My daughter should draw a ML bull tag this year in CO, so we have a few rules to play by. No smokeless powders, no pellets, no optics, and full bore .50 caliber projectiles or larger diameter. I would also prefer her not to use a sidelock rifle, opting for a inline ignition system. To me I'm not worried about traditional, I'm wanting her best chance to drop a bull at 100-150 yards before she graduates high school.

I'm not real experienced with ML rifles, I've only killed a couple does with patches round ball out of a cheap synthetic sidelock rifle. I did try to upgrade a few years ago to an NEF sidekick, but accuracy has been less than stellar, +3" at 100 from sandbags. I've considerd going to a shorter front post and aperture rear sight trying to improve accuracy, but a new rifle isnt out of the question. I simply chose ML for her due to higher % of elk at that time, longer days, and better weather.

TC Impact, believe midway has them on sale for $199. The use 209 ignition, has a built in stock spacer you can remove to shorten LOP. Good sights from the factory, made by Williams, fiber optic.

3” at 100 yards isn’t that bad given the size of an elks vital area.
My daughters use 80 grains of BH209 with a saboted 250 grain bullet for deer, that works fine out to 100ish yards. A full bore bullet would be somewhat heavier than that I think?

For Colorado I for sure would stay away from TC brand.

I'd highly suggest a non thumb hole - CVA Optima or a CVA Wolf with the shorter 24" barrel. These are not heavy rifles and they are excellent open sight shooters and most importantly, CONICAL shooters.

Good info on the CVA’s. I hadn’t really thought about the need for a dedicated conical shooter and twist/rifling. I have shot the Hornady Great Plains conical out of mine, mainly b/c that’s what I use in my Great Plains hunter, and they did pretty good out of the TC. A bugger to get seated though.

taylorce1 pm me and I will send you some 50cal bullets to try

This

Oops

PM incoming

She couldn't handle the recoil of that load, it was 125 grains of BH209 and a 250 grain Aeroflite bullet. At 90 grains that bullet had a lot larger grouping closer around 5" at 100 yards. Plus I maxed out my elevation adjustment and still the group was about 16" low at 100.

Pure BS.I have three. Hawkin, a Black Diamond, and and Impact.I have killed several elk with each of them. For a youth, it's hard to beat that Impact that has the removal 1" of butt. It's light weight and can shoot better than most hunters can.Price isn't bad either. 80 gr of BH209 and either 295 or 348 gr Powerbelt or your other choice of bullets.I have shot 3" or better at 100 yards with that load and I have pretty bad eyes. They all work

sadly its not pure BS. Its all over the web and even TC recommends shooting sabots in their rifles. Will some shoot them? Yes, but due to lack of quality control when they machine the QLA, these are often off center and with conical bullets, the result is an inaccurate conical shooter.

any 50 cal she likes, and 80 grains of 777, with a saboted 230gr (45 acp ) bullet. Yes it will do the job so have your knife sharp.

I don’t think they are allowed to use sabots.

Ok, sorry I missed that part. Try the 50 cal lee real bullet cast from their moulds. 300 grains, 50 cal. Powder charge will be a balance of power, accuracy and recoil tolerance.

Gee,I wonder how all the elk I killed died since TC's are so terrible. All of them have the QLA. Of the the htree I have not one piece of their literature that recommends sabots. When the Hawkins came out, and the QLA, sabots were not even on the market. I am on the third barrel of my Hawkin and they all shot conicals just fine. I have only used sabots once since 1977 for a deer hunt in Nebraska two years ago. If it is all over the web, I sure don't see it on here and a few other sites I visit.

BTW.TC is now part of S&W.

One thing to remember about Pyrodex or 777,they degrade after opening. Don't save any from year to year unless you find a way to seal the canister really well.. Use black powder or BH209

well theres plenty fellers that have issues with them. Its a coin flip, take your chances or go with something that has a good reputation at shooting conicals.

Thank you for the generous offer!



Thank you as well for your generosity!

I bought an old stainless Knight at an auction. Does the deed.

Have you ever actually shot full bore bullets out of a T/C..... or are you just regurgitating crap you heard on the web?

My wife clobbered a CO bull at 90 yards last year with a T/C Impact. The load was 90 grains BH209 under a 295 grain Powerbelt. Interestingly enough.... I killed a bull about 3 minutes before that, also at 90 yards, with a 350 grain Hornsby FBP.... also fired from a T/C Impact (100 gr BH209 behind that one).

My daughter, who’s almost 15 now, has killed several deer in CO with a T/C Triumph... again, shooting PB bullets.

Well my daughter got a Knight Extreme, as we couldn't beat the price.

tay if you want to try some offer still stands

Maybe I am just old-fashioned, but I believe she would feel a lot prouder of the kill now, and more so in the future, if she DID use an old fashioned side lock rifle.

Her first elk is something special. Having the memory of using an old style rifle, and maybe having the rifle mounted on top of the hide or set in the antlers is going to be a lot better with a wood stocked side-lock then a plastic stocked scoped gun.

But that's just how I feel. She may not feel that way.

The very best advice I could give it to simply let her try both and ask her what she likes.

Id vote one of those Knight Littlehorns. Load some no excuse conicals in it. I have an old mk85 that shoots them very well. Put her a Williams peep on the back and fiber optic firesight on the front. Sweet combo IMO

I sent you a PM after you offered the first time, I guess you didn't get it. I'll send another.

She is more interested in getting the job done quickly and humanely more than anything else. My daughter's biggest fear is making a bad shot and having her animal suffer. She's made a bad shot before and had to track a wounded deer over several miles to finish it off, she almost gave up deer hunting. I was able to get her back in the saddle and she made punched three tags in OK without issues and decided she would keep hunting.

Anyway, she was given the Knight rifle for the price of some pictures of her using it hunting. Like I said we couldnt beat the deal, and she's very excited to try this gifted rifle. I'm not sure that using a sidelock would make her feel better, than using a generous gift from a total stranger who just wants to see her succeed.

got that one will mail you some

Thank you!

An excellent gift, a fine gesture, and a Conscientious hunter dedicated to doing the job right the first time. What's not to like? Good luck to the young lady.

The Knight is a good choice. Here is a link to a story about my first hunting trip with my Knight Extreme. https://theolddeerhunters.com/knight-muzzleloader/

20190921_084112 by Chad Taylor, on [bleep]

The Knight Extreme and my daughter did a good job in her any bull unit, a buddy called this one in to 37 yards on the third day of the four we allocated for this hunt. This was my daughters second elk hunt but her first successful hunt.

Thanks again Geno (colodog) for the Knight Extreme ML, it worked perfectly.

Sight was a SeeAll MK1 which my daughter really liked.
Load was 100 grains 777 and 250 grain Powerbelt Areolite bullet.

Awesome job! Hope to do the same when my daughter comes of age. Hopefully she still thinks I’m cool then

That's outstanding!
You've got a huntress in the house and a hunt partner in the field!

I'm in North Carolina now so her hunt makes me feel close to Colorado still!

Thanks for the pics!!!

I agree on this one if you want an inline. I have one and with Harvester Crush Rib Sabots and a .452 cast 305 grain bullet and 70 to 100 grains of Pyrodex RS it will shoot 1 1/2" groups at 100 yards. I use sidelocks and PRB myself, but my 14 year old granddaughter is using the Impact. I bought it used because it was cheap, but it shoots surprisingly well. I think the granddaughter has inherited it. She hasn't tagged a deer yet, but she shoots it well enough that if one gets broadside inside of 125 yards, it will be toast. She's already about 5'7" and has her dad's "condor arms" so we left the spacer in. Her younger sister will probably have to have it removed if she gets it passed down eventually.

I don't think you can go wrong for the price.

Yep, win/win !!

Awesome.

WINNING !!

Kudos Colodog !!

Much respect !!