Using in a 300 wby at 3150 fps. A friend has killed a truck load of bulls and cows in this combination. I was planning on using it in Wyo this year however after a recent experience with this combination on a Pronghorn buck last weekend Im reconsidering. Bullet appears to have blown up on the ribs at 350 yards. Behind the shoulder fully broadside hole in the ribs
with no exit. No internal damage on the inside near entry. I had to make a very hasty second shot as he crested the roll of a hill and a final shot as he tried to regain his feet after finding him bedded under some sage. Second shot seemed to have either have went up his a—hole as there was some damage just inside and a broken bone in the ham. No external bullet hole found there. Although it’s possible my final shot destroyed any evidence of either exit wounds as it was poorly placed.
After talking to a nosler rep he believed the bullet blew up on the ribs and said its not a elk bullet. So what say you? I do have 180 gr partitions and Barnes TTSX bullets but have not made a load for either. I may just take my 338 as its ready to go with 210 partitions.

Nosler had trouble wirh the ballistic tip from the day they started selling it. My elk load in the 30-06 was the 180gr Hornady interlock, never had a problem with it. I recall one story a guy reported was a BT bullet blowing up in the skin of an antelope. Sounds far fetched to me but who knows, maybe it did. At any rate just been to many report's of blow ups over the years for me to mess with them. Nosler probably should have stuck to just the partition for big game bullet's.

Those problematic Ballistic Tips went away 30 years ago.

Don't push a BT past 3000 fps and you're fine. If you're wanting that kind of velocity, I'd use monometals.

Iv'e shot 2 elk with 180gr Partitions (300 Wby), the one bullet that a recovered was a perfect mushroom (about 65% retained weight). I would use the Partition or the TTSX.

This ^ ^ ^

IIRC Nosler went to thicker jackets for the .308 180gr bullet and above.

The 150 and 165 have also been stiffened since their introduction. I've shot both through deer and pigs with no blow ups.

I believe our fellow Campfire member Shrapnel has taken some elk with the 180 Ballistic Tip with his .300 Weatherby, including a mature cow he shot in the front of the chest--and he found the bullet in one of the hindquarters. Maybe he'll see this and comment.

Nosler developed the Ballistic Tip hunting bullets in the mid-1980s for hunting deer-sized game, and emphasized that back then, because they already produced a bullet suitable for bigger game. But the trend even then was to higher BC's, and many hunters ignored Nosler's advice. Which is why early Ballistic Tips didn't penetrate well on larger animals.

But demand continued to increase, and in 1993 Nosler introduced the first "heavy jacket" model, the 200-grain .338. I got to test them that year in my custom .338 Winchester magnum, first by shooting a few side-by-side with some 210-grain Partitions into a stack of dry newspaper (still my preferred "media" for supposedly tougher big game bullets, though newspaper is getting harder to find). They penetrated about 90% as deeply as the 210 Partitions, and retained over 60% of their weight.

Took my .338 to northern Quebec that fall, and killed the biggest-bodied bull caribou I've take, about the size of an average 5-point bull elk. It was standing almost broadside about 200 yards away, and put the bullet in the little angle behind the near shoulder. The bull collapsed instantly, straight down on his belly, ready for the trophy photo. The bullet had broken the far shoulder just above the big joint, and exited, leaving a 2" hole.

A few years later I used the same load to take my first bull gemsbok in Namibia. It was standing quartering slightly to my right at 150-175 yards, and I aimed for the near shoulder. It also collapsed at the shot--and the bullet had not only broken the shoulder but went through the bottom of the spinal column, before ending up under the hide of the left ham, retaining around 60% of its weight. (Which, by the way, is about the weight of the jacket in the 200-grain .338, now available as the Combined Technology Ballistic Silvertip.)

A few years after that Nosler acknowledged that hunters weren't going to use Ballistic Tips only on deer-sized game, and similarly beefed up the jackets on several others, including the 180-grain .30. If somebody has one "blow up" the bullet was one of the early ones, and a surprising number are apparently still around.

In 2005 I killed buck pronghorn at around 250 yards with a Federal factory .308 load featuring the 150-grain Ballistic Tip. The buck was facing me, and dropped at the shot. The bullet exited the inside of the right hindquarter.

Now that was a .308, and the muzzle velocity was probably around 2800 fps--but that's the kind of penetration many hunters brag about from monolithics.

Why not the 180 gr accubond ?

I'm not an elk hunter, but should I avail myself of the opportunity to hunt elk and my two choices of projectiles were the Nosler Ballistic tip or the Nosler Accubond at equal weights, I would go with the Accubond, eleven times out of ten.

Ya!

GWB

Once in awhile when I’m over at JB’s house pulling horseradish from his garden, we will talk about guns and ballistics. I hate to admit it, but he has never steered me wrong and one of his suggestions has become one of my favorite varmint cartridges, the 204 Ruger, and not to forget the 17 Hornet. I did have to discover all my elk killing by myself though.


The issue of what a NBT bullet will do, will never reach total resolution. What’s best vs what failed will be discussed for as long as we shoot modern firearms.

I probably killed 40 or more elk with a 30-06 and 165 grain Hornady spire point bullets. They worked great, but I decided I wanted a longer range cartridge and tried the 300 WBY, then the 30-378 WBY and then back to the 300 WBY.

I used Hornady 190 grain Interlock, and then Nosler 200 grain Accubonds in the 30-378 until I decided it was too much gun. Over the years I shot dozens more elk with the big 30’s and finally have ended up with a combination that is real hard on elk. Many can make claims of better bullets and ballistics, but I can verify firsthand through experience that a 300 WBY with IMR 7828 and Nosler Ballistic Tips, will kill the hell out of elk.

I also believe that specialized and premium bullets may have some affect that others are looking for, but I have killed a butt load of elk with that combination and seen many others that were made just as dead in their 300 Weatherbys, that I’m more than convinced it is a great bullet for killing elk…

Bonding a bullet never made it shoot better

I have killed elk with the 180gr BT out of a 300 Ultra. If there is a tougher cup and core, non bonded 30 caliber bullet I am not aware with it. They are hell on elk and they typicly are less bitchy than the 180 accubond which is the same bullet with a blonde core.

Some guys love the AB. Personally, they don't/have never shot as well as the BT in my rifles. Other's mileage may vary.

I’m reading this and my first thought was “300 Wby for pronghorn? Why?” Because you wanted to is the obvious answer, I understand.

I’ve seen one bull shot with that load and he behaved perfectly. 343” 6 by shot at approximately 250 yards. Spun around once and died right there. I shot a 6 by the next day with my 300 and a 180 grain AB and he pretty much died the same way. I’m sure the BT in your rifle would do just fine if you do your part.

Perchance I come at my choice of Accubonds from a different perspective.

I've killled a number of critters with both Ballistic Tips and Accubonds from 6mm through .375 caliber.

Additionally, geography has a major influence on my choice of bullets, in that if a critter is not DRT, and a blood trail is not found within say a +/- 20' diameter circle from the POI, most time there is no recovery. Perhaps lack of blood and distance traveled is not a major concern for some.

On numerous occasions I have shot game with ballistic tips and there was no animal DRT and no blood to "trail. IIRC out of all the critters I've taken with Accubonds, I've only recovered one bullet, and typically enjoy significant "sign" on the occasions of having to track.

Years ago when I was in the "insurance' business, I had a mentor who had a mantra, "when you know you know, and you know you know, confidence replaces fear.

I'm sure your mileage may vary, but the elk hunt I did in 2008 cost me around $8,000 all in. I carried as my principal weapon a 338 RUM, loaded w/200 gr. Accubonds, my back up was a 300 Win Mag with 180 gr. Accubonds.

Took a mulie, but no elk.

I had no doubt that either load would suffice. For me, with Ballistic Tips I would not have had that same confidence.

If I had a shred of doubt about whether I had the proper bullet and had lost an animal, I'd be bummed to say the least.

Best,

GWB

Section a ballistic tip and an accubond, get back with me...
I stripped the action of the .300RUM that I built including removing the barrel and scope & mounts to add an external bolt release. Put it back together, took it to the range with me to verify the zero. I was shooting 300 yards that day, prone with my F-class rifle. When I was done with that I threw a bipod on my ultramag, dialed in my scope for 300 yards and put three rounds downrange. 200gr accubonds at 3200fps. The target dot is 1" diameter. A few elk have been taken with this rifle...

I've only killed four elk with a rifle, and all were 180 Accubonds out of a .300 Win Mag. I wouldn't want to step down to Ballistic Tips.

At the risk of sounding like Big Stink, get back to me when you have killed a few elk and lost more with a Ballistic Tip…

I've seen one elk killed with a BT. 300 Win mag shooting 180 BT, recovered bullet looked like an add. Expansion was excellent with a nice shank left.

JB the bullets loaded are recent manufacture, purchased about 2019 or 20. I figure it may have been a bad bullet but the nosler tech believed it was just a fluke. Basically a perfect shot in the ribs and a impact velocity of about 2600 fps according to the Nosler rep’s est. Truly I am surprised at the fact it appeared to have blown up on the rib. I am not a ballistic tip hater and have seen a antelope shot at 75 yards with the same load and nothing more than a half dollar sized exit wound. One reason I use this bullet was that performance and the fact the first max load I tried with 7828 went 3250 and shot very well. I dropped the load to 3150 fps and still shoots very well
For the guy who asked why a 300 on Antelope main reason is it was ready to hunt and is a very accurate rifle. I have shot them with a 223,6mm,257 Rbts, 300wby in the past and almost grabbed a 270 or 06. I guess the fact it was sighted in and the scope reticle gave me confidence for a longish shot.
These herd of antelope ran when they seen you at 4 miles. Lol
Maybe a exaggeration but thats what a guy told me when we stopped for a burger and he asked what unit we were hunting. I had never experienced that before. I spotted this antelope in a draw and worked my way in for a shot. 350yds and I was out of cover and he had me spotted. Shot from cross sticks so was pretty steady.

Two bull elk, 410 yds (measured) and 260ish yds with Nosler ballistic tip 180s from a 30-378 Weatherby at 3400 fps chronographed. Several antelope at some long ranges and some mule deer. All dropped dead except the shorter range elk who stumbled about 70 yds and fell. All shots passed through. Also hell on prairie dogs with no recovered bullets either.

338reddog,

Thanks for the details. It does sound like it was a fluke.

I've also taken a pronghorn with a .300 magnum--the .300 WSM in 2000 just before it was first announced at the 2001 SHOT Show. Used factory ammo featuring the 150-grain Ballistic Silvertip, which is the Ballistic Tip dressed in different colors. The range was around 270 yards and it worked fine, in and out of the ribcage without excessive meat damage.

This was on an "industry" hunt sponsored by Winchester with several other hunters, so I not only got to see the results of the shots on several other bucks, but actually watched a couple others being taken.

I had 165 grain BTs out of a 300 win mag fail on a combination antelope and mule deer hunt. Bullet blew up on both animals. They had a full charge of IMR 4350 behind them, so I suspect they were travelling something north of 3K. That was sometime in the early 90's, it's been so long I can't remember exactly when. It was before my son was born in 95.

I know the BT bullets are better now, but I just can't bring myself to use them again when I could shoot partitions. I know they are going to work every time.

Jeezus F’n H Christ…. The last 4 big game animals I’ve taken have been killed with the “LOWLY” 165 Nosler Ballistic tip out of a 308… It’s blown thru the chests of 3 elk and one moose…
Why TF this bullet get so much disrespect is beyond me.
It’s going moose hunting next week and elk hunting in Dec… Have no doubt it will work, again.

People living in the past mostly.

No disrespect here, currently shooting 50 gr. BT's out of a 222 Rem, and 120 gr. BT's out of a 6.5 Grendel and a 260 Rem.

Just am of the opinion that there are better choices (as in optimal) when going after critters that matter.

ya!

GWB

Adding 400fps might change things?



That said, my 660 308 has used 165BTs since 1989. (Except for a bit of time with 165gr HPBT Sierras)

All old style, out of 100 count boxes. I bought the stock of a closing store!😁😁

For deer, in that gun, they are perfect.
Plenty of damage, not excessive(usually), full penetration(usually),
DRT(usually) or short trails(usually)

Put so many usually in there to make a point.


Shooting guns, and especially shooting them at animals, you
make choices based on odds. You can stack the deck, you can
try to affect the outcome.

However, you can never totally control the outcome.

Schidt happens.

Yep, that was before Ballistic Tips from about 7mm up were strengthened, either by heavier jackets or harder lead cores, or both. Some of the earliest, however, were good to go from the start, such as the 140-grain 7mm. I used it in the late 1980s with no problems--and never recovered one.

The reason the early Ballistic Tips "over-expanded" was Nosler simply put plastic tips in their Solid Base soft-points--which were pretty tough bullets. In fact the first animal I killed with a Solid Base was a Montana whitetail buck, with the 100-grain 6mm started at 3000 fps from a .243 Winchester. The range was around 125 yards, and the buck was angling away. At the shot he went maybe 10-15 feet and fell dead. The bullet entered at the rear of the left ribs and ended up in the right shoulder, retaining 61.5% of its weight.

But Nosler didn't realize adding the plastic tip would would cause problems, due to the BIG hollow-point required for rear end of the tip. That was in the mid-to-late 1980s.

The changes in Ballistic Tips started shortly afterward, which is when the 200-grain .338 was developed. And what they learned from that was soon applied to other Ballistic Tip hunting bullets. (The varmint Ballistic Tips always worked fine.)

Hornady went through the same sort of deal when they introduced SSTs not too long afterward--which are basically Interlocks with plastic tips. But like Nosler they also made some adjustments, and the present SSTs (and ELD-Xs, which are essentially a higher-BC version of SSTs) worked pretty well. I went on a hunt in Texas five years ago where several hunters all used Fiocchi .308 Winchester ammo loaded with 150-grain SSTs. We killed 20 whitetails and pigs up to 200 pounds live weight, and never recovered a bullet. The biggest deer was shot quartering to the hunter, and the biggest pig was broadside, and shot through both shoulders.

I have a friend in Colorado that only uses 180gr BT at 2750fps. His rifle is a sporterized 1903a3 in 30-06. He uses that rifle for everything, yes everything, PDs to Elk. Never has an issue. He calls those bullets “green death”.

Thanks, Tom

Yup, my 3 bad experiences in NW Montana were with the Nosler .277" 130 grain BT at 3100 fps in 1984, switched to the Hornady 140 grain boat tail Interlock the following 2 years with good results.

41

I've done so. They are identical.
Here is a pic comparing the two. Not mine BTW.
[Linked Image][url=http://https://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d128/stubblejumper11/P7230005.jpg][/url]

When I see stories of bullets made during the last 20 years blowing up on ribs and such I immediately think BS.
The last BT I killed a bull elk with broke both shoulders and was recovered under the hide on the off side the core had seperated and I didn't look for it but the jacket weighed something like 70gr IIRC. Entrance hole was fist sized. Bull was dead on the spot too. This was from a 300 RUM at close range.

Your link doesn't work...
I've got nothing against ballistic tips. I use them to debug a rifle that supposedly has accuracy issues to verify the potential of said firearm. Once the problems are found and resolved I'll move forward and find a load that works for the intended purpose. That's the fun in reloading, experiment and find the components that give you the results you're confident with. 👌

I'll say if no one else will bullshit. The ones nosler makes today are better BUT every gunshow I do these days you will find tables that have boxes of bullets for sale . The original NBT's with the explosive traits are still out there. They were packaged in a black box with a label that was red / green and white you buy that vintage your screwed. Accurate yes but explosive. If the OP used that vintage it explains his results..mb

Hang around long enough and get in on enough critter killing and about all bullets have and will "fail".

A lot of these failures result in some very dead critters so I wonder how we can really consider them a failure.

Match the tool to the job at hand and things go pretty smooth.

That depends on what you're going to do with them. The 165 grain in that version was a great deer bullet out of a 308 Winchester.

And a 30-06.

Some background trivia about AccuBonds and Ballistic Tips:

After the introduction of Ballistic Tips, hunters kept bugging Nosler to make a "tipped" Partition, and some also bugged them about making a "bonded" Partition. Instead Nosler decided to bond Ballistic Tips, and when they did tested the bonded version to see how it penetrated. In some of the bullets the bonding made a difference, and in others it didn't--so they dropped some of the Ballistic Tips in favor of the AccuBond model, usually larger-caliber bullets. The 260-grain .375 Ballistic Tips, for example, only existed for a year or so before being turned into AccuBonds.

So yes, if you section Ballistic Tips and AccuBonds of the same caliber and weight, they'll usually appear identical. But the bonding process Nosler uses (and many other companies do as well) involves heating the bullet until the core melts slightly, so gets soldered to the jacket.

However, this also softens the jacket slightly, but that doesn't matter as long as its bonded to the core. AccuBonds still tend to retain more weight than Ballistic Tips due to the bonding, but also often "mushroom" wider, which can reduce penetration.

This also doesn't matter much, especially in the larger-caliber models. One of my favorites is the 250-grain 9.3mm, which I've used on a bunch of big game up to kudu and grizzly. Have only recovered one, from the third shot at the grizzly.

It went down at the first shot, taken at around 65 yards as the boar quartered away. I aimed behind the near shoulder, hoping to break the far shoulder, and the bear immediately dropped. But it got back up again almost as quickly, and ran back along the path it had been walking--which brought it closer to me and my guide. We both shot at the same instant, but missed, because the bear turned to bite at the entry wound.

My third shot was taken as it angled away, the bullet entering the right ribs, and the bear sank into some tall grass. We approached very cautiously, but it was dead--probably due to the first shot as much as anything, which made a big hole in both lungs and exiting--but missed the far shoulder by maybe an inch.

The last bullet ended up under the hide on the left side of the neck. It retained over 80% of its weight, because larger-caliber AccuBonds, like larger Partitions, are designed to retain more of their weight.

But AccuBonds also a brief problem about a year and a half after being introduced. They immediately became very popular, so much that one of the guys in the Nosler assembly line decided to speed up his job--which resulted in the cores not bonding. Since the jacket was softened, those bullets came apart even worse than some early Ballistic Tips. The problem was caught quickly, because Nosler tests small batches of each manufacturing run both for accuracy and penetration, but a few did get sent to stores and distributors.

I started using AccuBonds as soon as they appeared, and never ran into any of those unbonded bullets, but a few people did, so still don't trust AccuBonds--much like those who used some of the early Ballistic Tips.

Of course, some other bullets have gone through growing pains. I never got consistent results with Barnes Xs, whether accuracy or opening, until a decade or so after they appeared, and later learned from Randy Brooks that was due to inconsistent copper. Once he regularly got good copper the problems went away, and after the grooved TSX bullets appeared, if I recall correctly in 2004, Xs became far more popular.

Yeah, but they are so cheap when I find them and they usually always shoot good...

Bsa, you shoot any meat with them? I said they were accurate in my post.you can have my share of them at any gun show I go to..mb

There are a lot of Accubonds out there with bad plastic. I have 3 boxes of 200 grainers. Been waiting amongst 18 months for Nosler to replace them. Tips turned into powder in the box. When i asked around, i found this was not at all uncommon.

This. I have a bunch of 250 grainers in .338" that the tips disintegrated on. What's up with that?


41

You're stressing over New-Old-Stock? I suppose that could happen. I have a few vintage 125 gr .308's I am going to reserve for my Blackout.

Thats funny I used the original BT's for years on deer with good results.

I had a box of 200gr AB's that lost some tips way back when they were first released. Never have had a BT lose a tip.

Your going to trust me then. I can say for certain that the 180gr BT and AB look identical when sectioned.
The 165 and 168gr BT/AB have an even thicker jacket than the 180gr variety.

BWalker,

I addressed this a few posts ago:

After the introduction of Ballistic Tips, hunters kept bugging Nosler to make a "tipped" Partition, and some also bugged them about making a "bonded" Partition. Instead Nosler decided to bond Ballistic Tips, and when they did tested the bonded version to see how it penetrated. In some of the bullets the bonding made a difference, and in others it didn't--so they dropped some of the Ballistic Tips in favor of the AccuBond model, usually larger-caliber bullets. The 260-grain .375 Ballistic Tips, for example, only existed for a year or so before being turned into AccuBonds.

So yes, if you section Ballistic Tips and AccuBonds of the same caliber and weight, they'll usually appear identical.

I think a lot of us saw that when they first came out. I first tried the 200gr accubond in 2006, and it suffered from tips breaking off. Never saw that with the BT either. I have seen some BT's with chipped and bent tips though. If we are going to talk elk and bullet, my vote goes to the 200gr Partition. No guess work there.

No sir. I've shot plenty of 30 cal 165gr solid base bullets into deer though. Those always seemed to work well. I've seen the results of some of the very first BT's and it was not pretty. I always thought it was weird because people always said the BT was just a solid base with a plastic tip. Must have been more to them than that.. The bullets shown above in the pic were bought recently. $10.00 for one box and a buddy gave me the other. I would not put them in a deer. I've always been impressed by their accuracy though.. My old 300WBY loved the 180gr ballistic tips.

BSA,

I also addressed this in an earlier post on this thread:

"The reason the early Ballistic Tips 'over-expanded' was Nosler simply put plastic tips in their Solid Base soft-points--which were pretty tough bullets. In fact the first animal I killed with a Solid Base was a Montana whitetail buck, with the 100-grain 6mm started at 3000 fps from a .243 Winchester. The range was around 125 yards, and the buck was angling away. At the shot he went maybe 10-15 feet and fell dead. The bullet entered at the rear of the left ribs and ended up in the right shoulder, retaining 61.5% of its weight.

But Nosler didn't realize adding the plastic tip would would cause problems, due to the BIG hollow-point required for rear end of the tip. That was in the mid-to-late 1980s."

I still used them without the tips on several deer. Didn't seem to notice much differance.

I missed your comment, John.
In regards to a bonded partition. The swift A-frame is bonded and honestly I can't say it's a real improvement. I don't believe the penetrate as well as a partition. I also don't believe the cause as much carnage on the entrance side.
What Nosler really needs is a bonded, tipped partition in a VLD profile. They would have all the marketing bases covered!

I am one of the people who had one unsatisfactory experience with a 100 grain BT in a .257 Roberts on an antelope. It stopped the animal but didn't kill it. After that I switched to Partitions (in hunting loads of all calibers). From then on I had no unsatis- factory results. Eventually I came to the opinion that I probably had a box of the early Ballistic Tips. Even so I never again used BT's.

Remember the old saying "happy wife, happy life." Now I say Partitions equal happy life.

Jim

Run them at 2300-2500 fps and the old 165/180 gr .30 cal bt worked great on WI white tail at mostly less than 100 yds. Not much meat damage and usually two holes. Dad still has a couple hundred 180s loaded to those specs from back in the late '80s for his 30-06. They are also rather enjoyable to shoot compared to full snort '06 ammo in any rifle so chambered.

A-Frames are great bullets, but yes, they don't usually penetrate as deeply as Partitions of the same weight and diameter. This is primarily due to their "mushroom" being much wider, and also sometimes due to the rear core also expanding somewhat.

Many hunters, even some with long experience, don't know that only the front core of A-Frames is bonded, but not the rear core. Since the jacket is pure copper, softer than the gilding-metal jacket of Partitions, A-Frames tend to expand more, both in the front and rear ends. This tends to make a bigger hole, which is what kills game--and also often results in the bullet not exiting. This is considered by many African PHs a good thing when hunting buffalo in herds, where a bullet that exits can wound another buffalo beyond it.

Had great results on a cow elk with the 165 gr Nosler Ballistic Tip at 2940 fps from my 30-06. It broke both scapula and damaged both lungs significantly. Quick kill. I think that the sturdy Ballistic Tip did well, aided probably by the lessened velocity out at 340 yards. Either way it worked great. That's been a great general purpose hunting load for me: bear, mule deer, pronghorn and cow elk have all expired quite quickly.

Ballistic Tips in general have worked really well for me, though yes, the early ones were pretty frangible.

Regards, Guy

It’s always interesting to see what conclusions can be made from samples of 1,2 or 3…

Describes my hunting partner and best friend of 40+ years.

He won't make it to 3 though.

I'll respectfully disagree.

In 2011 or 2012, I helped a hunter using a .25-06 with handholds with NBT's. He wounded and lost deer and pigs for two days. Wish I had a photo, but one of the pigs looked like someone took an ice cream scoop of flesh out of the hide with zero penetration. The shot stunned it enough for a follow up to drop it. So, when we found that one, we figured out what was happening.

I lent him my .308 and he started dropping animals where they stood. I've never liked Ballistic Tips or the .25-06 since then, there are better choices. Barnes TTSX are my go to first choice bullet these days, fantastic bullet with uniformly good results now on well into the hundreds of animals.

I've shot quit a few hogs and deer with the 100gr BT out of a 25-06 and 25-06AI. Never failed me and most of them were shot at close range.
TTSX are great bullets if you want the best chance of an exit. However they don't kill very abruptly in many cases and often the entrance and exits are small. I've been using the TTSX and LRX for myself, my two kids and my brother for the last 10 years btw.

Why, would you use them ??? The AB and Partition are better bullets. My experience? Over 100 elk and deer taken primarily with the PT.

Personally I would use the tougher bullet in 300 or 338 with partitions. This is not to say the 180 btip is a bad bullet or won’t work but why not use them if you have them given you already have some doubts.

Lou

One additional comment is that I've used Ballistic Tips, Partitions and AccuBonds considerably, and have recovered dozens from big game animals. There simply isn't that much difference in retained weight in most of those bullets.

The exception is above above .338 caliber, where AccuBonds and Partitions are designed to retain a higher percentage of their weight. Those tend to retain at least 80% of their weight, and often over 90%. The most weight retention I've experience is 95% from a 400-grain Partition fired from a .416 Rigby, which traveled several feet from the left rear ribs of a big Botswana Cape buffalo, into the bull's right shoulder.

But at .338 caliber and below there just isn't much difference in retained weight between the three bullets, especially with the thicker-jacketed Ballistic Tips, which start around the 150-grain 7mm and go up through the 200-grain .338--and these days is a Ballistic Silvertip.

Usually all three Nosler bullets will retain 60-70% of their weight, exactly how much depending on what they hit. The single 200-grain .338 Ballistic Tip recovered, for example, broke the right shoulder of a gemsbok bull quartering strongly toward me at around 150 yards, then traveled through over a foot of the bottom of the spinal column before ending up under the hide of the left ham--retaining 59.4% of its weight.

Have recovered several Partitions in calibers from .270 to .30 that retained around the same percentage of their original weight, and a couple even less. But one of those still penetrated a Shiras bull moose from the left ribs to the right shoulder--which took a step-and-a-half and fell dead. The other went lengthwise through a mule deer buck standing facing me in thick timber, which dropped dead right there--though the bullet wasn't recovered until months later, when I bit into a round steak and found what I thought at first was a piece of bone. Instead it was the 140-grain Partition from my 7x57.

The partition is a great bullet, but can be finicky to get to shoot. The AB is basicly the same bullet as the BT except that it has bonding. Marketing aside I am not sure the bonding matters a whole lot.

Never an issue getting Partitions to shoot.

They like a full to very full load of fuel.

Ray Charles would see the difference, but hey, you go girl... 🙄😁😅😅🤣🤣🤣
The Ballistic tip came off during sectioning.

AJ,

Were those sectioned bullets "twins"? By twins I mean, for example, a .308" 165 grain Ballistic Tip and a .308" 165 grain Accubond of the same vintage? I ask because I've seen a number of sectioned Ballistic Tips with thickened shanks like your second photo.

Same vintage, 180gr Ballistic Tip, 200gr Accubonds which is .09" longer than (in the shank) the 180gr. I thought I had some 180gr Accubonds left but I sold the last two boxes here. The 180gr looked the same as the example, couldn't find the sample I had back when I also sectioned Partitions and Partition Golds.

Towards the bottom of this thread there is a pic of .308 ballistic tips sectioned and they look very different than the one above, basically identical to the Accubond:


https://www.africahunting.com/threads/experience-with-nosler-accubonds.54877/page-2

I don't know what that alleged BT is, buts it's certainly not a modern BT. Below is a 180gr BT and a 180gr AB. Look identical to me.
How many elk have you shot with a BT?

What the fűck is that cr@ppy photo supposed to prove... 🤣

The photo might be of low quality, but Ray Charles could tell the jackets are identical or nearly so.
How many elk have you killed with BT's?

Accubonds and Partitions meet my accuracy and performance demands, I don't see a need to use BTs. 😉

So the answer is no... typical of the MO of many Campfire members. Experts at things they have never done.

Hey, what ever blows your panties up your skirt...
You do what works for you, I'll continue doing what works for me.

As somebody already pointed out, while your opinion is obviously valid for you, it doesn't mean you're "right" for anybody else.

There have been many other posts here about consistent elk success with 180 Ballistic Tips, as well as my post about the relatively small difference in retained weight between the three Nosler bullets being discussed. But you obviously don't "know" anything about the field performance of Ballistic Tips--as you admit.

So what is your point?

That's exactly it. And if you have no expiereance why the poster in question even reply?

What the fűck are you now, the contents cop? Fůck you and the sheep you rode in on, LittleBitchWalker... 🤣

I mirror many others here in my experience with the 30 cals and elk, from the 300 Savage all the way to the 30/378 Weatherby. I have used several 30 cal rifles and many different bullets over the last 55 years.
But by now I have stopped my "testing' of bullet in 30 calibers over the size of the 30-06. Now days I use the 200 grain Nosler Partition in my 30 magnums and stopped trying about everything else.
Why stop?
Why not!

it's been an outstanding performer for me and I'll acknowledge that there may be others as good or even "better", but I get through and through wounds on elk at every angles I've hit them at so far, and they hold up well at closer ranges and do the job perfectly at the longer ranges, so once you get a straight expanded hole with day-light out the other side, how is it possible to get "better"?

Always keep this fact in mind:
Bullets actually do not kill game. Bullet holes kill game. The bullet is simply the tool you make the hole with.

There are 3 factors about holes that can be adjusted.
Depth, width and relative straightness.
That's it! That's all there is! Only 3

So I look for bullets that exit.
That maximizes performance for one of the 3.
Next I look for a bullet that expands evenly for the most part, so I can get a straight hole, and as big around as is needed to do a good job. But years of killing game in many states and several countries have shown me that a somewhat narrower diameter that goes straight and exits is reliable, even if the game runs a short distance. A bullet that breaks up or comes apart, or one that often forms a "J" or "L" and turns course inside the game is not the best. It sometimes works to your advantage and sometimes it doesn't.

So what does this all have to do with the OPs question?
Not much, other then to say I can't give him an answer because I stopped trying to improve on perfect performance in 30 caliber magnums about 15 years ago. I use the 200 grain Partitions now, and I know I am going to be fine.
If in doubt use the 200 grain Partition and forget about the rest.


My opinion:
(May be worth as much as I charged you for it.)

I’ve shot as much game with ballistic tips as any other bullet. They will, eventually, become a problem. When they work, they work well, but I’ve seen them absolutely come unglued. Even the supposed “tough” ones.

Sounds like you lost your point somewhere. The argument for sure.