I'm pondering a new purchase and was wondering what you guys think about Remington's 5R mil spec as compared to their regular stainless rifling as in an SPS or Mountain rifle? Can you tell any performance in accuracy difference?
Thanks in advance,

I cannot compare but will tell you that my 5R's in 308 and 223 are both extremely good shooters.

The two Barliens I have a very accurate also, I don't think they are more accurate than a 4 groove but there not any less accurate either!
Just buy from a reputable maker and you should have no issues!

The M24 has 5R rifling. I have a S&W AR-15 with 5R and a Savage 6 Creedmoor with 5R. I’m looking forward to doing some testing to see how well they shoot or if they shoot any better than standard rifling

My 30-06 has a Pac-Nor 5-R barrel and is very accurate and fast too.

if you can tell an accuracy difference between 5R and “standard,” that isnt attributable to any other reason, be sure and run a flag up the flagpole and let us know.

I bought one of the 700s with the heavy barrel in .300 Winchester Magnum and a 700 Mil-Spec .308, also with heavy barrel. Both were bought new and are 5R guns. Still working with various loads, but each rifle shoots very well. I also have a 700 VS in .308 that I bought new at least twenty-five years ago. Of course, it has whatever conventional rifling Remington was using at that time; always been very accurate. I haven't done a formal side-by-side comparison, but I'm pretty sure the 5R .308 is no more accurate than the 700 VS.

Regardless, a comparison of only two rifles wouldn't mean much. Whether a good 5R barrel offers any advantage (other than from a marketing perspective) over a good conventionally rifled bore probably remains to be seen.

I have 5 R barrels from Rock Creek and I find that they do not foul and are extremely easy to clean

Exactly...I had Boots Obermeyer rebarrel my 308 40x when I was shooting HP. That was lots of years ago. I put about 12k rounds through it. I would not say the barrel was any more accurate than a conventional design. YMMV.

I have a 5C Broughton on a Kimber Classic. Great barrel, accurate and doesn’t foul. It does have DBC.

Can’t say it’s better than Brux, Krieger or other premium barrels.

But it’s a real good one.

DF

I have a 6.5 Mike Rock 5R on my hunting rifle and a .308 4 groove Kreiger on my Palma rifle. Can't discern that one is more accurate or fouls less than the other...

I have a Rock Creek 26 Nosler and a Remington factory 5-R in 300 Win mag. Easy to clean. Very accurate!!

As for barrel cleaning, I've found a couple of Extreme Weather Model 70s copper foul far less than most factory barrels. I can't say my 5R Remingtons are any better in this regard, though they are probably the same about the same. Lack of fouling may be due more to general improvements in barrel making rather than a particular rifling style.

DBC is a good treatment for a foul proned barrel.

I even treat new premium barrels. Can't hurt, may help.

DF

Just curious you say "they do not foul".........Then why even clean ???????

I have never owned such a barrel, every barrel I have will carbon foul or copper foul eventually.

I have a 5R X-caliber barrel that is a nightmare and a 5C Broughton that seems to be a great barrel.

Boots Obermeyer was the originator of the 5R barrel, he states to be a 5R it must be cut rifled hence Broughton calls their's a 5C because it is button rifled. How does Pac-Nor and Remington call them 5R when Pac-Nor is button rifled and Remington is hammer forged ???

Straight from Boots' website:




I don't see anything in Boots' answer about the rifling having to be cut.

I have a Rock Creek also. Accurate as hell.

I have or have had several 5R barrels. 2 Rocks, 2 Bartleins. One Krieger I'm waiting on, 1 Obermeyer here but unchambered.

I also have a 5 groove Pac Nor.

I also have a 4 groove traditional Brux. And a rimfire Shilen. And a Lilja here chambered but not screwed into a receiver.

I can't tell a difference between any of the accuracy or cleaning between any of the above. Some are better barrels than others, the Brux and one of the old Rocks being very very good. But one is a 6 BR and one a 25-06, both chamberings known for good accuracy.

break break

Is a 5R Remington the real deal? That's a different question. The 5R Remingtons I've seen (never owned one) looked like quality construction, good stock, heavy-ish barrel screwed on right. It's hard to tell if they are more accurate because of the barrel or because Remington decided to put it together with a little extra attention.

I have a 5R Milspec in 308 and it does pretty well. But I don't think it's because of the rifling form as much as that it's smooth inside, it was hammered straight since it doesn't walk when hot, and it was screwed on reasonably straight. I have a couple of XCR models that do very well for what I believe are the same reasons, and they have conventional 6 groove rifling.

I have the 5-R Milspec in 300 Win mag. It’s a great rifle, accurate as hell.

Just picked up a 3R 6.8 SPC II barrel from AR15performance oit of Key West, FL. Can't wait to see how the 3R button rifling performs.

Had 3-G P-N barrels shoot amazing, and 5R.......and "CHOSE 4-G" when I could have had 5.......

Odds are a good barrel will out shoot what we can hold

A wet patch and a few dry ones is all I’ve ever needed on my barrel. I’d say that is easy.

I also have a 5R that was made by obermeyer in 300 win. it is very accurate.

It's been interesting reading this thread. I'll share what I know to clear up a few misconceptions;
Boots Obermeyer did not "invent" the 5-R rifling pattern. He got it off the Russians. When the AK-74 was introduced by the Russians, Boots was asked by the gubmint to produce barrels to T&E the 5.45x39 ammo that was captured. He produced barrels in multiple configurations all with the 5-R being the most consistent. The "R" in 5-R is "Russian". Boots being a match shooter adopted it for his highpower and long range barrels where they did well. When the Army was developing their M-24, a 5-R barrel was spec'd. Mike Rock who apprenticed with Boots and whom Boots taught how to cut the compound angles of the Russian pattern produced the prototypes. When the M-24 was adopted and put into production, Remington elected to part ways with Rock and invested in the hammer forging tooling to produce their own 5-R barrels.

I don't know if a 5-R barrel is inherently more accurate but they're certainly not a detriment. I believe that the execution in producing the barrel probably has a greater influence, and Boots is/was one of the best so naturally his 5-R's shot. Boots would says that the 5-R pattern produced less stress on the bullet jacket when you were pushing a bullet hard.

There's more color and detail to the story, but this is what Boots had shared with me during our conversations. Fascinating man. I hope ole Barret J recovers and returns to barrel making.

Very informative post.

Thanks.

Tag

Don't know but I suspect a little more care goes into the Remington 5R barrels and the hammer forging mandrels may get less wear or be replaced sooner than the regular production run of barrels. I think this is true of the 40X rifle barrels even with conventional rifling. They can be easier to clean and sometimes produce slightly higher velocity but hard to generalize about all of them. I have not heard of any negatives to them. My experience is with Bartleins and you would expect anything they turn out to be good.

Bartlein states that the 5 R is not any more accurate than their 4 groove.

Popularity drives sales.

I have more than a few of 5R in various calibers and one 3R in a 6 Dasher. They are all accurate and easy to clean like all custom barrels. As to whether or not one is more accurate than the other, I could not say that.

Bore uniformity from one to the other, with perhaps a .0002 choke toward the muzzle is what I like the most. 4 groove and 6 groove of top brands will not fail you, and I have never had a bad three groove from several makers.

Getting a good straight chamber in line with the bore is way up on my list vs. groove design or number of grooves.

When I was shooting Benchrest Competition, there was a saying going around, that if a guy showed up with a Wheel on the side of his scope, and he won the match, then at the next match, everyone would have a wheel on their scope.

I have ran into two very good gunsmiths that will refuse to chamber a 5 R barrel due to the increased chance of reamer chatter, and I am not expert in this at all. My 5 and 3 R's came off without a hitch.

I think that it is nothing short of amazing how one group or type of barrels are popular with Benchrest shooters, then another with Tactical shooters, etc.

Note, I don't think that Remington his hammer forging their barrels now, they are made in Alabama. They bought all the barrel making equipment from what is now X caliber and moved that equipment from Montana to Alabama. X caliber folks did not want to move, and they started their own company, now making some fabulous barrels.

I have chambered a bunch of 3, 5,.and 6R barrels never had a hint of chatter in any of them.

Dusty, in the two that I have chambered, I never had a problem. One of those things that make you go hummm........eh?

odd groove barrels are about all I try to stay with these days. Easier on the bullets and pressures to start with. Never had an accuracy issue with them either. Actually can say the only accuracy issues I've ever really had are 3 Douglas barrels, and I'll never ever run one again. By 3 seperate smiths on top of it just to try. Even Mickey talked me into my LAST one.

I have done 5R shilen 6.5-06 and 5R Benchmark 6mmBR and 7mmRM.

Just like any custom barrel that was hand lapped at the factory, they shoot so much better than me, I can't tell a difference.

This is interesting, mostly because Shilen does not make a 5R ???????

4 groove Krieger's for me!!

You are correct. They make a 4 groove Ratchet. A good barrel is a good barrel.
Bart Sauter just shot a new 5 shot World Record, .282, at 600 yards. He used a 4 groove Lederer barrel.

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I guess I made an erroneous assumption that "Ratchet twist" is "5R"