I JUST picked up an incredibly gorgeous 7x57 on a military '98 action with lovely wood, great checkering, and flawless blue from a client of mine. The gunsmith's name is stamped on the barrel O.H. Elliott & Co and I'm wondering if anyone knows about this 'smith?

Full length:



Recontoured tang



'smith stamp



top view (note crest removed from front ring)



Butt... I'm a sucker for great walnut



Wrap around checkering (seems to me to justify barrel-band front sling swivel)



Lyman peep sight... anyone know anything about this? Model name, etc?

[img]http://i480.photobucket.com/albums/rr166/efrrwake99/O%20H%20Elliott%207x57/P1380783.jpg[/img]

Sorry for all the junk in the background... windy day yesterday...

Well, a quick search turned this up.

The .277 Elliott Express and .357 Elliott Express are two of a series of wildcats developed by O.H. Elliott & Company of South Haven, Michigan, based on the .405 Winchester cartridge. This custom gunsmith manufactured his own rifle barrels.

Source is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.405_Winchester

Not much help but something. Bear BTW NICE Rifle!

Pretty darned nice custom. Is the action a Mexican Mauser or a large ring? (I am too uninformed to tell from the photos.)

I am pretty sure it is a standard large ring. It is stamped "Mod 98" in front of the thumb cut. I don't remember my SR'98 having that. Doesn't have the Springfield-style cocking peice, either.

Sweet rifle!

Based on 4xbear's note, it appears to have stayed close to home. Guess I need to start cruising the west MI shows.

405wcf

Thanks for the compliments all!

Anyone know how to tell the difference between rust & caustic blue?

Eric,

I can tell you a bit about O.H. Elliot... As I also have one of his rifles... I just tried to call you, Give me a call back and I'll let you in on some unbelievable facts...

GH

P.S. I'd post them, but I'm getting tired of being told I don't know what I'm talking about...

Grasshopper, whoever said you didn't know what you were talking about, tell them I said to pee up a rope.
The Elliot rifle is a class act. Tell us what you know about them..

Why am I not surprised that GH has one?

Go ahead and post, give me a reason to dig around at the shows.

405wcf

Looks like the classic rifles made in the '30's. Nice rifle.

Ok, Ya'll talked me into it:

A few years ago, I posed much the same question here and nobody seemed to know anything about O.H. Elliot... As I travelled around, I asked in every gunshop I visited... Eventually I asked a gunsmith in the East Detroit area, not really expecting anything and was surprised when he answered: "What do you want to know?" I said anything I could find out. He told me that he had taken his apprenticeship under Mr Elliot, starting when he was in High School. He also told me that OHE wouldn't let him work on guns unless he kept his grades up. He said that during WW-II, OHE was hired by Saginaw Steering Gear to head the engineering dept for the building of M-1 Carbines. OHE, had the very 1st one built there. (Serial #EXP OHE001) He stated that the rifle in question is now owned by OHE's daughter, whom he knows personally. (He grew up with her)

My rifle is built on a pre WWI Oberndorf Mauser action. It is chambered in .35 Apex. Which as near as I can figure, is a .35 Whelen A.I. with the shoulder moved fwd about .010". I have been totally unable to find any written data on it.

The gunsmith who was telling me about him, said: "Wait a minute, I've something to show you..." He went back in his office and returned with a notebook. It was handwritten in OHE's own handwriting... It contained all his personal hand-loading notes... The 'smith told me that OHE's daughter had given it to him after OHE's death...

When OHE was in business, he made his own barrels... His boring and rifling machines are now owned by a gunsmith in northern MI. And are still in regular use... AAMOF, the 'smith who now owns them, had done a number of rebores for me and another member of this forum. I also know of at least two other members of this forum who use him, as well... (They all know whom I'm speaking of...)

The rifle that efw owns, and my own rifle are the only ones I have ever seen... Mine has a 22" bbl with a full length Mannlicher style stock... And is complete with a Williams rec'vr sight. It has never been D&Ted for a scope. Last summer I met a couple of forum members who are interested in custom rifles, and they took pics of mine. Perhaps they will see this and might post them... (I am technically challenged...)

If I were to guess, I'd say that efw's and my own; OHE rifle were built in the period after WWII, perhaps up into the mid 60's... By the early to mid 60's a lot of folks were going to the use of optical sights... I started hunting in 1968 and even as late as then, a lot of hunters I saw, still used sights. I never had a scope on my rifle until 1973...

Hope ya'll enjoyed it...

GH

efw

Beautiful rifle in a classic chambering.

GH

Very informative, thank you.

JD338

intresting

Oh Ed, you're so full of poop .

Seriously thanks for the insight. I took one look at this thing and knew it had to be mine...

Beautiful rifle efw. Does this mean you're ready to part with that 9.3x57?

G.H., thank you for that interesting glimpse into Michigan gun smithing history. Being a resident of Northern Michigan I can't help but wonder where O.H.E.'s equipment went to.

Scott

It is a large ring.

Unfortunately when my father died I had to sell that rifle to come up with funeral money. Ed hooked me up with a friend of his who has it now...

Ed has he fired that rifle yet?

Not yet!

Grasshopper,

Thanks for posting all the great info. Sounds like O.H. Elliott rifles might be almost as scarce as Adolph Minar rifles.

I'm kind of into older custom rifles myself, and now will have something else to look out for.

MD,

After working on a custom 7x57 of my VERY own for a couple of years now I have to admit I was on one hand pleased as punch finding this rifle, but on the other hand a bit irritated... I think I paid something like 1/9th for this rifle what I'll have in my Mexican small ring when it is complete.

Of course they do compliment one another VERY nicely...

Knock on wood, but I think my appetite for building my own full customs has been filled. I'm going to haunt area gun shows looking for stuff like this.

Oh yeah... HW Creighton is another name I'll be watching for. I picked up one of his 03-A3s here last year and while not quite as nice to look at as this specimen it shoots the lights out. I since found out he built benchrest rifles down in the Nashville area and is known for tack drivers. There is a 257 Bob for sale in the classifieds right now built by him... a bit outside my price range though .

Nice rifle! I think you're right about the barrel band.

- Tom

efw,

I recently picked up a custom .243 from the late 50's or early 60's, by the looks of it. It's a heavy barreled varmint rifle, with typical California-style stock made out of BEAUTIFUL American walnut, with nice checkering, fittings of paler wood (probably maple, and what appears to be an old Timney set at right around one pound. It's on a Mexican Mauser action (the cocking-knob model) and everything was done just right. I paid $350. It shoots great. No markings as to maker or barrel.

Last year I bought a genuine Bill Sukalle sporter. Yep, the barrelmaker who did work for Jack O'Connor. A .257 "Rem." on a good military 98 action, with a nicely made stock (he farmed those out), and a Lyman 48 underneath a K4 Weaver in a Griffin & Howe side mount. The military trigger was remodeled to a crisp 3-pound pull. Price: $700. It shoots into well under an inch.

Yeah, I'm a rifle loony!

O.H. Elliott was born in Michigan in 1903.

Served an apprenticeship in Indianapolis, Indiana 1919-1920.

University Michigan School of Engineering 1920-23.

Apprenticeship gunsmithing in London 1923-25.

I don't know if he made stocks or not but employed one stockmaker (name unknown) after 1946 in Williamsburg, Michigan.

That is great information; thank you very much!

That is purdy! Thanks for the message, made my day seeing a classy old rifle like that. You're a lucky man to have that follow you home.

Yours appears to be caustic blue to me. Below is one of mine that is rust blued and you will note the almost grey-like color, not deep blue at all. Nice rifle and story to boot.

Thanks for answering that question, Tony.

That is observably different from mine, which is slightly different colors; the barrel one, the shroud another, and the reciever/BM yet another.

That is a beautiful custom job you have there. Whose BM is that? What cartridge is it chambered for?

I likey.

The aperture sight is a Lyman 48, a superb sight.

Admitting you have a problem is the first step.
And thanks to efw and GH for a great thread. There's something about the older customs that just seems right.

efw - careful, someone will accuse you of having a rifle that was "butchered" from the original now-collectible military version!

That is one terrific looking Mauser. I like the old customs myself. Sometimes a guy can find a real nice one at a bargain price. Yours is a beauty.

Regards, Guy

The action and bottom metal were made by Pete Grisel before he and Don Allen landed on the Dakota action. He made just 50 of them, this one is stamped #49. It is pretty slick with quick detachable rings and all. It is a 280 Remington. Thanks for the comments.

Guilty as charged.

Here is what Grasshopper's rifle looks like. The pictures don't completely do it justice but you can see it is a rifle well worth owning.








Edward, I'm sorry I didn't know about this thread sooner, but we have been gone and just recently got back home. My brother let me know about it last night. Larry

My apologies for not getting back to your PM, Grasshopper.

I scanned all my photos from that day and didn't find one of your O.H. Elliott..........so I presumed Larry had taken them.

I do have one of you clutching a ratty old Springfield however.

Larry,

Thanks so much for posting those pics... Hope you had a good time on your vacation...

Grandview,

No apology necessary. Thanks for looking...

GH

Man, you guys are giving me the mauser bug again. Something about the classic lines and simplicity. Thanks all for sharing.

Maybe someone will start a new classic Mauser sporter thread. I always enjoy looking at them also.

I say a new thread because I really hate to take away from the thought of this thread. I'd enjoy seeing more of O.H. Elliott's work if anyone has more.

GV,

That "ratty old Springfield" was one of the highlights of my trip....

Dang Ed that is indeed an amazing rifle! I absolutely love the full length stock...

Oh, and "ratty old Springfields" are another of my joys in life, too!

Maybe a "classic Mauser sporters" thread is in order along with a "ratty old Springfields" one ?

Ok, when I was a little girl my father was a friend of Mr. Elliot's and Mr. Elliot made ALL my father's guns.....he made a 30 06 gun for my mother to hunt with and she still has it. The REASON I am posting here is this. DOES ANYONE HERE know the "value" of this gun? I can send anyone pics if you can help me. She has terminal cancer and I need to KNOW the value of this gun so I can pay for cremation expenses. ANY HELP would be appreciated. I figured since you all were interested in his guns someone would know? Thanks.......

Lopiekitty,

First off I'm very sorry to hear about your mother's health. I just trudged down that same path with my father in Feb so I know exactly how you're feeling.

I'll shoot you a PM with my email address, but it is really hard to price a custom rifle like this because the value really is only what a person is able/willing to pay at the moment you need to sell.

On the other hand, you've got an audience here that is more likely to offer you a fair price than most other groups of people.

THANK YOU SO MUCH! So darn sorry to hear about your father! And yes, it IS a path hard to trudge but this is not my first "rodeo" so to speak...but it never gets easier! I appreciate any help offered. I will take some pics today if anyone wants to see the gun....it has a really nice scope and was used for big game hunting out west.

I would love to see that gun.

IF anyone wants to see this gun please send me a message with your e-mail address and I will send you the pics I took today....I could not get a "full gun pic" but it's all there. (gun, scope and leather strap in excellent condition) it could use some "love" and someone who will use her and appreciate her.

For those who responded to my posts.....I want to thank you ALL for your kind words, INVALUABLE advice and honesty!

Had to add a reply. Just bought a O. H. Elliott 30-06 on a Smith-Corona 03-A3 action at the Traverse City Gun show this morning. Heavy, straight taper barrel, Lyman micrometer peep sight. Neat to know he worked at Williamsburg (near here) after the war. Old guy selling the gun said it was made by "some guy from Acme" (same as Williamsburg).

Very nice! Add pics if possible.

I too have an OH Elliot rifle (270 caliber). My father inlaw gave it to me just before he passed away and I've never been able to find anything out about the rifle until being directed to this thread. He was a former employee of Saginaw Steering Gear and only told me that he had purchased the rifle from a coworker. The only marking I could find on the barrel was the OH Elliot stamp. It's in pretty nice shape though I had planned to drill & tap the barrel for a scope and also refinish the stock and pass the gun down to my new grandson. *Might leave the gun as is after reading this information