I guess this is going to start a flame war or whatever, but at least I can say it wasn't intended in the vein.

I have noticed that Zumbo is back! As such, I am curious, are you watching? Are you for giving? Do you have any thoughts on that? Do you care either way?

Opinions of all are welcome, but I am particularly curious as to what the writers will have to say, hence it being here.

Whatever . . . . ..

Hell no he shouldn't be back. Makes us no better than the libtards not to make him pay.

I"ve noticed his show back and admit I even watched a few minutes trying to see if it was a re-run. But haven't had time to fire off letters...

Old bastard needs to stay retired....

I've met the guy at various shows. I thought he was a meaningless tool before he swallowed his foot to the ankle. I don't expect he's any less pompous and foolish now than he was before, so I have no extra interest in watching him or reading his pap now either.

Not a matter of forgiveness, because he has no need of my forgiveness. He had every right to say what he did. Everyone else had every right to react the way they did. He experienced the consequences of his behavior, which is the basis of being an adult. He has no need to change his opinion, nor to stop expressing it. And we have no need to support him or his advertisers.

It's a free will/free market thing. It works, when people don't screw with it.

Dennis

I am all for giving him a second chance.Hopefully he has learned by his mistakes and will be asset instead of a ass.

Ditto. If we don't forgive someone who has offended us we don't get it when we need it. Like the old saying, "what goes around, comes around".

I guess if we can forgive the president of our country sticking a cigar where it wasn't intended,we can forgive some old fool for shooting off his mouth. Doesn't make much differnce to me,I don't watch those hunting shows anyhow.

I liked Jim's show before putting his foot in his mouth and I still like it. He made a mistake, for pete's sake, forgive him and move on.

I guess I missed that one...........can anyone give me the long story short on what went on?

I think the cigar whent where it was intended to go!~

The people who'll never forgive Jim Zumbo are the very same ones who sold all their Rugers and haven't bought any Rugers since Bill Ruger said that no responsible citizen, not in LE, had a need for large capacity magazines.
BTW Jim Zumbo said something to the effect of AR type rifles have no place in the hunting fields because of the negative image they have among non-hunters with all the possible consequences that might bring about for all hunters.

This link will tell the tail...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/23/AR2007022301709.html

And he can say what he wants... but I never have to listen or support those who pay him to say it...
But I hope he has a wonderful life... Without my support

Well, i believe a guy shouldn't crap where he eats........

Forgive??? Not hardly.

Haven't bought a ruger since either..........

Forgive and forget with liberal scum is why we've been stomped on for so long regarding our rights.
No one seems willing to take a stand and willing to let bygones be bygones when the smoke settles.

To some of us, firearms are more than a way of life and tradition.........They're the food that we put on our families tables and not just from hunting.

I take it very personal and there's no excuse for a person with his experience and knowledge to play the ignorance card, let alone claiming to have seen the light later to save his sorry butt.

I WILL BOYCOTT ANYTHING THAT ZUMBO SUPPORTS OR SELLS.

Alpine optics now being one of them.

Speaking for someone I know who has been taken for proud, aloof, and arrogant; who has said things that in restropect have made him cringe at the thought of stupidity personified and who has done countless things he'd undo if possible - me, I find it hard to understand the degree of ire birthed by JZs comments.

In terms of damage done us, I find many of the Outdoor Channel hunting programs to have content that does much more.

Gees I like Jim and have met him several times. To be honest he has done more for the ar market than any body else could have done. I had zero experience until he brought them I now see a ton of them at the range and having a few freinds hunting coyotes with them. You can flame me all you want but I am glad he is back and I am watching his shows at least he does hunt fair chase. I also have several of his books and I didn't burn them either grin!

Well said goodnews!
Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone.
I think I read that somewhere!

you don't have to necessarily condemn him for his past actions ... meaning, no need to cast stones ...

but support him, promote him, or support the products/wares that he promotes? Not hardly ...

Have him stay away from the firearms/hunting scene, and go merrily on his way somewhere that he can't/won't have the opportunity to make the same mistake again ...

I think he is almost singlehandedly resposible for the sale of thousands and thousands of "black rifles" to people who were previously unaware of their versatility until the controversy erupted.

Law of Unintended Consequences at work again.

That said, he's a doofus.

Sorry, but stating that ARs are "terrorist rifles" went WAY beyond forgiveness!!

Yes we can certainly forgive but there are consequeneces
for one's actions.

Especially for those in a national exposure/leadership role. It's not like "one of us" just mouthed off.

Some have said that Zumbo has taken what was a negative and misinformed slip of the tongue, retracted it and moved on."

What a bunch of baloney!!! You think we the shooting public are stupid? This little "poo poo" attitude insults our intelligence.

"For out of the heart the mouth speaks" Luke 6:45

Zumbo has spoken, he spoke what was in his heart and he was not just misinformed. He knew exactly what he was saying, he meant what he said and said what he meant, period!


Zumbo gave the anti's enough ammo to last the rest of his lifetime. He will always be a reminding tool for them.

He just needs to fade away for good.

I don't need him, the "real" shooting public does not need him.

Go away zumbo, for good, your a continual disgrace and black mark
for all shooters, hunters and Sportsman.

I never thought he carried that much authority in the first place. I think WE were more upset about what he said than the anti's were delighted by it.

Sinned?? Yes, but not against the gun community....Not now and not ever.

Jim Zumbo? Who the heck is that?

+1

Here's his original blog comments that got him into hot water (I saved screen shots of his blog web site back when he made his comments on his blog and saved the images):








�Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed; as they are in almost every kingdom in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops that can be, on any pretence, raised in the United States. A military force, at the command of Congress, can execute no laws, but such as the people perceive to be just and constitutional; for they will possess the power, and jealousy will instantly inspire the inclination, to resist the execution of a law which appears to them unjust and oppressive.�
--- Noah Webster, An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution (Philadelphia 1787).
http://www.guncite.com/gc2ndfqu.html


�As civil rulers, not having their duty to the people duly before them, may attempt to tyrannize, and as the military forces which must be occasionally raised to defend our country, might pervert their power to the injury of their fellow-citizens, the people are confirmed by the next article in their right to keep and bear their private arms.�
--- Tench Coxe, "Remarks on the First Part of the Amendments to the Federal Constitution," in the Federal Gazette, June 18, 1789
http://www.guncite.com/gc2ndnew.html



Jim Zumbo didn't understand this back when he made his remarks and I'm not sure that he understands it now. He frequently mentions "hunting" this and "hunting" that in his writings. He's too focused on only "hunting". He strikes me as the type of firearms owner that wouldn't mind if certain types of guns were made illegal as long as he could keep his "hunting" rifle and his "hunting" shotgun. Well, that's a slippery slope and a classic ploy of the anti-gun forces. Slowly nibble away and restrict more and more...

Firearms ownership in this country is not about just hunting. It's about the protection of rights and liberty from a potentially oppressive or abusive government.

My two cents....
-Bob F.

Dennis, man, talk about hitting one 'bout 450 ft to straight away center....Well said. Very well said.

Didn't like him Before. And Still Don't care for him.

Never really had a problem with his show or him. I don't know him so I can't say I don't like him. Do I like or agree with what he said HELL NO.

I don't have a use or a want for an AR. That doesn't mean I don't think others should have one. I could give two schits what you hunt with. If your not hunting with me I don't even care if it is leagl, thats a you problem not my problem. The reason we live here is to say and write whatever we want.

What it boils down to is if you don't like the show or him, the TV has two knobs on it, one shuts it off and the other changes the channel.

OK, I'm done bithcing.

Tom

Zuck Fumbo....

I never found a word he wrote useful. His column in "Shooting Illustrated" was a snore; Wiley Clapp's "Fightin' Iron" is the perfect contrast to Dumbo's addled ramblings.

Zumbo is protected by the first amendment... That's a good thing, the Constitution at work.

Sorry, I cannot say the same about his sponsers... I don't have a requirment or a desire to buy their stuff.

g

the first amendment protects you from 'undue' prosecution for expressing your opinions/thoughts ...

in no way does it mean that you're supposed to just shrug off what someone says because they have 'freedom of speech' ...

the court of "public opinion" can be a mightier force than most seem to give it credit for ...

� Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I see nothing of what you speak. Perhaps I missed something.

g

I'm just saying that the first amendment protects you from the government prosecuting you for voicing your opinions ... that's part and parcel to the "congress shall make no law..."

however, that doesn't mean that the public cannot take action against someone for their thoughts/ideas, by their action or inaction ... i.e. not supporting his sponsors or the goods he promotes, etc...

"Congress shall make no law"

That is a prohibition on Federal lawmaking and nothing more. There is no freedom to speak without criticism, there is only freedom to speak without prosecution by the government or prospective prevention, depending on where, when and how you propose to do so.

Despite the "sin" of Bill Ruger nobody can say that Bill Ruger didn't do a whole lot to promote and advance the cause of firearms in America during his lifetime (and continues to even in death). His perceived transgression in the 1990's in no way minimizes his remarkable body of work and his leadership role in American firearms.
Point is no man should be judged on one utterance.

I understand your point. I'd just prefer to not criticize the man if that's the way he feels. I will however refrain from supporting his sponsers and will freely express my opinion on the situation if the subject arises.

We're on the same sheet of music concerning the 1st

g

We all have the Right to free speech. However, when a gun writer says something that alienates the people they make a living from... Think of one of the Dixie Chicks shooting off her mouth about the President five years ago. I think JZ is entitled to his opinion just as Natalie Maines was to hers. If, how, when, and where he express that unpopular opinion determined how JZ's readers and viewers expressed THEIR OPINIONS of his views...
I believe JZ has suffered enough for ill stating his opinion on AR15 rifles. If he thought about it more maybe he would recall all the hunting rifles built on Mauser and Springfield actions out there. Good luck JZ. idahoguy101

Is he back with Outdoor Life? Thanks...Bill.

Never did care much for him,I haven't missed him at all.

I'm not so sure he was wide of the mark. It must upset the
"Bird Watchers" to meet a man carrying an "Assault rifle".
P.O. Ackley warned of the same thing 50 years ago.
He probably was talking about M1"s but the point is the same.
The Supreme Court ruled that we have a right to ownership,
but it will be "controlled". What the controls will be depend
on our actions and words. It may be a macho rush to chant
"from my cold dead hands" but it scares the rest of the
voters.
Good Luck!

Jim Zumbo before/after/show rates a yawn with me. Don't watch his shows or read his articles other than in a once every couple years forced circumstance such a a dentist office etc. where there is nothing else to read. Same goes for the outdoor media as a whole. I can think of about three or four magazines/writers that are subscription worthy, IMO.

I posted my opinion on Jim's comments long ago, when the fireball first flared up. Mostly I said he had every right to say what he did, but was obviously ignorant about the 2nd Amendment. So I am only going to comment on the side effects here, including some of things that have been posted on this thread:

1) Jim Zumbo never was a "gun writer." He's a hunting writer. There's a huge difference--though there are some people out there who are gun AND hunting writers.

2) I have known Jim Zumbo for about 30 years. He is about a liberal as George Bush.

3) Jim has now been solidly educated on the fundamentals of the 2nd Amendment, and has hunted a lot with AR's--and has fun shooting them.

4) If he had made his comments in the days before the Internet, there would have been a few letters to the editor at OUTOOR LIFE, and then the whole thing would have blown over. Or the editor would have said beforehand (because there was time to do so in print media), "Jim, you sure you want to say this? Maybe you should do a little research first."

5) I guess it is now an American tradition to condemn for life anybody who's said something stupid and uninformed. If that is so, logically we should place every politician of any persuasion under house arrest for their lifetime.

By the way, about four months after Jim posted his blog, I stayed at the very same Wyoming hotel where he wrote it. I even stayed in the same room. Several of the other writers there offered to search me and confiscate any electronic writing implements before letting me unpack, but unlike many writers I don't travel with a laptop or even a cellphone. All I had was a ballpoint pen and notebook, so anything stupid I wrote down would take some effort to send into cypberspace, and I'd have time to reconsider.

MD - thanks for an excellent summation/appraisal with very good things to consider. Hopefully your bona fides will merit the attention your post deserves. Best, John

JB ... while I generally agree with you, there's a point that I still take issue with ...

Zumbo made a stupid mistake, against the people/things that have afforded him a good living. He provided ammunition for the anti-crowd to use against us for a long time, because as a noted person in the hunting/shooting field, he spoke out against our second amendment.

I would liken that to the husband that hit his wife - only one time, in a fit of rage - it's still not acceptable in any way, and is almost unforgivable ... sure, if he'd hit someone else, it would still be "wrong", but at least he might have been doing it to protect his family - instead of directly hurting it.

That's kinda how I see this ... but like I said, I'm not saying that the guy should be stripped of all worldly possessions and thrown into the fiery pit ... I'm just saying it will be a while before he receives my forgivness, and a very long time before he or any of his 'sponsors' receives my support ...

I think that's fair enough, and would expect the same against me were I to bite the hand that feeds me ...

JB: Your points are well-taken. The "problem" with the internet, emails,and so forth, is that they allow the instant communication to anyone,anywhere,of every thought, rational or otherwise,that crosses an individual's mind in a given moment.In the business world, I see it all the time.And missing from the equation is the "cooling-off" period necessary to avoid saying something foolish before the whole world see's it.

I, for one, am glad Zumbo has climbed back because he seems to be a really decent guy who has been a good nuts and bolts hunting writer and communicator on behalf of our sport(s)for many years. I happen to enjoy his hunting TV programs.

Oh, that Jim Zumbo just made an ignorant slip of the tongue.

BS.

I'll bet anybody that after the elections the anit's will be pouring it on and I guarantee you we'll be hearing Zumbo's name and comments and if he is back in the saddle that just gives them
all the more ammo to use against us.


I don't care if he's gun writer or hunting writer he's a scribe with a national audience that crapped all over our rights.

btw, I don't even own a black rifle and probably never will.

MD

I'm not sure his being as "liberal as George Bush" is necessarily a great endorsement.....proof can be found in the recent Heller case in the brief filed by the Bush administration.....not exactly what you would expect to see from a 2nd amendment believer...or, maybe you are referring to Bush 1.......who gave us the executive order banning import of "assault weapons"??????

I don't believe the fact that the internet was used to publicize Zumbo's blog is any excuse for what Zumbo said.....it's not like the internet changed anything other than the number of people who now know his opinion and the speed at which his opinion was spread.......he meant what he said and I don't believe he deserves to be trusted or "forgiven"......EVER!!!

As far as having time to reconsider........reconsider what.......the fact that he said black rifles are "terrorist rifles", or the fact that he believes it??? The fact that he believes it is enough for me to never trust the guy again.........

Zumbo is a JUDAS.......he has the right to his opinion, but, with his actions come consequences.......

With "pro-gun" people like him, who needs liberals?

He has a right to say whatever he wants, and I have the right to ignore him.

He can seek forgiveness in church.

As for me, wouldn't cross the street to pee on him if he was on fire.

SOS

Jim Zumbo ran his mouth, got a well deserved kick in the nutsack, claims to have been "educated", is actively promoting that which he spoke against and seems to have learned a lesson. He's infamous now, and probably will not make the same mistake again.

Can he be trusted to do the right thing when nobody is looking? Probably not. Good thing lots of folks are looking... & thanks to the internet, there aren't many "secrets" out there.

The response was swift and unbending. This shows just how effective the internet is, as a tool to "educate" those who have something to lose, like Jim Zumbo. The tougher nuts to crack are those who have nothing to lose by publicly hanging on to their stereotypes and closed minded opinions. The ones with the absurd notions that if only we ban the "mean looking" guns, theirs will be safe.

It's a certain recipe for disaster that is proven with the newest "Heller vs DC" twist. Any semi-automatic pistol is classified as a "Machine Gun". Yep, if only we give up the 1911's and Glocks, the rest will be safe....

Never had much use for someone who hunts big game in a black cowboy hat. All he needs is some Red Ryder gloves with them fringe to complete the outfit....

I think JZ was demonstratably correct in his assessment of the public's opinion of "black rifles"- that they are not sporting and have no business in the hunting fields. I think the public opinion is WRONG in this regard, but I do think he was right about that being what the public opinion IS.

Worries about that exact thing have stopped me from carrying an AR at my private-land honeyhole; I don't want to freak out the landowner's wife, in particular.

That's just reality; AR's have been imprinted on the public conciousness since Vietnam as weapons of war, not sporting arms.

However I think he was insane to post that, and I think he deserved what he got in terms of backlash. WGM put it well- he's part of the gun "family" so it was a particularly unkind cut.

I met him at the Sportsman's Show in Portland last year. I shook his hand. He seemed like a nice enough guy. I dunno, I have a hard time holding a grudge... my take on it is, if he's indeed become educated about it, and is indeed actively promoting AR's at this point... then I for one would give him the benefit of the doubt and basically move forwards...

(I have owned (4) black rifles and currently own one. I am a big fan. And I believe they are crucial for the defense of our liberty. The above is my take on what "reality" IS, not what I wish it was!)

Bighorn; That's funny. I met a guide once who had long white hair, beard about a week old, and wore a gray cowboy hat. He had a elkskin coat with fringe on the sleeves that he wore in fourth of July parades where he lived, and was quite a character. I grew to really like the old guy, but at first I wondered what I had gotten myself into. Going by a person's appearance, as far as judging a person's character, is a sign of the immature...but you couldn't have told me that before I gave him a chance.

"Black Rifles" are a lot like some of the large breed guard dogs, there is nothing wrong with them but there sure are a lot of morons attracted to them which in turn reflect poorly on others who are responsible owners. I don't agree with his comments but I can sure see where they caome from.

I absolutely agree. The morons who think the Black rifles are the only way & call any bolt rifle a "Fudd" gun are just as bad as the intolerant morons who immediately think anyone who hunts with an AR is a moron.

Kinda like the fellow totin' his "Thutty Thutty" that he shoots once a year into a twelve inch group, the day before hunting season, who proclaims loudly that the AR-15 someone else is shooting into sub MOA, "..is just good for "killin'." (Does his rifle give CPR?)... For every "tacticool commando" AR dude, I'll match with a Fudd as described above only. Both are the extreme fringes and harm the overall goal, IMO.

Shooting a "Thutty Thutty" doesn't make one a "Fudd", same as having a "Black rifle" doesn't make one a "Tacticool commando".

It's the behavior of the person that carries either of these tools that makes them idiots, not the tool.

Any rifle is an assault rifle if the objective of the user is to assault. And they will be thusly treated if we allow. Dzumbo said what he meant. I only hope he has truly repented.

This is why you are better than Zumbo.

Discretion really is the better part of valor.

BMT

Damned if ya do and damned if ya don't.
Some hunters don't like black rifles but won't say bad about em for fear a loss to any gun ownership. Some hunters like em and shoot em and some hunters hunt with em.
Would be interesting as to what the numbers are one way or the other.

Public hunting land is a clear playing field on that debate.

Private hunting property owners that I know don't allow em and I don't ask why.
Would be interesting to know the numbers amoung them also.

Well... not really. From Wikipedia:

"The term "assault weapon" in the context of civilian rifles has been attributed to gun-control activist Josh Sugarmann. Assault weapon refers to semi-automatic firearms (that is, firearms that, when fired, automatically extract the spent casing and load the next round into the chamber, ready to fire again) that were developed from earlier fully-automatic weapons. By former U.S. law the legal term assault weapon included certain specific semi-automatic firearm models by name (e.g., Colt AR-15, H&K G36E, TEC-9, all AK-47s, and Uzis) and other semi-automatic firearms because they possess a minimum set of features from the following list of features:


Folding or telescoping stock
Conspicuous pistol grip
Bayonet mount
Flash suppressor, or threaded barrel designed to accommodate one
Grenade launcher (more precisely, a muzzle device which enables the launching or firing of rifle grenades)..."

"The earlier term assault rifle, refers to rifles that are select-fire (that is, rifles that are capable of either semi-automatic or fully-automatic fire), firing intermediate-power rounds (such as the 5.56 x 45 mm NATO, or 7.62 x 39 mm), which along with fully automatic pistols, provided the pre-cursor for the term "assault weapon.""

Not trying to be argumentative, but, the term "assault rifle" has widely accepted meaning in both military and civvie circles...

I completely agree with the sub-text of your comment, Shootem.

-jeff

Come on Jeff, how liberal are you? Those definitions are no older than the repealed ban.....

They certainly don't fit the brown bess, or trapdoor etc...

That is simply a modern liberal definition, one helped out by azzholes like dumbo.

Jeff

SA Charlie

How many landowners do you know, and they all don't allow them? I never saw that in any lease contracts we've ever entered into. Not that I'd sign one written by a dumbazz.
What part of TX is this in?

Jeff

Agree wholeheartedly. Have none of you who are so vehement in your opinion of him never changed your mind about an issue or since you grew up? Gee, I wish some of our politicians would be more open to other ways of seeing things and change their mind with new or different evidence. Sure, in the world of instant communication, his comment's malestrom caught him with toilet paper in his shoe but then he went out, saw that he was mistaken and changed his mind. That doesn't automatically make it expediency as some cynics suggest and is independant of whether you like his writing, or the content of his shows, which I don't particularly.

It's simply understanding that the guy commented honestly, caught a tsunami of grief for it and then reversed himself. Whether or not he really changed his mind I don't think we can judge unless he tells us which I would now doubt.

Gdv

Those are indeed modern definitions. My bad.

However, my point still stands. The term "assault rifle" does NOT mean "any rifle being used to assault somebody" (to paraphrase Shootem). In fact, the term goes back to the middle of the last century, to wit:

"The (German) MP-43 was a revolutionary design in all respects, not just the cartridge. For one big thing, the gas piston and cylinder that operated the mechanism were placed on TOP of the barrel, rather than underneath as had been standard practice in previous automatic rifles. (E.g. the BAR.) This put the line of the barrel much lower, thus causing the recoil to come straight back toward the shoulder, rather than on a line above it as with conventional rifles; and this made it much easier to control in rapid fire. Following the same principle, the butt came almost straight back compared to the usual rifle design, and there was a pistol grip like that of a submachine gun, which further made the weapon easier to handle, especially when fired from the hip. It had a long magazine holding 30 rounds, and this was detachable for rapid reloading.

The MP-43 also had the capability of selective fire - it could be fired either semi-automatically, as a rifle, or full-auto like a submachine gun. It was quite accurate on semi-auto, and on full-auto at short range it would just about cut a man in half.

The German troops loved it - the few who got their hands on it; it never did attain anything like full production. The Russians found it fascinating, and promptly began to study it.

There was one more change, toward the end of 1944; not a technological one, but one of nomenclature. The CEO of Germany, one A. Hitler of whom you may have heard, was tremendously pleased with the new rifle, and bestowed on it the name "Sturmgewehr."

Meaning "assault rifle." "

This is from an excellent treatise on the subject, to be found here:

http://www.sff.net/people/sanders/ar.html

Go check it out, it's very interesting. Lots of neat illustrations etc.

-jeff

+1....exactly my feelings!

Difference being, most of us don't bite the hands that feed us!

I own several black rifles, I can assure you none of them are "terrorist rifles" as proclaimed by Zumbo.........

I don't think Zumbo would have seen anywhere near the backlash he did if he had simply said he didn't think they were suitable for hunting, or that he thought they might give a bad impression to the general public.......but, he said they are "terrorist rifles" and that statement is simply unforgivable......

Dumbo's not repentant over what he said, I'm not stupid enough to believe that.

Dumbo feels bad because of this...$$$. Lost revenue out of his pocket.

The liberals are and will celebrate their new poster boy who
handed them a propaganda list.

The guy is an idiot and so are the sponsors who are trying to support his comeback. It all amounts to greed for money at our expense.

Jeff

Yes and no in agreement.

The point is that no one called the springfield or the M1 garand, or the 98 etc.... assault weapons, yet they were some of the most advanced battle weapons of the day. They were used for assault.

I'm really touchy on this situation as I've been acosted by the ATF using the same word and I told them they could have their friggin FFL if they didn't get their head outta their azz.... I still have it though. I am surprised but I digress.

Anyway its a sore thing. Dumbo was and is stupid. I don't see him regretting any more than the money. And I never thought he was anywhere NEAR swift to start with. He SCREWED us bad, he can pay for a long time as he has done damage that will take years to recover from if ever.

Jeff

Jeff, I agree it's a politically-charged term, and that the definition has largely been accomplished by those who are AGAINST them (assault rifles). It's a term used to scare soccer mom's and grannies and pantywaist suburbanite office jockeys.

But, the TRUTH in what Zumbo said, in regards to public perception, can't be denied. I remember when I got my first "assault rifle"... a Ruger Mini 14 (don't shoot, I was dumb(er) then, I apologize <g>!)... anyways, my otherwise rational wife whom I love dearly said something like "That thing looks like it wants to KILL somebody!"

Now obviously that statement is WRONG on so many levels that it's comical, and yet, an intelligent, free-thinking, person couldn't help it from popping out of her mouth.

And there's millions more like her.

No argument whatsoever about Zumbo being wrong in what he said, and wrong for saying it in the first place. I'm just exploring the issue beyond what he said a little. You know, just me being me <G>.

-jeff

Jim Zumbo has never been high on my ladder since I met him at a writers' conference.

His writings are good. (I've edited some of it and read more.) But I've known more than a few human anuses who wrote good stuff, as well as a few good guys who wrote stuff that I wouldn't print on used Charmin.

I don't begrudge Zumbo anything, but he gets nothing worth having from me.

Jeff
Kinfolk in So. TX...they even raise hell about neighboring ranches.
Friends in hillcountry_LLano area.

I remember as a kid hunting with oldtimers that frowned if ya fired twiced at a deer and ya didn't joy shoot at all.

I know the reason with my kin down south is hog hunters.

This is only a handfull of folks but thats all the ranchers I know.

Therefore my interest as to the number of landowners with the same attitude.

Jim Zumbo is still working, still has industry support. Poor Jim Zumbo.

Its not like he re-canted the minute it came out.
He's kinda like a C.E.O. running a company into the ground, leaving, only to land a multi-million dollar job somewhere else. He'll still get to hunt and shoot more than I ever will, and I've never spouted off about what tools folks use to eat (sorry we are all not "trophy hunters" or "experts" like Jim).
Some may call it envy, I call it B.S..

Regarding JB's #5; I wish it WERE and American tradition, unfortunately Rosanne Barr, the Dixie Chicks, Jane Fonda, Linda Ronstadt and now Jim Zumbo all still do what they have always done.

+1

-Bob F.

I saw Zumbo two or three times in Salt Lake City when the Mule Deer or Elk Foundations held their annual gatherings, and came away with a similar opinion expressed above.

Like anyone else Zumbo has a right to make a living, even the convicted con who did his time in prison. But I doubt like the proverbial leopard Zumbo has changed his spots, and feel no need to change my beliefs about the guy.

Oh well.

Spot-on!

One of my personal policies is to give anyone I first meet the benefit of a doubt, unless they they do or have done something that shows me they don't deserve my trust!

Trust is a funny and very big thing with me. If I don't ever trust someone, I'm always suspicious of them. Once I loose trust of someone, I'm ALWAYS lerry of them. Even if I forgive them. PERIOD!

I had never heard of Jim Zumbo until he did a write up for one of the cartridges in the Nosler manual. Never got familiar with him 'cause I don't watch TV. As a couple others mentioned on this thread, his actions did a lot to bring black rifles to the mainstream. When the SHTF over his stupid comments it seems the shooting press were stumbling all over themselves to run AR articles, just to show they weren't infected with the Zumbo mentality. Prior to that, you would almost think that some publications had been editorially sanitized to remove even the mention of black rifles.

Personally, I have no animosity toward the man, but certainly no respect from someone so obviously out of touch with such a large segment of the population that supports him.

I can forgive the guy, just won't ever read his articles or watch his shows ever again. No question his actions deserve some consequences. And the Socialists definitely will use his comments next year against gun rights.

He's tired alright. But, just like Jimmy Swaggart, he's too full of himself to admit it.

The "Black Rifle" is used by scores of United States civilians in CMP High Power matches at the grass roots level across America.

By JZ labeling the AR as a terrorist weapon he has disrespected the very core shooting organization (CMP) that has promoted responsible civilian shooting sports.

He shall remain on my list of those who will be discounted as irrelevant.

Does anyone else find it ironic that one of his major sponsore, Remington, now sells and promotes their own "black rifles," except they are camo, not black.

Did anyone catch Ted Nuegent on the Outdoor Channel this weekend? He was plinking with a black AR-15 with a nice blue Leupold scope painted with the American flag. At least twice he said he was paying tribue to "our good friend Jim Zumbo".

It was pure Nuegent.

The Nuge had Zumbo on his show shortly after the "incident" and gave Zumbo an opportunity to make a statement rehabilitating himself. Ted liked it, but I thought the statement felll well short of what it should have been.

Ted is in the "we're all in this thing together" camp - dissension is bad nwithin our ranks.

Was on a hunt once with him and SU35 has hit the nail on the head, though I'd go a bit further and say Zumbo is about at the pinnacle of Dumbf%#kitude.

His writings are/have been garbage..........when I met him I just wondered how he could even find his own azz with both hands, much less an elk or a mule deer of any significance.

MM

I'm sure that's why Remington dumped him. They had the deal in the works and he didn't know it. I notice Dumbo still hunts with Remington rifles and they don't sponser the show.

O

After Jimbo's little folly of shooting himself in the foot and then sticking both of said feet in his own mouth I think he's going to limp the rest of his life.

I am wondering if Zumbo ever joined the NRA? It seems even if he reasoned the way he did about assault rifles, that he would have known politically not to write it.
If I was a sponser like say Remington, I would want any writer that I am sponsoring to be NRA educated about political pitfalls with firearms.

Recent new Zumbo shows with the Remington marketing/PR wizard: Shooting (not much hunting) exotic deer on a ranch in Florida. Looked pretty canned to me.
Next show I saw, she shot a black bear while a sow & 2 cubs were in vicinity. Great judgement there. I'm afraid Zumbo & Remington have both turned me off.

What a GREAT POST John!

SO TRUE!

I just recently added Outdoor channel and got a chance to see Zumbo in action...gotta admit, the mystique was better than the reality....it's not show I watch anymore

Nevermind. I misstook this for the the General discussion section, and its the Gunwriter's section. Geez, I'm sorry.

Verbal fellatio..........

MM

Well....Yeah, really.

You can use Wiko or Websters or the Democrat Platform; whatever you wish. The bare facts of the matter is that all this BS about what constitutes an "Assault Rifle" is just exactly that. [u]The end result is determined by the user, not the philosopher. [/u][u] You may agree with whatever label is put upon it but a rifle is only a tool. It is the human mind and manifestation that transforms it into whatever the user wishes, be it an instrument of murder or a boat paddle.

yup ...

it ain't the fork that made Rosie O'Donnell so fat ... it's the fact that she can't stop using it to shove so much crap down her throat with it ...

And to follow liberal logic there'd be a 3 day waiting period (or Instant Check with your local sheriff's approval) to buy silverware.

You know, seems to me that everyone should be entitled to a mistake or two. Mia culpa, some genuflection and we should forgive him.

Kinda remember that there was supposed to have been only one perfect person to ever exist.

If he says something similar again though...

A so called expert in the field of hunting and shooting writing the blog that he did want to ban so called "black rifles" and calling them the weapon of choice of terroist (of course the AK-37 is their weapon odf choice), is not a mistake it is the way he feels and if it was a mistake then he is not whom I want to read and or follow his advice, because it clarly proves that he is indeed not an expert or even reasonably informed

+1

Fast Ed

I have to admit I've never found him interesting to watch at all and will skip over him when I see his show on the guide anyway.

I can't understand why anybody would waste time or money on a
product pimp.

"a mistake or two"?

How's about putting his name to the most God Awful "hunting" knife I've ever seen?
It's a step up from a dull axe in design but not much.

Sorry Jimbo there's some things that just cross the line of common decency....

I understand where you guys are coming from, and I respect your opinions on Zumbo's show. Personally, I'd much rather watch him than Jackie Bushman (he should be selling used cars)or some of the other guys that I see on these shows. Also, I'd rather watch the type of hunting that Zumbo does --- Moose, elk, muledeer and bears --- than see another turkey get called in, or get another view from a treestand in the brush. TEHO.
The guy screwed up, apologized, and is an asset to our cause now. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt; and if he screws up again, I'll hang him.
Zumbo as a show host may not be perfect, but watching his show is better than "Queer Eye For The Straight Guy" or some such other trash.

It's too bad JZ engaged his mouth before his brain, but everyone makes blunders. I like his show, except I get really jealous at the opportunities he gets. I don't know him personally but I'll give him a second chance. Other TV guys pull worse crap than he did.

-

NAME THEM !!!!

Yes, I too would like to know the names of these "Other TV guys". Along with their, names please include what "crap" they pulled.

Thanks

Zumbo's statement is kinda like having a 30 year professor proclaim to all of his students and colleagues that Einstein's Theory of Relativity is false............

He had decades of information at his disposal and walked arm and arm with the NRA, yet still posted his drivel.............

Anything he would say at this point that would be contradictive to his original thoughts on the subject would merely be a lie.

I could excuse a life-long liberal for making such ignorant statements long before Zumbo. At least they would have had an excuse.

Well, his ignorance did make me go out and buy an AR Now I just need someone to call a H&H double a "terrorist weapon"

Maybe Wolfe Publishing will offer him JB's beat...

I bought one too, but not because of Dumbo............

...That's the spirit!




Casey

This is not a good place to be... Its not edifying!

I don't know J. Zumbo personally but I've enjoyed his writings. One of the most intelligent and humorous pieces I've ever read on moose hunting came from him in American Hunter's OUTFITTERS, 2006. At least I could identify with him, which I can't say of those who mostly hunt mulies, mountain goats, grizzlies or African game.

Let it rest! I'm already tired of these threads that can think of nothing better than character assination! As Jesus said on one occasion: "Let the one who has never sinned throw the first stone". And on another: "If you do not forgive you will not be forgiven".

I think I'll go elsewhere...

"We don't need to be lumped into the group of people who terrorize the world with them,..."

Jimbo, I carried one of those black rifles for 27 years in defense of this country, including your right to run your stupid mouth. My son carries one today. I'm kinda proud of that.

Forgive, maybe. Forget? No.

Watch your show? Support your advertisers? Hell no.

++
Thank you and your son for your service
T

I can't be bothered even giving an assault style - AR type rifle a second look unless it is set up for national course match shooting, then it is a target rifle IMO.
But just because i don't like them doesn't mean I think they should be run down, bad mouthed , or otherwise discriminated against.
Nor should the people that like them.
The people that figure they are no good, shouldn't be allowed in hunting areas or on a range however, get a good bit of attention from me, and it is the sort of attention they do not like!

I stand firm on firearms ownership, whatever the type it is, as long as it is not used for criminal intent.
Zumbo is an snob of the worst type IMHO....
Cat

Sir, If more people had your attitude our rights would be safe. Thanks for having an open mind.