Yes, I stole that from Larry Potter. Some quick background on my hunting. I hunt mostly public or block managed land in MT. It is a long travel for me, but I used to live there, so I kind of know what to expect.

I have a Ruger Hawkeye in 6.5x55. I really like it as a hunting rifle. Low recoil, drops mulies in their tracks, shoots like a laser, what could I not like? Well, I’m not sure about 6.5x55 on elk. If your only comment is that Swedes have killed moose with them for years, save your breath....I got that. I’d also be willing to bet most Swedes would rather have a 9.3x62 in their hands on that hunt!

So, the step up to me is some moderately customized model 70 based rifle with a good barrel, custom fit wood, open sights and a quality scope with bdc to 500 and about a 40mm objective.

So, let’s talk caliber....right now, I’m thinking 6.5X55, 6.5-06, 270 Win, 280 AI, or 30’06 AI. My deciding factors are elk killing ability, ballistics to 500 yds, bullet selection/quality, recoil, availability of good brass at reasonable cost, mag capacity, etc.

So what should I be thinking?

.284

Of those the 280AI would be my choice.

No wrong choice in that list... if you hunt around grizzly's you may want to lean towards the upper end.

They will all work...but I'd lean '06 for all the usual reasons.....

.280 AI of those. I wouldn't bother A.I. a 30/06, it's good as is. If you want the extra FPS save yourself the headache of fire forming and go with a .300 WSM, WM, etc.

Open country I tend to grab my 270 or 6.5-06.....

In the thick forest around home my 9.3X62 or 338 mag gets used.... too many big bears causing trouble lately

You may need two perfect elk rifles....

6.5x55 is the correct answer, use a good bullet and it is an elk killer. You know your drops on it, from your post you obviously have confidence in shooting it, there is an old saying with a lot of truth in it - "dance with the one who brung you".

I used a 243 and a 260 for years and never had issues with either of them, although I was always careful with shot placement with the 243.

drover

With those choices, why bother? None of those are going to do anything the 6.5 x 55 won't do just fine at the ranges you are discussing. If you're going to take a step up, make it a worthwhile one- 300 Win Mag or a 338 WM (my favorite)... excellent ballistics far beyond your stated ranges and enough energy to be sure it won't bounce off anything on any continent on earth. Excellent bullets available also- in factory fodder and for handloading.

Bob

Anything will work, I’ve done it. 338 win mag was made for elk...

I’m liking the looks of that AALF, specs?

270 for sure.

Man...I’d honestly use your trusted 6.5. Spend the money saved on alpha glass and alpha boots

I would want a 30-06 at least, 338 would be better!

Hunting camp chat, after a few whiskey.
These new mono's change the picture quite alot. The 6.5 's with a good copper bullet is adequate, 500 yards too is far , imo, for any chambering.
Believe it or not we have killed elk with a 22/250- not recommended.
Our southern moose are easier to kill than elk, imo.
A mature bull will take a vital shot and run, you had best follow. The old guy might be piled up in the creek bottem.

It's been said many times, it's the bullet not the headstamp. All the rounds you mentioned will do if you use a good bullet, like the Nosler partition. There are other good bullets too. But, at the end of the day, you've got to make a round choice. I chose the .280 AI. I know it works because I've killed eight bull elk it and the 160gr NP.

Answering the OPs question, .284 or .308.

Cartridge depending upon platform, shot distance, etc.

Just to be clear, I was set on 280 ai due to the dies being more common and good 7mm bullets.

What I found was 30’06 ai can hit same velocities with slightly better bullets and Lapua brass.

I think you have answered your own question.....

A model 70 in 280 AI will be a nice rifle.

I’ve killed a few elk with a few different rifles/cartridges, .270, 7x57, 7mm Mag, 30-06, 338-06 and .338 Win Mag. I’m no doubt “old school” but a Winchester M-70 Featherweight in 30-06 would be tough to beat. My favorite bullet is the discontinued Hornady 190 gr. BTSP, however about any 165-180 gr. bullet will do. Plenty of ammunition anywhere you go and plenty of rifle if you’re in bear country.

No idea, I stole the pic off the innerweb.....ha ha, as I didn't have a pic of mine.

Mine's a 700 S/S 700, 21" Rock #3, McMillan Classic in 50/50 orange/black, with a 3.5-10 CDS Leupold in Talleys on top.

It's my "big gun" now.......

Ha, aalf, I thought maybe you had converted to the dark side with walnut and blued steel..... no such luck

Not wood; not an m70; but ...
https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/14267356/1

.280 or a 7 mag. 7x57 ain’t bad too.

Ah yes, the perennial “perfect elk cartridge.”

Whatver you’re truly comfortable with, ego and internet pressure aside, is the “perfect elk cartridge.”

Cartridges are more alike than different...

I have killed elk personally with 270 Winchester, 270 Short Mag. 7X57, 7MM Rem Mag, 300 Savage 308 Winchester, 30-06 300 H&H 300 Win mag, 308 Norma Mag, 30-387 Weatherby, 8X57, 338-06, 338 Win Mag, 9.3X74R, 375H&H , 416 Taylor, 44 Mag hand guns, 454 Casull handgun, 62 Cal Flintlock, a wood arrow from a long bow .... and I probably missed 1 or 2 from this list. I have killed them for over 1/2 a century in 6 different states.

In addition to the ones listed above I have seen them killed with the following when hunting with friends, and in guiding elk hunters.
243, 257 Roberts, 25-06, 6.5X55 , 260 Remington, 6.5 CM, 270 Weatherby Mag, 7-08, 280, 7MM Weatherby Mag, 30-30, 30-40 Krag, 300 Ultra Mag, 325 Short Mag, 8MM Rem Mag, 338 Federal, 340 Weatherby, 338 Lapua 358 Win, 9.3X62, 9.3X57, 416 Remington, 416 Rigby, 458 Winchester, 50-90 Sharps, 577 Enfield 50 cal muzzleloaders, 53 cal muzzleloaders 58 cal muzzleloaders, 8 bore muzzleloader, about 35 killed with compound bows and modern arrows, and again I am sure I am missing a few here too.

What's the near perfect caliber?
What ever the near perfect hunter is using.

It's not about the shell or caliber.

The one factor that is the most important in the area of hardware is the bullet, ( the best ones expand well and go clear through and exit in a relatively straight line 100% of the time) but the #1 MOST IMPORTANT factor ABOVE ALL ELSE is the hunter and his skills. Hardware is a small percentage of the equation and the hunter is the big percentage of that same equation.
Skill in hunting and shooting trumps hardware every time.

Yes...

Sorry to lead you guys on like that..............OK, not really.......

I rather like my 280ai on a M70. It wont do anything a 30-06 or 270 wont though.

A 338-06 with 250 scenars would be interesting. Might get 2500? 9.3x62 with 250's as well. Both are a step up in thump. At least on your end. Lol.

Some of the Elk hunters that I know in MT have gone to the 9.3 s . A better thump factor. The 270 with 150 grain bullets has killed all of the elk a friend has taken for the past

40 or so years. Much of the time it is the man not the rifle.

I live in Montana and have never, ever, met anyone using a 9.3.

You're just fine with your 6.5x55 Sweede, or any of your other choices.

My last 5 Rocky Mountain bulls were all killed with my 6.5X284, which produces similar ballistics, from ~100 to right at 600 yards. I've used both the 140 berger hunting and the 140 AMAX, and am going to go to the 147 ELDM next. I had some bad experiences with the berger, but there's been no issues with the size of the cartridge.

Haha I just peed!!! 😂😂

The first elk of the year, damage cow tag back in February, I ghosted with my 6ai and a 80 bt... haha

I don’t even know anybody with a 9.3!! Haha

I have carried my 9.3X62 the last few days.... no elk have volunteered to be victims though.....

[a Winchester M-70 Featherweight in 30-06 would be tough to beat.

I shot my first cow elk with a Fwt that was rebarreled with a 23" Douglas #3 in 30-06. She was running at 135 steps and the rifle was "perfect" in my hands! I was using the old Hornady Light Magnum with Hornady 180sp. It had a Leupold 2x7, scope was on 5x. I gave that rifle to my missionary friend in South Africa with the Federal High Energy 180 partition loads. He killed every PG, including Cape Eland with it! With these newer powders, you can give those two loads a run for their money! Put a 168 TTSX in it and out do both of them on game! So...I have to agree that the Fwt to beat!

That looks good. How about some details.

I’ve read that the 30-06 AI doesn’t add enough to justify the exercise. How about the std 338-06 vs the AI version. Is it worth the effort?.

Also what bullets and loads do you like?

DF

Again, I stole the pic off the innerweb, just for effect, as I didn't have a pic of mine.

Mine's a hideous stainless/plastic stock version.......

700 S/S 700, 21" Rock #3, McMillan Classic in 50/50 orange/black, with a 3.5-10 CDS Leupold in Talleys on top, weighing in at 7-12 empty.

Whether it's worth it or not, is up to the individual, there is a small gain to be had. I did it because it looks cool and the smith had the reamer, so why not.

I'm at 2800 with either 200 BT's or 210 partitions. I've only killed one deer with it, but it folded on the spot like a cheap lawn chair.

For me, the “perfect” elk rifle was my old Stainless M70 in 338 WM w/22” bbl. loaded with 210 Partitions at 2,925 FPS.

Problem is, “perfect” on paper is different from reality. It put stuff down in short order, but not enough differently than dozens of other softer recoiling cartridges that can be chambered in lighter, easier to carry rifles.

I like the 6.5CM/270/7mm-08/308 approach these days. Anymore, to me, a “big” gun is the 30-06 or 300 WSM.

Were I you, I’d use the 6.5x55 Norge with a 130 or 140 gr. bullet and not think twice.

Light , reliable and handy are good elk rifle qualities... when you hunt away from the road.... if you shoot them off the haystack, hell anything will work

I'm really "keen" on hayfield cow elk with about 1 foot of snow on the ground, right at freezing temps around 9AM and me the only hunter on the place, with a P/U truck/ranch hands waiting to load it! Wow!

I would be tempted to work up a load with the 120 TTSX and use the Swede.

I hate you! use a tractor to load more better...

Expend your time, energy, and resources looking for the perfect elk.

None of the above.

A standard 30-06 will serve you well. If you want to go looney, 338-06.

I own and really like the 338-06, but I also have a 300 H&H along with a couple 30-06's.

You wouldn't go wrong with a 30-06.

Shot my 338-06 this afternoon. It really likes the 160 TTSX over Varget, sub inch. I didn't get a chance to clock it, but IIRC it's 3K fps.or better.

B.C is .342, not the greatest, but the trajectory isn't bad out to 250 with a 150 yd zero, start dropping after that. It's not as flat shooting as the 338 WM, but doesn't kick as bad. In fact, it's a reallly pleasant round to shoot off the bench.

I have 210 NPT and a few others yet to try. Will report.

DF

Nothing wrong with a 30-06 or its ballistics performance identical twin, the 7mm /rem mag. The little brother 280 Rem is not much behind.

My choice as the perfect elk rifle has served me well, a Ruger #1 in 7mm STW with 160s at 3200 fps MV.

Waiting on the 7mm PRC

Thats the way i roll. You cant get much better than a 338 for elk killing at longer range. Short range, it just plows them down too. With the chamberings hes asking about, you'll need a perfect broadside shot opportunity at longer ranges. And as we know, elk dont always want to cooperate in that regard.

Amen. I thought everyone knew that^^^^

For me it is either the .340 Wby or .338 RUM for the "Nearly Perfect Elk Rifle....Caliber."

Says the guy who shoots little wabbits with a 460 Wby........

Harrumph !! As long as we are throwing out a plethora of cartridges, I'll toss in the ones I have used with success. 35 Whelen and 7x57 Mauser.

You can't even keep em in the target and we're supposed to take yer advice?? Raff Out Roud. And besides, elk don't have little orange thingys on their hide to shoot at!

aalf is a milk jug killer extraordinaire...... do not underestimate him.....

furlessbalz be jealous.........

Yeah, but if you're building a custom I'm pretty sure you still have to tell your smith what chambering you want.

If I were building from scratch today, I'd go 280.

Although all of cartridges mentioned will kill elk if everything goes just right and have so. However, I prefer to view it in the worst light. By the time I've gotten myself in elk country, I've already got quite a bit of time and money invested. What if the only shot I have is not anywhere close to what I would prefer for a good, clean kill. That's why I always take plenty of gun to elk country. I'm talking a minimum of a 300 something mag just in case. I generally use a 300 Weatherby or a 338 Win Mag. When I hunted Vermajo back in the late 80's, if you hunted with anything less than a 300 mag of some sort and the bull ran off, that was your $7000 hunt. If you were using a 300 mag or bigger and he ran off, you got to keep hunting till you got your bull. I agree with their policy.
Phil

Elk rifles are also our sheep rifles. Bighorn Sheep , mule deer and Mountain goat . Being overgunned is not an option for me.
Just pick a .270 wcf, .280 or a 30/06. Carbine style, light and compact. You won't see many sheep hunters packing the heavies.

Yup, that has pretty much been my criteria since I started elk hunting a long time ago. I didn't want to have a cartridge that would work if everything was perfect- I wanted something that worked when everything went wrong.. so far, the 338WM has pretty much filled that role just about perfectly for close and far, as well as my son's 300 Weatherby.... I'm starting to question my new direction of going with a 26 Nosler but I haven't had a chance to kill anything with it yet, so the verdict is out until I get the opportunity...

[ When I hunted Vermajo back in the late 80's, if you hunted with anything less than a 300 mag of some sort and the bull ran off, that was your $7000 hunt. [/quote]

Where I hunted in South Africa, Namibia and every Exotics ranch in Texas; you wound it you bought it, found or not! In Sa, the smallest we used was a 300WM and 180 Barnes. In Texas, I used small calibers ( 220 Swift & 6x47mm) when recovering from surgery, but made "dang sure" I could kill them! ha Most of the time it was .257 Weatherby, 6.5/284, I even used a 338 RUM/180NAB on an Aoudad hunt! ha.I c these "Money Hunts"...its serious business when you pull the trigger! ha

Now now...

Dem be big wabbits...

DF

And those rabbits bite back.

The New mexico dept. of fish & game needs to capture and relocate those dangerous wabbits..... maybe Texas would take them?

There is no 180 gr 7mm ELD-M equivalent in the 308 caliber.

Going to send them up to Montana to take care of them grizzly bears.

Ah hell the Hutterites will sell them at the farmers market....

30-06 is the bread and butter for elk cartridge. Elk aren't really that hard to kill if you hit them in the boiler room.
I'd also have no problem taking my Flat bill 6.5CM with LRX, or you wish I was gay 270 with TTSX . Andr if I really want to anchor them, I can take the african worthy 9.3x62. But the older I get (lol .. Im only 40) and years of hunting and killing elk, I realize you don't need the big super duper magnums unless you're really going long range.

You'd bite, too, if there was some crazy redneck chasing you around the desert with a .460...



DF

I have a 6.5x55. I carry a 300 win mag for Elk. Have you ever had a big Elk run off a few hundred yards? When that few hundred yards is down into some hell hole you now need to disassemble the Elk in. Load it on your back and claw your way back up to that nice flat ridge it had been standing on. If all I had was the 6.5x55, I would kill Elk with it. I have Elk rifles, So I use them to kill Elk.

According to Monty Python. You just need a "Holy Hand Grenade"

Oh I know! Jus funnin him.

The last two elk I killed (include the one yesterday) were both cows. One was shot with a .260 Remington, the other with a 7mm Remington Magnum and neither took a step.

Obviously a cartridge with Remington in the name is the perfect elk cartridge.

If you said anything other than .280 Remington,...then you are wrong.

Dave

I have the "elk rifles" in the following- 25-06AI,280 Rem,30-06, 308 Win, 300 Win Mag, 300 WSM, 300 RUM and 375 H&H.
There are many ways to hunt elk. If I was hunting private ground really all I would need is the 25-06. However, I feel more comfy with a 300 mag of some sort. Especially so given the rising grizzly population.
Most years I use my 300 RUM exclusively for everything in MT because it is like an old friend and it's been a plain lucky rifle for me.

Wow! I guess I asked for it! Looks like anything from 260 rem through 340 wby!

I’m trying to be just a bit weight and recoil efficient! I’m back to 284 AI and 30’06 AI. ‘06 AI looks real nice with Lapua brass and 30 cal. bullet selection!

I vote for the 7 Mashburn

It's not for everyone though. I wouldn't want to push a wildcat on anyone not prepared to learn a ton about reloading for the same result as a 7 Weatherby. But it sure is fun!

I have had many Ackleys. The most "not worth it" for me has been 2 30-06 AI. One in a rechambered 22" ADL and another in a 26" Shilen. "Maybe" with 150gr it was a bit faster, but honestly, it never gained more than 50fps "with any kind of accuracy. Sure, you can push an Ackley to 74K quick, but seldom is it accurate. Rifles are a gamble, as you might spring for a custom .280 AI or even a .280 Sherman...and barely beat a 24" .280 for a combo of speed and accuracy. If you can handle the recoil...300WM through 338 RUM are flat shooting, hard hitting rounds. If you "know" you will be cruising timber, closer shots, the 338/06 to 35 Whelen AI, or 9.3x62 will hammer them down! Have a ball though!

I've killed a number of elk with 30-06, 300 H&H, 338 WinMag and even a 7-08 (won't do that again - it worked, but I think an animal that big needs a bigger cartridge/bullet. That's how I justify having too many rifles...).

I just got a 35 Whelen as the newest Nearly Perfect Elk Rifle.

As I've always said:

"The 'best' elk rifle is whatever the best elk hunter has in his hands"...

That and a 338 sure have been pretty decent to me.

When I shot my bull this year, I was glad I used my 338wm, instead of my 6.5 cm... Just sayin..

At the expense of beating a dead horse... perfect to me means under all conditions.... big bulls, expensive guided hunts , limited opportunity, bad angles etc... that means 300 mag , 338 mag.

For a "nearly perfect" elk rifle, I'd be looking at weight and balance, as well as that "perfect" cartridge to go with it.... There are some cartridges I'd just a soon leave at home or on the range and take something more suitable.



And rather than worry about what's perfect for shooting them with (that rifle above is about as perfect as you'll get), more focus should be put on boots, knife, pack, GPS, rifle scope, bullets and binocs. IMHO...

Your new 35 Whelen, with the right bullets, should be a hammer, but it's not going to be any more impressive than a good ol 06 with 200gr Nosler partitions...

Perfect:

Since this is the "custom rifle" forums...

Well everyone knows that the .308 Norma is the perfect cartridge. Not just for elk.

Lots of good options in here....looking to not increase diameter above 30’06 and would like to use 30’06 Lapua brass. This leaves me at 30’06, 30’06 AI, 338-06, 35 Whelen.

All good rounds, but I really want to shoot a 180-220 gr 0.45 or greater bc hunting bullet over 2700 FPS. 30’06 ai seems to do that. Nosler data is: 200 gr Partition or Accubond at 2700fps....nice.

35 Whelen would be my next choice, but bc’s are lower by a bit...and recoil!

I've always wanted a 358 Norma Mag. Hardly necessary with a Whelen and a 338 but I'll end up with one I'm sure. Just need to decide whether to get it before or after the 9.3x62...

Although you finally got something right, this is comedy gold coming from you.

You said you want to talk caliber. Everything you cited are cartridges. What you should be thinking is learning the difference between the two.

Sure got that right. Love that picture.

You are a fu cking idiot. You sold me a rifle (308 fwt) and now you seem to think you can attack my posts with stupid fu cking remarks. That rifle I have pictured is an elk killing machine. Nothing in which you know anything about...:


I suggest you stfu and take up something else, as you are doing a terrible job influencing anyone here with half a brain...

When you have shot as many bulls and elk as I have and can come up with something halfway intelligent to say, then maybe you might be able to contribute to a thread like this:



I think your meth is calling you...Better go back to it...

Chit just got real..

Uuuuum, ya!!😂😂

Popping popcorn

No, I [bleep] with you cause you’re a tool.

Nice pic of some random elk on a wall. Bosses?

Come on, post a pic.
online photo host

That's a neat looking bull right there!! Grats

You know it’s a caliber war once the f-bombs drop!

I'm too scared even mention what I use for elk now..

SLM has the dick measuring contest well in hand.....

It's probably big, usually those skinny guys are hung like a donkey...😂😂

I just hope I can go elk hunting before I hit my 30s

Best get to it!

Gotta a little over a year before I hit Journeyman and can make better $$. I often wonder what trades y’all got in. I’m all about getting into better work.

I'm gettin' too old to start hunting for the wily elk. Forget the desert biting wabbit! I don't have anything with large bore in beltfed. Maybe my old '05 Steyr M/S in 9X56? Be Well, Rustyzipper.

It’s always in hand.

Thanks.

Since bigger is now better, I now have a hankering to take this Al Biesen 358 Norma Mag to Wyoming next year instead of my GAP.

Nice looking bull SLM.

Very cool looking bull. Short and stout..... public land? limited draw unit? or private land?

Public, all elk hunts are limited draw in NM.

Cool, thanks for the reply..... is it hard to draw?

Depends on the unit. The unit he was killed in is not one of the harder units to draw.

I really like how that main beam tips back....

You should be smiling in that pic.... very cool elk

Laffin’, I was solo and running back and forth with the timer.

He was a neat old bull. Took 3 years to finally kill him.

Gotta pic of him in a turkey fryer?

Someone say deep fried turkey?

No, i’m going to have to start doing that though.

At least you didn't squat on a prickly pear for the photo.... ask me how I know....

Ok I'm noisy and it's slow day in here in Alaska.. so how this feud begin? I read something about model 70 featherweight in a 308??

If you do enough meth the cactus doesn’t hurt as much.

The elk down your way do meth? damn....

This^^^^^^^^^^^^

I've killed more elk with a 270 than all else combined & it is a great elk killer at all ranges, but, today, if you're in grizzly country, the '06 or 338 is a better option IMO.

I've had as many as five 338's & they are very effective & shoot as flat as a 270, if you can handle that round.

The '06 with good bullets from 168 - 200 is also a superb round.

MM

Jesus...nice bull dude...

Although the rifle was a pain in the ass, it has nothing to do with it.

He got twisted a few years ago when I asked for photo proof of his hunting claims like he does to everyone regarding group size.

Super cool bull SLM! Did Carl do his magic on him? Hijack question aside from meth and boiling 5x5s, is that an Idaho Shag in your avatar pic?

As far as perfect elk caliber, everyone knows it’s a 50. Best elk dates in NM are early rut hunts and late muzzleloader hunts!...for the most part!

Roger that...Excellent bull!

😎

Yes, Carl did his magic. Need to go visit with him to see what all he is working on.

Have no idea on the shag, it’s something my daughter found.

How has the season treated you?

Thanks all.

I do miss elk hunting, if I move from Alaska it will be to a state I can elk hunt in and will robably just use a 270 or 06

Aye

[quote=SLM]Yes, Carl did his magic. Need to go visit with him to see what all he is working on.

Have no idea on the shag, it’s something my daughter found.

How has the season treated you?

Thanks all.

Post a pic of the mount! Hadn’t killed anything to take to Carl in a while, but that’ll change in Dec with some luck, wife drew a trophy tag on Rhodes canyon and I drew a Mcgregor range tag!

Rest of the season has been good, hunted some giants but hunters just couldn’t connect.

In 2018, 24HCF did the "Which rifle (chambering) killed the most game?" thread. Then in early 2019 we did the "Which rifles (chamberings) have killed elk?" thread.

By my unscientific count, the .30-06 and .270 Win chamberings topped both of those polls handily. However, in the elk thread, the .300WM, 7RM, and .338WM moved up into the number 3, 4, and 5 spots respectively.

I will get some pics when I make it back home.

Glad I’m not the only one to screw up on a big bull. Made a stupid decision this year I’ll remember for a long time.

How about a Niedner Springfield in 35 Whelen with a 20 inch barrel and stocked by Alvin Linden?

7 Wby or 300 WSM

I’d take that!

If I were to routinely shoot beyond 400 yards for elk, I’d be tempted to move up to a magnum 7mm, .30, or .338. If it had to be in an M70, it would be the 7mm Rem Mag or maybe a 30-338, 308 Norma Magnum, or 338 Win Mag.

My pics don’t do Carl’s work justice.

Beautiful head, beautiful mount too.

MM

I love the 338 Winchester for Elk, shoots flat enough for open country and is a perfect Elk caliber IMHO. I've used the .270 and 30 06 a lot with no problems but the 338 shines. My .338 is a little heavy for the "long walks".

I think you need to weigh your own ability, willingness to pass up shots, the terrain your most likely to be hunting, the bullets you'd use. 6.5 swede with heavy handloads in lapua brass in a modern rifle, with Barnes 127 ttsxlr, will outperform a '06 with 150 gr. cup & core bullets. How far are you willing to shoot, or not shoot? 168 gr. in the same bullet in a .280AI will out-perform at all distances all others you have listed. I believe .300 Mag is the best elk round ever made, but not everyone is comfortable with that much recoil or the weight of carrying it.

That is such a cool bull!!! That main beam, how it tips back, just badass...

Also, until you've hunted bulls in western Wa, coast range of Oregon, or the Idaho panhandle, where it a elk makes 100 yards, he's gone forever, it's a whole different game, as guys who've killed bulls there can attest.... Most other states I'd use about anything, and have, but it's a whole different game in said locales.. As said before, 338 was MADE for killing elk...

BTW I've shot a couple of deer with the 338 and tracking is not a problem, usually about 3/4" with less meat loss than 270 Win.

Truth

Mine's a 700 S/S 700, 21" Rock #3, McMillan Classic in 50/50 orange/black, with a 3.5-10 CDS Leupold in Talleys.

338-06 Ackley

338 wm or 338/06 aalf?

I built my perfect elk rifle , it is a 1909 Argentine Mauser, #3 Douglas barrel cut to 22" in 338 Win Mag. Bansner stock, NECG sights, early warne QD scope rings. 2-7x33 Leupod. Weighs 7.75 lbs all up
I use two different loads depending upon terrain, the most used is a 210 N.P. at 2900 fps the second load is a 250 N.P. at 2650 fps. Light, handy , rugged and powerful.

Me likey that rifle!

Oooops....338-06 Ackley....I'll edit.....

That would be a dandy over in this country, bout the same as my whelen . Nice rifle man

There’s something intriguing about the 338-06 to me. Looks like a good combo with a 210 NP. What velocities are you guys getting with the shorter barrels?

I'm at 2830 fps with 210 Sciroccos out of the 21" barrel from my standard 338-06. Part of me wishes I went all the way with the AI route, but I didn't so stuck with it.

I'm getting right at 2700 from a 22 inch barrel.

[img]https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/galleries/14342668/338-06[/img]

An old classic that’s stood the test of time.

What loads are you guys using?

DF

I'm using 55gns of RL-15, RP .35 Whelen brass, WLR primers.

54 gr Varget with 210 NPT shoots sub MOA in my FN rifle, (.8”) as does 61 gr H-380 with 200 gr Combined Technologies (a black NBT) (.65”). Seafire and Gunner500 both like H-380 in the 338-06. I do too.

DF

Pretty sure I answered this. Why are you guys still talking about this?...

Dave

A Loony should understand such goings on.

DF

I have killed a handful of elk (no monster bulls yet) with a model 70 270 shooting 130 partitions manly back when it was the only rifle I owned as a poor high school then college student and newlywed...Now I have many rifles and am confident the seekins havak 6.5 PRC with 139 scenars at 3100 will handle my elk hunting needs.

Sure would love to hear the stories behind all those bulls that BSA shot...

So would he.

😆🤭

Probably a .338 or .340 but I don't carry either. Too much recoil and too heavy for me. The 30/06 with a top bullet and a light little carbine works in my case.

BSA you got some elk pics your hiding?

Food for thought. 338 Federal. I've looked at it seriously in the past, it just doesn't fit in with what I have right now. I recently came across this short article from Ron Spomer.https://ronspomeroutdoors.com/shooting/ballistics/cartridges/338-federal/

Just looming in the back ground here again, so I thought I'd add a bit more:
I have several "Perfect" elk rifles. Elk can live in a lot of different places and so "perfect' is going to be defined more by the ground you hunt then the gun with hunt with.
So, my most perfect elk rifles are as follows.

For hunting elk is very steep and thickly covered ground with a lot of high brush and heavy forest:
Mauser M98 in 8X57 with 18" barrel, loaded with 200 grain Nosler Partitions.
Mauser M98 "Scout" in 30-06 loaded with 180 grain Nosler partitions or 220 grain Partitions.
Mossberg MVP with 18" barrel, Weaver K4 scope, and loaded with Nosler 180 grain Partitions
Ruger #1 in 9.3X74R loaded with 286 grain Noslers
Mauser M98 in 9.3X57 loaded with 250 grain Accubonds
Browning M95 30-06 with issue Irons, loaded with 220 grain bullets.
M1 Garand loaded with 220 grain bullets and 3031 powder (so the port pressure is mild enough to not harm the Operating Rod)
Lee "Speed" loaded with 180 grain Nosler partitions (yes it shoots them REALLY well, despite the fact the bore is .310 and the bullets are .308) Iron sights.
Remington M81 in 300 savage with iron sights loaded with 150 grain Barnes X or 165 grain Partitions.
Savage M99 in 300 Savage with peep sight, also loaded with the same loads as the above Remington.

Again, hunting for elk in heavy brush as above, but in the places inside Wyoming and Montana where we have a LOT of grizzlies.
Ruger #1 in 9.3X74R loaded with 286 grain Noslers
Mauser M98 in 9.3X57 loaded with 250 grain Accubonds
M1 Garand loaded with 220 grain bullets
Mauser M98 in 9.3X62 loaded with 286 grain partitions.
Mauser M98 in 375H&H loaded with 270 grain Power Points.
Mauser M98 in 8X57 loaded with 200 grain Partitions.

In more open areas with good cover but also good visibility, all the above, plus the following:
Mauser 98 in 270 Winchester loaded with either 150 grain Remington Core-Lokts, 150 grain Nosler Partitions or 160 grain Nosler partitions.
M98 Mauser in 30-06 loaded with 165 grain AccuBonds
Mauser 98 in 300 H&H loaded with 200 grain Partitions.
Mauser in 375H&H loaded with 270 grain Power Points.

Are my choices "Perfect"?
Yup..............for me.
Why?
Because that's what I like and I like to enjoy my hunts.

I would use the .270 or .280 Ack., only because you left the wonderful 30-06 firing a 175 grain Barnes LRX bullet at 2,800 fps mv off of the list. That load combo will put a moose-elk down at 500 yards and shoot through most any grizzly. It has all of the "right stuff".

How about the 300 Sherman?

Thanks for the 338-06 info, if I ever find a wore out 30-06 pre-64 Winchester it might become one.

340 wby...the "little" 210 partitions at over 3200 fps will stretch you across a canyon or drop them at 50.....

If I were to wildcat it would be 7mm Practical, if proprietary it would be 7mm Dakota (one of the finest cartridges out there). If neither it would be a 7mm Rem Mag.

Ya’ll should be looking for the perfect elk.

Truth ^^^^^^^

Yup....

I don't think you'd be under-gunned at all by pairing your Swede with a 140 grain Nosler Partition.

Besides, I think a person really has much better success on using a rifle they "really like" as you state above.

Good luck on your final choice!

Agree...Some wouldn’t think my perfect elk is all that perfect. Grins. 😎

A friend once told me, "Elk just seem happier when you shoot them with a .338 Winchester. It's kind of like the coyote and the 6mm Remington; they were just made for each other." GD

Here it is ! Either Ai version or std. with a 210 NP will so a marvelous job.

Does a 6.5x55 with 140s allow you to practice more and be noticably more accurate than an 06 with 165/180gr?

When you take that suboptimal shot without pausing to consider angle properly with limited daylight next to thick cover when tired, frustrated and desperate which will you rather have had in your shoulder.

I dont hunt elk - I do hunt large smart deer in wilderness. I imagine perfect scenarios but I get realism and carry my 7-08. I can't think of a time Ive wished I had my 243 in such situations even thoughI shoot it fractionally better.

I know five people here in Wyoming who shoot 6.5X55s to kill elk. 3 men and 2 women. All are doing fine and all say that same thing. Use tough bullets.

One man in Worland used the Norma bonded 156 grain.

The woman in Green River used the 140 grain Hornady flat base and found it to be a bit too "soft" and has gone to the 140 grain Nosler Partition. I made her rifle.

A grand old woman I know in Lander shoots factory Norma Ammo and I think she is also using the 156 grain bonded bullets. She has been killing all her game with a Swede for longer then I have been in Wyoming and started hunting back in the 60s. She is happy with her rifle and ammo. Her rifle is a custom M96 Mauser that she got when she was in her early 20s, nicely done by a Gunsmith who lived in Douglas Wyoming in those days. I'd bet she has killed more elk with her 6.5MM then all the other 6.5MM kills I personally know of combined. She's been killing game for longer then I have, ......and I have been doing it since 1964. She started in 1960.

A man I know who also lives in Green River used the 140 grain Nosler Partition. 3 elk kills so far. (I made his rifle)

And my friend Bob B. in Riverton uses the 140 grain partitions and has used the 160 grain Hornady with great success. He uses a Swede rifle I re-barreled for him. I likes the Partition because it shoots flatter, but the 160s kill just as well.

The Swede kills elk fine. I have seen it done a number of times myself, and I have also seen elk killed with 2 different 260 Remingtons and 3 different 6.5 Creedmoors, all of which are firing the same bullet weights at about the same speeds plus or minus about 50 FPS.

The only truly poor results I have seen have all been from bullet that broke up badly. I can say the same about much larger calibers too, so I don't blame the shell if the results are with poor game bullets. I have seen plenty of bad ones from 7MM Mags and 300 Mags in my 50+ years of hunting and guiding elk hunts and I can't say the shells were bad.

So far I have only seen one so-so shot with a 6.5MM shooter. All the others were placed well, and so I do place blame on some of the bullets that broke up.

The one "so-so hit" was fired by a who lady killed her elk with a liver shot with her 260 Remington, which I followed up for her. That elk went about 300 yards after the hit and I found it dead. So it was a one shot kill, but not too impressive. The bullet was a 130 grain Accubond and seemed fine when we recovered it, but the liver/paunch shot was not so good. It cut the paunch and went through the liver and was found against the skin on the other side. I can't say bad things about the bullet at all. It was just not placed in the lungs or heart. A killer to be sure, but none too fast. If she had placed it about 12"-14" farther forward I am sure the results would have been faster. A 30-06 may have been faster, but I am betting not all that much, if the wound was in the same place. A heavier bullet may have exited, and that helps drop the blood pressure a bit more and a bit faster, and makes following the animal a LOT easier, but a marginal hit is still marginal -------- even if the hit is with a 338 mag.

Me............I like my bigger rifles most of the time, but I have 50+ years of experience that have taught me I do not NEED a big powerful magnum to kill elk. I just LIKE big rifles and also rifles that shoot bullets that are not super high powered, but have a tendency to go deep and exit. I am happy with my 300 mag, 9.3X62 or my 375 H&H, but to be honest, I feel just fine in the timber hunting elk with my 300 Savage or my 303 British too. My 270s have done me right 100% of the time on elk too.

If you hit an elk with a bullet that give reasonable expansion, and your hit goes clear through them and exits , from the liver forward, or if you break down their shoulders or breaks the spinal column, the elk will fall instantly or within a few seconds.
What cartridge case it was fired from is of far less importance then placement and penetration.

Really? I mean are you really going to beat me up for listing up 5 cartridges of 4 calibers?

Drop it on us! I’m sure we’re mature enough to handle it!

I might too, but I don’t regularly shoot elk, let alone 400 yd elk. I just don’t want to miss an opportunity...

I’m pretty set on 300 Sherman. Waiting on dies and getting my hands on some Bell&Carlson/McMillan stocks at NRA 2020.

My Dad (1922-2004) hunted in Wyoming for elk nearly every year until we moved east to Pennsylvania. He toppled well over 20 elk with his 300 Savage levergun which is ballistically similar to .308 or 30-06 out to about 200 yards. Beyond this distance the larger cased cartridges have the velocity and energy advantage. But to further illustrate this power, 300 Savage has about the same energy at 200 yards as 30-30 does at 100 yards.

My elk rifle is similar to Dad's except for .308 chambering. None got away; they all were downed humanly.

Sherwood

I have a NIB, BACO-USA (made and assembled in South Carolina) Winchester model 70 30-06 sporter in absolute mint, unfired, with factory barrel sticker still attached, with nice walnut stock. I was thinking of moving out of the collection. It has a 1-10" twist, so it should handle 200 grain jacketed bullets beautifully for your elk hunting (22" barrel).

It was made at the FN-USA defense plant in South Carolina. The barrel was hammer forged on the same machine they make their sniper barrels ( to ISO 9001 standards).

I have another BACO-USA Win m70 30-06 sporter rifle configuration that I have shot less than 70 rounds. But so far, every load tested has been moa or less (180 grain Hornady flat base, 165 grain Speer flat base with IMR 4350). Action is butter smooth and is a joy to use (precise tolerences).

PM me if interested, will send pictures.

Have a 338-06 and a 35 Whelen in pre-64 Model 70s-original re-chambered/re-rifled barrels-iron sights. A 338-06 Ack Imp
is close to ideal. Having land in Alaska influences my thinking. You never know what will show up at the gut pile or around the next spruce.
If its under 125 yds, a 348 Ack Imp has worked really well in a pre-war Model 71 Deluxe on AK moose.
If these seem like minimum standards -I have to confess to killing my first bull elk with an original Winchester 1895 in .405 WCF. He
did'nt suffer or require a second shot. If an elk or moose gets taken over by a grizzly-you will have a fight on your hands

A guide in Wyoming was killed by a grizzly a year and a half ago-elk hunting. I am sure he would re-think his choice of weaponry if he could do it again.
Rifles and calibers are like girl friends and wives. Choose carefully and wisely- because you will have to live with your decision.

Fair enough, 284 or 308. I like exit holes.

I always enjoy this topic because it was instrumental in my early elk hunting pursuits 25 years ago. Anything suited for the great western elk hunt had to have a magnum primer stuck in the case or it wasn't ethical. I gladly played those games with a variety of 338WM's, 300WM's, 300 WSM's, and one 325WSM. All brought elk home - cows and bulls from 125 yards to 385 yards. But so did .270 Wins, .308 Wins and 30-06's - with "deer bullets" that the others in our camp were using. Well, 25 years later, I have a couple of thousand primers to sell.
Well there is that Talkeetna way in the back of the safe waiting to go to Alaska again.
Anyway, the moral of the story is your plain old deer rifle is an elk rifle too! Maybe a bump up in bullet quality is prudent, but you'd be better off upgrading something else like boots, a backpack or a binocular. Good luck.

I was interested, but I just closed the deal on a buttery smooth New Haven M70.

Well if you're like me, and I know I am, you'll agonize over all the details, get the perfect set up for your application. Then, just carry the same damn rifle you always carry because it works and it's the one you shoot best. My do it all is an 8x57.