Any gunwriters aware of these? Seems they want to keep tight control and not release them into the U.S. for fear of potentially being copied!Did Ruger miss the boat when they didn't neck down their 375 Ruger case?



They claim that their 7mm Blaser Magnum moderately loaded at factory with 140gr. bullets will easily achieve 3150FPS; handloaded potential may be much higher??! But no belt, LOW gas pressure, increased accuracy, better cases...

They claim that their .300 Blaser Magnum moderately loaded at factory with 165gr. bullets will easily achieve 3120FPS; handloaded potential may be much higher??!But no belt, LOW gas pressure, increased accuracy, better cases...



http://www.blaser.de/uploads/media/Blaser_Magnum_Ammunition_03.pdf

Blaser Magnum

New generation of cartridges by Blaser and Norma

7mm Blaser Magnum
.300 Blaser Magnum
.338 Blaser Magnum
.375 Blaser Magnum

In cooperation with Norma, Blaser has developed a brand new generation of high-performance cartridges. No existing calibres were copied. Instead, the latest ammunition technology was applied to achieve the optimum performance in each calibre group. A pleasant change in the history of ammunition: Both high-quality manufacturers were equally keen to avoid any compromises with the production of their joint venture.

The product development was determined by the following key factors:



notably increased precision values
higher performance in terms of energy and speed at low gas pressure
more comfortable recoil effects
enhanced reliability
perfectly suitable for reloading

Thanks to an optimised cartridge geometry, stable cartridge base and modern powder types together with 4-groove barrel profiles and adapted twist rates, all development objectives have been achieved.
To start with, Blaser will distribute loads with Nosler Accubond and Barnes TSX/TTSX cartridges whereas Norma will offer additional loads under their own company label. Additional Blaser loads are in progress.
All Blaser R93 and K95 models can now be ordered in the new calibres (K95 in calibers 7mm, .300 and .338). Delivery of rifles and cartridges starts from August 2009.


Download PDF technical data (2.6 MB)


Note
Blaser ammunition is not offered for sale, sold, or distributed in North America.

Actually Blaser offers the following loads:

7 mm Blaser Magnum: 9.1 g / 140 gr Nosler Accu-Bond
.300 Blaser Magnum: 11.7 g / 180 gr Barnes TTSX (lead-free)
.300 Blaser Magnum: 10.7 g / 165 gr Blaser CDP
.338 Blaser Magnum: 13.6 g / 210 gr Barnes TTSX (lead-free)
.338 Blaser Magnum: 13.0 g / 200 gr Nosler Accu-Bond
.375 Blaser Magnum: 17.5 g / 270 gr Barnes TSX

They claim reduced recoil. Using cases, they claim higher potential for reloaders.

Nosler and Barnes were apparently part of the testing. This is a joint venture between Blaser and Norma! Just like Ruger and Hornady!

Imagine a potential handloaded 7mm 140gr @3300FPS; no belt; LOW gas pressure, increased accuracy, better cases
Imagine a potential handloaded 300 165gr @3300FPS; no belt; LOW gas pressure, increased accuracy, better cases

• notably incresed precision values
• higher performance in terms of energy and speed at low gas pressure
• more comfortable recoil effects
• enhanced reliability
• perfectly suitable for reloading
  

yawn..



Mike

Blaser Magnum

Link from May on 24hr. Not knowing what the dimension of the case is...can't imagine it's something radically different...but who knows, maybe they have.

All in a standard length action and with the ability to win long-range shooting matches or shoot you that trophy deer, elk, sheep...or take to Africa or hunt hogs or kill B&C Pronghorns...

You're right, anyone with their case capacities in grains of water? They look just a little larger than the 7mm rem magnum, 300 win mag, 338 win mag and about identical to the 375 Ruger.

Right......folks on here have expressed a desire for this since the 375 Ruger showed up,hoping this would be the next line of cartridges Hornady would bring out. Instead we got the RCM's or whatever you call those shorter things....These are likely very similar to the Dakota lineup of cartridges.

This has to be one of the longest product launches in the history of the industry. CP.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth..._Norma_s_new_chamberings_and#Post2184433

Wow this is just what the hunting world needs!

A new line of proprietary cartridges not available in the US that are loaded under their potential for an expensive rifle...........................DJ

Blaser rifles blow IMO and these cartridges do nothing for me.

Not sure why anyone would care, there are lots of cartridges, ammunition in other countries that is not available in the US.

[quote=BobinNH...folks on here have expressed a desire for this since the 375 Ruger showed up,hoping this would be the next line of cartridges Hornady would bring out....These are likely very similar to the Dakota lineup of cartridges. [/quote]

Exactly. Very similar to Dakota, but with Norma brass! I think that it's great to have more choices. If us consumers ask for them, we'll get them in the U.S.

With globalization, I can get these cartridges into the US various ways. All I need are a few hundred cases for life. Looks like more options the better.

Finally! After nearly 100 years a major(?) manufacturer is going to take the Newton cartridge design and run with it! GD

When I opened the thread I was expecting an announcement from Speer/CCI about some aluminum cased, low cost, throwaway ctgs in center-fire rifle ammo.
You know, the empties that litter every rifle range, gravel pit, and any other shooting area.

Yes, it's great.

Mule deer, 458Win., the Bod, any comments?
Looks like they will compete directly against the semi-proprietaries from Ruger/Hornady/Dakota/Lazzeroni?

Hello All,
Just how many times are Charles Newtons cartridges going to be "reinvented" over the last 95 years. Change a couple thousands here or there, bingo, a "new" cartridge. Give credit where credit is due. Several magnum calibers, all fitting into standard length actions, all producing about 3.000 feet per second or more, without a belted case, reduced felt recoil, and all years before Remington or Winchester would introduce their first commercial bolt action rifles!
Visit www.NewtonArmsCompany.com and check out the Newton Rifle Cartridge Reloader Association page. It may be informative and fun.

More "Me Too" cartridges are just plain boring. It has been covered. The animal varience is not there justify a "gap".

I wrote in the 80's that the next valuable contribution to our insutry was going to be powders. I was right on the money wioth that one but I did not forsee the bullets that came along at the same time.

At that period in time, I did not see any visionaries in the bullet manufacturing industry. I am very glad I was wrong.

Wow...more high-dollar copy-cats. Maybe Lazzeroni will sue them or something...has to be close.

Easy to see why brooksrange is supportive and interested, though...another compelling ignorance for him to support as if he actually knew something.

Very little that will make me yawn like this intro...

Dennis

And folks - not only are we offering yet another set of "miracle cartridges" - each one of which will defy all of the known laws of physics but we also will be marketing a new and improved "Miracle Gun-Oil" which in addition to cleaning your barrel, if drank, will cure high blood pressure, impotence, incontinence, all known cancers and even Alzheimers! It may even help you grow old - but backwards!

If you hurry and order in the next 24 hours we will also throw in a brand new set of barrel patches that have a retail value of $57.99 - for a mere $17.99 additional price!

Act now - this is a limited time offer with amounts limited to four orders per family!

Coming soon - Blaser Rifles that will be as accurate as the average Savage rifle!

Now I think you are just asking for too much on that one.....

I just returned last night from Texas where a few gun writers were able to shoot the new Blaser R8 rifle. What they told me is that there are some copyright issues to work out here in the U. S. regarding the name for the ammo. Blaser vs Blazer. That is on track to be solved and they will launch the ammo here sometime later this year. I did get a chance to check out the .375 Blaser while I was in Sweden this past fall and I liked it.
I guess we will see how well any of the cartridges will do in the U.S.

By the way, I don�t have any inclination to get into an internet pissing contest, but those of you who don�t think much of the accuracy of the Blaser, probably have not used them much. In my experience the rifles are very accurate. I have tested several in multiple cartridges over the past few years and they have all be exceptionally accurate. That includes both the R93 and the K95 single shot.

I have a K95 with an octagon barrel in .243 Winchester. By rights a single shot with an octagon barrel should not shoot, but this is an honest � inch rifle. The R93 I tested for some NRA articles in .223 Remington, .300 Winchester and .375 H&H is an honest sub MOA gun with five, five shot groups in any of the cartridges. With select loads it�s even better. The skinny barrel .223 will put handloads in one ragged hole at 100 yards. I shot another .300 Winchester quite a bit on a range in Africa a couple of years back with Norma 200 grain Oryx loads and was getting sub-inch groups at 200 yards. I think that�s pretty good for any factory rifle.
With the several of the new R8 rifles I shot sub MOA groups out to 600 yards earlier this week. I had one 5 shot group at 600 yards with a .300 Winchester that was about four inches. That was at the end of the day after every other writer had shot the gun. The bore had a few hundred rounds through it without cleaning and the barrel was too hot to touch. Probably not the best conditions. I had several 100 yard groups with a .308 and a couple of different Federal factory loads that were close to half-inch. I shot Federal ammo in a .22-250 at 300 yards and all my groups were sub MOA.
They might be pricy, but Blasers will shoot.

Bryce

Thanks for sharing Mr. Towsley. We appreciate your insider insight on this board. I wish you'd post more.

Splain your self.Why by rights ,would a single shot rifle with an octagon barrel not shoot??????I have quite a few Highwalls(original) that easily do that.(Sub inch groups).Not trying to be a smart ass,I don't understand why you made that statement,please clarify.Thanks,Huntz

Sure,


In my experience modern single shot rifles are usually not as accurate as some other rifle styles. There are always exceptions, I.E. my statement about not wanting to get in a pissing contest.

Also in my experience, modern octagon barrels, which tend to be a lot thinner than what is probably on your High Wall also do not shoot as accurately on average as similar diameter round barrels. In fact that came subject up in conversation with several experienced custom gun makers I recently had dinner with and to a man they all agreed with that premise. What may make the difference with the Blaser is because they CNC grind the flats on barrels, rather than milling. They say it induces fewer stress problems and the evidence, at least with my rifle, says they are right.
The high walls, rolling blocks, Sharps, etc. are usually much different rifles. Most are chambered for low intensity cartridges and have massive barrels and frames. I have reproductions of all of them and have shot several original rifles and agree that they can be very accurate.

Bryce

Thanks for your explanation.I dont have any modern guns with octagon.I like the looks of the Blaser`s,just cant afford one.Huntz

UMT...

With all due respect, your expectations of octagon barreled rifles sure is different than mine...

This quote especially got me-

"By rights a single shot with an octagon barrel should not shoot. "


Browning/Mirouku has been making B-78,and 1885 high wall and low wall rifles that shoot well for over 30 years now. Not to mention Shiloh , C Sharps and a HOST of other makers..

I've owned about a dozen Brownings with octagon barrels and they shot like a house afire. I have owned those guns in 22 hornet, 223 ,22-250 ,243, 25-06 and .270.

I have never had trouble getting ANY of them to shoot 1/2" groups with a good load- sometimes with cheap factory ammo. The 1885 low walls have been especially accurate given the fact they aonly weigh 6.5 lbs and have external hammers.


I've also owned quite a few Shilohs, Pedersolis ,and Uberti replicas in 1885 and 74 sharps replicas. I shot NRA BPCR for years using Shilosh and shot into a Master Classification using an off the shelf Pedersoli. They all shot very well, too. No trick to get 1 MOA groups with a good jacketed bullet load if you can shoot the rifle well enough to do it..

My suggestion to you would be to get a sample of the new 1885 Winchester Low wall rifles. If you give that rifle as fair of a shake as you have the Blaser you tested, I think you will be amazed at how well it shoots.

In fact I have shot several of the new Winchester reproduction High Wall rifles. Perhaps you didn�t read my second posting?

I did ,sir..

And you were not specific with regards to the actual models, calibers or performance of the guns you may have shot in the past..

You merely claimed the accuracy of the Blaser to be superior.

And as I have said.. based my on own actual (and not inconsiderable)experience with Octagon barrels both factory and custom chmabered in many cartriges seems the exact opposite of yours.

And based on my actual experience with the other rifles I mentioned, I feel that there is nothing particularly special or unique with regards to the accuracy of the Blaser rifle you tested. It can be equaled by several models of currently available single shots (with octagon barrels) at a fraction of it's price.

I seem to recall that when the 44 Magnum was introduced, Norma ammunition had a higher performance than US made ammo. People were confused why domestic ammo underperformed the European loads. Eventually, it turned out that European test protocols were different and that the Norma loaded 44 Magnum ammo exceeded the US made loads by 15%. Toady, their loads are equal.

Could this be a similar situation?

This is that predictable �pissing contest� I alluded to earlier. Sorry, but I am too busy to play your game.

DakotaDeer wondered why I don�t post more. This is why.

Bryce,
You comments are always welcome but you cannot please everyone. Keep the facts coming as yuou see them, and let the experts determine their own facts.

That is why we don't all buy the same beer anyway.

John

Bryce--

Let me echo how much I appreciate you taking the time to share first hand experience when the rest of us can do little more than speculate, theorize, and nit-pick.

No "pissing contest" at all Bryce..

What did you expect?

The fact is that anyone- writer or not, who makes a generalized statement like for example - octagon barrels generally don't shoot as well as round barrels- then you'd better be able to back it up.

It's just that my ACTUAL EXPERIENCE with the accuracy of octagon barrels- either factory or custom -tells me different.

I am sorry your apprently fragile ego can't deal with that.

Merely getting published in print magazine does not automatically make someone the arbitor of all wisdom,experience or knowledge in the universe.

A fact lost on many of them..

Which is why octagon barrel rule the world of competition shooting.

Utah.

That does not mean octagon barrels are any LESS accurate than round barrels..

Anymore than a synthetic stock is "more accruate" than a properly bedded wood stock on a target rifle.

BR and other centerfire target shooters burn out enough barrels that COST plays a factor as well.

Octagoning a barrel is largely COSMETIC to most folks.. If it cost'more money -even if it does not HURT anything- if adds nothing to the accuracy of the gun it generally not get done on a modern target rifle..

A properly contoured, chambered and fitted octagon barrel will cost nearly TWICE what an average orund barel cost, all other things being equal..Octagon barrels are pain to index and fit properly compared to a round barrel. It costs extra $$.

Most serious bench rest shooters I know would rather use the $$ buying an extra barrel blanks as they tend to buy them and fit them to a rifle in groups(the smart ones at least) and sort the "hummers"(shooters) from the average tubes..

They would simply rather spend the $$ on something other than the shape of the barrel.. And, if performance VS cost is important, I would chose a round barrel for a BR rifle as well.

It still does not mean across the board that octagon barrels are any less accurate all other things being equal.. Which was my real bone to pick with UMT's comment.

You missed the fundamental point of Bryce's post. His statement about the .243 was true--if most people envision a .5 MOA rifle design, a octagon barreled single shot is not the first thing that comes to mind.

So rather than engage the breadth of his experience in a collegial manner, you nit-picked a turn of phrase and probably yet again ran him off.

FWIW, I have enjoyed some of his writing in the past as well.
And I might add that I PAID for the privilege to read it in magazines..

I will not however, give up my right to to voice a considered opinion based on my own experience just to avoid offending someone ..

Writer or not..

About the new Blaser ammo. We already tested in France with Blaser Rifle. Velocity was rather deceptive no more than "standard well known magnum calibers" sometimes less. In the new catalog were they present the new R8 rifle they give velocities:
7mm Blaser:140grs AC 960m/s 3150fps
300Blaser: 165grs CPD (sort of Partition bullet:950m/s 3116fps
300Blaser: 185grs TTSX: 920m/s 3050fps
338Blaser: 210grs TTSX: 900m/s 2952fps
338Blaser: 200grs AC: 920m/s 3050fps
375Blaser: 270grs TSX: 840m/s 2755fps

In the real world with Blaser barrels, brand new, we got lower velocities that i could give you tomorrow cause my data are at the office tonight. If you want to best "old magnums" you'll be obliged to handload.
Accuracy was impressive.

I have been following this thread for a while now without comment, but now I will:

Yawn.

Hi John,

Please could you go deeper inside this tread, seems that you agree with me but as i'm not so fluent in US langage i don't really understand Yawn. These cartridges were to be introduced under Norma brand. But seems that the Swedes are smart and knows very well the market: there's not a lot of place for others calibers doing nothing better than the already existing ones. Blaser wanted to have is name on some to go with the new R8 rifle so they did it. For exemple without going over pressure and in total security i can load the old 7Rem Mag to the velocity of the Blaser round using french Vectan TU7000 and 8000 powders with the same bullet the same with 300 and with the new High performance Hornady, the former Winchester Partition Gold loading and Federal Hi Energy already bested that!I can load my 8x68S or 8Rem Mag to the velocity of the 338 without danger for me or bystanders and as you know the 8x68 has no belt...
Maybe you understand that i'm no Blaser fan (for lot of reasons)but generally considered by others as honnest and knowledgable so your impression about these cartridges even if you don't test them would be appreciated.
Regards

Marseille,

"Yawn" means the whole thread bores me.

While I can understand any company wanting it's own cartridges, I just can't get excited about yet another introduction of "rimless magnums."

We have seen many rimless magnums introduced in the fairly recent past: Dakotas, Lazzeronis, Remingtons, Rugers and several other obscure lines. Exactly why some company like Blaser would imagine that there's yet more room in that marketplace puzzles me.

But maybe there is an infinitely expanding market at the top end, among hunters who are willing to pay for anything new and relatively expensive.

Thank you John for your answer. I think about the same and i agree with you and i don't know if you've seen the new rifle from Blaser the R8. May be at the Shot Show or i can crack my press cr-rom on this forum tonight. Lot to say about....

Here are the real world velocities:Temp 13�C, Chrony Gamma

7mmBlaser 140grs AC: 885m/s 2900fps
300Blaser 180grs TTSX: 876m/s 2870fps
338Blaser 200grs AC: 895m/s 2935fps
375Blaser 270grs TSX: 810m/s 2660fps

No worse but no better than the other magnums..
You're right with the last part of your answer expensive and often not adapted rifles sell well in Europe and in France. Blaser sold 150000 R93, more than 20000 came to France.

The Blaser cartridges seem to be a solution in search of the preverbal problem. What will they do that other cartridges will not do - thinking of the Remington Ultra-Mags, Lazzeroni, Dakota cartridges, etc.

Interesting! Anyone try one of these new cartridges?

It would be a great to see what the real world velocities are.

We already know the potential in the real world.....look at the Dakota lineup of cartridges.

As one example,a 7mm Dakota will push a 140 gr bullet at 3300+ fps easily from a 24" barrel.

Just look at Writing Frog's chronograph results above....no wonder the factory stuff "kicks less".....it isn't loaded to the round's full potential.

I first got a Blaser (Ultimate) years ago because of the switch barrel concept, coupled that I bought the distributor's sample at a seriously discounted price. It worked well, even though a bit unconventional in appearance. This was my "gun of the month" period of my life, and it went after a couple of years.

I got into the R-93 business, quite by accident . I had a Browning Olympian .270 for many years that had begun to show evidence of salt (no action/barrel blue loss- but the butt plate screws and the bottom swivil stud were eaten up. I could not sell it for anywhere near what the Angelo Bee engraved barreled action was worth, but I did stumble into a dealer that had what he thought was a "clean" stock for it. I traded the salt gun heads up for a Blaser R-93 with one barrel and scope mount. I did pay extra for another barrel, mount, and fitted case. On the heads up part of the trade, I think I did well, no really well, as far as cash value. If I had it to do over, I would have paid 1000-1500 to a good stock maker and kept the Mauser. The Blaser is accurate, I just do not use it. Perhaps it is time for it to go.

The topic of todays discussion is cartridg design. I see no useful purpose for the shorter fat cases in a Blaser. They are already light and the action is not going to get smaller to utilize them. In fact the newer R-8 is a larger, heavier action than the R-93, to better handle cases of .375 and larger. jack