If you invite a guest to hunt on your lease and you explain what the rules are, what do you do when the guest violates the rules?

Uninvite them?

This exact thing is the reason I will never again invite anyone to elk camp. Some people are totally different when you get them out away from home.

Yes. Unfriend them.

After several seasons of pleading, we had a spot in our party and invited a coworker to one of our public land deer spots. Next season we pulled in and he was at our campsite with about 4 buddies. Thankfully the country was too rough for the cohort, and they made no subsequent returns.

That is what I was thinking about doing, but didn't want to come off as being an over-reacting dick.

Might be better to be a dick than your lease uninviting you.

Escort them to the gate and explain why they are no longer welcome.

That’s why I never invite anyone. They will foul up somehow.

Send them back to Indiana.

Good point!

There is a reason we have a no guest oolicy, unless it's a junior hunter

We actually had a member get caught hunting with his boss. We approached them. Immediately removed him from the club roster and had his boss arrested for trespassing

Wow! This is about the harshest thread I’ve ever read. Value friendships much?

All of the "friends" or "co-workers" that I bring on my place understand my rules and they will pay the same fines as our member hunters.

My two buds and I were going on a deer trip when a guy we hardly knew invited himself. He saw two does and a female.

Hunting brings out the nucklehead in people

People who value your friendship will go the extra mile to fit in and to follow the rules, especially if they know anything about hunting. If they don't, then they're not your friends.


Okie John

I had the same thing happen to me with a so called friend. After years of figuring out the habits/routes the elk used during hunting season on public land, the "Friend" shot his first elk. We swore him to secrecy. And of course the next year he was there with 3-4 buddies. The year after that the Friend's buddies were there some of their buddies. That sweet spot was destroyed. I never hunted with him again. I hate getting stabbed in the back. I like my hunting too much to waste spending time with a proven liar. These particular non-residents were from Minnesota, not Indiana.

I don't hunt on a lease, but there's no way I'd jeopardize my membership on a lease for a "friend".

My hunting spots are all public, and the folks I've invited to hunt with us in the past never abused the chance we gave them.

I don't think the OP described the guest as a friend. I can think of a number of situations where I might invite an acquaintance who was not what I would consider a friend. It would also depend upon the rule that was violated. I would be much more tolerant of an honest mistake than blatant disregard. If it were a friendship, if it were a true friendship, the friend suffering consequences as a result of disregard for the rules shouldn't end the friendship.

Don't have much 'lease' experience but have had to un-invite so called friends from hunting my little piece of heaven owned.
It's really simple: if YOU break OUR rules on OUR property YOU no longer have permission to hunt here.
It's happened twice in 25 years and neither person speaks to me.
I'm good with it as it showed their true selves.

Used to have some brothers come to camp back in the day. Good friends and coworkers of my dad’s. They became uninvited after one of the filled my dad’s cow tag for him, on opening morning without him ever even expressing the idea that they should do something like that. That was the final offense, they’d been given a pass on a couple similar shenanigans previously.

They didn’t speak for about a decade afterwards but have gotten past it now. They still haven’t been invited back though.

The guy I brought along one year just wanted to come hang out. Until we got there and he decided he should “share” my bull tag and would pay half if he killed one. When I told him that wasn’t happening he got pouty and stayed drunk for the next 6 days. I was embarrassed and nobody wanted him back.

We do not allow "guests" on our lease. Our rules are immediate family only which is defined as spouse and your children. On leases we were on in the past it was invariable that the "guests" always shot young bucks that the paying members had agreed to give a pass on to grow up. It is not fair to the paying members that follow the rules. Every place is different but we really like the immediate family only rule.

In the OP case I would not invite that guest back. If that person is a true friend they will understand they broke the rule and brought that upon themselves and not harbor any bad feelings.

Tell em bye.

NO guests allowed on lease = no problems. None of my hunting buddies know the location of our lease and I don't ask to hunt on their leases. Simple solution.

What rules were not obeyed?

The situation was that my son invited a friend from a non-hunting family to hunt with us last year. The boys had a good hunt and punched some tags. All went well, so we invited him back this year. All was fine the first weekend, with both boys punching their two RIVER WMA doe tags. They both had an "any deer" WAHOO WMA tag to fill, so we went out to the lease this past Saturday. The three of us were in the same ground blind, so I had what I thought was final approval over which deer they would shoot. The rules are the we don't shoot small bucks and we don't shoot does with spotted fawns. The boys decided who would shoot first by way of a coin flip before the season and then alternated shots from there on. Those rules worked fine last year and for opening weekend, but my son's friend shot a small buck after I specifically told him not to shoot it.

The shooter was using our gear, rifle/scope/ammo, and I bought the deer tags and habitat stamp for him. I was happy to do this and had planned to give him the rifle/scope combo for a high school graduation gift, but now I'm not so sure.

Being from a non-hunting family, is he actually clear on what a small buck is? Heck, half the guys I know that have hunted for a long time don't know the difference.

Being your son's friend puts you in an awkward situation.
Truthfully, at his young age, it might be an opportunity for a teaching moment. But if he did it just to be a contrarian and to satisfy his wants, I'd tell him to stay home.

What Skane said.

I'd just told him not to shoot it and less than a minute later he shot it. It was the only buck in the field, so there was no misunderstanding. When I asked him why he shot it, he said that he wanted to shoot a buck and punch his tag.

I pay for the lease, so I get to set the rules, Besides, if you shoot little bucks, they never get the opportunity to grow into whatever their potential is and isn't the whole point of shooting an animal with antlers to shoot one with either a large or unusual set of antlers?

That's blatant disregard, not a yootful mistake. He's burned the bridge. This will be a valuable life lesson.

Seems like he certainly knew not to do what he did but disobeyed your rules anyway. I would not invite him again and also explain why to him. Also explain to your son that if his friend gets mad with him about the situation he caused between himself and you then he isn’t a friend he needs anyway.

Based on this information I would not even think twice about letting the young man know that he is not going to be invited back to hunt. He needs to learn some life lessons. If my boss tells me not to do something and I do it anyway right in front of his face he would fire my butt.

Ahhhhh - well, then he'll be learning a very valuable life lesson from the last time he hunted with you. Enjoy the public land hunting, youngster!

He would have been sat down and talked to before the Deer was moved, and told not to expect to be asked back. Perhaps not forever, but most definitely for the immediate future. How he conducted himself in future interactions would be a large determining factor. How old is he?

well past the age of accountability.....

Reading back, I see he was getting ready to graduate from HS, so I agree.

However, I’ve learned more from my mistakes than my successes.

Yep, agreed.

We don't even allow spouses unless they become paying members.

And the child allowance stops when they graduate High School.

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I have 160 acres of my own! I wanna help those that don't get to hunt much but I rarely invite anyone due to those "misunderstandings" that happen but those times that I do extend an invite the rules of engagement are explained fully and that any brain farts will not be tolerated.

I have a lady and her husband coming this weekend to hunt! She has never killed a deer but Ive explained to her what I expect and what I will allow her to shoot!

That's pretty cut and dried right there. He feels entitled, doesn't appreciate your generosity nor does he respect you. Adios.

I’d be irritated. Give him a ration of schit. But I value friends more than I value deer, so I certainly wouldn’t get too worked up about it.

Not my friend, my son's friend, just another person's kid to me. With my son going off to college next year and me moving on to wherever I retire to, this was probably this kids last opportunity to hunt bucks with us anyway. The fact that he blatantly shot the deer after I specifically told him not to definitely put a crimp in how I feel about having him around me, even more so if he has a loaded firearm in his hands.

Kid needs to learn about accountability and consequences. I specifically told you no but you did anyway. This means I can’t trust you, so I’d rather not be around you.






P

I was speaking in general. Your situation would irritate me but I’ll still choose my friends over deer.

That said, I would never blatantly shoot a deer a host asked me not to.

Like a lot of undisciplined kids, just “testing” to see if you really meant it....

I got a free invite to a deer lease about a month ago but turned it down. I dont know anyone at the lease and Im at the point in my life that I dont care if I hunt deer anymore or not. Never thought I would ever say those words.

I'm for people shooting whatever buck makes them happy. This "only big bucks are worth shooting" is a big crock of shyt and I have no desire to force it on others, especially young/new hunters. I wouldn't belong to or accept an invitation to hunt on a lease where a bunch of lame ass dickheads would tell me where, how or when I can hunt or what I could and couldn't shoot. I was given permission to hunt a piece of private land that came with a bunch of restrictions a few years back. "Don't shoot any spikes or forks, don't shoot this 8 pointer or that 9 point cuz they'll be real slammers in a couple more years" yada yada yada. The guy had game cams all over the property and was showing me pictures of what bucks I could and couldn't shoot. I ended up telling him "no thanks" and have never hunted there.

How does your son feel about the situation?

Just curious.

If I bring a guest, I sit in the blind with them. That way they don't shoot something they're not supposed to. In rare instances, I put them in my blind and I'll sit in another members blind (but that's usually only if we're hunting pigs).

I was in the blind with the shooter and had specifically told him not to shoot the little buck just before he shot it. Last year, this same kid followed directions without question, which is why he was invited back.

My son is madder at his friend than I am. I think that my son was embarrassed by his friend's disobedience, 'cause he knows that I am a stickler for following the rules and particularly strict when firearms are involved..

Blackheart,

I have you on "ignore" and won't read your posts, but assume that it reflects your values and is therefore of no value to me.

8 of us have a 1200 acre wooded lease, and we eliminated some problems by having one rule. If it is legal by Game Commission law, then it is up to the individual. All of us pay for the same ground. There are no restrictions of your stand is here, mine is there. None of the silly, posting your spot on a map for the day. Some like to still hunt and not be stuck in one place. They paid the same for every acre as someone else. We don't crowd another if we know they are there, but if I wander past you on stand and had no reason to know you were there, then that's the way it goes.

One guy years ago put in a small food plot and thought that gave him exclusive right to some unspecific amount of land. He felt it was off limits even if he wasn't there. That became clarified quickly.

Everyone does things different, and the above situation is another issue. However, unnecessary rules cause their own problems. And often there are those who want to make rules .

I have to toggle your posts too because I consider you a worthless dickhead and have had you on ignore for quite some time. That hasn't changed and is unlikely to in the future.

That's the best lease I've ever heard of. Congratulations on finding a good one.

Highly doubtful you two would get along on a lease.

We don't even need a stinking meeting. You pay your money to the landowner, sign a contract with him and get a key to the one gate. Someone becomes an [bleep] the landowner removes them quickly.

I agree that puts you in a pickle. It’s strange. Did he just get excited? What kind experience does he have? How old is he?

I’ve been hunting for a week with 2 14 year old kids and a 15 year old. My son and 2 of his buddies. It’s tried my patients to no end. But we are all learning from it. Good and bad. 2 of the kids made some bad shot choices and didn’t listen to direction afterward, in the excitement.

I was a bit upset at the time but now chalk it up to inexperience. We all talked about what went wrong and how to fix it moving forward.

Have you talked to the young man and expressed your concerns? If not...give it a shot.

Sounds good. I've never heard of one with so few rules. Hows it going this year ? Any luck so far ?

Sign me up!

There is deer hunters and trophy hunters. The deer hunter wants to shot anything legal. The trophy hunter wants a old deer with large horns. Nothing wrong with either group. They just don’t mix.
Most folks that hunting is a priority find a place to hunt. If they can’t follow rules in every day life don’t expect them to change while hunting. Hasbeen

No guests allowed on my lease......and wouldn't have it any other way.

My thoughts exactly !

Having said that, if I had an invitation to hunt somewhere else & did accept the invitation, I would follow the "rules" to a standard above what was requested.

Rather, if it's a conditional invitation that you accept, you accept the conditions !

I've quoted it, so you'll see it.

Actually I agree with most of Blackheart's reply, in this instance !

Your situation is quite different from mine, as you appear to be part of a peer group of equal share holders, while I am the sole lease holder on this farm.

As part of the lease agreement, I am personally responsible for myself and my guests, so I set and enforce rules. I typically don't invite guests, never more than one at a time, and if they complain about my "we don't shoot small bucks" rule, they usually don't get invited back. I invited this 17 year old because he is a friend of my son. This boy was fine last year and he took a nice buck, a buck that I had mounted for him, so he was invited back this year. He knew what the rules are and by blatantly disregarding my directions not to shoot this buck, he disrespected me, and as a consequence it is unlikely that I will ever invite him to hunt with me anywhere ever again.

Battue;

Well thought through & completely logical.

As if I'd expect anything else from you !

Happy Thansgiving to you & yours, Sir.

Exactly - RIGHT !

One bowhunter who does well every year, took a nice Buck early in the season. A couple others have taken a few Does and there are more there than there should be.

The son of a friend had a few cameras out and he has pics of three bruisers. He also got a pic of two guys coming in-in the dark-with a game cart. So for sure, something came out. Blurred so a positive ID is not a consideration. I know 5 of the 8 guys and it wasn't any of them. The bow hunter didn't do it and the other 2 wouldn't. There are only two roads into the place. Both have locked gates. One of them belongs to a farmer. They were coming in from there. Could have been part of his clan. In fact he is a distant part of mine. Another side is completely bordered by a 50 yard wide creek. You really have to work to sneak on.



Rifle Buck starts Saturday....

That sounds about perfect.

I forgot your gun season hasn't started yet. Hopefully the poachers haven't gotten much. Good luck and have a happy thanksgiving !

I understand your situation, especially when a friend of your Son is involved. However, as I previously mentioned, I've learned more from my mistakes than from the successes. And it took some adult forgiveness along the way to lighten the path. "Unlikely" is better than never, which shows you are perhaps open to the same. If the boy has potential, then all is far from lost.

Addition: There are more than a few "wild" ones who go on to succeed in life, business, and the military.

That's fine, I'm not seeking affirmation, just stating the facts of the case.

Happy Thanksgiving to you and all. Spent mine yesterday with the Daughter and family. She is stuck in the position of having to satisfy two families, so one year we get the day and the next they.

Our “ little piece of Heaven” only gets visitors that we invite. And that’s a rare occurrence. Rules are “Be Safe” and enjoy.

My first job out of college taught me the 30 mile rule.if it happens more than 30 miles away, it stays there . Haha

Seriously, they’d never be back at the lease .

A couple years ago a good friend took me on his lease for the first time, only 3 guys and I know all of them. Rules...if you wouldn't hand it on the wall don't shoot it. Within 20 minutes i had a 6 point 20 yards in front of the stand. He walked and I watched. Took a pic and sent it to him. I needed some meat in the freezer but wanted the friendship more. That afternoon i got the keys to 235 acres and told to fill the freezer as no big bucks were in there. Had the keys since and taken a couple moderate bucks out of it, haven't been invited back to his lease yet but they pay the lease.

If I'd shot that 6 point we wouldn't be doing any hunting together anymore.

Let your kid deal handle it then. Assuming he's the one who made the initial invite, doubt there will be another.

I invited a friend to hunt my number 1 stand who is a if it’s brown it’s down kind of person never had killed anything bigger than a spike buck I sat across the ridge and watched several does and small bucks pass by him all the time he’s texting me begging to shoot I told him to be patient and lo and behold he killed a decent 8 pt

If he's observant, a light shoulda came on.

Good coaching.

UPDATE:

As part of the initial invitation, my son's friend had agreed to join us for a work day at the lease on Saturday, 11/30/19. My son called his friends on Friday, 11/29/19, to confirm the time that we were planning to pick him up and he replied that he was busy and wouldn't be able to make it. My son told him that the work day wasn't optional and that he wouldn't be invited back if he didn't do the work that he'd agreed to.

My son was pretty pissed that after we'd provided all of the hunting kit, bought the tags, paid for the processing last year and the taxidermy fees to have the buck that he shot last year mounted, that his friend wasn't going to follow through and do what he'd agreed to do. I told my son that it was a good life lesson for both of them.

I owned 200 aces in GA for 12 years, I built a cabin, planted trees, built stands, put my money, sweat and literally blood into the property. My three young sons hunted with and as they became successful, we agreed to shoot only "mature" bucks. I had friends and family wanting to hunt all the time and I had guests several times per year and eventually someone would shoot a yearling or really small buck. I was never too hard on them but it really burned me considering my sons would pass on deer only to be shot by others, not often but enough to get at me and they never had a clue how much work it took to make everything come together in November so they could show up and shoot. My family ties run deep from a long line of hunters and outdoors men so I was patient but friends who didn't honor my rules were not invited back.

I second what Okie John has to say. Cheers NC

I've only been in on one lease, basically to help a friend fill a needed spot to be able to keep the lease. It wasn't expensive, and I never hunted it.

One of my best friend's sons is on a great lease and has invited me several times. I've declined, mainly because I have family land to hunt, and decent public land is close by. I took this kid to my spots years ago, where he killed his first half dozen deer with a muzzleloader I gave him. I'm proud of him for wanting to return the favor, but he's new to the lease idea, and he's already taken another non-lease member, who killed a great buck.

I've tried, in subtle fashion, to explain how this kind of thing rubs lease members the wrong way at times, especially when nice bucks are involved, and I don't want this kid to lose his membership. Hopefully he works all this out with his buds in time.

I always feel like I have to entertain a guest. That’s the main reason I don’t take them.

That seals it. He needs to be taught the "don't jack around the host" rule. He will only hear hunt reports from now on - if they speak.

between that and the first offense, i'd say that kid is a spoiled ass. if someone had done for me what you have done for him, they'd have a lifelong friend and helper. this kid sounds like he doesn't appreciate what you have done at all.

I have learned a very hard lesson about allowing a neighbor to hunt with a very few rules he had to follow. It started 32 years ago when I bought 117 acres of land and the mother of a nineteen year old slow witted young man asked if her son could hunt deer. Trying to be agreeable I gave him four rules to follow. 1. Do not shoot any non-antlered deer 2. Do not shoot anything on the adjoining properties. 3. Do not use my property to access someone else's property. 4. When we are on the property, you are not to hunt. Opening day of the first deer season he shot a doe deer that was across the property line on my neighbor's place with the landowner watching. I let that and several other violations go. Then he used my place to get to a deer stand he had nailed up in an adjoining property where he had been told to stay off. He found the landowners son in "his" stand and ordered him out of it. When the boy said "this is our place, we hunt here" my "invitee" threatened to kill him. That is when my guest got his walking papers and you would not believe the hell we had with these people over revoking hunting privileges. It only ended with the sheriff coming out with an arrest warrant in the spring of 2018 and killing both nitwit mother and son. We only have immediate family hunting now and even some of them aren't allowed

They po-po killed the mother and son for being combative over hunting rights? Dayum

NO. It's a very long 25 year story. They were shot for pulling guns and firing on the sheriff when he came out to serve an arrest warrant pursuant to a restraining order violation. I had secured a court order enjoining them from shooting across our property.