The Beartooth Bullets 185gr. FNGC is shown with a recommended powder charge of 16 grains of h110/296 with standard small pistol primers in the .357 Magnum. Apparently this load uses about 98% of the powder space available. Is this load under the 45,000cup level?

I used to load 16.6gr 296 & a mag primer under a jacketed 158gr and it was pretty hot. I know, jacketed vs. cast, but that still seems hot to me.

Sounds hot to me, but regardless, I wouldn't start a load workup anywhere near that. Go to Hodgden's site and compare loading data.

One concept to keep in mind is that heavy bullets are not as dependent on velocity to perform well. Relatively mild loads penetrate surprisingly well.

TC

My Lee manual shows a max charge of 13.5grs under 180 Lead, 16 sounds warm for a revolver a rifle would hanle it I figure.

Range Test

Ruger New Model Flat Top, 4 5/8" barrel:

Bear Tooth Bullets, 185 grain FNGC, .358 diameter.
16.0 grains of H110,
New Starline brass
Winchester Small Pistol Primer.
6 rounds fired.
1326 FPS average, 30 ES, Low 1306, High 1336 FPS.

Temp: 75F

Note: Standard Primer.

Load worked up from starting charge listed in the current Speer load data manual.

Current Speer Reloading Manual shows this load with 180TMJ bullet under the 45,000 CUP SAMMI standard.

NOTE: Use at your own risk.

The meplat is .280" - the same as the original Keith .44 bullet.

So if both the 185fngc and Keith .44 250swc completely penetrate with the same meplat area (wide flat nose), tissue damage should be essentially the same.

I've used 17.0 grains of 296 with a 160 grain LBT WFNGC in a couple of Ruger GP-100's and it didn't seem to be pushing the envelope. The LBT designs stick more of the bullet out of the case so you have more powder room compared to traditional SWC. I would have gone to 17.5 or even 18 grains but can't find any good published data for that bullet and I just don't like to go beyond published recommendations even if my reasoning tells me it would be okay.

16.0 296 or H110 (same thing) with a 185 lead FNGC is probably top end but it should be safe enough.

To the OP,
Your original question references the .357 mag. The post after your range test seems to be about a .44 caliber bullet? Are you confusing data for the .357 and the .44 mag? That would seem problematic. I don't have my loading records with me, but 16 grains of h110 in the .357 under a 180 grain bullet seems hot....

Ella

Read again: I was comparing the Meplat (flat nose) of the BTB185 in the 357 mag. to the meplat size of the well known original .44 swc designed by Elmer Keith in the 1930's.

If both bullets have the same meplat dimensions (the part that does the damage) and both bullets pass completely through the vitals of a deer or other game animal the damage done should be essentially the same.

Same load from a rifle.


Rossi R357B single shot 22 inch barrel .357 Magnum.

Temp 75F
6 rounds fired.

185gr BTB FNGC
16.0 grains of H110
New Starline brass
Winchester Small Pistol primer

1714 FPS average, 14 FPS extreme spread
Low 1706 FPS, High 1720 FPS.

Load worked up from the starting charge listed in the current Speer load data manual.

Current Speer Reloading Manual shows this powder charge with a 180TMJ bullet under the 45,000 CUP SAMMI standard.

NOTE: Use at your own risk.

RMcL,
Pardon, I did indeed misread.
(On a tangential note: I do recall Keith arguing that it wasn't just the metplat that "did the damage" but it was the whole frontal area of the bullet, which was part of why he argued for a sharp rather than a rounded contour around the metplat--the shoulder of the bullet?--so the whole diameter of the bullet punched a hole, rather than just the metplat. Course my memory grows foggier by the day.)
How's the accuracy with that load? How's recoil in the revolver? I'm intrigued by the numbers.

Ella

The WFN cast bullet design is now used for big game solid bullet rifle ammo to maximize tissue destruction and straight penetration. The adoption of this style of solid bullet by big name ammo manufacturers was the result the tremendous field success of the WFN cast bullet design and the results of recent fluid dynamics studies.

Recoil from the load in question, while heavy, is not abrupt in the revolver. Accuracy has been in the <2 inch range at 25 yards with the issue iron sights over sandbag rest.

Sounds like it's gonna work real well. That should be a great load for the .357, what are you planning on hunting with it? I really like a .357 and have been kicking around the idea of picking up one in a Blackhawk.

Looking forward to using this load for Deer and Feral Hog this fall.

that's a smoking load from a short barrel.