be The Most American cartridge.

Jerry

6.5 creed

Ain't old enuff to vote.

Jerry

45-70, 45 Colt.

D S

I FORGOT about the 45 Colt. Good Idea

Jerry

jwall, the first two that came to my mind were the two you mentioned, 30 WCF and 30-06. Then Dollar threw in the 45 Colt and 45-70. I guess for me it would have to be the two latter as I've shot infinitely more of them than the two 30's. However, I'd bet there's a lot more users of the first two than the latter two.

30-30 and 30-06

22lr because it was everybodys first.

Spot on.

I remember as a kid wanting one so bad I could taste it. I'd even dream about getting a .22 LR. I don't think I've ever wanted anything worse. Now I have one of course and a couple thousand rounds but I seldom bother with it.

30-06

'06 for the win. It's fed millions of us and kept millions more safe from commies and fascists for a long time. No other round in pantheon of American shooting has done anything close!

Probably one of the most important creations which killed many of men and game in the frontier west was the 44-40 Win. A true combo for the man who carried a revolver and a Winchester repeater rifle having the luxury of matching ammo.

30-30 for my money. Not just hunting, but also saw some homefront service through Winchester lever guns issued on the west coast during WW2.

The .44 Henry rimfire should get a mention for setting the stage for later lever guns. As should a .58 Minie... foreign origins aside, one could argue that we wouldn't be "us" in the 20th and 21st centuries without it.

.30-30. Made in America for the uniquely popular American lever action rifle. For decades the phrase "deer rifle" was synonymous in people's minds with a .30-30 lever action and mostly a Model 94.

Lots of others are "American" but I'd vote for the thutty-thutty as the Most American.

Funny!

I SHOULD have been more specific >>> I guess context doesn't mean anything today or HERE>


I was THINKING C F rifles and handguns.

Jerry

.270 and .30/06

My first thought was .30-06, but then settled on the .30-30 for purely historical reasons: the .30-06 was an outgrowth of the 8x57 Mauser, the Ordnance Dept. having necked it down to .30 to suit our "decimal" sensibilities (and then current use of the .30-40 Krag) and lengthened a tad for the powder capacity needed to drive the .30 bullet at the speed we desired. So in that respect the '06 isn't purely an American invention. The .30-30 is.

I guess your right Jerry. Should have been more specific if 22lr isnt exactly what you wanted to hear.

30/06 & 30/30. In Canada it is the 30/30 and .303 British. War surplus. 303's were everywhere as a kid.
None shot well, many had excessive headspace and factory ammo was anemic....it killed moose from sea to sea to sea.

.308 Winchester outsells .30-06 these days and is still actively in use by the military and has been adopted by our allies.

So, I'll give the nod to .308 Winchester, an American icon that lives on, though the corporate accountants and MBA's killed the company.

.45 ACP - John Moses Browning, the greatest designer of all time.

People argue about whether 9mm is good enough, never hear anyone ask that about the .45.

I don't know about anyone else but my first was .410 shotgun.


Jerry

I think you nailed it jwall.

-Jake

.22, .45, 30-30, 30-06, 12 guage. Can't go with just one.

i have never had a .45 tho.

NOT to argue there sharps. I guess living the South and not knowing anyone personally who has travelled to hunt Moose or
Buffalo or Big Bears-----> the 45-70 never came to mind. I know 'some' of its history and it CERTAINLY is American !

Jerry

Most American is very subjective. With that said on pure numbers alone it would be .22LR, 30-30, 30-06, 45 Colt, 12ga

But do pure numbers make it the most American?

gnoahhh, I'm not going to argue with you. I've heard that before from you and 1 other person. I haven't checked it out for myself but I am GOING TO.

My REcollection is that the 06 bagan life as we'd call it....30-03. That was an even longer case than the 8 mouser!

Gnoahh & Cowboy Tim - I know and I ADMIT that I'm PREJUDICED against the German ............. !

I'll get back to you on this.


Jerry

Americas cartridge is 30-06 or 30-30

Gods cartridges are 270 and 25-06

Rimfire would be .22LR

IMO, no it's not the numbers. Obviously the 06 isn't AS popular as it WAS for DECADES.
I'd agree with whoever said the 308 is seeing more use today than the 06. What about 'collectively' over the years ? that's another question. However the 308 is @ 1/2 the age of the 06.

We have many American proprietary cartridges and I'm GLAD.

The 270 Win certainly IS American w/o Question.

Maybe it's my "maturity" , aka age, but when asked or someone mentions 30-06 >>> WW I, WW II, Korea, etc. comes to MY mind.

AMERICAN? Yes Indeed.

Jerry

American Cartridge > not deer cartridge.


Jerry

.30-30 IMHO. Mine has been taking deer since 1951. It claimed an 8 pointer this year. You can certainly make a good argument for several other cartridges, though.

I 'hear' ya Ross ! My question is Where Is It Now ?

American YES, we moved on.


Jerry

wilkes, I haven't touched a 30-30 since 1974.
It IS one of my nominated cartridges tho.


Jerry

gnoahhh, I'm not going to argue with you. I've heard that before from you and 1 other person. I haven't checked it out for myself but I am GOING TO.

My REcollection is that the 06 bagan life as we'd call it....30-03. That was an even longer case than the 8 mouser!

Gnoahh & Cowboy Tim - I know and I ADMIT that I'm PREJUDICED against the German ............. !

I'll get back to you on this.
-----------------------------------------------------------

"Aug 4, 2015 - 30-06 was first known as “U.S. Cartridge, Model of 1903,” and was loaded with a slow-moving 220-grain bullet; the whole package was designed for the Springfield Model 1903 bolt-action rifle. This was all very well and good for two years—until, in 1905, the Imperial German came up with an 8mm mauser"

This is what I found when I did "30-06 origin" Google search.

I'm NO expert and won't base ALL my opinion solely on this but it's what I found.


Jerry

30-30 and 30-06

If we are talking most American CF's I would be inclined to agree with jwall's list. 30-06 has killed many of our foreign enemies. Its a cartridge that we've all probably owned and love (I have two). A close second would be the 30-30. Its fed alot of American's also. The first CF's I bought my kids were all 30-30's. Third would be 45 colt because it's in almost every western and has a neat place in American law/outlaw history. I own one also.

Additional Info 8X57 Mauser


7.92×57mm Mauser
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to navigationJump to search
7.92×57mm Mauser

Place of origin German Empire
Service history
In service 1905–present
.
.
.

The 7.92×57mm Mauser (designated as the 8mm Mauser or 8×57mm by the SAAMI [2] and 8 × 57 IS by the C.I.P.[3]) is a rimless bottlenecked rifle cartridge. The 7.92×57mm Mauser cartridge was adopted by the German Empire in 1903–1905, and was the German service cartridge in both World Wars. In its day, the 7.92×57mm Mauser cartridge was one of the world's most popular military cartridges. In the 21st century it is still a popular sport and hunting cartridge that is factory-produced in Europe and the United States.


Guys -- It seems to me that the 8X57 was BEING developed at the SAME time as our 30-03--30-06.

NO ?


Jerry

jwall, you're only getting the 2nd part of the history of the 8 X 57. The ONLY difference between the 7.92 X 57 you're posting about and the original from 1888 is the bullet diameter. The 8 X 57 beat the -03 by 15 years and the -06 by 18 years. Sorry. In 1905 the German Army changed the bullet diameter from .318 of the original 8 X 57 to .323 and the bullet weight from 220 to 150 grs. The .318 change to .323 has confused most American shooters ever since. The case head, rim and body diameter of the -06 are, for all intents and purposes, identical to the 8 X 57. They were not being developed at the same time. Any cartridge based on the 8 X 57 can be easily made from -06 brass usually simply by resizing and trimming. Many thousands of handloaders have made those modifications of -06 brass, me included, probably millions of times. Rarely will the neck diameter of the formed cartridge need to be reduced.

The 30-06 is indeed derived from the 30-03 which was derived from the 8 X 57. So much so that Mauser took Springfield to court not only over the 1903 rifle but also the spritzer bullet of the 30-06. I am open to correction but I believe Mauser won both cases. I know Mauser won the case over the 1903 for patent infringement and except through WWI, Springfield had to pay Mauser $1.00 per rifle royalty. The bullet law suit I am foggy on but I thought Mauser won it as well.

Truth be told, the Germans were a generation ahead of the Americans in cartridge development until after WWI. Paul Mauser developed what is basically the 6mm Remington in 1899. Wilhelm Brenneke beat the 280 Remington by 38 years. If a person is to be completely honest about it, most popular cartridges can trace their origin to the 8 X 57 Mauser and the 375 H&H Mag.

So, essentially, gnoahh is right. The essentials of the 30-06 are not of American origin. But for cryin' out loud, what is more American than a 30-06?....and I don't really care for the cartridge.

This

O K and I DO remember some of that! Thanks.

.318 yes.

lawsuit, patent infringement, yes.

"spritzer" - NO > spitzer.

Don't tell Gnoahh ..

American Absolutely.







Thank You, as you can see I DID some searching AND my memory has FMD (fading memory disorder)

Jerry

.22 short?

.44 Henry?

.56-56 Spencer?

50 BMG. Nothing says "Murica" bigger and more boldly than a 50 out of a Barrett or M2 Browning.

30 carbine

You are saying this like I disagree with you. Look at my list! I don't own a 30-30 or 06.

50 BMG

30-06 hands down 👍.....Hb

I've been a member of the German Gun Collector's Assn. for either 10 or 11 years and I think it took me the first 9 to get it all straight. The .318 to .323 difference I picked up after only 5 or 6 years. and folks tell me I don't learn quickly....hogwash!

There is a little misunderstanding ‘somewhere’ ?
I was agreeing w/you as well.

Jerry

30-30, or 30-06......and 357 magnum

I just said 45-70 because 30-30 was already out there. But the 45 and 45-70 do have the longest running history of American cartridges that are still popular today.

Yeah, Good call.

Traditional American, yes, 30/30 and 30.06

For modern America, it's the 5.56 and .308.

Go to the range today, everyone has an AR, or two, or twelve.

Two world wars say it's the 30-06. You might heard about em, it was in all the papers.

O K.

I’d bet there are MORE guys who have an 06 than an AR.
I have yet to know anyone personally who owns an AR anything.

Also, it’s been 30 + yds since I saw anyone hunting a 30-30.


Jerry

Don’t forget Korea.

Haha! All in good fun!

I had skipped the .30-03 because I didn't want to muddy the waters- and perhaps not germane to the thread, and probably still isn't but here goes. The only difference between it and the '06 was a bit of neck length- .30-03 neck was .1" longer and originally made so as to best accommodate the standard .30 bullet, a 220 grain RN held over from the Krag. (Look at the neck of a .30-40 Krag next to a .30-06 and their thinking will become apparent.) In 1906 when the 150 grain spitzer at much higher velocity was adopted it was decided that the long neck wasn't needed for that application so it was shortened 1/10"- voila, the .30-06 debuted in its final iteration. (Even though the "new" cartridge could be safely fired in the old chamber they felt a need to shorten all the barrels in use and recut the chambers for the '06 cartridge neck. It was a helluva undertaking because in those three years of service the Armory had batted out a pile of rifles and they all had to be altered. Naturally from that date on Service rifles had the new chamber. It also meant that .30-03 ammo had to be recalled and replaced as the '03 cartridge won't quite fit in an '06 chamber.) And yes, the lawsuits we lost to German concerns really happened and were only abrogated by us going to war against them, and winning it.

I own a bunch of .30-30's (but no Winchester or Marlin lever guns) and a bigger bunch of .30-06's (mostly original Springfields), and I shudder to think of the number of guns in both calibers I've owned over the last 50 years. I would be happy to live out my days with nothing but either one by my side. Perhaps it should be a "King and Queen" dual title as Most American Cartridge"?

Gnoahh

THUMBS UP !!

Jerry

Maybe, but not as lopsided as you might think. Most of the gunnys I hobnob with own '06's, and they also own AR's. I do, and have a ball shooting it.

I still run into a lot of guys toting .30-30's in the deer woods, both young and old. I have a Winchester M54 .30-30 bolt gun that makes it into the woods at least once each year, and a Savage 99G .30-30 that arrived too late last year but will certainly get its share of woods time in the future.

Good point re: the 5.56/.223. About as American as you can get and certainly an icon of the last 60 or so years- but it's still in diapers compared to the other contenders.

270 Win... a caliber unknown to the rest of the non-American world.

22 and 30 cal’s were available elsewhere in the world, not so the .277”

I’ve got a buddy that shoots nice Arkansas bucks just outside Pine Bluff, with a .30-30 Maybe it’s time you give the ol .30-30 a try again.

5.56

Yep. That and the 30-30. 45 Colt and 45 acp get honorary mentions.

Brad got it right!!!

Man, I can't hear ya. grin

Jerry

YES, American NO Doubt:



the 270 does NOT have the World Wide recognition of the 30-06.

Jerry

Fair enough. I guess I misread this.

Maybe it's my "maturity" , aka age, but when asked or someone mentions 30-06 >>> WW I, WW II, Korea, etc. comes to MY mind.

Most American as opposed to foreign or most American in terms of those that are or have been in use in America?

For the former I vote .30-30 and .45-70. Both have been in constant use for over 120 years with the .45-70 in use for over 140. And both are still popular.

For the latter I vote .22LR for first place and second place varies depending on the time frame - .30-06, .308 and .223/5.56 being the top candidates IMHO.

.45 ACP should get an honorable mention.

Geez. Everybody seems to have an AR but me. Everybody I know that's still into guns either has one or did. And that's mostly what I see at the range.

Yeah right. I watch Wild Boar Fever on the Outdoor Channel. Its European hunters and all the hunting is done in Europe and several of them use .270's.

You think so.

moosemike, I don't own an AR and won't. They hold absolutely zero interest for me. I didn't care much for the M-16 in basic training and my opinion hasn't changed since '72.

The 270 does have a certain degree of popularity in Europe, especially Germany and the Scandinavian countries. Of American CF rifle cartridges, the 270 will always be my first choice to use. It's as American as one could ask for but, it still doesn't have the history of the '06 and 30 WCF. I'd kinda like to have an OLD Marlin or '94 in 30 WCF but I have zero desires for an '06 of any stripe. The cartridge has been so studied, researched and fired with so many different loads there's nothing left to learn about it. Anyone tell me what they know about the 8 X 65R Brenneke in a double rifle...…? I just acquired one and there is an entire rifle/cartridge combination of which precious little is known. Most have probably never heard of it or the cartridge for which the rifle was originally chambered, the 8 X 62R Vierordt.

Mike -- I 'think' Brad was talking about the 277 bore BEING unknown WHEN produced. ? ?




Jerry

the 270 does NOT have the World Wide recognition of the 30-06.

Jerry

[/quote]
That right there is funny!

You need to get out more often,Jwall.

Easy pal. really.

I am thinking of the World's exposure to the 06 -> WW I, WW II, Korea.
Plus the hunting exposure OF the 06 long before the 270 got the same.

Plus the 06 was in use before the 270 was produced.


** FOR ALL - I appreciate the 270s uniqueness and qualifications as much as anyone.
I've hunted the 270 FAR more than I have the 06.

That said, I have killed MANY Xs more critters with the 270 than the 06.


Sometimes we don't get to qualify ALL we are thinking AND we don't have space to write books HERE> grin.

No Offense Ken >> None Taken

Jerry

For a rifle cartridge I'll go with the 30-06 SPRG - it's both a great military and a great hunting cartridge.
For a handgun cartridge I'll go with the 45 ACP - it's battle proven and a terrific self-defense round.

44-40, 06, 45 colt, 45-70 and 22lr all good choices. But in the end, it doesnt get any more american than a 30-30 model 94.

Gotta be the winner.

Well my nomination would be the .30 WCF or/and the .45 ACP. As far as the .277" bore being unknown to the rest of the world, I think I remember Winchester swiped it from China. And the .30'03/1903 Springfield was brought about because the 7x57 in Mauser rifles that the Spanish used gave us a problem in Cuba against our .30-40 Krag. Fun reading, Carry on.

The point isn't that the 270 isn't a world-wide cartridge (it is), but at the time of its unveiling in 1925 it was unknown.

I would have thought that would be self evident, but I guess after being on the campfire almost 20 years I should know everything needs to be spelled out c.a.r.e.f.u.l.l.y.

Indeed.

My bad.

Good grief...it only took me two days to catch my typo....lol! You are correct, spitzer.

And, it remains true the Germans were a generation ahead of the US in cartridge development until after WWI and well into the 20's. Cartridges the US was thinking newe well into the 1950's had been developed in Germany before the turn of the century. Like it or not, it's true. The same holds true of optics. DURING WWI the US went around the barn through Sweden trying to buy German rifle scopes....then thought better of trading with a country you have sanctions against. The medium of exchange was to be food.

You wouldn’t believe how often I find something in a post that I LEFT out
or didn’t say LIKE I was thinking !!

Sometimes my fingers don’t type what I told them to type.
That’s really true.

Jerry

Yes....and ordinarily I proof read my posts...and STILL miss typo's or get thoughts and letters bakcwrads…..lol!

Rifle: 45-70 and/or 30-30

Handgun: 45Colt and/or 45ACP (Get a dual cylinder Single Action revolver and be extra extra American!)

When I think of "most American" I think 30-30.

Thanks Guys for your participation and contributions.

As I said in the OP, we are blessed to have MANY 'American' cartridges. Of all that have been mentioned
TWO had not come to my mind. And Great American Cartridges they are.

45 Colt and 44-40.

We've had a lot of participation in a short couple of days & 9 pages.

Thank You

Jerry

30/30 Winchester. Most American cartridge used for the most American game, deer!
Not the sexiest, most powerful, most handloaded, most sought after, or often chambered in bolt action rifles, but the most American round.
I’ve had two Ruger No.1 rifles in 30/30 (still have one), and have a Browning 1885 in 30/30. I had two Remington 788’s in 30/30, maybe 3 or 5 Handi Rifles in 30/30, and maybe a half dozen pre safety Marlin and Winchester lever guns in 30/30.
The 30/30 is a fine round for what it is, despite the few things it ‘won’t’ do!

Hands down it is the 30-06. Our great American military used it to defeat evil around the world and then came home to hunt every critter in North America with it. If fed it the right bullet and load it handedly kills deer and every thing else in between including the big bears of Alaska.

It's case spawned many other cartridges, from the 25-06 Remington, .270 Win., 280 Rem., .338-06, .35 Whelen up to the .400 Whelen and their improved versions. It is and will always be a good choice for any riflemen and the super bullets we now have made it even better.

If I ever have only one centerfire big game rifle it will be chambered for the great 30-06!

Maybe the 45 Colt.
30-06, 308, 223, 50 BMG.....

Maybe they are American, but they are common everywhere.
The most American Cartridge needs to be popular, but only
in America.

Rifle I'd say .308, pistol I'd say 45 LC

Don’t change the GIST of the thread. NO one said ONLY in USA.

The Mausers are known .....
The mmmS are known......

Most American Cartridge does NOT matter WHERE it’s used.

Jerry. < O P.

And yet, it remains the offspring of the equally great and equally as historic 8 X 57 as is any cartridge derived from the '06.

Wee gnu u ment butt mebe u shud lye offa da spritzers?

.22LR
.223/5.56
.30-30
.308 Win
.30-06
.357 Mag
.44 Mag
.45ACP
.45 Colt
.45-70
.50BMG

That would be my current list of "most American" cartridges.

In previous eras the list would have been quite different as many of these didn't exist.

We heard you the first time.

Beside the 8X57 AIN'T American ! !


Remember I done tole ya that I'm PREJUDICED !


Jerry

Hey C H ! No 270 Win...... NO 7mm RM.... NO 458 Win ?
Huh what's up with that ? <smile>

Jerry

I don't see how the 30-06 can be the "most" American round... the caliber was universal at the time, the only difference was the case.

I'm sticking with my case (pun intended) for the 270... it takes "The" American 30-06 case further, giving it a truly American caliber.

5.56

FIRST - Brad, I am NOT arguing about it w/you. really.




In the OP ^^ I said what do YOU think. That's FINE, it's what you think.

-------------------------------------

I said 'Cartridge' not caliber. NO PROBLEM

MY opinion includes the World Wide exposure the 30-06 had in the W W s, and Korea.

NO other round, even 308, has represented AMERICA like the 06.

WE are allowed to have different OPINIONS. All is GOOD.


Jerry

45-70?

...[/quote]

Wee gnu u ment butt mebe u shud lye offa da spritzers?
[/quote]

We desperately need a "like" button.

I agree wholeheartedly and I did, 11 years ago Oct.13th. Maybe that's my problem?

Jerry –

Realized I had unintentionally omitted the .45 Colt, so I went back and added it.

Not saying anything about men that use the .270 Win, but I bought one for Daughter #1.

My first centerfire was a 7mm RM and it will be one of the last to go. The .458 WM is another good one but I don’t think I’ve ever seen a hunter carrying one.

The list was getting a little long so none of them made it. The .257 Roberts, .270 Win and 7mm RM would probably be next up (not necessarily in that order) if I decided to add to the list.

If you asked this question around the end of the 19th century the answer would have been 45 Colt. There were two guns made specifically for the caliber so that you wouldn't have to buy any other ammo in a different caliber.

I read this and laughed at myself - I've had a Ruger Blackhawk with both cylinders since the mid to late 1990's and have never even put the 45 ACP cylinder in it - I guess I ought to fix that!

Most American? 30wcf. (30/30)

with respect to our World War 2,Korean war,Viet Nam American Soldiers- 30-06 / 45 ACP ,308 WIN.,.223Rem.,12 gauge ,50 BMG

and now our American Soldiers are sent to those dang sand countries > 223/556,308 Win.,300 Win.Mag,50 bmg, 45 ACP

my vote would be >45ACP the most American Cartridge <

If anyone has an 1873 Colt or Winchester they want to part with let me know.

I would have to say 45 ACP and 30/06, as much as I admire the 45 Colt and 45/70.

If there's any doubt, just keep the same shellholder in the press and load both.. .

The original Henry and Winchester levers weren't chambered in .45 colt (came later)... so to a large extent the one cartridge on your belt for two guns is a myth (as was the quick draw holster itself in the late 19th century).

Once the army adopted it, you were just as likely to find 45SW (for a Schofield #3) tucked into a belt as an 1873 Colt SA.

A myth except for the 44-40, 38-40 and 32-20.



5.56

Yes and no. I don't think those were being referenced, just the 45 colt. Anyhow, the 32-20 wasn't around in 60, 66, or 73. It's really the 44-40 that did a lot of the work and then 45LC swooped in and stole all of the glory.

Edit (added): 44-40 beginning in 73. Prior, 44 Henry. But I think it was much more common to have a cap/ball gun converted to 44-40 or 44 colt than 38-40 in the mid to late 1870s.

.44 Cap and ball conversions were mostly .44 Henry and .44 Colt.

Yea edited to add 44 colt right after the original post. My understanding is that once you got a couple models of Winchesters using centerfire cartridges, conversion to Henry rimfire tailed off significantly.

Overall, the prevalence of shootists relying on pistols -- or at least the ones we imagine -- is somewhat overblown. Most towns had anti-carry ordinances, so bull dogs. belly guns, etc, were more common. Cowhands often weren't allowed to wear guns on the trail (stampede risk). Metallic cartridges were expensive; no one practiced; most weren't great shots (exceptions: Hardin, Hickok, etc.) and preferred long guns if possible.

The .30-30 Winchester is the most American cartridge and most commonly chambered in the most American rifle, the lever action.

I would say .30-06 would get my vote.
It's 114 years old, fought and helped win wars on several continents and can be easily/cheaply purchased all over North America.

It might not be the sexiest but it checks a lot of boxes

Yeah puah, the 06's little sister.

I rate the 06 higher because it's NEARLY twice its age.


Jerry

jwall:
Top of the morning to you sir, I hope this finds you and yours well, warm and dry on this second last Saturday of February.

While it's most likely breaking several written and unwritten 'Fire rules, I have indeed read all the posts in this thread and have what I believe is a slightly different take on a few of the origins of the cartridges mentioned. Please understand as well that I'm not a professional historian, more like a serious student of it and all things arms related along with that.

Great Britain adopted the .303 British in 1888 and since they were at that time the "empire whereupon the sun did not set" they got to use it in many far flung corners of the globe. As was common practice in those times, US military observers were present at a few of the dust ups, went home and made reports on same and that gave input into the US developing a repeating rifle for it's military.

One doesn't have to look very long at a .30-40 Krag cartridge beside a .303 British to see the lineage - or at very least admit the similarity.

Of special note I would say would be the Spanish American war of 1898 and the Boer Wars beginning in 1899 where both armies found the rimmed cases of the .30-40 Krag - for the US troops that had one and still didn't have a .45-70 Springfield - and the .303 British came up lacking when compared to the 7x57 Mauser cartridge which the Spanish and Boers used in 1895 Mausers with deadly effect.

The British were in the throws of developing their own 7mm cartridge with a more Mauser than not Enfield rifle and the US lengthened and blew out the 7x57 in order to keep the same diameter bullet as the .30-40 had, but in the 1903 Springfield which again was Mauser if you said it fast, more or less...

When WW1 broke out the British abandoned the experimental cartridge and eventually the Enfield Pattern 14 as well, but the US of course had the powerful, albeit a bit long .30-06 up and running and the rest is history.

Therefore - I'd say that to answer your question, I'd likely nominate either of the .45 military rounds - .45-70/.45 LC as most American martial round or as Brad noted the .270 Winchester for a sporting round as it wasn't really something seen elsewhere.

As always, it's just a few random thoughts from a Canuck and nothing more sir, but thanks for generating some interesting opinions on this thread.

All the best to you and yours as the days get longer.

Dwayne

https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/308-win-vs-30-06/

30-06

Pros:

Can use heavier bullets
Velocity is slightly higher due to more powder capacity
Many reloading options with larger shell casing and wider range of bullet weights

Cons:

Needs a long action rifle
Rifles are slightly heavier
Fewer options in semi-auto rifles
Less accurate at longer ranges
Ammunition is more expensive
Costs more to reload



308

Pros:

Fits in short action rifles
Rifles can be made lighter due to shorter cartridge length
There are many more options in semi-auto rifles chambered in .308
Slightly more accurate at long ranges
Factory ammunition is less expensive
Cheaper to reload


Cons:

Cannot use heavier bullets
Lower powder capacity


Conclusion:


The argument of the .308 vs .30-06 has been raging for decades and is still a hot topic on some shooting and hunting forums. For the most part, it’s guys and gals just sticking up for their cartridge of choice. The reality is, when looking at factory loads of the two cartridges, is that they are much more similar than they are different. From our research, there is nothing that jumps out at us to choose one of the other. And you know what the greatest part of all of it is?

You can have both.

If you have to decide between the two, so be it, but if you can, get some experience with both. They are great cartridges, and there is a reason they have been a mainstay in the shooting and hunting world for decades with no end in sight.

Define "The Most American Cartridge".

30-06

Afternoon Dwayne.

Thanks for your post and qualifiers.

In the op which you quoted I said we are privileged to have MANY cartridges that are particular to America.

I chose and said, IMO, the 30-06 is the most American IN RELATIONSHIP to it use over the years in BOTH W Ws
and Korea. AND on top of all that it became not only an American hunting cartridge but is/has been hunted around the world.

Later someone mentioned the 45 Colt that I had not thot of and it certainly deserves consideration.


As I closed the OP I also said, "What do you think would be the Most American Cartridge?"
There really is NO wrong answer, but IMO some suggestions range far from the original idea.

All of us are entitled to our OWN opinion.
Thanks again and I hope you and we all have a GREAT year playing & hunting with our CHOICE of weapons.

Jerry

I read your longer answer & reasons.

Since there is NO wrong answer, you’re good.

ATST, I like my answer better. LOL. LOL

Thnx

Jerry

Elmer Keith verifies everything you said in Sixguns by Keith.

I didn't know Keith had a six gun book, but it just got ordered on Amazon. Thanks for the heads up. I teach a class about the western frontier on film, so we talk a lot about fact vs. fiction vs. myth in the Old West.

It's a good book. You'll like it. He clears up a lot of misconceptions.

Since we are a nation of immigrants, this only stands to reason.

jwall;
Good evening to you sir, thanks for the reply and further thoughts on the matter, I appreciate both for sure.

Honestly when answering I was being a tad on the side of devil's advocate as for years I personally hunted with an '06 so am fully aware of it's capabilities as a hunting round. Here in BC, I've taken black bear, sheep, mulie and whitetail bucks with it as well as helped cut and wrap moose who died in front of an '06. In Africa I was witness to game as large as a decent cape buffalo bull and a good sized zebra stallion taken with a single .30-06 round each too.

I'd also opine that if one was going to travel the backwaters of the world, one would be able to scrounge up ammo for a .30-06 in a sporting goods store or outfitter's tool box more than any other given round.

Truly local favorites might be in the backwater stores too, so when I was a kid in very rural Saskatchewan one would find .30-30, .303 British and .30-06 - as well as Imperial branded .22 rimfire if they had any ammo for sale at all.

When in Kenya in 1975, the chap we were visiting used a .30-06 for most hunting and shot his .458 less both because of the cost and availability of good ammo - which had to be factory ammo then by the way.

Anyway that's just a couple examples from a Canuck who paid attention to such things since I was able to read. Funny how we don't always change that much over half a century is it not?

Thanks again for the thread and all the best to you folks once again sir.

Dwayne

5.56

^^^^^^^^ is on P 11

I’m wondering now how many times you’ve entered. ??

Jerry

You know sharps that you CAN make 8X57 cases from 06

You CAN NOT make an 06 case from 8X57.

Think about it.

Jerry

5.56

Really !, I'd never have guessed ! LOL


Jerry

Yes sir, I am fully aware of that and it holds no significance for me. What'd I do...get my mind in front of my fingers again and get it backwards? One of them is slowing down, maybe/probably both!

Rifle: 30-06 or 308
Pistol: 45acp
All around: 22lr

excellent answer ! AGREE X2

I'm going with the 6.5 Swede.

Yeah I'm all in on that too.

Yeah Jerkpole, Real American.

Jerry

I've read through most of the responses and I think most people answered as to what they believe is the most common cartridge people would have in America.

For me when I think about what makes America or something American I think of the American West and our popular culture. This would be clear to us and those abroad. To represent that I think you would have to look at the repeating lever action rifle, single action revolver, and something like the Weatherby Mark V. So the cartridges I choose to represent that would be 30 30 Winchester, 45 Colt, and the 300 Weatherby Magnum.

The 30-30 shows the epitome of the lever at a time when smokeless had come into play. The 45 Colt made the jump from black powder to smokeless and still has a hold in it's place. Nothing says look at me quite like the 300 Weatherby did in it's day. Just my 2 cents.

Well, then: .458 American.

7mm Express

300 WinMag. Because it's WinMaggier than a 30-06.

7mm STW. Loses points for the metric designation, but gains them for shilling a gun rag.

25 Souper. Can't go wrong with a cartridge that has a comfort food in its name. Someone needs to invent the 264 Grilled Cheeser.

Jerkpole?? That's not very nice Jerry, it sounds like something one of your kids would say.

In fact, most of your posts sound like they were written by one of Jerry's kids.

I like where your heads at. Tell me more about this grilled cheeser of yours. Are you thinking belted, or rimmed? I'm working on a 27 Frito Pie. 27 Frito for short. Its a necked down 30-378 wby and then cut down 2 inches. You know, for shorter bolt throw because thats what everybody seems to be into.

The 264 Grilled Cheeser has to be based off the latest and greatest, because, you know, that's what all the cool kids are doing. The new 277 Furry. Neck that puppy down to make it more Creedmoory.

Really, Smokey. Huh, I thot you’d recognize

That’s LAUGH to help you understand I was joking !

I said earlier that I don’t have a problem with you.
YOU are the one who resorts to INSULTS.

Okay, Smokey I’ll not respond to / or about you.
Let’s get on with our lives without each other.
I don’t have time to explain humour or innuendo.

Have a goodun Smokey.

Jerry

The following is from the O P.
I thot I expressed the purpose of this discussion. ? maybe not ?

Per usual, some don't read even the OP and jump into the middle or end of a discussion w/o understanding the concept.


I was not asking about the most commonly used cartridge. The 06 probably is not that today > given the proliferation of
cartridges & rifles SINCE 1906.

"Foreign", which don't qualify, includes the M Ms, 7X57, 6.5X , 8X57, et.al.

I was asking What Cartridge REPRESENTS America the most, NOT only in America but around the World.
Maybe that was not clearly expressed ?

Every ONE OF US is entitled to our own opinion. NO problem.

This thread is OFF Rail and has Crashed. Y'all carry on.

Jerry

Sorry Jerry, I thought it was pretty obvious I was joking, even without a smiley face.

OKAY, but I do not see any indication of humor.....




But if you say you were kidding I'll accept it. seriously.

I don't like nor look for trouble or fussing. All is good !

Jerry