Blue Dot for reduced loads.

I see these reduced loads for Blue Dot all over the forum. I've YET to see any PRESSURE numbers. Where are the pressure numbers?
I'm not going to load any reduced Blue Dot until I see some. This story about "it is safe in my rifle" just means to me that the rifle in question didn't blow up.

Where are you guys that are using Blue Dot in rifle cartridges getting your information, please?

Any writers have any pressure readings from the Alliant people?

Troll

Higbean, your ignorance is showing when you say that.

I just call them like I see them.

How strange Higbean. I've been on this board for longer time than you and have never had anyone say such a thing.
Regards,
Dew

I've popped a primer using bluedot in a 223. I don't have any pressure barrels but I know I got lucky. I do keep a lot of bluedot on hand. It is a very handy powder. I just take it easier now.

I've shot quite a few 168gr Nosler J4s in my 308 over 17gr Unique. Fun plinker and surprisingly accurate to several hundred yards.

QL calc'd pressure, 40-45K lbs psi
velocity, 1900 fps
load density, 54% in Win brass
Very soft shooting, and the primers are very rounded.

Here's a Blue Dot calc for 40s in the 223,

Code

Cartridge          : .223 Rem. (SAAMI)
Bullet             : .224, 40, Hornady V-MAX BT 22241
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.260 inch or 57.40 mm
Barrel Length      : 26.0 inch or 660.4 mm
Powder             : Alliant BLUE DOT

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-41.7   35     7.00   1974     346   10552   2262     93.1    1.841
-37.5   37     7.50   2088     387   11877   2434     95.1    1.736
-33.3   40     8.00   2197     429   13297   2597     96.7    1.645
-29.2   42     8.50   2302     470   14816   2749     98.0    1.566
-25.0   44     9.00   2402     513   16436   2891     99.0    1.496
-20.8   47     9.50   2499     555   18163   3019     99.6    1.434
-16.7   49    10.00   2592     597   19998   3134     99.9    1.377
-12.5   52    10.50   2680     638   21946   3236    100.0    1.326
-08.3   54    11.00   2766     679   24010   3333    100.0    1.279
-04.2   57    11.50   2847     720   26195   3429    100.0    1.236
+00.0   59    12.00   2926     760   28504   3525    100.0    1.197
+04.2   62    12.50   3002     800   30941   3618    100.0    1.160
+08.3   64    13.00   3075     840   33513   3711    100.0    1.126
+12.5   67    13.50   3147     879   36223   3802    100.0    1.094
+16.7   69    14.00   3216     919   39077   3891    100.0    1.060
+20.8   72    14.50   3283     958   42081   3979    100.0    1.028

Blue dot loads always stir controversy. Thus the troll post. Didn't mean to come off as a dick, but the truth is, your post and the way it was worded is stirring the pot.

Higbean, I'm sorry you took it that way.
I'm not stirring the pot. I ask a simple question and now that some answers are coming in I'm pleased to know the information.
I forgive you.
Later,
Dew

Originally Posted by Dew

I see these reduced loads for Blue Dot all over the forum. I've YET to see any PRESSURE numbers. Where are the pressure numbers?
I'm not going to load any reduced Blue Dot until I see some. This story about "it is safe in my rifle" just means to me that the rifle in question didn't blow up.

Where are you guys that are using Blue Dot in rifle cartridges getting your information, please?

Any writers have any pressure readings from the Alliant people?

Seafire is the one that has this whole mess brewing, he believes that you can use SQUIBLOAD's of Blue Dot in anything from 22Hornet to 50 BMG and naked girl's will be knocking at your door

Rogue, do you remember that amount of BD that you were using that was too hot a load?

Montana Marine...
Thank you for the information. It looks like we are getting somewhere on the use of BD.

Dew

[/quote]

Seafire is the one that has this whole mess brewing, he believes that you can use SQUIBLOAD's of Blue Dot in anything from 22Hornet to 50 BMG and naked girl's will be knocking at your door [/quote]

And there it is. 10 pages.

I have used some of Seafire's load suggstions for Blue Dot in 30-06 and found them entirely safe, LOW in recoil, and pretty accurate for training my wife to hunt moose and deer. If you want a heavier load, use a different powder. No-one is saying B.D. is universal, just that it is effective as a training/reduced recoil load.

[/quote]

Seafire is the one that has this whole mess brewing, he believes that you can use SQUIBLOAD's of Blue Dot in anything from 22Hornet to 50 BMG and naked girl's will be knocking at your door [/quote]

and this was shoved down WHOSE Throat?

From someone I don't even know... yet thinks he has the right to flame me.. for me trying and sharing something from experience.. when I bet he has ZERO experience with it to condemn or Praise it..

another arm chair ballistician with an opinion...

since Montana Marine posted a chart derived from Quick Load ( which I myself don't necessarily trust however, it verifies what I list as max load for a 50 grainer at 14.5 grains in the 223 being in the low 40K CUP range, and a long way from max pressure in a 223)..

however, point out where you think a Squib Load would exist at with the MVs posted???

my apologies to other forum members for being on my soap box...

I post data with Blue Dot at the request of other forum members.... I don't get paid to do it.. I share, with other shooters, the info for free that I spent a lot of time working up and developing...so I know where the safe parameters are...

and personally I am getting sick of getting flamed by some YoYo that hasn't tried it.. acting like he has some infinite knowledge that the rest of us are not privileged to....

any handloader knows to work up a load, so these were worked up...

if you don't want to use it, then just pass the thread by...and buy factory ammo....

instead of coming in and spreading your negative 2 cents, on a subject you have NO experience with...and then being pompous enough to flame the person who does have the hands on experience...and being gracious enough to share it with those who ask...

and to quote Forest Gump: that's all I have to say about that...

I've been watching that thread in Varment Reloading for a year now, I remain amazed that some folks never seem to have looked at the Lyman manuals with their reduced loads of pistol powders in rifle cartridges.

(PS: I've not tried BD yet but I've burned quite a bit of Unique and SR4759 in rifles)

Credit for the idea doesn't go to me.. it goes to Calhoon bullets as I first read about it on their web site and tried it, it worked real well.. and then I just expanded on it...

I noticed the header says 40 grain Vmax, not 50 grain bullets.

Any way to post the data w/o having to scroll so I can print it, please? It may be the screen size I have that makes it not fully pasted.

Thanks

Allen

Yeah Allen, I noticed that Montana Marine had it listed as a 50gr but had the print out saying 40 grain V Max...

just for the record, for my own use, I use 14.5 grains as max for my 40 grain bullets and 14 grains as max for my 50 grain bullet loads..

anytime I have seen quickload ran on these, what I list as max, has always been in the 40 to 45K CUP ranges... well below what is the cartridges are rated for... and right in line with the old Mauser 93/95 limitations...

Seafire, good catch. The data was calc'd with a 40gr bullet.

Thanks Shane, and thanks for posting the chart..

Google, "cat's sneeze", you will find some interesting reading on the Finn's use of reduced loads.

Originally Posted by Dew

Rogue, do you remember that amount of BD that you were using that was too hot a load?

Montana Marine...
Thank you for the information. It looks like we are getting somewhere on the use of BD.

Dew

It was well below the max data listed by MM. I dropped down what I figured to be a safe amount, touched off what I thought was a safe starting load and whammy. Just popped the primer, didn't damage the extractor. It was with LC brass so who knows. I still us BD a lot but use a much lower starting load.

I have no personal experience with Blue Dot in rifle loads.....nor do I have a dog in that fight.....my reasoning is simply that if the manufacturer (Alliant) doesn't recommend it then I don't use it!

I'm not sure if Al Gore invented the internet.....but of this I am sure....the internet has invented a helluva lot of experts and some are truly worth listening to.....but sorting them all out is beyond me so I confine myself to published loads from the manufacturers and those with pressure testing equipment such as Hornady et al.....

So far I have all my fingers, both my eyes, and haven't blown up a gun. It's a lot more fun that way.

Originally Posted by Dew

I see these reduced loads for Blue Dot all over the forum. I've YET to see any PRESSURE numbers. Where are the pressure numbers?
I'm not going to load any reduced Blue Dot until I see some. This story about "it is safe in my rifle" just means to me that the rifle in question didn't blow up.

Where are you guys that are using Blue Dot in rifle cartridges getting your information, please?

Any writers have any pressure readings from the Alliant people?

If you look at Lyman's reloading manuals you'll see many reduced loads listed that use pistol powders. I haven't gotten around to putting any blue dot reduced loads together YET, but bought a can for that express purpose. The last primer I blew was back in 1972. Stupid is, as stupid does...YMMV

Like the man says if you are worried about trying the loads "DON'T.
JEEZEE

Blue dot works very well in .300 whisper with 200 grainers 8 grains outta have you right at supersonic.

I've used Bluedot for the 308 and the 6.5x55. I stayed within Seafire's recommended max, worked up my loads slowly, and got great accuracy and no pressure signs. Nothing too difficult as long as the loader knows what they are looking for in regards to pressure signs, and uses their heads a little. For a fact, if a loader don't, won't or can't do that anyway, they have no business reloading.

" nor do I have a dog in that fight....."

vapodog,

Really?

Ive been using Blue Dot with seafires recommendations for a couple of years now, and have had no problems and great accuracy.

Proceedure is very important when using it, load one at a time.
Prime, charge and seat bullet.

2 charges will fit in the cases that i load it with very easily.

Obviously, we are all responsible for our own actions, but I choose to use them, and I've had excellent results in various cartridges.

If one is worried about printed data from a manufacturer, there are other powders intended for reduced loads. I've recently tried the Trail Boss powder in a 243 with darn good results. I've tried it with 75 grain Sierra HP's, and Hornady 100 grain BTSP's. I found best accuracy closer to the top loading, both around the 14.5 grain mark; these are sanctioned loads direct from the Trail Boss data: http://www.imrpowder.com/PDF/Trail-Boss-data.pdf

It may be a little louder, but I'm getting 1" or less accuracy at 100 yards with little recoil and not much barrel heating; great for practicing field position shooting and for using up odds and ends of bullet boxes. Anywhere above 13.5 grains puts the powder level close enough to the neck that you can visually check the powder level and no way to double charge unless one is completely incompetent. Not sure how it will drop from the measure, I've been scooping with Lee scoops and trickling in to finish.