Hello Crew,

Just recently picked up a older(96') NIB Sendero 7mmRemMag. to replace the one I sold last year. Looking for advice as to bullet weight for those whom have shot any of the new Nosler LRAB and their performance on deer sized game over 500yds.

The Sendero sports a 26" 1 in 9.25 twist tube and would like to keep MV near 3000fps. Would you choose the 150, 168 or 175? I'm leaning toward the 168 at 3000-3100fps. My tried and true 162 Amax's performed very well at those speeds in my last Sendero but looking for a bit tougher bullet with same flight characteristics.

What are your thoughts and can you provide any load data for the new Nosler LRAB's?

Thank you and Happy New Year!

SD

I'm curious to hear any comparisons on toughness. The Amax gets a lot of praise here for performance on game although Hornady says it's not a hunting bullet. The few reviews of the LRAB I've heard sounded like it was considerably softer than the standard AB.

I used 175's and loaded exactly the same as I did for 180 VLD's, including jump. Group went from .75 with Bergers to .6 I won't use a LRAB on an Elk but might for a Deer or Antelope.

Why does this nonsense keep getting repeated?





And furthermore who cares what Hornady says. It either works or it doesn't. The AMAX kills wonderfully. As well the HPBT of same weights.

From Hornady's website.......

"A-MAX�
Designed by match shooters for match shooters. With an ultra-low drag tip, our A-Max match bullets feature an aerodynamic secant ogive that delivers flat trajectories with excellent uniformity and concentricity. Find out more...

Rapid, explosive expansion with limited penetration.
Recommended muzzle velocity range: 2000+ fps.
These bullets are not recommended for hunting."

If any object of reasonable mass can be launched at 3000 fps and stay together, it has a good chance of killing things. However, it doesn't mean it's the best choice.

I have no experience using an Amax on game. Just curious why they wouldn't recommend if it's so awesome.

What Hornady edition is that one?

The one just before they started loading Amax in LEO ammo.....

See above, then do math... for reason they no longer recommend them for hunting....

SD65- I use the 168 grn. Long Range Accord in my Rem. 700 7 Rem. Mag., 26" bbl. 9.25 twist just like yours. Winchester cases, Fed. 215 primers, H 1000 powder, and shoots very well out to 800 yards on steel. Between my brother in laws Gunwerks 7mag, a friend's Rem. 700 7 mag, and my own rifle, our loads chrono between 2950 and 3080 in our rifles (the loads vary a few tenths grains and a few thousands seating depth.) Between us this fall, the load took one mule deer buck and three whitetails bucks, the furthest at 643 yards. No bullets were recovered, nor were any bullet fragments located. All were one shot kills, some hit bone some didnt. Exits holes were less than one inch. In all 4 cases, it appeared the bullets held together and exited, even after hitting bone. The loads are consistent out of my rifle (es-19 and sd-7) and hold 2" vertical at 800 yards. Work up a load with H 1000 just under max for your rifle and watch what these bullets do.

manny: Any elk with that load?

Thanks for the info gents.

Not my intent to open a can of worms with the Amax's. I purchased several thousand of the second generation Amax's back in the mid 90's and those were of different construction from the current version of the 162 Amax with AMP Jacket. The second version was slightly longer with a larger tip and bullet was more frangible than latest version.

The middle bullet in photo below is the second generation 162 Amax. It performed well on paper, groundhogs, coyotes out to 1000yds. I shot a deer or two with them but they did not perform well with total destruction of the bullet if hitting bone and softball size exit under 200yds. I shot one deer at 680yds that had pass through (lungs) with a 2" exit but that deer was an exception. The current version of the 162 Amax may perform better but I have no experience with them and hence looking for a bullet with a BC similar to the 2nd gen Amax(.660)that will hold together a bit better on deer sized game. I think I'll give the 168 LRAB a try!




Manny,

Thanks for the load data. In regards to seating depth, did you find the load to shoot better further off the lands?

Thank you,

SD

@Bobin-No, we did not get drawn for any elk tags for 2013. Based on what I saw, I think these will hold together enough for elk. In fact, we are switching from Berger to these because of the tendency of the Bergers to fragment in game. We wanted something to penetrate better on elk than Bergers. On one shot, a 225 pound whitetail, the bullet broke the onside shoulder, ranged up through the neck breaking the spine, and exited the neck up by the offside ear (due to the angle, it was straight line penetration) for about 18" of penetration including all that bone. Granted, elk bones are much bigger...but I wouldn't have a problem using these on elk. Hopefully we will find out next year.
@SD-I have read a about the profile being such where the bullet does not have to be seated close to the lands, however in our rifles, they shot best .01" off. I started right on the lands to establish my max powder load and started working out, all the way to .070", but came back to .01".
Manny

I'll keep watching this for new input...thinking of trying the LRABs in 7x57. 150/168, might be able to run out to 2850/2700, which would be lethal to my farthest needs and still pretty mild on the back end.

Nosler data speed minimum for Accus is 1300 fps! Started at 2700 fps looks like that should work! Expansion seems to be no issue. You just plot and double check the trajectories and put new batteries in the rangefinder...

I shot the 150s at 3170 this year and killed a antelope at 350 and a mule deer at a steep angle through the shoulder at 80-90 yards. I found the bullet in the mule deer and it weighed in at 79gr. I figured it hit the mule deer just over 3000 fps.

Thanks Manny, I'll give her a go just off lands and work up a charge.

Upper deck, that 150 doesn't look too bad with impact velocity at 3k. The 168's should do fine.

SD

How is the actual BC stacking up to the advertised BC of the 7mm LRAB? I've seen some reports that say some are spot on and some say they are inflated a bit.

I have shot mine out to 500 and were very close not saying I am an expert by an stretch of the imagination but it held great groups and might have be about an inch low. That is my experience.

My experience has shown the BC to hold up out to 1/2 mile or so.... I used the same chart as the 162 Amax 3k load for the 150 LRAB at 3100ish.

I just got some 150 LR's yesterday. Going to try them in the 7.08 this weekend. Mean looking little bullet, and designed to thump game.

Guess I'll order some up and give them a try.

Be interested to see the data on that.... was thinking 7/08 + the 150s might be a couple of wins.

I am probably one of the few that doesn't find the 7.08 magical. It is what it is, and it is a dog with heavies. I am thinking a 150 is a good trade off especially with the claimed .611 BC.

I've read people claiming 2800+fps with a 162 out of the 7.08, but I am not sure how that is even possible. 2800 might be doable with a 150 though.

Nosler manual has 3 or 4 powders clocking 2800+ with a 150 NBT.... the bearing surface in the 150 LRAB is significantly less than the 150 NBT... seems 2800-2900 should be reasonable.

Look at the barrel lengths the manuals use...

24"...... that's what I'm running....

I've owned three 7.08s and all came with 22". Not to mention at least one of my manuals is using a 26" for their data.

Lots of on game performance reports on the Nosler site. Here is my best load with my Accustock savage

Fotis, show us a good 5 shot group without the taped up bullet holes ..Measure center to center from the 2 furthest bullet holes and use a good digital caliper. That steel rule doesn't cut it...

Yeah, and get yer big toe outta the frame next time too......

That was kind of mean, but real funny

Velocities still seem a bit fishy to me. Wondering in anyone has a bearing surface measurement on the 168 and 175 ABLR....

The ones on the 168 are real close to the 162 amax

Real close like +100-150 fps......

Re: 7/08 and 150s, I concur, I feel it may be a better choice, or could be as good as, since powder capacity is modest and seating depth a factor in many rifles, for 160 and heavier.

WapitiBob--could you explain why you won't use the LRAB's on elk? Thanks.

I've seen only a few reports showing the bullet retaining a decent amount of weight when shot into game. They look great when shot into water though. My interpretation of what I have read is that they shed weight faster then a comparable 7mm Berger. I could be looking at it wrong but that's what I come up with.

bsa1917hunter

I am LMAO

Or are you two friends? And this is an inside joke?

8mmwapiti

Ya, circling it and writing "pulled shot" is much more acceptable..

Bahaha. My rifles shoot really good groups when all the fliers are "my bad".

A buddy of nine just showed me this this afternoon. Shot by his wife, from his 280 AI @ 2900 fps. The 150 LRAB, killing the cow at 440 yds, rib to rib. They could not find the bullet but the butcher did find it stuck in the off side rib. Weighed 80 gr and I measured it at .5" across the widest point. The cow was up the steep angled hill side like you see in the back ground. Once she went down like a ton of bricks, DRT, she picked up speed and was absolutely cart wheeling/careening nearly to the bottom.









Alan

GSSP,

That place looks familiar. Nice cow elk. I really like the idea of a 280ai.

FH

It might. It's just inside the mouth of Hobble Creek Canyon, very close to the Garth Kilpack rifle range.

Alan

Looks like the shooter made a great shot and the bullet did precisely what it was designed to do !

That same young lady/shooter can hit'em far or close.

WapitiBob, these lrabs hold together far better than the Bergers we had been using. There is also substantially less bloodshot meat.
Manny

I use the same dots for multiple loads for multiple rifle. That day I had 5 rifles out there. I record the group sizes and velocities and tape up the holes.
This way I can use the same orange dot (4 or 5 of them) many times without having to wait for the range to go cold. BTW I only shoot 3 shot groups from Big game rifles.


Also there are 6 shots on that target. Dead on bulls'eye , adjacent to that at 11 o'clock, and the other one in the white at 10 o' clock.

Omitting bad shots? That is fooling yourself on your rifle's ability no?

As for the ruler? If it's under 3/4" for a hunting rifle that is more than good 'nuff for me.

Very nice congrats!

It's looking pretty good in that picture above for sure.