The object is to build a rifle to put a Alberta trophy class whitetail on the ground
Price is no concern.
Pick your components.
And gunsmith.
Your hunting area is north eastern Alberta on the edge of the big bush.
Late November.
One day your sitting a field edge.Figure 500 yards as max.
The next day your in the bush.
The next day your on the bump and run.
You have 12 seconds.
See him.
Judge him.
kill him.
What would you build?
dave
I've got that ultimate rifle but it's for across the line in the Peace Country, BC. Guess I can't play!
I'd borrow your 270 STW
Any of my rifles may get pushed into that kind of service on any given day...
But if I HAVE to play...
Game Scout Edge
Krieger, Bartlein, or Rock #3ish at 23", fluted with 8" twist in .260AI
Rem 700 type action (Templar, Defiance, etc)
Jewell trigger (currently using Shilen)
Badger M5 w/ 5-round mag
Scope would probably be a Leup Mk4 6x42 M1 or S&B 4-16x
Finished weight of around 8-9lbs would be just fine with me for this type of hunting.
Or I could just use my Montana 7WSM with FX3 6x42 M1 and call it a day
Never hunted Alberta but via extrapolation, the areas I hunt whitetails are similar........
Given the parameters, I'd say a 7mm-08 (straight or AI) firing a 140gr Accubond via 22" barreled short action would be near perfect!
If you must, then a .280 AI with 160 Ab's and a 24" barrel............. Karl is still my favorite!!! Scope the SA 2.5x8x36 Leupold or 6x36 and the LA with a 3.5x10x40 or 6x42, all with custom shop LR dots..........'tis my "ultimate"!!!
X-VERMINATOR
Uhhh....uhh...Unfortunately,I can only tell you what I have brought up there which has been a fair bunch of stuff...dunno if its right or not but they have worked for me
FW 270 Winchester with 22 inch Krieger barrel and Brown Precision Poundr stock. Scope has been a 2.5-8x Leupold although today I think better glass is mo better up there...but it does work OK.
I have to endure the cat calls and ankle biting up there from other hunters who consider the rig too small for those huge northern whitetails,but the last one I killed,a buck grossing a bit over 160, was hightailing across a field at last light,blowing clouds of steam at 25 below zero, and caught a 130 Partition on the point of the shoulder and collapsed in a cloud of snow...pretty impressive I thought
This outfit works in the fields,is precise enough at distance,short enough to squeeze in a ground blind, and will not break you down if the day includes some still hunting or pushing bush where a fast off hand chance is possible.
IMHO here trajectory and PBR can be important and IME use the LRF before hand to plot the field or cut line,and NOT in the presence of the buck....as Dave alludes to you are not going to have time;the big mature Canadian bucks do not dilly dally crossing openings, appear suddenly, and you will have little time to react and kill,assuming that is that you can recover in time from the shock of the size of them to even shoot...it should be over in few seconds or forget it.He will be gone if you dilly dally
So, for me, 3 inches high with the 130 gr bullet, and zero at 275 yards, down about 8 at 350 and about 14 at 400,about as far as I have had to reach.
Up there if I had to trade skill sets between hitting at LR,or being good at game on the move, I will take the ability to hit moving game every time.IME really long shots are rare, but moving targets at medium distances are far more frequently encountered....at least for me, a tourist hunter with only 7 days to do it and maybe one chance at a good one in a weeks hunting.y
Your ability to hit gongs at 600-800 yards is largely irrelevant....your ability to hit a basketball at 300 or less,from unsteady positions and in a hurry,is more important.
A big buck does occasionally step casually into the open at great distance to gawk, but he is far more likely to be moving hard during the rut.Mostly you will be hard pressed to be deliberate.
Next choice is pretty much the same thing,slightly longer barrel, a bit heavier but still able to cover the open stuff or the bush chores,and is a 24 inch barreled 7 magnum of some stripe and the rifle should still be light.Any 7 mag will do.I would zero the same way and with a fast 140-150 gr you will better the trajectory of the 270 by a few inches at 400-500...
The longish PBR of the 270, 7 mags and their ilk simplify issues of holdover under stress...I would not even bring Dots and would easily prefer a simple duplex reticle zeroed for 300 yards....using a ranging reticle at anything under that distance is a distraction you will not need.Leave the B and C reticles at home, forget the bars and graffs....they cant be seen in real low light that well and are just a distraction anyway.
JMHO
FW 270 Winchester with 22 inch Krieger barrel and Brown Precision Poundr stock. Scope has been a 2.5-8x Leupold although today I think better glass is mo better up there...but it does work OK.
This would work in Alberta and for 95% of all the other deer hunting we do.
Mine's the same except it's a 23" Gaillard in an Edge.
I have several .270s and .280s, that are much like Bob's choice, tend to prefer Zeiss and Swaro scopes, but, have at least one newish Leupy 2.5x8 on a spare rifle.
However, while I would tote one along, as a spare, my first choice would be my P-64 Mod. 70 Westerner, .264WM, pretty much new condition, except pillared into a Micky G7H, with a Zeiss Conquest 4.5x14 up, bipod on and it drives 140 NPs ate 3275 into average .6" groups at 300 M.
I built this 12-15 years ago, and almost never hunt/shoot it, but, it DOES perform and I keep it in case I ever hunt Canada's prairie provinces or BC's Peace River Country. I can do an honest 3375 with fine grouping with the 125 NP, but, feel the heavier bullet is better at range and in wind.
For pushing bush for Whiteassed Deer, I have a custom 6.5 lb. Classic sts shorty in .308W. with a short Leupy 1.75x6 HD on silver Talleys in an Edge Fwt. It was done by Martini Gunmakers in Cranbrook, BC, is slabbed and all that and has modded P-64 alloy bottom metal.....this, is my "geezer gun" and I am just now getting the irons on her.
Like most here, I have dozens of rifles, custom and modded, that would work perfectly in this scenario and I expect to hunt the flatlands as I age and BC's mountains keep getting steeper......
They DO, just try the West Kootenays with a multi-day pack, Dakota .338 and one soon sees that one's age and mountain steepness are definitely linked....NOT in the manner one would wish!
However, while I would tote one along, as a spare, my first choice would be my P-64 Mod. 70 Westerner, .264WM, pretty much new condition, except pillared into a Micky G7H, with a Zeiss Conquest 4.5x14 up, bipod on and it drives 140 NPs ate 3275 into average .6" groups at 300 M.
Just so I'm reading this right, you've got a Pre-64 Winchester 70 that shoots, on average, under 1/4 MOA at 300 meters?
FW 270 Winchester with 22 inch Krieger barrel and Brown Precision Poundr stock. Scope has been a 2.5-8x Leupold although today I think better glass is mo better up there...but it does work OK.
This would work in Alberta and for 95% of all the other deer hunting we do.
Mine's the same except it's a 23" Gaillard in an Edge.
Super Cub: Exactly
It does for me and is what I used in your province a couple of times as well.
Would ditto what Kutenay said about the 264 as well; I took a 264 M70 to Alberta once but never got to use it on anything.
Same rifle i wouldn't hesitate to use for most any other big game in north america.
Custom built 300 saum. Model 7 action, Edge classic stock, Zeiss Victory Diavari 2.5-10x42 with elevation turret. 150gr accubonds.
308 with a 21" tube, sporter contour in a McMillan compact stock (not Edge) with a 6x42 and an M1.
Scope would probably be a Leup Mk4 6x42 M1 or S&B 4-16x
Finished weight of around 8-9lbs would be just fine with me for this type of hunting.
Mr. Smith,
Either 4-16,the 42mm or the 50mm S&B would be problematic at best for a 9 lb limit.
but your young.....
Whos the smith?
Pretty nice parts list.
dave
308 with a 21" tube, sporter contour in a McMillan compact stock (not Edge) with a 6x42 and an M1.
How come not an edge stock?
dave
I like an Edge, but figuring with the heavier tube than I put in an Edge, it will balance better as a non-Edge.
Besides, many of the tube makers that many on here are likely to go are too damn skeered to make a skinny'ish stainless tube for fear of blowup.
krieger started that.
dave
I've got that ultimate rifle but it's for across the line in the Peace Country, BC. Guess I can't play!
You can cross over and play.
Whatch got?
inquiring minds want to know
dave
308 with a 21" tube, sporter contour in a McMillan compact stock (not Edge) with a 6x42 and an M1.
How come not an edge stock?
dave
What weight bullet in the 308?
dave
Uhhh....uhh...Unfortunately,I can only tell you what I have brought up there which has been a fair bunch of stuff...dunno if its right or not but they have worked for me
FW 270 Winchester with 22 inch Krieger barrel and Brown Precision Poundr stock. Scope has been a 2.5-8x Leupold although today I think better glass is mo better up there...but it does work OK.
I have to endure the cat calls and ankle biting up there from other hunters who consider the rig too small for those huge northern whitetails,but the last one I killed,a buck grossing a bit over 160, was hightailing across a field at last light,blowing clouds of steam at 25 below zero, and caught a 130 Partition on the point of the shoulder and collapsed in a cloud of snow...pretty impressive I thought
This outfit works in the fields,is precise enough at distance,short enough to squeeze in a ground blind, and will not break you down if the day includes some still hunting or pushing bush where a fast off hand chance is possible.
IMHO here trajectory and PBR can be important and IME use the LRF before hand to plot the field or cut line,and NOT in the presence of the buck....as Dave alludes to you are not going to have time;the big mature Canadian bucks do not dilly dally crossing openings, appear suddenly, and you will have little time to react and kill,assuming that is that you can recover in time from the shock of the size of them to even shoot...it should be over in few seconds or forget it.He will be gone if you dilly dally
So, for me, 3 inches high with the 130 gr bullet, and zero at 275 yards, down about 8 at 350 and about 14 at 400,about as far as I have had to reach.
Up there if I had to trade skill sets between hitting at LR,or being good at game on the move, I will take the ability to hit moving game every time.IME really long shots are rare, but moving targets at medium distances are far more frequently encountered....at least for me, a tourist hunter with only 7 days to do it and maybe one chance at a good one in a weeks hunting.y
Your ability to hit gongs at 600-800 yards is largely irrelevant....your ability to hit a basketball at 300 or less,from unsteady positions and in a hurry,is more important.
A big buck does occasionally step casually into the open at great distance to gawk, but he is far more likely to be moving hard during the rut.Mostly you will be hard pressed to be deliberate.
Next choice is pretty much the same thing,slightly longer barrel, a bit heavier but still able to cover the open stuff or the bush chores,and is a 24 inch barreled 7 magnum of some stripe and the rifle should still be light.Any 7 mag will do.I would zero the same way and with a fast 140-150 gr you will better the trajectory of the 270 by a few inches at 400-500...
The longish PBR of the 270, 7 mags and their ilk simplify issues of holdover under stress...I would not even bring Dots and would easily prefer a simple duplex reticle zeroed for 300 yards....using a ranging reticle at anything under that distance is a distraction you will not need.Leave the B and C reticles at home, forget the bars and graffs....they cant be seen in real low light that well and are just a distraction anyway.
JMHO
School is in session.
Bob is like E.F. Hutton.When he speaks.People listen.
Thanks for the great write up Bob.
dave
Unlike Bob, I've only hunted Alberta twice, taking three deer, two mule deer and a whitetail. The first time (when I got one of each) the rifle was a .280 Remington by Dave Gentry, shooting 150 Partitions at 3000 fps. The scope was a 2-7x Bausch & Lomb Elite. Shot the mule deer at a little over 300 as he stood still behind some does, and the whitetail running at about 175.
The other time I took my Serengeti 7x57 with a 2-7x Leupold VX-II, the load the 160 Partition at 2700 fps. Took a mule deer at just under 300 yards--10 seconds or so after my wife shot his buddy with her Serengeti .308 using the 150 Remington Core-Lokt Ultra at 2800. Her scope was a 3.5-10x Leupold VX-III.
Both hunts took place in the aspen parklands, the transition area between the prairie and the big woods to the north, within 100 miles of the Saskatchewan border. All of the deer were big-bodied, but the mule deer I killed on the second hunt was exceptional. We got 130 pounds of boned meat from him, meaning he weighed 400 pounds on the hoof or very close to it. Eileen's buck was a little smaller, but not much.
21" 308win w/3.5-10x44 Zeiss
Classic
155 VLD flying 2760
![[Linked Image]](http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv360/slg888/005-1.jpg)
I have killed Canadian deer with a 270, 308 & 7 STW! IMO, a nice quick handling rifle that you know how to shoot is far more important than caliber.
Take what you shoot well!
Randy
John,
Thats the area im talking about.
Cold Lake Air Weapons Range.
Runs across Alberta and Saskatchewan.
Thanks for the reply.
dave
Uhhh....uhh...Unfortunately,I can only tell you what I have brought up there which has been a fair bunch of stuff...dunno if its right or not but they have worked for me
FW 270 Winchester with 22 inch Krieger barrel and Brown Precision Poundr stock. Scope has been a 2.5-8x Leupold although today I think better glass is mo better up there...but it does work OK.
I have to endure the cat calls and ankle biting up there from other hunters who consider the rig too small for those huge northern whitetails,but the last one I killed,a buck grossing a bit over 160, was hightailing across a field at last light,blowing clouds of steam at 25 below zero, and caught a 130 Partition on the point of the shoulder and collapsed in a cloud of snow...pretty impressive I thought
This outfit works in the fields,is precise enough at distance,short enough to squeeze in a ground blind, and will not break you down if the day includes some still hunting or pushing bush where a fast off hand chance is possible.
IMHO here trajectory and PBR can be important and IME use the LRF before hand to plot the field or cut line,and NOT in the presence of the buck....as Dave alludes to you are not going to have time;the big mature Canadian bucks do not dilly dally crossing openings, appear suddenly, and you will have little time to react and kill,assuming that is that you can recover in time from the shock of the size of them to even shoot...it should be over in few seconds or forget it.He will be gone if you dilly dally
So, for me, 3 inches high with the 130 gr bullet, and zero at 275 yards, down about 8 at 350 and about 14 at 400,about as far as I have had to reach.
Up there if I had to trade skill sets between hitting at LR,or being good at game on the move, I will take the ability to hit moving game every time.IME really long shots are rare, but moving targets at medium distances are far more frequently encountered....at least for me, a tourist hunter with only 7 days to do it and maybe one chance at a good one in a weeks hunting.y
Your ability to hit gongs at 600-800 yards is largely irrelevant....your ability to hit a basketball at 300 or less,from unsteady positions and in a hurry,is more important.
A big buck does occasionally step casually into the open at great distance to gawk, but he is far more likely to be moving hard during the rut.Mostly you will be hard pressed to be deliberate.
Next choice is pretty much the same thing,slightly longer barrel, a bit heavier but still able to cover the open stuff or the bush chores,and is a 24 inch barreled 7 magnum of some stripe and the rifle should still be light.Any 7 mag will do.I would zero the same way and with a fast 140-150 gr you will better the trajectory of the 270 by a few inches at 400-500...
The longish PBR of the 270, 7 mags and their ilk simplify issues of holdover under stress...I would not even bring Dots and would easily prefer a simple duplex reticle zeroed for 300 yards....using a ranging reticle at anything under that distance is a distraction you will not need.Leave the B and C reticles at home, forget the bars and graffs....they cant be seen in real low light that well and are just a distraction anyway.
JMHO
Like others, I agree with Bob, on all points. Much more important to be quick onto the target and getting off your shot than absolute precision the vast majority of the time where I hunt. Most of my shooting practise is based on those conditions.
Deer aren't that hard to kill. Hard to find sometimes, hard to hit sometimes, but not hard to kill with any reasonable rifle.(hard to beat a 270, though I am temporarily without one!)
I am happy with a simple duplex reticle as well, for where I hunt (typical ranges being very close to 300 yards, with a few 400ish yard shots across a canyon with me moving through these areas throughout the day). I may have a different opinion if I hunted some of the wide open treeless areas or cultivated fields where you consistently take a very long shot or none at all.
Randy/Dave/John: I have used the 270 and 7mm mag,because that's what I had but by that I mean anything reasonable and if you have a 280,7/08,7x57,280AI,7mm WSM,7SAUM,30/06,,260,etc, etc, ad nauseum,grab it and just go hunting.There's little magic in cartridges.
Canadian whitetails are legendary for their size but they are not Sherman tanks and I think any good bullet weighing 120 grains and up,in calibers from .25 and up to .30 are just fine.....trying to argue about which of these is "best"is sort of silly because from what I've seen,the results are always the same if they land right.As John points out they CAN get to 350+ pounds and to someone used to looking at 200 pound deer some of these things look huge. IME they die the same as the smaller ones.
I have carried the 300 mags(Win,Weatherby,H&H) up there numerous times early on and they are great but can get heavy and awkward for the walking,can kick like a mule from unorthodox positions or the confines of a blind(I laid my left hand wide open from the swivel stud shooting a Sask buck at about 325 yards with a 300 Win Mag from a blind. That stings !).
and simply aren't required.
I have seen my share of 300 and 338 RUM's up there and the folks who carried them thought they were "essential";ditto one guy hunting bush stands with a 350 Rem mag....judging from some of the shooting I've seen a lot of guys have the whole cartridge selection thing ass-backwards.
To me the important thing is "KISS";something shootable and accurate that you handle well with cartridges being a very secondary consideration,and not too over-scoped with something maybe 3.5-10 being top end....at least that's the biggest scope I have taken there.
dave
Thornberrys pic, when asked was the standard 25-06 with a 100, partition.
His take was that hunters handled them well under stress.
Upping his odds.
And that just about any solid hit,even marginal hits were
lethal.
He always had at least one in camp.
Low recoil,hard hitting,flat shooting.
His second pic was the 300 Win mag with a 180g Ballistic tip.
In this time frame,late 80s mid 90s,ballistic tips were bombs.
....ie he liked it if the client could shoot it.....
Alot could not,at least not very well....
dave
To me the important thing is "KISS";something shootable and accurate that you handle well with cartridges being a very secondary consideration,and not too over-scoped with something maybe 3.5-10 being top end....at least that's the biggest scope I have taken there.
E.F.Hutton again.
Bob you should charge for your advise....
dave
Dave laffin'!
Maybe I should listen to myself more often....lots of times I don't
I only learned some of this stuff by making some really bad mistakes!
Scope would probably be a Leup Mk4 6x42 M1 or S&B 4-16x
Finished weight of around 8-9lbs would be just fine with me for this type of hunting.
Mr. Smith,
Either 4-16,the 42mm or the 50mm S&B would be problematic at best for a 9 lb limit.
but your young.....
Whos the smith?
Pretty nice parts list.
dave
I've not yet been able to afford a Schmidt, but this is a dream rifle, right?
Even 9.5lbs would be fine, and 10lbs wouldn't be the end of the world for this kind of hunting, so long as the rifle balanced well. It's far different from the sheep and mountain elk hunting that I do.
Are you planning on hunting around the Cold Lake area? It's a beautiful area, but the deer are no harder to kill than anywhere else in the province. I've seen some real whoppers laid out flat with things like the .243, .25-06, .257Bee, and up. Terrain can vary greatly, even within the same geographical area, so a rifle that you can shoulder quickly and naturally, but also shoot accurately at long range, is a real asset. The most important thing is to familiarize yourself with your rifle, both in terms of muscle memory and how the rifle shoots.
And I'd have Henry Remple screw the rifle together for me
21" 308win w/3.5-10x44 Zeiss
Classic
155 VLD flying 2760
Still one of the best-looking "serious business" rifles I've seen on here.
As others have mentioned, Bob speaks with the voice of reason. I'd likely grab my 22" 7mmSAUM M7 with 160AB's or my 22" .338WM 700LSS with 200BT's. They are easy enough to hit with out to 400-450yds.
Concerning the original post, the 12 seconds to make a shot would be a luxury around here! (grin)
either my swede 6.5x55 sporter or encore in .25-06. probably swede since it's a repeater
If I was in the US I'd be talking with George Gardner and going with something like the GAP non-typical, with maybe a few tweaks and changes.
I'd reach in the safe and grab my SS Mtn Guide 243 that wears a 6x36 FXII. Load would either be 90grSSII's or 95grVLD's. I know the Canadian bucks are bigger body-wise than our Northern Michigan deer, but ours aren't exactly "southern deer" by any means....I've spent too many years and killed too many deer with the 223/223AI/22-250 to feel handicapped in the least with a 243. Put a good bullet in a good spot and go pick up your deer, headstamps be damned. Not much else too it (grin)
I carried my .243AI with 105AM while deer hunting this year (both WT and MD), and I'll likely take it with me chasing cow elk tomorrow, as well...
i'm surprised it took 4 pages for the .223 ai to be mentioned
slg888, what contour are you running on the .308?
i'm surprised it took 4 pages for the .223 ai to be mentioned
Maybe if Dave said moose and brown bear were possible too....
I carried my .243AI with 105AM while deer hunting this year (both WT and MD), and I'll likely take it with me chasing cow elk tomorrow, as well...
One year at the Minburn camp.....thats farther south and alot more open....figure the Reddeer area.
Doctor buddie shot a BIG boonie.
Ill put it like this.
Most likley,up until that time the best deer he ever saw, let alone shot.
Sucker would not go broadside.
Tick toc.tick toc.
This thing takes a step, in either direction left ot right, .....its gone.
Tick toc.tick toc.
So he let it have it.
Texas heart shot.
7mm Mag,140g ballistic tips from the bomb era....
Bullet did not penatrate into anything vital.
One step and the sucker WAS gone.
Followed the tracks for 40 yards and then no blood.
Tracks mix with other tracks and then you got squat....
Darkness falls.
No deer.
The following day they picked up were they left off.
.75 of a mile in they spot a bunch of ravens over a spot about .5 of a mile away.
They found him.
Eyes picked out.And coyotes had cleaned it up all the way to the front shoulder.
Cape was crap.
But they got it.
Hell of a rack.
Im thinking i'd like alittle more bullet.
dave
I've got that ultimate rifle but it's for across the line in the Peace Country, BC. Guess I can't play!
You can cross over and play.
Whatch got?
inquiring minds want to know
dave
I can just say "What Bob said."
My biggest bodied deer, a mulie taken near Fort St John in 1995, was with a 270 Wby and early 130 XBTs. He field dressed 315 pounds. I will post pics later. Since then I have used several cartridges including the 25-06 for my best whitetail but it's not huge (haven't gotten a BIG whitetail yet), 6.5-06, 270 a fair bit, 30-06, 280AI, 300Wby and others up to the 358 Norma. They all work.
The handiest to use was the 280AI. Pics in the custom rifles thread from about 2006. 6-11 all-up with a 24" MR contour PacNor barrel in a compact Edge stock. Leupold 6X42 in Talley LWs.
But since this is about ultimate, it is about to come out of the oven. In short it is a blatant copy of Bob's 7 Mashburn. M70 Classic action, 24" Krieger #2 with some slimming in the middle ala Douglas, a Legend Edge and Williams bottom metal. It will wear a Kahles CL 3-9X42 with multi-zero turret in the lowest Conetrols that will work. A phenomenal scope that is better in low light than a 2012 production 6X42 Leupold I own; likely due to the etched reticle.
It will weigh an ounce or two under 8 pounds and balance where it is supposed to. I expect to use a high BC 165'ish weight bullet at close to 3200 fps which will work nicely in the wind. If the rifle agrees I will use the 168 LRX for everything.
My wife made an awesome shot the other day on a Sask whitetail at 390yrds with her factory FN M70 FWT 7-08 with a Leupold 2.5-8x36 scope....seems to work just fine.
Rick,
Nice.
I have all the parts for two buns in the oven.
Another set of twins.
Im trying to figure how to set up the second one.
dave
You have 12 seconds.
See him.
Judge him.
kill him.
What would you build?
dave
12 seconds, holy craplola that's a ton load of time! Guessing I'd have a slice of pizza, a shot of diet dew and oj (my morning drink) then grab one of the rigs I just spent the summer shooting the heckola out of that I've been running for years and knock the bucks dick in the dirt...
Seriously, this is just my way but on big time hunts I'm not about taking virgin rifles along.
Dober
Side note, I get it that it's after season and where all bored for till spring bear/turks etc so I'll add this.
Many rigs listed will work just fine, the cals from .243 to Big 7's will do just fine. I'd want a rig I was incredibly intimate with and a rig that had dotz in it. Aside from that, I just can't care much about what round its chambered for....
Dober
![[Linked Image]](http://i423.photobucket.com/albums/pp311/patrickgsinclair/Alaska062.jpg)
This.
This is the way I hunt in MN, last two deer have been around 300 yards. I shoot:
Custom 700 in 308
21" Douglass
Timney trigger
McMillan classic
Leupold 3.5x10
It'll shoot my 150 tsx's into .6 at 100 and keeps em tight out to 300.
Can't imagine needing anything more for deer.
Where do you get 12 seconds, 5 or 6 would be more like it where I hunt?
You have 12 seconds.
See him.
Judge him.
kill him.
What would you build?
dave
12 seconds, holy craplola that's a ton load of time! Guessing I'd have a slice of pizza, a shot of diet dew and oj (my morning drink) then grab one of the rigs I just spent the summer shooting the heckola out of that I've been running for years and knock the bucks dick in the dirt...
Seriously, this is just my way but on big time hunts I'm not about taking virgin rifles along.
Dober
Was hopeing you would grace us with your presence
Either one of my twins would get the nod if I had to go tommorrow.... and there sure not virgins...
But inquiring minds want to know what the Dober would build today,for the conditions listed up top.
dave
Where do you get 12 seconds,
Was trying to sight best case.
Hope for 12.
Get less.
Custom 700 in 308
21" Douglass
Timney trigger
McMillan classic
Leupold 3.5x10
Very nice cfan.
Have to go make the Donuts guys.
Later
dave
I've hunted Alberta maybe 12-15 times. I always killed my whitetail and mule deer and sometimes a moose.
My rifle always worked for me:
Rem 700 Action blueprinted and hard chromed (made before SS existed)
Three-Contour Gary Schneider barrel, .284" 1-10" twist, cut at 24-inches with floorboard crown
McMillan Remington Classic Stock - pillar bedded and free-floated
Remington Factory Trigger, blueprinted and set at 3�-pounds
Calibre: .280 Ackley Improved
Started out using 140 Ballistics. Used 120 Ballistics for the last four or five years; they killed mooses, elk and those humongous Alberta whitetail and mules just fine.
The rifle and loads shot pretty "clean." All of my kills were literally one-shot, with the exception of one particularly nice whitetail that I cleanly missed at 150 yards. He ran out to about 300 and made the mistake of stopping.
The whitetail, he was a decent 160-class and I wanted him, DID NOT survive the second shot I fired. 120Ballistic Snow Nap.
Blessings,
Steve
However, while I would tote one along, as a spare, my first choice would be my P-64 Mod. 70 Westerner, .264WM, pretty much new condition, except pillared into a Micky G7H, with a Zeiss Conquest 4.5x14 up, bipod on and it drives 140 NPs ate 3275 into average .6" groups at 300 M.
Just so I'm reading this right, you've got a Pre-64 Winchester 70 that shoots, on average, under 1/4 MOA at 300 meters?
Most of the three shot, 140 NP groups at 300M I have shot with this rifle, were right at .6", but, if I go to 5 shots, they open to about 1.12-.25". This, is not unusual for these rifles, WHEN the barrel is new and the piece is correctly bedded and tuned, with good loads and scope.
I am not shooting a stock P-64 here with a 1963 Leupy 3x9 and WW factory ammo. The rifle has been carefully tuned and of the several of these owned by other very experienced BC shooters I have known, this performance is pretty typical.
Contrary to a lot of bullschidt spread by various post-J0C gunscribes, largely flacks for the arms makers, P-64 Mod, 70s WILL shoot EXTREMELY well and many std. 270s, I have owned about ten of these, will shoot so well that most cannot take advantage of it.....I no longer can shoot as well as I did, but, I very seldom have grouping problems with any of my P-64s.
Just what I have seen in 54+ years, about 150 big game rifles and trying to do my best to learn about these guns and how to use them.
I carried my .243AI with 105AM while deer hunting this year (both WT and MD), and I'll likely take it with me chasing cow elk tomorrow, as well...
One year at the Minburn camp.....thats farther south and alot more open....figure the Reddeer area.
Doctor buddie shot a BIG boonie.
Ill put it like this.
Most likley,up until that time the best deer he ever saw, let alone shot.
Sucker would not go broadside.
Tick toc.tick toc.
This thing takes a step, in either direction left ot right, .....its gone.
Tick toc.tick toc.
So he let it have it.
Texas heart shot.
7mm Mag,140g ballistic tips from the bomb era....
Bullet did not penatrate into anything vital.
One step and the sucker WAS gone.
Followed the tracks for 40 yards and then no blood.
Tracks mix with other tracks and then you got squat....
Darkness falls.
No deer.
The following day they picked up were they left off.
.75 of a mile in they spot a bunch of ravens over a spot about .5 of a mile away.
They found him.
Eyes picked out.And coyotes had cleaned it up all the way to the front shoulder.
Cape was crap.
But they got it.
Hell of a rack.
Im thinking i'd like alittle more bullet.
dave
No problem. Substitute an 80gr TTSX for the 105AM if it worries you. Your doctor buddy would have been eating deer steak that night if he had been shooting the 80TTSX from a .243, or a 100gr .257" TSX/TTSX at 3300+fps...
I can't yet say how the 105AM would do in that situation, but I intend to sluice enough meat with it in the near future to find out.
I think we might have collectively concluded that......your Alberta deer rifle is not significantly different from what we use at home.....or anywhere else!
Or shouldn't be....
But thanks to Dave 7mm for the brain tickle!
Pretty much. Use a good bullet in a rifle you're comfortable with, and it's a done deal.
I'd use my current
Bryant Custom .260 without hesitation. Specs:
Stiller Predator
#4 Brux w/interrupted fluting, finished at 24"
Shilen trigger
McMillan Remington Hunter stock
PT&G bottom metal
Stiller 20 MOA rail
Burris Xtreme rings
Zeiss 3-9 Conquest w/ #4 reticle and turrets.
130gr VLDs launched at 2943.
Have mucho confidence in this combo.
John
![[Linked Image]](http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n159/Hondo64d/39aee0c9.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n159/Hondo64d/500yardsteal.jpg)
Anywhere~anytime rig built by Redneck. Amazing with 150& 165 NBT.
Zero to 600 yards is just a twist away
.308 Winchester
Rem 700 action
Pac-Nor #4.5 wt bbl at 21"
10 twist
McMillan HTG
Leupold 3.5-10x40 Tactical
Talley mounts
![[Linked Image]](http://i580.photobucket.com/albums/ss243/gunnut308/0e03416b.jpg)
What weight bullet in the 308?
dave
130 ttsx launched over 3000 in this....
![[Linked Image]](http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r27/ed_Brown308/308a.jpg)
Pierce action
Jewell at 1.75
Rock 5R #4 22"
McMillan rem sporter ADL
SWaro 1.7-10x42 perfect for bush or wide open
8.25 pounds scoped
Makes holes.....
![[Linked Image]](http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r27/ed_Brown308/EEC7F170-C0D8-47CC-9743-747C57D3DCC3-6267-00000394B3B2E0DA.jpg)
This.
Why this one? Have you killed anything with it?
John
John, I think Pat uses that one strictly for paper-punching...
No problem. Substitute an 80gr TTSX for the 105AM
Mr Smith,
If the 105AM your talking about is a 105g AMAX.
This is what you can expect from a 243 WCF.
![[Linked Image]](http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c90/dave7mm/trees2010131.jpg)
Thats whats left of two woodchucks at 250 yards.
I dont think I'd be very comfortable with that bullet for 200lb plus deer.
At the time my doctor buddie shot the deer in the story up above.
Ballistic tip were bombs.
Current production ones have been tuffened up quit a bit.
I am a mono fan for pretty much just about everything on four legs these days.
dave
I've hunted Alberta maybe 12-15 times. I always killed my whitetail and mule deer and sometimes a moose.
My rifle always worked for me:
Rem 700 Action blueprinted and hard chromed (made before SS existed)
Three-Contour Gary Schneider barrel, .284" 1-10" twist, cut at 24-inches with floorboard crown
McMillan Remington Classic Stock - pillar bedded and free-floated
Remington Factory Trigger, blueprinted and set at 3�-pounds
Calibre: .280 Ackley Improved
Started out using 140 Ballistics. Used 120 Ballistics for the last four or five years; they killed mooses, elk and those humongous Alberta whitetail and mules just fine.
The rifle and loads shot pretty "clean." All of my kills were literally one-shot, with the exception of one particularly nice whitetail that I cleanly missed at 150 yards. He ran out to about 300 and made the mistake of stopping.
The whitetail, he was a decent 160-class and I wanted him, DID NOT survive the second shot I fired. 120Ballistic Snow Nap.
Blessings,
Steve
Maybe 12-15 times?
You mean there may be three times you dont remember?
All my trips to Alberta were with the 280 Ackley improved and 140g Nosler Ballistic tip.
I never felt wanting.
Thanks for the write up Steve.
dave
308
Remington 700
Brux #3 @ 22"
Manners-SL
McMillan G-30 Action
4.5-14x50mm SF Leupold with DCT and my reticle
.264 Win Mag Mk II
140gr VLDs at 3250fps
![[Linked Image]](http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb428/GreybullPrecision/DSC00162.jpg)
This one is very fast up close and has all the reach I can use in the field.
Dave,
I saw this rifle come up on Gunbroker and grabbed it for pretty much what you describe so had no part in it's specs.
I think highly of it though.
Howa action slabbed and bolt fluted to lighten it up a bit. #1ish Broughton fluted, High tech specialties stock, pea green cerekote, 7mmWSM. I'm shooting 160 gr. Accubonds.
I like the cartridge/bullet combo because it has some ass.
Love the cerekote more for the protection of what you can't see than what you can.
The stock is a good one and a top notch bedding job of the action and shank with the barrel free floated make it a consistent shooting killing rifle.
I've shot quite a few good size whitetail with it and they don't go far or begin to catch the bullet. Little bloodshot meat gives me some confidence in it's integrity.
Lots of ways to get where you want but a good coating on the internals as well as out would certainly be on my list. Nothing like being able to set a soaked rifle in a warm place to dry and thaw out at the end of the day without having to worry about corrosion when you grab it early the next morning,IMO.
P to
![[Linked Image]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v664/fedsva/002-1.jpg)
Who says bolt gun? 270 Titus, 130 GMX at 2700+. Shot two 1/2" groups with Nosler 115 Custom Competition playing around today.
![[Linked Image]](http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z371/Weather223/DSC_0125.jpg)
Dave,
Nothing like being able to set a soaked rifle in a warm place to dry and thaw out at the end of the day without having to worry about corrosion when you grab it early the next morning,IMO.
P to
Thats a big plus 1
dave
McMillan G-30 Action
4.5-14x50mm SF Leupold with DCT and my reticle
.264 Win Mag Mk II
140gr VLDs at 3250fps
This one is very fast up close and has all the reach I can use in the field.
john,
Whats that thing weigh?
dave
The object is to build a rifle to put a Alberta trophy class whitetail on the ground
Price is no concern.
Pick your components.
And gunsmith.
Your hunting area is north eastern Alberta on the edge of the big bush.
Late November.
One day your sitting a field edge.Figure 500 yards as max.
The next day your in the bush.
The next day your on the bump and run.
You have 12 seconds.
See him.
Judge him.
kill him.
What would you build?
dave
Not as exciting as most, but I would run a Model Seven SS in 7 Shamwow, with a Wildcat stock, no paint, a drop chart on one side and an ace of spades on the other. Flinging 162 A-Max at 2950 fps. Rock the front bi-pod and a 6X42 in Talleys with M1's. For even more class, I'd add a horse hair sling.
I'd have this guy do all the work:
www.criticalprecisionrifle.comI hear he does really good stuff...
R.
Dave,
Forgot to mention I also used the 7x57 Serengeti on my Alberta moose hunt in the same area. It worked quite well on za mature Bullwinkle, but I used a 160 Northfork instead of the 160 Partition.
Don't think the "super-premium" bullet was necessary, though the bull only went 19 yards before keeling over. At the first shot (225 yards through both lungs) he stood there, then started to walk very slowly toward the nearest cover. The guide suggested I put another one in him, which landed 2" from the first.
I don't think it hurried anything up, but you never know. Found both under the hide on the far side. Maybe if they'd exited the moose would have died a lot quicker, but after some previous moose experience I doubt it.
A Remington 700 or Winchester Model 70 with a #2 contour 22-24" in .25 to .338 caliber shooting a 115-210gr bullet at 2800-3350 fps sitting in a McMillan Classic hunter topped with a 3.5-10 Leupold and CDS turret.
Rman;
I trust that this finds you and yours doing acceptably well this warm for December evening.
Since I've never hunted Alberta as yet I'm not sure I can contribute much in the way of an ultimate rifle for whitetail there. That said, our old youth pastor has moved to Bonnyville and has given the girls and I a standing invitation to come hunting. Apparently he has the exclusive run of some nice property one of the church members own....
Then too, my big brother who is still on the farm near Yorkton, SK keeps telling me I need to visit and can certainly come during hunting season and shoot as many whitetail as I can carry back here to BC.
Anyway if that day ever came I'd take along both a .308 Norma built on a Ruger 77 action or my .270 that I cobbled together starting with a military 98 action. It's got a Wildcat stock on it - but I've painted mine!
When I talk to the guides here in BC, by far the most common complaint I hear from them is that the visiting hunters take much too long to shoot once the game has been sighted.
As BobinNH said and I completely agree with, I'll take a rifle I can shoot quickly with out to say 300yds over something that I might be able to drive tacks with at 500 but takes me longer to get going with.
Back when we were on the farm in Saskatchewan we used to see some real good whitetail from the farm equipment, some exclusively at night but not always. Typically I'd say one would have had an honest 5 count to shoot the old boys before they decided to head over to the next quarter.
Anyway I just thought I'd shoot the breeze a bit and say hello to you sir and wish you and yours the best this Christmas Season.
Dwayne
McMillan G-30 Action
4.5-14x50mm SF Leupold with DCT and my reticle
.264 Win Mag Mk II
140gr VLDs at 3250fps
This one is very fast up close and has all the reach I can use in the field.
john,
Whats that thing weigh?
dave
Dave,
I weighed it the other day in the field and it was 1 ounce short of perfect. (I fired one shot at 495grs)
![[Linked Image]](http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb428/GreybullPrecision/JohnMuleDeerBuck2012_zps11967b41.jpg)
All joking aside it is 11lbs with the ammo (3 in the belly and 9 on the cuff) including the sling.
Thanks Dwayne!
All the best to you and yours this season as well.
I really have to say, if the whitetail around here stood still for twelve whole seconds, I'd have a freezer full them. But, they don't, so I have to suffer with a freezer full of grain fed mule deer.
Both Bonnyville and Yorkton have great WT hunting. Best part about both places, is you'd have to stop by here for a coffee first!
Take care.
R.
All joking aside it is 11lbs with the ammo (3 in the belly and 9 on the cuff) including the sling.
Only you could talk about walking around with an 11 lb rifle and say "all joking aside" in the same sentence John.
Eleven pounds? That is just plain silly.
But I guess that is the difference between a shooter and a hunter.
Sorry, but WELL over five hundred big game kills and fifty+++ years of experience have left me with a totally different opinion.
YMMV and obviously does.
Blessings,
Steve
Dave,
I think that since Melvin has already built it I would take the 280 Ackley with either a 120g or 140g TTSX. Easy to carry,very light, points well, accurate and although I haven't killed a big Alberta Whitetail with it I am sure it would work fine.
2nd choice would probably be my Sako AV in 300 WM that Bill Saxon at Douglas put together for me in a High Tech years ago shooting 180 NBT's. May head back up there next year and try one of them out.
Might get lucky and be blessed with an opportunity. Made a mistake many years back and passed on a dandy 3 days into a 6 day hunt thinking I would see something better. I play that scene on the crank film reel in my dreams. I need redemption.
Had the 300 then. Since Bill is gone prolly ought to take it back up.
Dave
Made a mistake many years back and passed on a dandy 3 days into a 6 day hunt thinking I would see something better. I play that scene on the crank film reel in my dreams. I need redemption.
I have a few(more than one)of those nagging replays myself.
dave
john,
Most that know me here know that I build on the heavy side of things.And am not afraid of a rifle that weighs more then most.
But 11 pounds all up is more than i'd feel comfortable with.
dave
Made a mistake many years back and passed on a dandy 3 days into a 6 day hunt thinking I would see something better. I play that scene on the crank film reel in my dreams. I need redemption.
I have a few(more than one)of those nagging replays myself.
dave
Alberta trophy hunter's lament.
What did you guys pass up?
McMillan G-30 Action
4.5-14x50mm SF Leupold with DCT and my reticle
.264 Win Mag Mk II
140gr VLDs at 3250fps
This one is very fast up close and has all the reach I can use in the field.
John,
How the hell are ya?? Haven't seen you post in awhile - hope all is good!!
Tell me more about the McMillan action on your rifle above - I have looked at them on their site but never seen one in person. I am curious to how it measures up with other Rem 700 clones out there (Defiance, Surgeon, Stiller, BAT, Pierce, etc.....)
Thanks!!
Bob
The first one was with Thornberry back in 87.
Oh yes, you never forget.
Coolie edge sitting.
About 250 yards below me wandering in and out of the red brush.
Just picking his was along nose to the ground.
I had him dead to rights.
Figure a solid 150 class 10 point.
Same same story as everone else.
Was only Monday morning, early.
Had the whole week to hunt,figured I had plenty of time.
Wish he was on my wall right now.....
Last hunt in 95.
Sitting high over a frozen river.
Saw this guy comming from ways off.
In and out of the chit.
Finally pops out about 200 yards right in front of me on the opposite side of the river.
.....head pops out first to take a peek.
Head gear was freakish......Like a 6 point.But super high.
Bases of his antlers here HUGE like REAL HUGE.
I should have shot him just so i could take a better look...
Odd looking body as well.Most Alberta deer have real long bodies.This guy was actually short from front to back.
Never seen anything like it or even a picture like it.
Have no clue how he would have scored.
I guess I was startled comming face to face with such an odd ball
Wish he was on my wall aswell.
Its the gift that keeps on giving.
It replays over and over......
dave
I have parts for another set of twins.
Kinda getting tired of the M700 turd polishing thing.
I detest the new M700s.
I think they actually do suck when you compare them to say 70 or 80 vintage M700s.Safe doesnt lock bolt down any more.
Just plane rough.Feels like someone thru a hand full of sand into the action when you work them.
Wont carry an action that will not lock bolt down....
Nuts on that.
So I went custom action.
Defiance Rebel long action.Long tennon. 700 tang.
I sent them to Dave Gentry for a M70 safe install.
...that took 11 months...
The very first two Defiance actions to be so converted.
Or so I've been told....
One has the 06 bolt face the other is a mag.
Got rails for both of them.
In case I feel the need to mount a hubble for some Texas nighttime adventure....
I did my McMillian GP/HTG in edge, bond patch inletted for the Defiance/Templar action.
14 inch LOP.
Half inch pad.
SS studs.
These things are light.
Barrels.
Well the original plan was to build a 25-06AI and a 300 win mag.That was the plan.
I have Fluted Rock No4s in 25 27 and 30.
Im planning on sticking with the 25-06 AI.
It will finish up at 24 inches.And should be just dandy for just about everything.
But the Mag action.
I just cant quite pull the trigger on the 300 mag.
I keep thinking id like to have something with less recoil.
Was thinking about the 270 STW.
Was thinking about taking Dobers 7mm Mashburn....
Was thinking about taking Dobers Mashburn and necking down to 270.....now theres an idea.
The STW is a wild ride.
Barrel life is very short.
If I ever get around to hunting Alberta again.I dont see the STW working out for me that well.....I like to practice alittle to much.
So I come the the fire for advise.
dave
All joking aside it is 11lbs with the ammo (3 in the belly and 9 on the cuff) including the sling.
Only you could talk about walking around with an 11 lb rifle and say "all joking aside" in the same sentence John.
Roy,
These guys said it too.
![[Linked Image]](http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb428/GreybullPrecision/f3133622.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb428/GreybullPrecision/efd90e92.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb428/GreybullPrecision/026436ac.jpg)
Eleven pounds? That is just plain silly.
But I guess that is the difference between a shooter and a hunter.
Sorry, but WELL over five hundred big game kills and fifty+++ years of experience have left me with a totally different opinion.
YMMV and obviously does.
Blessings,
Steve
I do like to shoot.
McMillan G-30 Action
4.5-14x50mm SF Leupold with DCT and my reticle
.264 Win Mag Mk II
140gr VLDs at 3250fps
This one is very fast up close and has all the reach I can use in the field.
John,
How the hell are ya?? Haven't seen you post in awhile - hope all is good!!
Tell me more about the McMillan action on your rifle above - I have looked at them on their site but never seen one in person. I am curious to how it measures up with other Rem 700 clones out there (Defiance, Surgeon, Stiller, BAT, Pierce, etc.....)
Thanks!!
Jeff,
I really am a fan of the Mac G-30. Last time I talked about it I made a few other action makers mad so let�s just say it is a very well designed and very well made action.
Some things in particular I like include the dual ejectors, really well thought out fluting pattern on the bolt, 17-4 PH Stainless, enclosed cocking shroud, and a really positive primary extraction cam.
John,
Push feed or controlled round feed on your G30 action??
I really like the looks of the G30 - seems like its built like a tank!!
John,
Push feed or controlled round feed on your G30 action??
I really like the looks of the G30 - seems like its built like a tank!!
I like the push feed but have never tried the CR feed in the G-30.
![[Linked Image]](http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb428/GreybullPrecision/Rifle%20Pictures/18aab0a2.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb428/GreybullPrecision/Rifle%20Pictures/04ea8c24.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb428/GreybullPrecision/Rifle%20Pictures/4f9701c4.jpg)
Uuuhh....what does the "G" stand for?
John, all I'm saying is dragging an 11 lb rig around gets old real quick for me. I have a Remington CS 700 APR in 300 WM that I love to shoot cause it's stupid acurate. I've taken it with me on several trips and it usually winds up being left in camp after a day or two cause, for me, it just gets to be a drag at slightly over 9 lbs loaded. My 280 Ackley or my custom Husky 06 are much more comfortable to carry around at closer to 8 lbs loaded.
I wasn't trying to down grade your rifles, you or anything you've said your rifles will/can do at long range shooting. Matter of fact, your "dial-a-range" turret system makes 10 times more sense than counting clicks and checking drop charts for hunting.
![[Linked Image]](http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r74/RDFinn/My700APR2.jpg)
John, all I'm saying is dragging an 11 lb rig around gets old real quick for me. I have a Remington CS 700 APR in 300 WM that I love to shoot cause it's stupid acurate. I've taken it with me on several trips and it usually winds up being left in camp after a day or two cause, for me, it just gets to be a drag at slightly over 9 lbs loaded. My 280 Ackley or my custom Husky 06 are much more comfortable to carry around at closer to 8 lbs loaded.
I wasn't trying to down grade your rifles, you or anything you've said your rifles will/can do at long range shooting. Matter of fact, your "dial-a-range" turret system makes 10 times more sense than counting clicks and checking drop charts for hunting.
Roy,
I took no offense and hope my post didn't come off like I did. You have always (almost)
busted balls in a good natured way and that�s the way I took your post.
I am willing to pack a bit heavier gun than most and was throwing my 2 cents out there but didn�t expect to get much agreement. I seem to be odd man out on a few issues here and there.
Uuuhh....what does the "G" stand for?
Stoney,
G stands for �Good�. Now don�t ask me what the 30 stands for cause I am now just making stuff up.
Dave,
I think that since Melvin has already built it I would take the 280 Ackley with either a 120g or 140g TTSX. Easy to carry,very light, points well, accurate and although I haven't killed a big Alberta Whitetail with it I am sure it would work fine.
2nd choice would probably be my Sako AV in 300 WM that Bill Saxon at Douglas put together for me in a High Tech years ago shooting 180 NBT's. May head back up there next year and try one of them out.
Might get lucky and be blessed with an opportunity. Made a mistake many years back and passed on a dandy 3 days into a 6 day hunt thinking I would see something better. I play that scene on the crank film reel in my dreams. I need redemption.
Had the 300 then. Since Bill is gone prolly ought to take it back up.
Dave
I would have saved a boat load of money if I had just went to Melvin 30 years ago.
I actuallty have one I bought used.
Its a 300 Win Mag and all up its lucky if its 7.25...loaded.
The one I have is way to short for me.
Not so sure I could live with that stock.
But function wise,accuracy wise and otherwise.
I like it alot.Safe even locks the bolt down like a rifle ought to....
I agree about the 280 AI.
I have often thought that the NULA model 20 in 6.5/284 would be dammed hard to beat.
The older I get the lighter the rifle I look for....
dave
John,
From what I've read from others about your shooting and the videos I've watched, I can't imagine the need for you to carry 9 spares on the cuff in addition to what's in the magazine. Seems you could save half a pound in ammunition weight on your rifle and be just fine.
Dave you could go 7RM in that mag action....it'll work.If a wildcatis knawing at you, I know the Mashburn works real well.
John Burns that McMillan action is nice!
Bob,
The wildcat part of the thing doesn't bother me at all.
And I know the 7RM would do whatever I need.
I just keep thinking about the recoil of a 300 Win mag.
Thought about the 7RM.
Thought about a regular 7mm STW.
Thought about my 270 STW
Thought about the 7mm Mashburn
Thought about squeezing the mashburn down to .270.
Thought about the 257 Weatherby.
As you can tell i've been doing alot of thinking
For deer I really like the classic 130g 270 and 140g 7mm bullets.
You ever run across anyone running 140g bullets in the 7mm Mashburn???
The 25-06AI just seemed so easy.For the one action.
Im obsessing about this mag action for some reason....
I have the Defiance action but I also have a spare vintage M700 with a mag bolt face.
Left over from the BOOBOO....
So if I wanted I could actually do triplets
Was thinking about keeping the Defiance something normal.
And then go batchit crazy on the M700.....
dave
Dave-there was a spell where I ran the 140 TSX and NBT out of my Mashburn (big suprise eh). They worked just fine.
I still prefer the 150 NBT as it flies well at range, and simply pounds game especially at distance. I couldn't get the 140/168 or 180 Bergs to shoot in this tube but the tubes really toast so I'll give them a go in the next one.
I have a reamer if you wish to use it you're more than welcome. It's traveling around the first of Jan for a couple of weeks but b4 or after that you're welcome to it.
Dober
Mark,
Thank you as I certainly appreciate the offer.
In the Mashburn what powder would you recommend for the 140g TTSX?
I know that the Mashburn is considered a "heavy bullet" type of cartridge.
But I see a round without the peekie 7RM type problems and I see a round with a neck length thats "better"....relative term.Not as crazy over bore as a 7mmSTW or the 7mm RUM.
Not to big and not to small but.....but just right.With a proper neck....lots to like when you study up on it.
I like the 7mm Mashburn.Alot.
No flys at all for me on one the 150 NBT.
I get squeamish thinking about Berger bullets on trophy deer.
Bad angles,Murphy's law.
If I learned anything on my trips to Alberta is that those deer dont stand around and pose for you to make a perfect chest shots.
All I can see with Berger bullets is the best deer of my life running full tilt away from me and there I am with a bullet that will only penatrate a couple of inches and then explode.
I get squeamish thinking about Berger bullets on my freezer doe here at home as well.I've seen x-ray pictures of the lead left along wound channels.
I never ate paint chips as a kid.Dont think theres alot of lead in my system.....i'd like to keep it that way.
I get the accuracy part.
I shoot the Bergers every month all summer long.At 1000 yards.
I just dont want to hunt with them...
My goto for decades was the 280 AI.
The reason for that was the 7mm Weathbery.
I had one early on and it turned me off to mags.
Havent fully recovered even now...
dave
I just used the same load of 7828 that I used with the 150's (4 the 140 that is). It worked well enough. I went one year of using the 140 TSX, and one year of 160 TSX, another year of 150 TSX and finally the 120 TSX. I didn't use the 120 on an elk that year, if I recall right I used my .270 that fall on my elk.
Long and the short I couldn't see any diff tween how any of them killed. And I went back to the 150 NBT. 4 me, the 150 NBT has all I want. I get two holes as I've never had one stay in game and I've been using it since the time it came out I think. It has wonderful BC and fly's very well. And it flat out pounds game! Deer and lopes when given a hit @ longer ranges (say 400-600) really react to the hit and that's what I like about the Mashburn.
And yet for me it's a fair bit more shootable (from all positions) than the various 300's and 340 that I used to run.
For me it does what I want very well and that's why I use it.
Dober
And yet for me the 7mm mashburn is a fair bit more shootable (from all positions) than the various 300's and 340 that I used to run.
Dober
Bob and Mark.
The campfire now has two E.F.Huttons.
When they speak.
People listen.
dave
Naw we're just the Smashburn Bro's that know what we want and likey...
Want me to mail the reamer...grin
Dober
Mark,
Thank you as I certainly appreciate the offer.
In the Mashburn what powder would you recommend for the 140g TTSX?
I know that the Mashburn is considered a "heavy bullet" type of cartridge.
But I see a round without the peekie 7RM type problems and I see a round with a neck length thats "better"....relative term.Not as crazy over bore as a 7mmSTW or the 7mm RUM.
Not to big and not to small but.....but just right.With a proper neck....lots to like when you study up on it.
I like the 7mm Mashburn.Alot.
dave
Dave I feel the same way...you hit on a few reasons I like the cartridge.Dober's experiences gave me the incentive to go with this wildcat,something I don't undertake very lightly....
I built the rifle specifically for the heavy 7mm bullets, but this is not to say it won't work with the fast twist and light bullets.I have run the FF load Dober gave me with 140 gr bullets and 65-IMR4350-139 Hornady for 3150(winter) to 3190 ( heat of summer) with good accuracy and no ill effects.I have not tried it yet but feel I could move to the 140 Bitterroot with the same charge,and new brass simply run into the Form/Trim dies and go hunting.Since I have used that bullet on those Canadian bucks a few times I know it will work.I have worked with 140 gr bullets in the 7mm Dakota(same thing),24" Krieger for about 3350 fps.
A couple of Mashburn correspondents are using things like the 150TTSX and Dober's 7828 recipe with good results on Georgia whitetails in open fields,to BC bull moose.I have to consider that pretty good testimony for an all round cartridge.Others are following Warren Page's script,shooting everything from antelope to elk,black bear,mule deer,whitetails,blacktail deer,etc with 175 gr TBBC's and 175 gr Nosler Partitions.All report good results.One fella is taking his to Sonora for desert sheep with the 175 TBBC very soon.
Me, I have a bunch of 175 Partitions loaded, but am mainly shooting the 162 Amax and 160 Nosler Partitions,both with 75-H1000 for 3169 and 3180 respectively.I'd consider something else,but these two bullets follow the dots on the 6x36 Leupold so well to 600 yards, I am struggling to find a reason to change.
When you get a 175 to almost 3100,and a 160 gr 100 fps faster, it becomes hard to worry about anything else :)It handles the heavy bullets very well,but can be a light bullet screamer as well, if that's what a guy wants.Ask Safariman.
My desire for another CF BG cartridge has been substantially dampened since I built this rifle.I don't need much else
I'm going back to Canada next year and I'm going to take my trusty old 270, just to prove to myself that all of these memories I have of killing deer with it, are real
It's hell when you get so old you gotta keep doing stuff just so you know you really done it.
Randy
Randy:Anecdote....I was in my garage at 3AM, bags and rifle packed, waiting for the ride to the airport going to Central Canada.
Back then I was into my "niche rifle" stage....you know...a "brush/tree stand" rifle, a "field rifle","walking around" and "stand rifle".In the case was a 300 magnum and a short tubed 7/08.
After the second cup of coffee my brain came to its' senses and I said to myself...."This is stupid".....
I jettisoned the ammo for both from the duffle, emptied the case,tossed in 40 rounds of 270 ammo and grabbed my M70 270 FW and locked the case.
I killed two bucks that trip(in the days when Sask had a 2 buck limit)...one in a field and the other at 40 yards as he blew by,chivied by another buck over a hot doe.
It felt better....like taking the monkey off my back.
Bob, in 06 I killed a bruiser in Saskatchewan with my 7STW @ 77 yards
I must admit it did a fine job but when I got home I put it in the safe and it sat there for a few years until I finally sold it to a guy here on the fire.
I should of had my backside kicked for selling it, Model 70 LH CRF, the things we do at times
Randy
Uuuhh....what does the "G" stand for?
The "G" is for "Gale" McMillan, who founded the company.
I have one of the G-30 rifles built on the CRF action chambered for 30-06. It is an extremely well made rifle and it is stupid accurate.
The week before hunting season started, I took it to the range to check it's zero and it shot a .640" group....at 300 yards.
I like this photo of the rifle:
![[Linked Image]](http://i1203.photobucket.com/albums/bb400/Chetaf/ChetCamera2012ElkHunt0024.jpg)
Randy those magnum left hand M70 actions are not easy to find....
Chet I saw some complete McMillan rifles at Cabela's Buda....they are nice rifles!If I were gonna get a PF rifle and drop some dough, that's how I'd roll!
Bob,
If I could only forward you the image that when I think about it still resides in memory. It and the Muley in Bridger (before the wolves got dang near all of them). If I had shot the Muley (35 yards and every bit of 32"+ wide) the horse my buddy was riding would be deceased.
No excuse on the Alberta Whitetail. I'll give you a hint regards something I tell guys that fool around trying to score the head dress on a Whitetail. If he has horns, a pot belly and a sway back and he is standing @ 110 Yards broadside in a cut road - shooooooot! Worry about the bone when you walk up on him.
First time in any Canadian Province and the body size - rack size deal made me hesitate that split second that was needed to take him. As we all know a buck like that doesn't stand broadside very long for anybody or anything.
Rode 30 minutes on the back of a 4 wheeler thru the muskeg to a clear cut before daylight. Walked in the cut road and found a spot to sit beside a log. Was as scent free as I knew how to prepare and had a drag on my boot freshened with Tinks and three or four 35MM film plastic cannisters with cotton in them drizzled too.
Dropped the cannisters starting about 125 yards in the cut line from where I ended up getting set up. Got light enough soon after. Clear day, cold with a skiff of snow on, and I could hear the the squirrels cutting in the woods at the edge of the cut block behind me.
Being it was the first week in November I allowed that getting my rattling horns out might be a good idea. Went thru a rattling session and put em down and listened and watched for no more than 5 minutes and to my left I heard hoves hit the frozen ground in the cut line. There he was. His belly line and his back line were profiled even with what today I would call a minimum of a 2" drop from end to end.
Had the gun (SAKO AV 300 WM stoked with 165 Sierra HPBT's) laying on a log to my left with the cross hairs just behind his shoulder and I waffled. Wish I could replay that one. Woulda, shoulda, coulda moment.
Dave
....with the cross hairs just behind his shoulder and I waffled. Wish I could replay that one. Woulda, shoulda, coulda moment.
Dave
He will always be with you Dave.
Just not hanging on the wall in your living room....
dave
Randy those magnum left hand M70 actions are not easy to find....
Chet I saw some complete McMillan rifles at Cabela's Buda....they are nice rifles!If I were gonna get a PF rifle and drop some dough, that's how I'd roll!
Bob,
You should check out the CRF action with the M70 style three position safety. Mine works great and feeds perfectly.
Chet
,but can be a light bullet screamer as well, if that's what a guy wants.Ask Safariman.
I read Safarimans write up with interest.
Doable for sure.
Thing is.
If I prep for a hunt in Alberta.
Im going to be practicing.
Alot.
Uber mags just dont hold up to being shot that much.
Uber mags being STWs and RUMs and such.
Case life,Barrel life.Blast.Recoil.
Damm, I might just have to pull out the 270 Win.
One of my problems is my very first rifle.My 280 AI.
Was just about perfict.
From Cold lake to the foot hills around the Grassy Island Lake in Alberta.
I never wanted for much more.
dave
Randy those magnum left hand M70 actions are not easy to find....
Chet I saw some complete McMillan rifles at Cabela's Buda....they are nice rifles!If I were gonna get a PF rifle and drop some dough, that's how I'd roll!
Bob,
You should check out the CRF action with the M70 style three position safety. Mine works great and feeds perfectly.
Chet
I wish I would've looked harder at that one.... I like fixed blade ejectors and CRF is icing on the cake
Bob, I'm afraid I will not find another. However, I have this MRC 1999 LH in 338 Win Mag I'm fooling with, if the 338 project doesn't work out I think the 1999 could be a good platform for a big 7 of some sort
Listening to some of you guys talk about the Mashburn keeps me awake at night
RaceTire, my first couple of trips to Canada I had a hard time judging deer. I have seen alot of very high scoring deer here in South Texas, but the damn head and body size of a Canadian deer can really fool you when looking at horns.
Two years ago I let an 8 point in Kansas walk on the 2nd afternoon of the hunt. It was late, cold and the wind was howling. Now I am certain I let a 160" 8 point Whitetail walk. It haunts me,even now.
Randy
I'd build a 30-378 Mashburn Super AI Improved Ultra Mag Short Action and call it good - rock on!!
4 some time I really wanted to do a 7mm Dobro. aka the 7mm/378...
Dober
Anybody done a .338-7 Mash?
If not, I call dibs on the .338 Tanner Magnum.
Dave,
Full body mount standing in the back of of my brain. I have about got myself talked into calling that outfitter up and seeing if he is still hunting the same area. Maybe I will run into one similar.
I do have a rifle that would be a prime candidate for a 7 Mashburn. Kill two birds with one shot. Another Alberta Whitetail hunt (haven't been up there since the previously mentioned experience many moons ago)and another special rifle.
HMMM.
Dave
no need to "build"...I'd run what I have.....
![[Linked Image]](http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g171/boltsonly/700ADLFS7Mag001.jpg)
a couple North Eastern Alberta whitetails have already succumbed to it's wrath.
Randy,
That is a big 8! I ain't fooling around any more. Opening day, second day, last day. Big and brown and I'm gripping the trigger. Sort'em out when they are on the ground.
Dave
Dave,
It was BIG and it haunts me!
Randy
Dave: I figure if a guy does not have a "shoulda,coulda, woulda" story, he has not trophy hunted whitetails,mule deer,(or other stuff)...a whole bunch.But the whitetails do have this quality about them that causes lapses in judgement,for some reason.I guess it has happened to us all at one point or another.
Randy: The big bodies will throw a guy off when it comes to judging racks....what I have found though,is a truly big whitetail(say 160 gross and up, in some cases WAY up)have that "shock effect" that makes them instantly recognized.I have seen two such bucks,the "Way Up" ones, alive,in my life....one that later grossed in the mid 170's and another that dwarfed him....in the same field and at the same time.There was no mistaking either one for what they were.
Dave I figure you have enough similar rifles that you could shoot a Mashburn as much as you need to,and shoot the others as much as you want to...a shooter of your experience will not flub things.
Bansners ultimate one or a Borden rifle in some kind of 7 fashion, mine would be 7-08 or wsm launching 120-140 barnes
Dave,
Full body mount standing in the back of of my brain. I have about got myself talked into calling that outfitter up and seeing if he is still hunting the same area. Maybe I will run into one similar.
I do have a rifle that would be a prime candidate for a 7 Mashburn. Kill two birds with one shot. Another Alberta Whitetail hunt (haven't been up there since the previously mentioned experience many moons ago)and another special rifle.
HMMM.
Dave
Dave
I still have all my chit.
KOM wool still fits.
KOM muff.
Canadian Military mukluks are in pretty good shape.
Have to air out the stand sack
Rain gear is good to go.
Could stand some new undies......
Yea.
Lets go spend a week in sunny Alberta next November
dave
Ya know Bob.
I can feel it pullen at me.
Been awhile sisnce I've been there.
I'd have to learn the leng-go again.
Going to Alberta to do some hunting A.
Thought I might go up in sunny November and freeze my butt off A.
Bounced a deer out of a coolie and did he ever bugger off A
Trucks frozen A
Guns Frozen A
Fingers are Frosted A
The dreaded ....
Thats a nice deer A
That means its a little one.....
Im kinda missen it.
Then after you come back.
Its
Im back A
Spend about a month working off the As after you come back....
dave
I just came home from Alberta a couple of weeks ago. Hunting the bush country watching cutlines. I took my 7mm Dakota loaded with Barnes 145 LRX's. Borden action, #4 Lilja fluted, Holland stock. My goal was to shoot flat as I could so I could use those precious few seconds I might get to judge and shoot and not worry about drop, too much. I was lucky, my buck came out at 120 yards and I saw two good tines on one horn and as I swiveled the tripod around to get on him he looked at me and I saw solid brows and fair spread. The outfitter had instructed us to assume mass, I assumed away and shot the pretty much broadside buck on the near side shoulder. The good part was he was a very solid 10 point with 4 stickers down low. Bad part was a broken G-3 and a couple of his stickers were broke. I am very happy with him. He would be in the 160's if not for the broken 3.
I came home thinking of what rifle would be the ultimate rifle for this hunt. I am leaning towards another 7 Dakota ( I think your 270 STW would be hard to beat as would the Mashburn), but might look at 120 TTSX. The TTSX due to penetration and someone mentioned you may not get that broadside or angling shot you hope for. I would like to have a M70 CRF action, I just like the feel of them and the safety. I will build mine on the heavy side (10 lbs) as I like a heavier rifle and and I am not covering much ground in the area I hunt so the heavy rifle gives me confidence for the longer shots. The stock of choice for me will have some beavertail in the forend so it sets solid on the shooting rail of the tripods. I am working with Redneck on putting it together right now. I cannot wait to go back next year.
Nothing quite like it man.
Congrats.
Remember, its always about Gross score.
Enjoy.
dave
Dave there is something singular and unique about Alberta whitetail hunting...
KSJohn the 120 TTSX will do 3550 from the 7 Dakota.
Don't forget the detachable mag for truck hunting.
I've got a couple of them. I know they work because I've killed deer and other stuff with them under those conditions, particularly the 12 second one.
One is built on a Mauser action, one is built on a M70 Classic action, one is built on a tang safety Ruger action, and one is built on a 660 Remington action.
What they have in common is that all of them balance on the front action screw. Three of them have 24 inch barrels. Two of those are .600 at the muzzle. All save for a 6 3/4 lb. .25-284, weigh 7 1/4- 7 1/2 lbs. empty. More important, when I shoulder any of them they settle right down and my eye picks up the target easily because the rifle and I come together easily.
That, this bussiness of the rifle and I coming together easily, picking up the target, and settling down smoothly is what makes it happen in that 12 secs.
I've killed all of my four year old class bucks like that. All of them running.
It doesn't take a magnum. I use premium bullets like the Nosler Partition or the Federal Throphy Bonded ammo. That way I have no concerns about bad angle shots or lack of expansion at the longer ranges.
To me, from what I've done, I'd far rather be faced with a 500 yd. shot with plenty of time to make it than a 200 yd. shot with the buck weaving through cover.
What I'm trying to say is that you must learn what works best for you when under pressure. Come up with a rifle you think will work and then see how much time it takes to hit a 12 inch target at 200 yds. from a standing start. Have somebody time you. Try a double tap and see hopw well that works.
I've found a fast handling shooting sling like a Ching Sling and lots of eye relief and eye box in the scope I use very helpful. Particularly when I'm out of breath and excited.
But regardless of what you use in equipment, or who made it, it has to work for you. I load up lots of ammo every year and shoot at 50-200 yds. In a hurry. A great way to burn up extra powder you no longer favor for those perfect loads and bullets that din't work out. As long as they hit within a few inches of your zero, you are good to go. They don't have to be full power loads either. E
Don't forget the detachable mag for truck hunting.
Tip that CAN happen!
Came close once but did not materialize,and that's OK.Just as well.
I got good at rolling three rounds around in my hand on the way "to" and "from".....click,click,click,click.....drives the guides crazy.
Better have a big loading port when the shidt hits the fan.
One is built on a Mauser action, one is built on a M70 Classic action, one is built on a tang safety Ruger action, and one is built on a 660 Remington action.
E
Talk about variety.
Sounds well thought out E.
Nothing like being Mobile and Hostile when you need to be.
The one thing i've done is to keep all the actions the same as possible.Stocks to.
Even on the experiments like the booboo and the stw I run late 70s vintage M700s.Pretty much all of them.If it dont work out eventually Ill recycle it into something else.
Cant see recycling Defiance actions though....
Only one not getting recycled.
Is the very first one.
just cant bring myself to redo the original 280AI.
I should just chuck all this stuff and have the good Mr. Forbes build me one.
Then i'd be all done.....
dave
Bob,
I went a day early back in the 80s and walked the West Edmonton mall.
Im not much of a mall walker but the place is pretty impressive.
dave
Don't forget to take a look at Raven Wear jackets/parkas and bibs for that Canadian weather too. That stuff is really warm and very high quality. Next the the skin, it's Patagonia Capilene 4 EW for me. For the rifle, I'd go with the 280 Ackley over the mags, cause, well they're still whitetails regardless of their body weight. First year I showed up in camp with mine, the general consensus of the guides and repeat hunters in camp, was it was on the "light side" (still chuckle about that one Dave). The camp favorites were various 7mm mags and several 300 mags (Win and one Weatherby)
Tip, at least in Alberta you can be in the truck where there is a heater
Saskatchewan - damn the days get long and cold.
If I ever go back to Saskatchewan I will have one of those "heater body suits"
Randy
Your point of using the same action is a good one, Dave. Of the four I mentioned, three of them have M70 style safeties.
Three of them also shoot bullets of similar BC's at similar velocities as well. Helps when making a longer shot. E
Dave I get a kick out of Edmonton....and Grand Prairie,too.
I got tired of all the airline shuffle one time when I hit Calgary,waiting to get connected to GP, so I left the airport and wandered around awhile
Had to get hustled back through security but missed my flight Haha! Arrived in Peace River with guns and no duffle.....the airline delivered it later.
There is a steak house in Regina that was fabulous...they show you the porterhouse before they cook it!
I have never had anything but a fabulous time on any Canadian deer hunt,as far as the place and people are concerned....IME there are not a more congenial bunch in Canada than it's hunters.
RD: Ditto on Raven Wear and Capilene....just don't plan on walking far in RW...it'll kill you!
I stopped taking all the KOM stuff;too heavy through the airports and now I bring down parkas and other stuff, maybe one Sleeping Indian garment(shirt).I look more like a displaced hobo than a Candian whitetail hunter
I look more like a displaced hobo than a Candian whitetail hunter
We look surprisingly similar Bob!
Rick,good to have comrades in arms.....
They picked me up in Peace River for vagrancy....the local waitresses wouldn't even sell me coffee....
One time in Durango,CO,after a week of elk and deer hunting,they almost wouldn't let me check into the hotel.The outfitter had to vouchsafe for me.
Your point of using the same action is a good one, Dave. Of the four I mentioned, three of them have M70 style safeties.
Three of them also shoot bullets of similar BC's at similar velocities as well. Helps when making a longer shot. E
Im in the process of switching over to the M70 safes.
The two new twins will be so equipped.
Not sure if i'd put the effort switching all my 700s.
Even though its a better "safe".
Bob.
I swinging back towards the 300 Win Mag again.
Hard to beat a 300 Win mag.
I could always run lighter bullets to keep the recoil down.
Salt bath nitriding would double barrel life.
Thinking about it today while trying to fill the freezer.
dave
RD,
Ive seen the Raven Wear stuff and I like it.
I always thought the sleeping indian stuff was itchie....
My KOM wool is still good to go.
Kinda bulkie but sweat up in it, and it really doesnt matter.
Never found anything else as good.
never hunted anyplace that freaken cold either....
dave
Dave, I have both KOM and Raven Wear and the Raven Wear is great stuff in the really cold weather, but you do have to carry it to the stand. I agree that you can sweat in the KOM stuff and it handles like nothing else.
I am also trying to get where most of my rifles use the M70 style safety.
Dave the 300 Win mag works there....and everywhere else.
I've used it there a few times.
I prefer a more compact rifle for AB. Between the truck and small box blinds, it is easier to manuever a 300wsm with a 22" barrel when it matters.
Sue with Raven Wear usually stays at the Ramada outside Edmonton airport. Makes it easy to pick up your order or rent one of her body bags. The body bags are heavy but saved my butt a few times on late Nov hunts.
Couple of time I just picked up a cheepo sleeping bag.
Used it for the hunt and then left it.
dave
I'm going to sask next year for first time...
Cabelas makes a stand hunter extreme parka and bibs.... Feedback on site is very positive
I know koM makes great stuff but ill never need it in GA and its pricey
The KOM is stupid expensive.
My other out fit is Cabelas....
The getting wet thing how ever you manage it, is where KOM really shines.
With KOM it just doesnt matter.
You get wet in Cabelas.
You can get and stay miserable.
In 85 we had -35 degrees the week I was there.
You want a deer you better figure how to stay out in it.
I over did it, like I do on most things.
But I never regretted buying the stuff.
I off to kill some chit this morning.
See if I cant get the STW barking.
Its not Alberta.
But it still beats the hell oit of working.....
dave
I'm going to sask next year for first time...
You going to love it.
I was in sask twice.
Different than Alberta.
But still great place to hunt.
Studie BIG deer heads before you go....
Just sayen...
dave
John,
Thats the area im talking about.
Cold Lake Air Weapons Range.
Runs across Alberta and Saskatchewan.
Thanks for the reply.
dave
I assume you mean the areas outside the air weapons range. The range itself is closed to hunting for obvious reasons. I used to hunt that area back in the 90's when I lived in Edmonton. Great deer around there.
My choice for hunting deer in Alberta is Ruger 77 RSI 35 Whelen 225gr TBBC. I have mounted a Leupold 4X M8 although I prefer to use the open sights, the action is bedded in a B&C stock I got here at the 'Fire. Trigger was cleaned up years ago. Not a full out custom job but some decent modifications. I really don't care to take a shot over 250 yards and try to keep them closer to 100, but I live here and have the luxury of time so I can afford to take a few chances trying to get closer. Great fun!
I'm going to sask next year for first time...
You going to love it.
I was in sask twice.
Different than Alberta.
But still great place to hunt.
Studie BIG deer heads before you go....
Just sayen...
dave
Good advice, more clearly identify mature deer by aging their body versus rack. In Canada a big blocky body, no neck and a sway back means shoot. Even if the rack doesn't look huge it's still likely a 150 up there as your taking animals that go 250 dressed. Done Sask twice and Alberta twice, I'm more of a fan of hunting natural deer movement and rattling which sets up better for Alberta as most outfitters in Sask bait deer. Different strokes . . .
I have one of the G-30 rifles built on the CRF action chambered for 30-06. It is an extremely well made rifle and it is stupid accurate.
The week before hunting season started, I took it to the range to check it's zero and it shot a .640" group....at 300 yards.
WOW!! .640" at 300yds.
How big was the group when you shot the rifle twice?
Never tried the KOM outer wear, but I've heard from others that it's good stuff. Went with Raven Wear cause lots of folks who did Sask multiple times liked RW. I recently looked at their new prices and it seems to have doubled in price from what I originally paid for the stuff. I have two 3/4 parkas (one white, one RT Hardwoods), one bomber jacket, one pair bibs and one sherpa lined/comformax IB fleece vest. One week the temps went down below -20 during the day and the price didn't seem so bad then as I was still pretty warm even in a ground blind. The owner of RW, Susan Hindbo, is one of the nicest folk you'll ever do business with and their customer service is outstanding.
RD.
They still have to wear the solid color white or red in
Sask?
Time I was there they bought us over sized meat cutter coveralls to wear over our stuff.
Kinda weird.
The bait piles were ok.
Some of there other "rules" were kinda dumb.
dave
I assume you mean the areas outside the air weapons range. The range itself is closed to hunting for obvious reasons. I used to hunt that area back in the 90's when I lived in Edmonton. Great deer around there.
Actually heard bombs dropping and felt the thump....
Got a low level buzz by an F-18.
Great deer is an understatment....
dave
6-06AI or 6.5 WSM
Sendero contour 24"
McMillan A2/3/4/5
Talleys
4.5-14X40 CDS and B&C
1 pound tricked
700 action (of course)
Amaxs/TTSXs/SSTs/Accubonds/etc etc at light speed. Send the deer for a point and click dirt nap.
John,
From what I've read from others about your shooting and the videos I've watched, I can't imagine the need for you to carry 9 spares on the cuff in addition to what's in the magazine. Seems you could save half a pound in ammunition weight on your rifle and be just fine.
My coyote shooting this weekend would seem to indicate I need a few extra rounds on occasion.
I actually don�t find it to be a particularly onerous burden to pack the rifle around at that weight. I do find it particularly helpful on occasion when all that I have is a tough shot.
To each his own, but I sure hate missing after climbing the mountain.
I used to worry about rifle I'd take and having the perfect setup. And I was changing a lot, building and customizing for the following years Canadian hunt. Then, one day it dawned on me - save the money from all the screwing around with rifles, hunt what I've got and be able to hunt TWO provinces in a year rather than one.
RD.
They still have to wear the solid color white or red in
Sask?
Time I was there they bought us over sized meat cutter coveralls to wear over our stuff.
Kinda weird.
The bait piles were ok.
Some of there other "rules" were kinda dumb.
dave
Dave, you still need to wear one of the approved solid colors up top. Camo's are allowed as pants/bibs.
I've never been very comfortable with the cuff mounted round carrier type set up.
Dont have anything to do with weight.
Might be fine playing around on yotes.
What I dont like about it, is the the bullet tips are exposed.
All of my rounds are are carefully spun and checked for concentricity.
It does not take awhole lot of pressure to push a bullet out of wack causing things to go haywire.
Thinking about all the crap i've put my rifles through up there.
For an Alberta hunt, I would never even consider it.
YMMV.
dave
I used to worry about rifle I'd take and having the perfect setup. And I was changing a lot, building and customizing for the following years Canadian hunt. Then, one day it dawned on me - save the money from all the screwing around with rifles, hunt what I've got and be able to hunt TWO provinces in a year rather than one.
I never did that
dave
I've never been very comfortable with the cuff mounted round carrier type set up.
Dont have anything to do with weight.
Might be fine playing around on yotes.
What I dont like about it, is the the bullet tips are exposed.
All of my rounds are are carefully spun and checked for concentricity.
It does not take awhole lot of pressure to push a bullet out of wack causing things to go haywire.
Thinking about all the crap i've put my rifles through up there.
For an Alberta hunt, I would never even consider it.
YMMV.
dave
I use one for every day hunted of every year. And in AB, to boot! Somehow I still manage to kill things every now and again!
Bob,
Been pretty busy and just returned to the forum for a visit late last night and today. I am thinking just for something to do converting my 7RM to a Mashburn might work well and be a lot of fun. If I could just find some time to mess with it.
Dave
If I lived where you do.
Im sure I'd not worry about it.
dave
Bob,
Been pretty busy and just returned to the forum for a visit late last night and today. I am thinking just for something to do converting my 7RM to a Mashburn might work well and be a lot of fun. If I could just find some time to mess with it.
Dave
Dave once you get past the mystique of the brass forming(pretty easy),it doesn't take very much time at all,certainly no more than you go through with any other cartridge.....once you get a 160-162 to close to 3200,or a 175 close to 3100,there isn't much else to do anyway except take it hunting.
I bet it works in Alberta.
BS. That would never work here.
Last night I spoke with a fellow Fire member and I told him the last time I did the intitial case prep with virgin cases I did it quicker than one can get a pizza cooked...
I can do 100 cases with the first two steps in less than 30 minutes and those 100 cases will last me a long time. 800-1K rounds I'd expect.
Dober
Dober that sounds about right time wise.Pretty simple.heck even with new brass for factory cartridges,a guy kills time round ing necks, chamfering etc.
This is not a tricky nor complex wildcat if you are using 300WM brass.With a bag of new brass in the morning,I'm hunting in the afternoon.
Sorry for the hijack.
I would not go lighter than a #3 contour with shank end trimmed to about 1 3/4" length with overall length about 23".
Any favorite caliber between .270 Win to 300 WSM.
A well adjusted trigger no lighter than 2 1/2 lb pull.
Right now,parts wise.
I have the long action Defiance with the Dave Gentry M70 Safe installed.Long tennon, M700 Tang.
Its a very slick action.
Stock is the GP/HTG LOP at 14 Edge Fill.
Action skidded forward .5 of aan inch just like all my others.
All it needs is bedding job and paint.
Bottom Metal PTG BDL.
Scope wise I might very well commit Blasphemy and run something other than a S&B.
Im thinking a Zeiss Victory is 2.5-10x50.
I find the 50mm Fits me much better than the 42mm stuff.With the Zeiss I loose weight.
Kinda depends on the reticle.
All time favorite is the S&B No4.
The heavy part of the reticle is much closer togeather than a 4a.You can use the verticle part of the heavy post as a hold over.
Works ever so well and is about the best you can do in the dark with out a light.
I still have fluted No4s is 270 7mm and 30 caliber.
Id try to keep it at a finished length of 24.
That I can live with.
I like the mashburn idea with the 150 NBT.
Dober just keeps chipping away.....
dave
For you RD.
A good read.
I did build a 7mm Mashburn and love it.
dave
Any dicking around to form that or just run it through the FL Mashburn die ? You still have that Defiance action with the 3 pos safety ? Any pics ? I think they are doing them now on the Rebel's.
When they are next to each other the 28 Nosler doesn't look like it dwarfs the 300 WM (Lapua) case.
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I still have both of them.
I've been tied up with my 1000 yard builds and have not finished either one.
There ready to finish but I just have not.
Dave Gentry 3 pos safes with rifle basic triggers.
Mcmillian GP/HTGs in edge and Rock barrels in 25 and 30.
If you stroke a 300 win mag case one time in a Mashburn die your pretty much good to go.
I have changed my mind several time on what I want for chambers.Latest is a 6.5/284 and the 26 Nosler.Kinda on a 6.5 kick and not wildcats.But who knows ill most likley change my mind again before I finish them.
My 270 STW was the most fun of all...
dave
Do you have a pic of the action Dave w/ 3 pos safety installed ?
No I do not..
Having my 17 pounder rebarreled at the moment.I can get a phone pic and send it to you if you like, say in a few weeks.
Both the 270 STW and the Mashburn were like M700 part gun extras
.
I ever get caught up,I got a couple more on the bucket list....
dave
Who installed those mod 70 safeties for you Dave ?
Gentry made them.Took almost a year.
I've fondled them quite a bit.
There sweet.
I had read somewhere that Defiance was going to start doing it.
Not sure if they ever did.
If your going to do it for sure ,tell Defiance to leave off the safety cut in the tang.
You wont need it.
Far as I know mine are the first.
dave
Yes Defiance will do it on the Rebel. SS or CM $225.
I guess I am a dullard because I would take a Sako Bavarian in 6.5x55 or 300 WSM with a Zeiss HD5.
Yes Defiance will do it on the Rebel. SS or CM $225.
Then your all set.
dave
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