I've been told that for a rifle for Vintage Sniper Rifle competition the A1 is preferable to the more common A3.

Can anybody offer any insight as to why this might be the case?

Paul

The sights. The '03-A1 has the aperture sight on the rear of the receiver.

The 03-A3 has the rear peep...

The 03-A3 has an aperture sight on the rear of the receiver. The 03-A1 and the 03 both have aperture rear sights that are mounted in front of the receiver on the barrel. In regards to sniper rifles, the 03A4 was an 03A3 rifle with a 2.2 power Weaver 330 scope mounted on Redfield rings and base. The USMC used a sniper rifle that was an 03A1 with an 8 power Unertl scope.

My 1903-a3 has the aperture sight on the rear
Vintage sniper comp uses a period or reproduction scope if I'm not mistaken..could be it's easier to mount the scope on the 1903?

http://www.nationalmatcharmory.com/Projects.html

Those don't have aperture sights, they are open sights with a ladder...

The ladder has an aperture on the slide that is visible when the slide is raised in the upright position.

Thanks for the replies, gents.

To be more specific, this would be for NRA Vintage Sniper Rifle Silhouette, with the rules specifying a vintage scope.

I'm pretty sure this involves Unertl-type blocks and mounts, although they allow some leeway with the scope rule. Does this offer a clue as to the preferability of the A1? As you can see, I don't have a clue.

Paul

Yes it does. I believe that the rules state that reproduction scopes can be used, but that the scope magnification must remain the same. Hence you are limited to 2.5 power on 03A4s and can use an 8 power scope on the 03A1s.

The 03-A3 rifles were WW2 production and had a lot of stamped parts, as opposed to the machined parts of the earlier Springfield rifles. The 03-A3s were faster and cheaper to produce than the earlier rifles but chintzy in the eyes of the purist.

Many of the 03-A3 rifles also had 2-groove barrels, and the purists wanted 4 grooves.

But, that being said, I've always preferred the bridge-mounted aperture sights of the 03-A3 rifles as opposed to the barrel-mounted sights of the earlier Springfields.

The sniper rifles produced in WW2 were new production model 1903A4. Essentially modified 03A3 with various rifle scopes installed.

The Model 1903 A1 is the original version of the Springfield Model 1903 with the leaf-type barrel mounted rear sight, but uses a pistol grip stock with a longer length of pull and a higher comb than the original straight grip stock.

The pistol grip A1 stock is much more suitable for use with a scope, and it also gives a better cheek weld than the older stock design even with iron sights. It is basically a target stock design, although it was used for general service as well.

The 1903-A3 is the final service version of the Springfield, using many stamped parts and a receiver mounted aperture sight. They can be seen with the short straight grip stock and the "scant" stock, which has a similar length of pull and high comb to the A-1, but has a less pronounced pistol grip.

Below are my late production 1903 with a scant stock...the A-1 would be similar but would have a more graceful pistol grip, and, below, my 1903-A3 with common straight stock.

The 1903 A-1 would be better for use with a Leatherwood or Unertl target scope mounted on barrel blocks. The 1903-A3 with receiver mounted Weaver scope was called the 1903-A4 and was a dedicated sniper rifle in WWII.

Thanks. That's the answer I've been looking for.

Now to find a decent A1.

Paul

Werent 03A3s used in the Vietnam War also?

I'm pretty sure the 03-A4 sniper rifles were, but have doubts that the 03-A3's were, unless maybe by the Navy aboard ships.

You can buy new production A1 stocks (also known as the "C" type stock) that will fit any Model 1903 from Gunparts Corporation:

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/ad/985010.htm

I like the 03-A3 for the rear mounted peep myself. That front sight blade is mighty thin for older eyes though.

Yes, I agree the 03-A3 is better for shooting. That leaf type rear sight on the 03 is fragile, imprecise in adjustment, prone to move right or left by itself and hard to see especially in bad light.

Plus, the battle sight setting with the leaf down is set at 547 yards, so it shoots way too high at realistic combat distances. Personally I think it's the single worst combat sight ever put on a 20th century service rifle...but secretly I think it's kinda cool (as long as your life doesn't depend on it).

In my good junk stash, I have two new in the cosmoline 03-A3 four groove barrels. you need one, PM me. jack

Just to pick a nit, the top rifle is indeed an 03, but the stock is a WWII expedient called the Scant Grip Stock, as opposed to the full pistol grip stock called the Type C stock. The scant grip stocks were allowed so as to use up inventories of straight grip (Style S) stock blanks in the duplicating lathes that were designed for the Type C pistol grip stocks. There wasn't enough wood in the S blanks to make a fully formed C stock, hence the weird pistol grip shape. Personally, I have consigned every Scant Grip Stock that fell into my lap to the kindling pile, I dislike them that much. Of course, I wish I had them back as people are actually paying money for them now.

Anecdote: My dad and his buddy both ordered an '03 from the DCM through the NRA 50 years ago. I believe the price was $19+ change. It was the luck of the draw as to what you got when you placed an order. Pop got a run-of-the-mill 03A3, Kenny got a 1903A4 sniper rifle, in mint condition. Naturally they both got sporterized and Kenny chortled that at least he didn't have to pay to have his bolt altered for scope use, and they both bitched about having to buy '03 bottom metal so as to divest themselves of the chintzy sheet metal bottom metal on the 03A3s.

If you read my post, you will see that I said it was a scant stock and I explained the difference between it and a "C". I missed the days of $19.00 03's, but I did buy my first one for $80.00 or so. Should have bought a truckload of them.

I hope the OP isn't planning on buying a vintage, issue 1903-A1 rifle and then butchering it by mounting a scope on it

For that matter, doing the same thing to an issue 03-A3 is equally cringe-worthy.

If you absolutely have to have an 03 for one of those NRA matches, I would look for (1) an A4 clone, or (2) an 03 of any configuration that has already been buggered up.

The CMP now has a custom shop that can do most of the work for a vintage sniper rifle. If you can find a suitable 1903 donor action they can barrel, stock and install scope bases for the '03 based 1941 USMC sniper setup. You would have to come up with the 8x Unertl scope, or a Leatherwood reproduction, which are almost as expensive as the rifle. http://www.odcmp.com/Sales/customshop.htm

The quickest and least expensive route is to purchase a Gibbs 1903A4 reproduction and then you wouldn't be butchering an original. http://www.gibbsrifle.com/1903-a4_sniper_rifle.html

at the end of WWII, the scopes were often separated from the o3A4 rifles. A real scope for that rifle a few years ago would cost you about the same as the complete repro gibbs rifle.

the thing that always struck me kind of funny, is the poor quality of the scopes in use on the 03A4 and the M1D. They really wern't much.
Same as the zf scope on the german K98 scout sniper.

This one is absolutely deadly back to 600 yards shooting 49.0 grs. IMR4895 and Sierra 168 gr. HPBT/F210M primers.

Springfield by Sharps45 2 7/8, on Flickr