Anyone have experience or advise on Krieger(not the Criterion brand)? I am looking to build a 223 AI on a Remington action. Probably 1 in 8 or 1 in 9 twist.

Krieger simply dominates the benchrest circuit.

Should answer your question......

Thanks for the info. Funny you should mention the Benchrest circuit as Krieger was recommended to me by a BR shooter. So, what is it that makes them dominate? Rifling process? Quality control?

I have two and both of those rifles have shot very well right from the fire-forming.

Yup, quality control and consistancy, year after year.

Just one lowly cautionary note - I had one Krieger for a customer that he simply could not get to shoot. Nothin' worked, and it wasn't a spindly barrel either - it was a #8 contour.... He finally gave up, round-filed the Krieger and had me install a Lilja.. That cured THAT!

But I mention it only because ANY barrel maker can have a turd leave the bowl.. I would have NO issue with obtaining another Krieger at all..

Krieger is first rate! I would use them exclusively if they offered stainless barrels in contours that are appropriate for a hunting rifle.

Krieger or Bartlein.

If you are going 223AI, I would not consider a 1:9. Go 1:8 - the bullet options are much better with this twist rate

Agreed. A #4 contour in 270 should end there, not start there.

I have both Krieger and Bartlain, both excellent barrels I would buy either.

A quick look at the LV equipment list for that last NBRSA group equipment list will show 14 Bartlain and 6 Kriegers out of the top 20.
LV Equipment list hard to go wrong.

Nothing wrong with Broughton either.

What 3 through 5 contours in stainless aren't acceptable for hunting what are you looking for? In my opinion their barrel weights are right in line with what I'd request in their list? I'm not a noodle barrel person.

I was thinking #5 contour. My Remington sporter measures .656 at the muzzle. Looks like the Krieger #5 contour is .700 at 26". I would most likely cut and crown to 24" so I am figuring a little over .700. If I remember correctly, they do offer stainless in this contour.

Dwight Scott chambered 7 of the top 20 finishes, 25 of the field had Scott as the gunsmith for 80 shooters, he told me 2nd place was not correct as he smithed Jack Nearys rifle also. I just had this discussion with him on the issue Krieger vs Bartlein, he ordered me a new barrel. His explanations, like always, very much from his vast experience.

I have a Krieger barrel one on my .338-06 (chromoly). It has given me well over 10 years of service and continues to shoot very well. My only beef with Krieger is their lack of smaller contours offered in stainless, already mentioned by Huntr.

What are you planning to do with you .223 AI? Is it meant to be a sporter weight, walking varminer? If so, a #5 is a bit much, IMO, and so is 24" of barrel length.

I have a Bartlein 1-8 twist on one of my .223AI's. When ordered, I asked them to duplicate the Remington Magnum contour, in an attempt to duplicate the 22" LVSF barrel. My Bartlein measures .680" at the muzzle. It's a bit heavier than I wanted or expected, even with fairly aggressive flutes. The total rifle weighs about 8 pounds, with a McM classic stock & 3.5-10x. She's the bottom rifle:


For comparison, my factory LVSF measures .650" and my .223 Montana and 7mm-08 Ti both measure .560" at the muzzle. All have the same barrel length, 22 inches. My #4 Krieger measures .660" at 23 inches.

I think a .223AI with a #5 contour at 24" would be a muzzle heavy set-up. If you're looking for sporter weight, I'd stick with something no larger than a #3.

In .308 caliber, Krieger's minimum is a #5 contour! .700 muzzle diameter is nothing that I am going to carry all day in the mountains!

Tim,

Which barrel did you go with?

Dan in AK,

Thanks for the info. You've given me some food for thought. Nice looking pair of rifles. I'm really hoping to end up around 9 pounds. This rifle would be used primarily for groundhog hunting or some day I hope to try PD hunting. I have 2 LW rifles already; a Weatherby Custom Outfitter in 270 Win and Kimber Montana in 223 Rem. Looking to build my 1st mid-weight custom.

You are an exception.

Krieger....

I've had fantastic results w/ krieger. My first choice if I have time....

The cross reference example to this anyone deal, is my buddy shot Kriegers for years and on a whim and some PR stuff floating in the highpower world, he ordered a Lilja. Shot like a house on fire. For about 1100 rounds. In a bolt gun 223 with 26 inch tube. Thats WAY under the life of a 223 barrel. I had a Krieger that had a documented over 10K rounds in it, I don't even recall but I THINK it was pushing 12K rounds.. anyway it still would shoot just over MOA at 200 and 300, but MOA and just over at 600 makes life tough in matches...

Jeff

My experience with Kreiger barrels consists of one so take it for what it's worth but man does it shoot! I've heard so many people say the .264 WinMag is a picky cartridge. That's what my Kreiger is chambered in and it's not fussy at all. I'm very impressed with the barrel and the cartridge.

Terry

Krieger makes excellent barrels, as do several others, including but not limited to Bartlein, Schneider, Shilen, Hart, Broughton, Lawton, PacNor, Brux and Rock Creek. The biggest reason they dominate in BR competition is that so many of the top shooters in the country use them. If 80% of the competitors used Broughton, then Broughton would dominate. Bartlein seems to be closing fast on Krieger when it comes to winning. That doesn't mean Bartlein is a better barrel than Krieger, it means that more competitors are using them.

I have three Kriegers and I can tell you they clean up fast andshoot as well as I can steer them. If you go with a Krieger I believe you will be happy. I also think you would find happiness with any of the others listed as well as a few that are not.

1flier

my Krieger .264 barrel shot the first load i tried into .5 moa. it has only shot that one load.

Bartlein is essentially a krieger in the contour you want it in,rather then what kriegers says you want it in.

I've had good luck recently with Brux barrels after using Krieger, Lilja, Douglas and Shilen in the past. Which is the best? That is up for grabs as far as I am concerned. All have been good barrels, and I can't say one is better than the other. Norm and Ken at Brux are great to work with and will make sure you get the exact twist and contour you want in a cut-rifled barrel. So far all have shot very, very well. They have said if their barrel doesn't shoot, let them know.

+1 for Brux. This Krieger was more of doing something different than needing a better product. My last 5 barrels have been Brux. I turned right around and ordered a Brux along with the Krieger after talking to Dwight, so he will finally get to see inside a Brux barrel.

First off, I own no barrels made by Krieger. I'll always be a Hart Barrel guy.
But, I read the Centerfire Benchrest shoots reports each month. Krieger barrels outnumber all others combined. Sayz something about Krieger barrels to me.
I ordered my first stainless barrel in 1967, a Hart, and took delivery of it when I returned for an overseas assignment in 1968. I've bought at least a half dozen Hart barrels since then, and they all have been shooters. Being a loyal guy, I'll continue buying Hart barrels.

I just chambered a 30 cal. Rock 5R barrel and it has shot so well that I have another on order. Being a benchrest guy, I would clean after every group. I went 75 rounds with this new Rock and it is still clean. I do have a borescope. Kreiger, Bartlein, Shilen, and Lilja make excellent barrels.
Butch

I prefer Rock to Kreiger,by quite a bit. Mike's 30cal 5R's in 11" and change,are simply wicked.

I've a Kreiger 223AI and another in 22-250AI. I don't get giddy about them. PN is still my favorite there and Hart my 2nd choice.................

What I like about Krieger is that they will sell you only their best barrel.

No tiers of quality with them.

What they throw away in the garbage can Pac-Nor will market.

I've heard tell that they are now going to produce a 5R.

SU35,
I don't completely agree with your assessments. Kreiger has the Criterion grade and has both Stainless and CM barrels. They make a cheaper grade as do some of the other barrel makers. They make a shoe for every foot.
Butch

I realize there are different "types" of barrels that Krieger markets.

But if their top of the line does not gauge out to the minimum it goes in the garbage can. Other makers like PN or Douglas will sell that barrel.

Very much the gist of a conversation I recall on the subject.

The new product manager Helmut, is building much pride right now within the company. He has challenged the crews on the rifling machines to be ultimately consistent resharpening of the rifling hooks used to cut the grooves.

Don't forget to condemn Shilen too.

Is there something amoral about a manufacturer selling a lower grade product at a lower price?

For those that have just ordered from Krieger, what is their lead time right now?

you are quite right sakojake. i own a Krieger stainless in a 30 cal, 1-10. it was right on .700 at the muzzle cut and crowned to 26". it shoots lights out on my old mauser. 5/8" in a 30-06 with my hunting load. 5 shots...

Yup, according to Krieger web site they are producing some 5R barrels whatever kind of barrels those are.

Curiously enough,I've "lesser tiered" wares by other Makers,which trump my Kreigers.

Fluff ain't my gig and I've no reservation quantifying goods at me feet,in fair extrapolation.

I'm done with Kreiger.................

Shilen is too dicey for my tastes,though I suffer quite a few..............

Has a familiar ring to it. Something about choice of words. But nah...It cant be. As for which barrel, I just purchased a brux for my latest project. Less money than the kreiger and a super fast turn around. And the icing on the cake was K.L. telling me for like the 4th time...we stand behind our barrels. If it dont shoot..send it back and we will replace it.

Coupla pards are raving about their recent Brux tubes and in fairness,I look to give some a whirl.................

My problem with Krieger is not having stainless in small contours.
I noticed our forums "Blaine" was pleased with his Benchmark barrel, so I tried a Benchmark #2 stainless and it shoots good. Also does not seem too bad about changing POI with different loads.

Broughton rates a thunk too,in fairness...............

I agree with SU35 on this, every Kreiger barrel I have has been great, more clunker's with Pac-Nor than any other brand............except mabey McGowen.
RC828

PWC rates a DFDS too, in fairness..........
RC828

Having seen Pac-Nor replace a second-hand, non-shooter barrel for free, I will give them my business again...

Few things more entertaining,than a DSMFer Dreamer,extolling in regards to things a goodly ways over her head.

Feel free to bite that hook..................

Guess who the latest dip stick is who gets the ignore function activated???

Lemme make another cast.

Yep...there we go.................

Bartlein draws the line on smaller contours also,have already been thru it with them!

All barrels turn down.................

Bartlein did a pretty slim #2 in SS for me.

......in .224.

Pappy called last night,raving about his 30" 338Ultra wearing a 1-9.5" Bartlein on a Borden actioned A5.

I get the feeling he weren't bluffin'...............

I noticed GA Precision no longer lists Rock as an option on their website. Are they getting hard to come by, what's the deal?

Mike is fickle and marches to his own drum.

Sweetens the pot IMHO....................(grin)

I'm sure it is caliber dependant,the smallest they would go on a .284 was a.830 neck and .630 muzzle maybe their changing their policy!

I prefer not to mess with a barrel after it's finished,some may remain accurate,just not willing to take a chance, or spend the money,YMMV

Have done it too many times,to be even remotely spooked................

I have 3 Kriegers that shoot very, very well. I have an Obermayer that shoots very, very well. I have a brand new Brux that shoots very, very well. The Bartlein guys are ex-Krieger guys. I work right down the road from Krieger and Bartlein and the guys that work at those places know what they are doing. Buy a barrel from a Wisconsin barrel maker and you can't go wrong.

Fast Ed

Quite a few of them, aren't there?

.830 neck & .630 muzzle is a hefty barrel for a minimum size to offer.

Betcha they get quite of few customers saying "Ill call you back"

i'd use em to if there s/s contours were smaller. my last 5 bbls have been pac nor 3 grooves.

I have a Krieger on my .30-06, light sporter contour 22". It shoots Sierra 165 GK's into .60 at 100 yds.