My buddies son is going elk huntIng and using some Remington corelocv bks over 165 grain over 56 grains of imrb4350 what you say

Assuming I decoded your post correctly, seems like a solid choice assuming it shoots well in his gun.

If reloading, I personally would have chosen another bullet - but in the 165-180 range. IMO, if I’m going to shoot Core-Lokt’s, I might as well just buy factory ammo at Walmart.

That bullet is certainly a proven killer though, and at 56gr it should be going 2800 fps MV or so.

I'd opt for a 180 gr. If 165 go with a partition.

180

I'd switch to H4350. Just a touch slower burning, more temp stability and an increase in MV.

57 grains of IMR-4350 under a 165 grain Ballistic Tip has been my go to 30/06 load for decades. If a rifle doesn’t shoot that load for me, then I know I have some detective work to do on that rifle.

I'd say if your buddies son can shoot he will be A-Ok. I think there are better bullets these days that are available, but no elk will sluff them off for long if you hit them where it counts.

I found that anything between 57.0-59.0 grains of IMR4350 under a 165 grain Hornady SP Interlock shoots great (<1") in my Browning X-Bolt. 57.5 gr. was the sweet spot. I've never shot anything bigger than a whitetail with it though so I can't comment on how it would do on elk.

This^^

The times I have temp tested IMR4350--albeit the last time was 10+ years ago--velocity and POI changed from my warm weather baseline.

Can you even find H4350? I was using IMR then couldn't find any and went to Hodgdon and loved it but now had to try Accurate ....so far not with great results but also had to try something other than Sierra.

With really tough brass like Lapua, you can bump the load up. I shoot more than that with one Rem 700 factory with 180g Ballistic tip, which would be more than adequate for elk...they are tougher than you would think, but a Partition in this weight would be the Mack Daddy. 200g Partitions are serious elk medicine in the '06. I rode mules back then an a riding partner shoot the 200g Partitions pushing some pressure with H4831 in Lake City match brass.


Note: 150g Barnes TTSX will out penetrate a 180g ballistic tip and on par with a 200g Partition.

H4350 is popping up now. I have seen it on a few shelves. I saw some Cabelas last week.

I've now replaced 4350 with Ramshot Hunter, excellent accuracy higher velocity and lower pressures

Not a corelokt fan here and I usually run 57.5 grains of Imr 4350 in Winchester case and much prefer a partition for elk.

A few years back I shot an elk with the 165 gr. Nosler Accubond. The rifle is a custom Mauser with a 24" supposed 1 in 12" twist barrel. It never has shot heavier bullets worth spit. The elk ran about 30 yards after the hit and expired. I think that while it worked out just fine, I might go with the 165 gr. Partition should I use the rifle on another elk hunt. My preference would be for either a 180 gr. Accubond or Partition but the rifle won't shoot them.

The load is 56.0 gr. W760, Winchester brass, Winchester WLR primer. According to Winchester's published data that load is maximum and I worked up from five percent below. Velocity is just shy of 2900 FPS in my rifle and accuracy is excellent.

FWIW, the bullet hit in the short ribs and went on ending in the left lung making jello out of the lung. No visible exit and the bullet was not recovered. Probably was buried in what was left of the lung.

PJ

Try the 150 Barnes, extremely accurate in five 06’s I have.

Here ya go.Some great advice from our Mule Deer
https://kristian555.livejournal.com/27291.html

Case full of H4350 fed 210m Lapua brass and Barnes 168 ttsx 2 moose 1 elk, all one shot kills. My last moose was shot with a Barnes 175 LRX 1 shot to the shoulder at 110 yards put him down.

I've used that load with a Sierra Game King, great accuracy and kills whitetails dead !

when is he going? what rifle? scope?

My old M77 30-06 favors 165 gr Nosler Ballistic Tips with 56 gr IMR4350. Your load will be just fine with proper shot placement, reasonable range and assuming your rifle likes your load.

If you have a 30-06 that does not shoot well with a 165 gr whatever and 56-57.5 of IMR 4350 I would sell it.

My load was 56.5 grains of IMR 4350, Win primer & 180 grain Hornady interlock spire point. Before I reloaded I used either 180 grain factory Winchester or Remington.

If you rifle likes 165---pretty sure the elk will be just as dead.

A couple of years ago I hit a cow elk that was facing me in the center of the chest with a 165 grain Partition pushed along by IMR 4350 with the range around 200 yards or so. Elk immediately collapsed. I did not find the bullet but found where it stopped, in the right side tenderloin.
For me that is enough penetration.

H-4350 and Big Game have shown up here. Its the first time I've ever seen big game around here.

I load 165gr Corelokts or Hornady 165gr flat base over 56gr of H4350. I used to load IMR 4350. I get 308 165gr velocity. How it will will work on elk I can't say but it works great for deer.

Powder OVER bullet? How does that work out?

It ignites sending the bullet into the bolt face, the ricochet forward toward the target. I've heard this approach degrades accuracy a tad bit 😊

For many years I used 58.5 grains of IMR4350 and the 165-grain Partition in my Ultra Light Arms Model 24, on a wide variety of big game. This may seem like an "overload" to some (Nosler has listed 57.0 as maximum for decades) but during a project for Handloader magazine I worked up loads for three rifles in different chamberings, using the "pressure indicators" many use. None of the loads showed any of such indications, including the .30-06 load, whether "excessively flattened" primers, difficult opening of the action, or anything else.

Then I had all four loads tested at the piezo pressure lab at Western Powders in Miles City, Montana. The .30-06 load averaged 58,800 PSI, well below the SAAMI .30-06 rating of 60,000 PSI average maximum pressure. Oh, and 3-shot groups at 100 yards still average 3/4" at 100 yards, despite nearly 1000 rounds down the barrel, at 2935 fps from the 24" barrel.

Not too good!

With the right bullet and powder charge its the go anywhere and do anything for most people load.

Great article from years ago, still a mighty fine guide to loading the 30-06 for hunting.

Regards, Guy

As others have eluded to that bullet is no good. It will absolutely bounce right off the elk even at close range. Why we weren't covered up with elk before the Partition or Barnes X bullets were invented is anyone's guess.



Please post pictures of his successful kill later after the hunt.

Usual bs. Sight in and go kill elk. Partitions on the next trip would improve a bit if a less than perfect shot shows up. I have killed a bunch of elk with Sierra 165hpbt and 150 gr. BTBT. Now I usually use a Accubond or Part.

I killed a couple of deer with 56.5gr and a Sierra 165gr Gameking HP, but wouldn’t choose that particular bullet for elk, though a man I once worked for did, and it worked for him. At the woods ranges I used it, it was very destructive. Not sure exactly what bullet the OP is talking about, but that charge level seemed mild and shot well for me.

That bullet and load should work just fine. Just shoot it behind the shoulder, keep the range und 1/4 mile and go get your knife ready.

For 20 years living in British Columbia I ran one load in my only centerfire rifle, a 30-06:

165 grain Sierra, 56 grains IMR 4350, CCI Magnum primers, one batch of Federal brass that I loaded over and over with a Lee Loader and an Ohaus 5-0-5 scale. That load would group about 5/8 inch all day long, any number of rounds. I didn’t have a chronograph, and went for accuracy over velocity. This “middle range charge” was the most accurate of those tested from 53 to 59 grains. It killed a pile of game.

One man - one rifle - one load - one pile 'o critters

Prolly a Redfield 4x scope too . . . .

Just curious, but how temp stable is Hunter?

I say head for the Lodgepoles and work the higher basins.

From a sample of decades of hunting with a 30-06, I can account for at least 40 elk and dozens of other big game animals with a simple load of IMR-4350 and 165 grain Hornady spire point bullets.

Any concern of temperature sensitivity never interfered with that success. The Hornady 165 grain spire point did not fail either.

Simply as near perfect an all around hunting cartridge you could possibly find…

I've taken quite a few deer, antelope, and elk - using 165 gr Remington Core-Lokts, and Sierra Game Kings.
About all I've used in my "ought sixes" in ~45 years.

If you can find it - haven't seen any H in years up here- just IMR. But then, that's just mostly casual browsing here and there - I haven't gone full-psycho about it...

The one and only elk I've killed died, boom-splat, due to a factory 140 gr. Corelokt from a 260. So have a number of caribou and a wolf. I would not worry about a .30 cal 165 or 180 gr in any decent handload.

JJHack, who used to post here, with far more experience than I, thought the 165 in 30-06 was just about ideal. I prefer 180, myself, but the 150's (Corelokts and SST) have killed a couple dozen caribou for me.

Pick your load and go forth and hunt, Grasshopper!

I use Winchester SuperX Power Points in mine in 180 gr. because my .30-06 loves them. Drops deer and moose on the spot, lethal and very affordable!

Good luck with the elk I hope he slams a big one

KB

How did you know?! A 2-7 Redfield bought from Ron Kesselring, my first scope!

Right now I'm finalizing a deer load for my latest 06, an M18. Zeroing in on 165 Interbond, 56.5 grains H4350, Federal primers, Win brass from a Lee Collet die.

My go-to .30-06 load is 57.0 grains of IMR4350 behind a Barnes 165 gr. TSX bullet. Sub-MOA accurate, and deadly on anything I care to shoot it with.

From Ramshot

"Is Ramshot Hunter temp stable?
Most of our powders are not insensitive, and will show some effect at hot and cold temperatures. However, we test at -40F and +125F and the deviation in most cases are ca 3% to 5% at these extreme levels. Therefore most shooters do not notice much difference under normal practical hunting conditions."

jwp,

When the Ramshot ballistic lab tested powder for temp sensitivity, they used ammo that had been chilled or heated--which has been done many times over the decades. In fact that's what Bob Hagel did for the results listed in his classic book, Game Loads and Practical Balliistics for the American Hunter.

But when I started testing powders for temp-resistance in the 1990s, I found that sometimes just heating/cooling ammo didn't produce the same results as when actually testing BOTH rifles and ammo in different temperatures. In fact the results only agreed maybe 20% of the time. There are several reasons for this, but it's why I don't trust results shot with ONLY the ammo heated or cooled.

This is also why the test results I list in Chapter 10 of The Big Book of Gun Gack II were primarily shot at actual temperatures, not with just the ammo heated or cooled.

Might also mention--as I have many times in various articles and books--that just about any modern smokeless rifle powder will produce very consistent results at any temperature from the 20s to 80s Fahrenheit, at least for typical big game ammo.

It's also well-known among Shrapnel's friends that he almost never hunts when it's really cold or hot....

I believe it was Mule Deer that made the observation several years ago about all the cracked windshields in trucks in Montana were from cartridges loaded with H335 powder and they cooked off in the sun, cracking the windshields.

Even I know when you are kidding and my temperature sensitivity testing goes beyond mild fall days, but you already knew that...

So how temperature sensitive is Hunter.

Your mention of Hunter is how I came to try it. So far I really like it

Not to torpedo - I’ve only loaded Hunter under a 129gr HIL in a 6.5 Creedmoor and it’s wonderfully accurate. What are the favored 165/180gr loads using Hunter in a 30-06?

Haven't used Hunter much with 165s, with 180-185 grain bullets have had great results with 57-58 grains, to the point where that's pretty much my standard 180-grain load.

First time I tried Hunter that bullet weight was in 2007 with 185-grain Berger Hunting VLDs--before they were even called "Hunting" VLDs. Three-shot groups averaged a little over half an inch at 100 from my Ultra Light Arms Model 24--but the same basic charge has also worked well in a wide variety of other .30-06s, including a Sauer drilling with 180 Partitions.

I won a Remington 742 30/06with a $1 raffle ticket that my nephew sold to me a fundraising for HS band. They announced my name as the winner at the Friday night football game. It wasn’t there cos I worked night shift. But you can bet my butt was at Western Auto to claim it Saturday morning. I used it for years and handloaded using a Lyman press I got for $15. I used 57 grains of 4350 and Hornady flat base 165 grains. It would group 3 shots you could cover with a quarter at a 100 yds. I couldn’t believe a semi auto shot that well. I kept the chamber clean with a dogleg brush and never had a problem with jams. We hunted with dogs and still hunted mostly. I killed a doe on a pipeline right of way at 375 paces, my longest kill. Still remember kicking the Walker hounds off her when I finally got to her. It was a crossing at the bottom of a long hill.

64 grains of Ramshot Hunter in my Kimber Classic Select got 2950 FPS behind the 168 TTSX

200 Yard Group

Thanks John! I’m going to fiddle with that load range next week. The weather up here has allowed more range time 😜

Dang. That’s pretty sweet.

I wouldn't worry about your load. A friend and his son borrowed my Ruger 77 30-06 for their first elk hunt a couple of years ago. I had sighted in the Leupold M8 6x with factory 165gr ammo, but only had a few shells on hand when they came to pick it up.

I told them they could pick up a box of any Winchester, Remington or Hornady 165gr ammo from the local Scheels and go hunting.

They each got their elk with 1 shot.

P.S. 57gr of IMR 4350 with a 165gr bullet is listed on Nosler's Load Data page as their "most accurate" load.