Ok, here's the basic blueprint...

McMillan A5
Remington 700 short action
Rock barrel in M24 contour

Of the following cartridges, which would you pick and why:

.243
.243ai
6.5-284
7wsm
308
300wsm

What do you want it to be able to do?

243 to 30wsm is a pretty big spread... i know those deer down there are huge but...

barrel length? no other 7's on the plate than the wsm? do you have the action and stock already? any chance on a long either mag or standard? not trying to push you outside your choices but you mention the 306 and the wsm. could do an 06' and split the difference etc.. same goes for the 7... a LR ackley in 280AI would be really slick and would feed lights out... again, not trying to add to your list but i see a huge variance on your wants...

if i had to choose off your list i would vote the 6.5/284.. would be the best middle ground you have and a perfect platform for anything from yotes and paper to elk...

woofer

Mainly punching paper/plinking at various ranges. Any of them should be able to kill a deer rather easily if I chose to do that. The local range only goes out to 300yds but I do occasionally have access to shoot at much longer ranges. Mainly just looking for something fun to play with.

I would opt for the 6.5-284. No particular reason, I am just interested the in round. Certainly has the reputation for being able to reach out there as well.

sorry, you replied before i finished my post

308 or the 6.5.... (or it's little brother should get serious consideration the 260!!!) and a few more rounds to barrel life with less recoil......

woofer

7 wsm, cause i want to build the same thing

I would go either 6.5-284 or 260. 95gr V-max's for varmints, lots of different weight match bullets for fun, 130 Accubonds and Sciroccos for the occasional deer. It wouldn't kick, it should out-fly the 6mm's, and it has enough ooomph for everything you want to do with it. Sounds like fun to me.....

6.5-284 or one you did not list but I would do is the 260

sniff, sniff.. i smell a trend

woofer

6.5-284. Just because I would like to have one

me 2

308 for ease, a 6.5-284 for the cool factor.

Ed

6.5-284, I tend to think it would serve you well in all regards, paper shooting and yotes and the like. let us know what you pick.

I have worked with 3 6.5-284s, and while I like them very much, I think the long bullets in .264 caliber make it a better match with a long action (and the original post specified a short action.) If you get an assortment of 130-140 gr bullets and do the math to see how much ends up down in the case when the cartridge OAL is held to 2.8" and you will see what I mean.

If I were looking for a short action "mid caliber play gun," I would build either a 25-284 or a 260 Rem. Either would work great in a short action. I have first hand experience with .260s, and it is very easy to work with. Mild mannered, but kilzemdead. I don't have any experience with the 25-284, but I can easily see the attraction to 25-06 performance in a short action. It should not be any trick with either cartridge to get a 7.5# rifle (all up)that shoots WELL under MOA, has a flat trajectory, is pleasant to shoot, and has adequate power for deer-sized game out to 400 yards. What is not to like about that?

Thanks for all the suggestions guys...keep 'em coming.

This definitely won't be a lightweight mountain rifle so I'm not really that worried about recoil. I hadn't considered the .260 but like the idea. I had considered the 25 Souper but really would prefer to stick to something I could order ammo for off the internet if I had to.

308.

BMT

Yeah, but a 308 is just not as much fun for me to shoot as a 260. A 260 shoots a 100 grain bullet about 3150, for maybe 10-12" of drop at 400 from a 200yd zero, with about 12 ft-lb of recoil. A 308 shoots a 150 grain bullet 2900 fps for 15" of drop with maybe 16 ft-lb of recoil. (All values from memory; someone with more time on their hands can look them up and clarify where I am undoubtedly off.) The 308 is in the 30-06 class for recoil, the 260 is more like a 257 Roberts. I much prefer the latter. No doubt 308 ammunition is more available and affordable. But I didn't think those were design criteria.

Oh, and I take back what I said about 7.5#. I forgot your A5/heavy barrel plan.

223AI, but since that ain't on your list I'd run a 243 or AI so long as you had a 1-8" twist. If not then run a 308.

Looks like you want to beat up on some paper and from time to time work over the deer mostly to 300 yds.

No doubt if I were you I'd go 243 and or 308.

Either one will do exactly what you're wanting and will do it well.

My experience with the short 700 is that the WSM's and the 284 based rounds feed in a manner in which I find unacceptable so I would not do that.

7/08 would be another way to consider as well.

Good luck to ya.

Dober

[quote=utah708]I have worked with 3 6.5-284s, and while I like them very much, I think the long bullets in .264 caliber make it a better match with a long action (and the original post specified a short action.) If you get an assortment of 130-140 gr bullets and do the math to see how much ends up down in the case when the cartridge OAL is held to 2.8" and you will see what I mean.

I'm not the best to give an opinion as i can't make up my own mind. But I'm curious Utah708, why would the 260 be ok and not the 6.5/284. Both use the same bullets and if I'm not mistaken the 284 version gives you more capacity.

I do like the 25/284 option as I'm nuts over 25 caliber at the moment and know you can get some great speed with it.

I have one other to cause a little confusion eventhough it is not one listed, the 338-08. As crazy as I am with the 25 caliber, i feel the same about the 33 caliber and love it in the LA version 338-06

There's quite a bit of application difference for most folks between the 243 and the 300 WSM but some of the others mentioned will cover the whole spectrum from varmints to caribou (ok, elk too) quite well if not be the best choice for either end of things.

The 6.5-284 has significant capacity over the 260 and I might opt for the 7 SAUM if going bigger (Probably not as practical as the WSM though) just because I like its shape better.

If you would consider the 260 then the fact that some bullets might protrude down into the 6.5-284 case is of no consequence because it will still have considerably more capacity than the 260.

Of the options you gave I would go with the 6.5-284 for from coyotes to big game it should work quite well with the right bullet and wouldn't be "out of place" on either end.

Gdv

The 7wsm like I mentioned would be the dream machine for me that could handle any longrange hunting task as well.

I would do the 243 with the 115 or 117 sierra's for long range play and paper punching, plus I bet they would do a number on a deer quite a ways out there.

308 if factory match ammo is going to be used at all.

Hello, if you're still taking comments from the floor, here goes:

The .243 Win is the smallest legal deer cartridge in many rifle states. Recoil will be less than the .308 because of lighter bullets. 100's are definitely deer killers, smaller, lighter for varmints too. My AI take is that you can still shoot your Wins in it, but to appreciate the AI, you have to reload. You get 5 - 10% more velocity than it's parent. In the case of the .243, you don't really need it.

The .308 Win is legend because it is accurate, bullet selection is unparallel, and good match bullets are common. I'm loading .308 now for my M1A competitions. The 168 Matchkings, and now the 155's. Very versatile, available, and not too hard on the shoulder. Cost is a little more than the .243 for bullets especially for varmints, but bigger critters can be dispatched.

The only other cartridge I know is the .300 WSM. I will tell you that it kicks, the SAMMI specs are sloppy, brass is sloppy, at least Win stuff is. I would get a minimum SAMMI spec chamber if I have another done. Shells are expensive, hard to find, and if you don't like 180's you're going to reload. Unless you're going to hunt beanfields or engage in long range benchrest, the benefits are small. I'd take the .308 to hunt and shoot paper, or the .243 if recoil is an issue knowing it will do the job and open up the door to varmint hunting.

260 AI.......

Of your list I would pick the .243 Win. It will do deer quite handily and is hilarious on varmints. Ammo can be found anywhere if for some reason you aren't reloading. Also it ranks in the top 3 of my favorite cartridges.

.260AI.

the 6.5 just reaches out and tickles all the others....
woofer

I appreciate all the suggestions guys. I'm going to investigate the .260 thing a little further as I hadn't thought of that. I also really like the .243 and .308. I now they're "boring", but they sure do work well and ammo is everywhere...and cheap.

I know it is not on your list, but the 284 win itself is an excellent all-around cartridge. I run 140gr tsx's at avg 2960fps and I use it on deer, sheep, goats, elk,and moose. It is nice to shoot and can reach out when you need to. No sense going wildcat when the original is so good. Just my humble opinion.

Sorry for the delay in answering your question, but have been busy.
The box on a short Remington 700 limits the cartridge OAL to 2.80. The length of a 6.5-284 case to the base of the neck is 1.91", while the same dimension on a 260 is 1.77". A 140 Nosler Partition is 1.30" long meaning that .41" of bullet extends down into the body of the case on a 6.5-284. On a 260, only .27" does. On the 140 gr Sierra boattail, which measures 1.25", the intrusion is .36" and .22" respectively. Some people say that such intrusion of the bullet into the case is not a problem, but I don't like it.

In addition, the .260 is really sweet with 100-120 gr bullets, while the 6.5-284 strokes with 120-140 gr. That makes the bullet length issue doubly significant.

This is why I like the 6.5-284 on a long action. I had mine throated so that a 120 Ballistic Tip comes right to the base of the neck.

George of GAPrecision likes the 243, FWIW.

Once I fry the barrel on my GAP 308, it will become a 260 AI......

Utah708,

thanks for the info and i now understand. good info to know also if building a 6.5/284.

Chip

6.5-284.

Less filling and tastes great.

Expat

260 or 308

.260 Rem. Skip the 6mm's

Since you have not mentioned any specific competition for the rifle and its going to be heavy and bulky I would leave thought for a switch barrel gun. Not to disparage heavy and bulky as that profile shoots!

A competitor here changes barrels at the match! The barrels on his gun are just hand tightened by notches on the end of the barrel at the muzzle. This system works and he shoots very well.

There are other switch barrel methods of course. I just mentioned a one off idea.

You could contact Moe Difino on this at.

Master Class Sports Incorporated, 166 Pocono Rd, Brookfield, CT 06804
(203) 775-1013
166 Pocono Rd, Brookfield, CT 06804

As for cartridges get what you want as thats the fun of it all. Here is a link to some sniper history.

Link to sniper rifle history.

Pictures