Ok! Lets see your smoothies! Here's an updated photo of my Fusil de Chasse I put together from an old Centermark kit about 20 years ago. The pouch I use is a late 17th/early 18th century military "Giberne" I copied from an illustration in Diterot's Encyclopedia. The flask or "pulverin" was made for me by Idaho hornsmith Lloyd Moler. I traded him a native style twined bag for it.
It is a nice firearm to tote in the woods! If you have a smoothbore, lets see it!

I savvy that a smooth bore is a musket without rifling, but not a shotgun, but designed for shooting a single patched projectile, correct?

What is a fowler?

All in how yoj wanna use the word. Technically, (smoothbores) are all considered a musket. The archaic french term for flint was fusil Its have changed sine the 17th century to mean a type of firearm. A musket has become a military weapon. A fusil can be a light musket. As can a carbine. Then you can get into musketoons, which is shorter. Bore diameter can also come into play in ththe discription. Musket bore, carbine, bore pistol bore. It can get complicated between 17/18th century terminology and collectors parlance. Fowler is basically an English term for like gun.

For practical purposes theres really no difference in a fowler and this fusil. Since mine is a "fusil de chasse" (hunting fusil)".They can both be used for shot or ball. Currently say in France a rifle may be refered to as a carabine and a shotgun a fusil.

A while back we had a thread on smoothrifles. It can get complicated

Never fear! Someone will be along shortly to correct me!!

I have shot my Centermark "fusil de Chase" with both shot and patched ball. They are great guns, and very accurate you just got to get that head position consistent. That is a nice set up great to see that level of craftsmanship.

My English .62 smoothbore / 20 gauge fowler. Although I guess it is more rifle since I had the rear sight added.
It's jug choked to modified and has accounted for two turkeys and a multitude of squirrels. One turkey fell at 32 yards...
She hasn't accounted for a deer yet, but she will place a ball well enough that I wouldn't hesitate to take a 100 yard shot with her.
Bag, knife sheath and horn made by me, knife was forged by Ben Hoffman

Nice rig htredneck! I stuck a small brass rearsight on my gun too! There was a french gun excivated at the Tunica Indian site at Haynes Bluff on the Mississippi. ( Tunica Archaeology, Peabody museum pub. Harvard Univ. ). It had a small brass rear sight on it too! So I kinda copied it. Makes a big difference.

Nice set up!

I enjoy shooting mine Pashooter! Grandsons wanna do a squirrel hunt after deer season. Suppose i'll pack mine along. . I carry a little cloth bag of wasps nest for wadding! Works great! Doesnt burn. Dissipates when fired.

Ok, tell me about single projectiles for a 62 caliber smooth bore, how you patch etc etc.


I can appreciate the dual functionality of something

Well, you can patch them just like you do for rifle shooting. You be surprised how well they may shoot. But I've shot a bunch just using a wad above and below the ball with pretty good effect! You can use a fiver wad over powder and a card wad over ball. But like I stated above, I use a lot of old wasp nest with good result as wadding. Because its convenient for me and works pretty well too.

Patched RB is probably the method most used tho.

A short story,

About 25-30 years ago acquaintenance calls me, "hey! Drive up and we'll have a flintlock weekend at my lease!" Ok, only flinter i owned at time was a Northwest trade gun. (These were the salad days of our family). Smoothbore 20 ga. But i had no .59/.60 calibre ball. I come up with 1/2 box of .440 round ball. So off I go! I load 4, .440 round balls in front of 70 grains fffg. I get me a spot behind this roch where i can watch a trail. Old doe comes alone. I aim and fire. Doe jumps straigh upand I watch blood shoot out of her neck! She hit ground drt!!! Hit her with all 4 balls. One hit juglar I guess. She bled out fast!

Edit!

Been thinking. This was ever bit 35 years ago and the NW gun was a 24 gauge! And i had no .570 ball for it! . Wished I had that gun back!!!

Great story KW. I’d imagine the 62 cal smooth rifle was pretty danged useful. Fowl and Big Game capable. Pretty danged neat.

There was such a wide variety of smoothbore firearms back in the day. Many made for the indian trade. It is a pretty safe bet that if one was to single out a certain firearm that saw the most use in North America, the smoothbore trade gun pretty much fills the bill. Some form of that old gun has been in use by white and red man since the latter part of the 17th century on. Gone thru a few modifications over the decades but pretty much the same gun. And still used by some of us today.

A bunch of them floating around Africa and being used every day now, too.

Speaking of which, I wonder what ever happened to that 4 bore African Settler's smoothbore that Crossfireoops restored? That one was a hoot to shoot!

Ed

I had one of those 6 bore Belgian made African Trade guns like Stoeger used to sell! Noticed Simpson's Ltd had one a while back too.

Quality was a bit questionable.

Dixie solld em too! As An elephant gun! LOL

If one were to look for a 20 bore (62 caliber) that is PERCUSSION, where would one look? I'm not doing a flint.

A custom gun. As most you see are flint. Contact Matt Avance here;

http://www.tennesseevalleymuzzleloading.com

He may be able to build you something like that! .

This would be a good place to start.

There are scads of others out there that could also put something together for you. Watxh the Contemporary Longrifle Assn. Website too!

I'd think a good piece of wood that long is not exactly easy to come up with. Beautiful arms indeed.

A pair of type "G's" for Birdwatcher! Courtesy of Clay Smith, gunmaker.

They are very sweet fusils to pack in the woods! Light!!!!



I know a Creek fellow who sports one like this one below!

I can attest to the beauty of htr's fowler. That is one nice piece.

At the moment I'm without a fowler or any kind of smoothbore M/L. I want to rectify the disparity but the right one hasn't popped up! Anyone sitting on a 16 bore they don't want?

The first gun I built was a track of the wolf fowler. It's a functional debacle, but accuracy wise it shoots about a foot and a half high at 25 yds. It's on my back burner list of projects but one day I'll wack 8 or 10" off the barrel and see what happens. Worst case I can burn the wood to stay warm and use the parts for something else. May have to lose the barrel at sea however.

Steelhead, in the latter part of the 19th century many of the old trade guns were converted to percussion. Any builder selling guns could pull that off.

"Steelhead, in the latter part of the 19th century many of the old trade guns were converted to percussion. Any builder selling guns could pull that off"

Piece of cake! A bit cheaper too!

I'm mulling and reading.

The pragmatic in me can appreciate being able to sling a 62 caliber ball or a load of shot at something.

FYI, last wild turkey i kilt was with a buck & ball load. 1 ball & 4 buckshot. Was shooting at top half of bird and hit him with one buckshot pellet in neck. About 25 yds. So you see you can shoot both at onced! LOL

Buck and ball was popular at Gettysburg. It is on at least a few monuments. 2 linked below. I remember a tour guide talking about the importance of the 69 caliber holding Culps hill. Some companies wanted to keep the smoothbore over the 58 caliber rifle.

https://www.hmdb.org/Marker.asp?Marker=27592

http://gettysburg.stonesentinels.co...lvania/more-90th-pennsylvania-monuments/

Thanks Terry! Yeah seems I remember reading that several militia units (New York popped into my head) were issued M1842's or 69 cal rifle muskets of that ilk and buck and ball ctgs. And hurried to the front!

kiaywoodie,

Fyi, many a Billy Yank & Johnny Reb went to war with a Revolutionary War BROWN BESS or a CHARLEYVILLE in 1861-62.
(One of those Johnny Rebs was a 16YO PVT from our family, who didn't HAVE a firearm, couldn't report for MO State service unarmed, so his father bought him a Bess for TWENTY FIVE CENTS. = A letter home from January 1862 indicates that he had "picked up" a modern rifled-musket from the battlefield. - The letter does not indicate the kind of RM.)

Smoothbore muskets, converted to percussion, were used throughout TWBTS for naval service/repelling boarding parties by the USN/CSN

yours, tex

Lots of refurbished firearms went theu the Tyler arsenal. The muskets N B Tanner's manufacturing facility from here in Bastrop were of such poor quality the Texas legislature decided not to issue them to state troops but instead give them to friendly local Indians. In turn the Indians would not even take them. It is speculated they were reworked Belgian muskets. There are no known survivors.

The most interesting military muskets i know of here, at least to me were the Model 1816/35 US Musket contracted to the republic of Texas from Tryon Pennsylvania. There was one found in the carraige house of the Pease mansion in Austin way back in the 50's or 60's when it was going thru a refurb. It had been converted to Percussion. Victor Fredericks, a local gun collector had it reconverted to flint. It is still floating around somewhere im sure.

I'm with you, a Hunter in NC used to post pics of Deer and squirrel the same day from a smoothbore 62. Now that I am in PA with its late Flinter season I am looking at the same. We also have a late turkey that hits the same week as Bear and right before Buck season so added fun. He has a very nice custom we discussed. I believe TVM made it and I wouldn't doubt they could do a Cap. I would prefer a Cap as well but season here is Flinter only.

I have an older trade gun that when I was a kid my dad helped me make from a kit. As far as accuracy goes it was not accurate enough to make me happy even at the age of 12 when it was built. I'm 50 now. After a year or so, my dad took it to a friend who had a press. We bent the barrel and it is now as accurate as I need for deer hunting out to 60 yards. 60 is a stretch but it is accurate now. I love that gun. I owned it from the age of 12 until I sold it to a friend when I was in my early 30's. I needed the money back then. I bought it back from him about 3 years ago and took it deer hunting this year for first time since I got it back. I did not get any shots, but I sure had a good time taking it hunting. I am looking forward to hunting again with it next year.

Now! This my friends, is a damn cool story!!! Thanks for posting!

Just put my thinking cap on and realized I have a 54 caliber Renegade that I don't use. Now to see if I can find a 20 bore barrel for it.

I'm loosing interest fast. Fugging everything you look is Flintlock, apparently you have to dress up and use flintlock if you want a smoothbore barrel. Finding one for the Renegade is a royal pain in the ass too.

That was fine, back to inlines.

If I happen to run across something, i'll always holler at you. But I think you had right idea on replacement smooth barrel for Renegade.

I dont pay much attention to whats available for commercial built guns and I dunno if one of the barrel companies offer a drop in smooth you can get. Havta check on that!

I have read instances where people have purchased replacement barrels pretty cheap, or used the one they have, and had a gunsmith do their thing.
The .54 is 28 bore in a smooth, and the 20 bore is .62 so that Renegade would lose some weight also.

I've lost interest. Green Mountain DID at one time make 62's but they stopped those shenanigans.

Neighbor has a smoothbore double percussion. The wad was 14 gauge. It looks interesting to say the least. Not sure how it compares to a 20 gauge/62 cal or if he can get PRB or Conicals for it. Might do a post deer season hunt for grouse and hare. One more week to hunt Deer.

Here is the Sitting Fox kit I built. .54/28 ga. I shoot both shot and patched ball.

[img]https://flic.kr/p/22gfeR1[/img]

Very nice Jeff! Nice gobbler too!!!

My Fusil de Chasse by Centermark, a good shooter with either ball or shot



This next gun is Two-Fer, a 20ga smoothbore with one of the two deer it killed with one shot on it's maiden hunt. The ball past through this deer and killed another on the other side.



The two deer that Two-Fer killed

Well done Longhunter! Nice lefty! FYI. I have personally held an original left hand French fusil lock that came out of one of the Tunica sites in Marksville Louisiana approx 50 years ago! It is in a private collection. There was another LH fusil found at another Tunica site on the Mississippi at Haines Bluff Miss. by Harvard Univ.

Interesting,

Big bird with my Tulle



Another big Tom with the Tulle

If you don't have a good beagle and a smoothbore flintlock to hunt rabbits then you don't know what you're missing. My beagle Dolly brought this cottontail around in front of my 28ga smoothbore loaded with #5 shot



This one was taken earlier in the season with a 20ga flintlock and #5 shot

Great pics Longhunter!! And a swell pup!!!

I just wished I could get out in the woods!!!!

"Deep Winter" ( relative term here) rendezvous is weekend afternext down here. Haven't been in almost 15 years!!! Know the booshway real well. We've hunted together. And it's only about 60 miles from the house. Gonna try and go!!

Steelhead; TC made the Renegade in a .56 smoothbore for a while. Massachusetts had a deer hunting regulation regarding primitive arms season where a rifle had to be flintlock but if you wanted to use a caplock it had to be a smooth bore. TC responded to their crazy neighbor with a smooth bore version of the Renegade. I don't know if one of those barrels might be available somewhere but thought it could be another option. Good hunting.

I have a Navy Arms English style 12 gauge percussion double I absolutely love. perfect for grouse squirrels etc. Not sure how to upload a picture unfortunately....

Just finished a refurb on my old Northstar West brand Light Infantry (English) fusil. It’s like a 2/3 scale Brown Bess musket. When I get opportunity I’ll post a pic. May be a day or two.

It's still 'tickling' me.

Please forgive crappy pic.

That looks great!

Thanks Jim. I let the brown "cook" the barrel a bit more before killing it. Worked good in our humidity here. And even tho its a walnut stock, I aquafortised it then burnished it with my heat gun to get the aged black color. That stuff is still reacting with the wood too making it darker. Then my BLO mix on the wood. It’s curing nicely.

Comin up turkey season real soon, can't wait to get after em again.



This is my first smoothbore that I've had since 79, a 12ga English Fowler built for me my Jud Brennan. It's accounted for it's share of birds, deer and rabbits

Very nice Longhunter!!!!! Very nice!!!

Very cool, both of you guys.

Thank you. Here's another picture of the 12ga fowler



And another

This one was taken with a Jackie Brown 20ga that I let a friend talk me out of.



These birds were taken with flintlock smoothbores

Damnedest thing, very nice.



Is the amount of shot similar to a hunting shell, or do you increase it some with a muzzle loader?

Jim,

Sometimes I’d shoot equal volumes powder and shot. Other time I’d shoot a measure of powder and then a measure and a half of shot.

Usually worked out well.

Sounds like a damn riot!

If I get one, do I have to dress up too?

Those pictures should really be tintypes.

Agreed, they would look great.

I've been searching the web a bunch today for a smoothbore.

Scott, have you looked at Track of the Wolf for a smoothbore? LINK

Ed

You don't have to but it adds to the fun and helps set the mood

Here's Ol' Two-Fer the 20ga smoothbore that took two deer with one shot. It took this Bison with 80gr's of 2ff behind a 595 patched round ball went in one side and out the other.

Dressin up makes it more fun.

Very interesting gentlemen. I just wish all the pics worked. (Some are broken).

They all show on my screen...

Page 1 pics are broken for me.

Been admiring that one by Tom Greco for several weeks that Track has. But too much for my broke azz. I have one of his his huntng pouches. He’s quite the craftsman!

Here’s mybfirst one from page one again. My Fusil de chasse.



Hope it works.

It does, sir. Thank you. I can't afford them, but I love the older guns. My oldest would be a Sterlingworth SXS 12ga. More than 100 years old.

Old Sterlingworths were a great gun!!!!

I hunt with it each year, as well. I have a modern muzzleloader, but nothing like you gentlemen use. Fascinating.

As for dressing the part

Many years ago in a galaxy far, far away,,,,,,

On the set of "The Patriot"

I did some work in the movies as well. Army of Darkness, China Beach, Murder She Wrote, and a few others. But I never got to use a smooth bore. Perhaps one day. I have a customer that crafts some might pretty muzzleloaders.

No, you don't have to dress up for the hunt. But I do enjoy dressing in period clothing for those type of events.

I wonder if JES or someone could rebore the 54.
It would easy remove the rifling, and you definitely have enough steel.
Might need to grind a cutter. Be interesting if one of the small barrel makers would do it.
But, they are busy making barrels that earn them more money, than "cool" projects.

Bobby Hoyt in Fairfield PA, could ream a 54 Thompson to 62. I think he charges 50 bucks plus shipping. He does first class work.
717 624 6696. He does not do internet, you have to get him on the phone. He is always busy, so call often to get in.

Dillonbuck,

Fyi, most ANY competent machine shop can "create a smoothie" easily, quickly & at (generally) a LOW price.
(About 5 years ago a local shop "reamed out" a BADLY PITTED .58 caliber ML barrel on a rifle that I "bought for peanuts": at a garage sale. - A&M charged me 25.oo for the simple job.)
Shoots FINE, too for bunnies/bushytails/etc. as a shotgun.

While I'm one of "Jessie's fans", I don't see any good reason to not use a local shop for this simple job. - Local blacksmiths in the 18th/19th century routinely performed that job & W/O modern equipment.

just my opinion, tex

Yep, this is what I was thinking as I read through this whole thread.

I have a precarved Lehigh stock with a 54-cal Green Mountain inlet into it. I'm contemplating calling up Bob Hoyt and seeing what it could be as a smoothbore.

I run a 62 rifle for deer, so a smoothbore wouldn't be a bad thing to have on hand.

Great pics in this thread. Love it!

Hey gang, isn’t this original German Fusil a peach!!!



Just found the pic surfing around and thought I’d share!

.

Ok, I had to bling up my fusil too! Made it a bit more Krautish!

New swivels, sideplate and triggerguard.

I guess I'm ruint because the only time I'm interested in a 'smoothie'....is when I'm shooting mallards over decoys!!

It’s ok Sharpy!! I know folks get much enjoyment outta shooting ducks and more power to em. I know its big sport in Louisiana. They out doing what they like and having a great time. Nothing against em. But a duck is one of three critters I just can’t get excited about hunting. No interest at all.



In case you’re wondering the other two critters on my care less list are javelinas and turkeys.