Welp, got my old rifle back from my 'Smith today, the old girls buttstock had began to crumble at the tang, kinda splintering and oil soaked, 'Smith buddy loves old Winchester lever actions, Colt 1911's and SAA's, he's also a Mauser nut, he offered to spruce the old girl up, complete with a new set of stocks, correct re-blue, he even color cased the butt plate, fore end cap, and a little flat, what i assume to be a spring retainer plate behind the load gate.

The old rifle turned out beautiful, it should now last close to another hundred years, shot it today in a hell of an East wind shooting dew North, 3 rounds of the old heavy jacket 250gr Barnes's landed into a couple inches, also a couple inches left of center, i'll go back in calm weather and center the rifle, chronoed a couple at 2188 fps, i dont lean on the old rifle, and where i come from that's plenty of velocity for bolt peep sight hunting within 200 yards.

Bought some of the Alaskan Bullet Works 250gr Kodiaks, thought i'd have to use those or the big 250gr Woodleighs, learned right here from North61 and others the old 250gr Barnes is not so bad after all, i was glad to read/learn that, have only shot one deer and one pig with this rifle before it went in for a makeover, it done a fine job.

Pictures?
I have a 1940 71 Deluxe w / factory bolt peep, best lever action ever made in my opinion

Dang, beautiful rifle Mossyoak, i agree, they are fine rifles, i had forgot how light and quick handling it was, never shot a big Grizzly/Kodiak bear, but would have absolutely no problem going after one with this rifle, that goes for timber elk and moose too.

I'd have to get Pacecars or Riflecrank to post some pics for me, i took about 6 pics today, fun, fun rifles they are.

sounds good,
just got mine this past winter didn't shoot it yet but it will be hitting the woods here in PA for Black Bear this fall, cost me a small fortune stocking up on ammo for it not the best time to be buying ammo.

Sounds great Gunner! A bolt peep sighted Winchester 71 is on my wish list. I have taken several head of African game and this BC moose with my Browning 71 in .348 Win using a max load of Varget under Swift 200 grain A Frames:



It is a fine cartridge! Would love to find a classic bolt peep sighted Winchester in this caliber! I've taken a couple of brown bears (both with a .500 S&W handgun) but like you I wouldn't hesitate to hunt one with a .348 Win!

Looking forward to your pics!

DJH

You bet Mossyoak, and dang, bet that factory ammo was/is very expensive, thankful for a couple hundred sticks of old WW brass and a set of dies.

Man, that's nice 8point, heck of a deal, beautiful bull moose, i suppose even at 200 grains those A-frames are giving you plenty of penetration? and yes Sir, the old 71's are cool, 200 yard steel is pure cake with the bolt peep.

I am indeed an A Frame fan! I've taken several head of game with the .44 Mag and 240 and 280 grain A Frames (deer and hogs) and the 300 and 325 grain A Frame in the 454 Casull (caribou and several African species up to the size of Kudu). They have worked so well for me in revolvers that it was only natural to try them in the lever guns. I was not disappointed! If they don't pass all the way through they are found just under the skin on the opposite shoulder with very high weight retention. As an added benefit, the 200 grainer shoots extremely well in my Browning 71.

I plan to use the 450 grain A Frame in the .50-110 this Summer on Cape Buff as well.

Nice, after hanging around and reading from some big bore handgun hunters, i bought and worked up loads for my 44 and 454 with 300 and 325gr A-frames, i bet once i drop the hammer on one of those i'm not likely to get it back, they penetrate like crazy according to the big bore handgunners.

Great news on the 200gr A-Frames, those 450's from your 50-110 are going to knock the soup out of M'Bogo! ; ]

I cant wait to read that report and see those pics too.

Great news Mossyoak and 8point, our friend Riflecrank has once again decided to bless my i.t. challenged soul, he will post a few pics i sent of my 348 Winchester, my old 'Smith Buddy done a real Bangup job! and you all should see the blue job he done on my '09 DWM 98 Mauser in 7X57, if that guy likes what he's working on Professional/Gunsmith/Guild etc, etc does not exceed.

For an example, i talked him into doing a trigger job for another Buddies 700 Remington varmint rifle in 22-250, the moment he finished the job he called and hollered, come get this POS outta my shop!!!!!

The trigger breaks at 8 ounces, it passes the slam bolt home as hard and fast as you want, bust butt on the floor without dropping the hammer, as said, the Old Guy knows his chit.

I'm more than happy that he calls me Friend.

The old rifle sounds like it got a fine make over. This is what she looked like before the work was done:



I liked the patina of the old girl, but if the butt stock needed replaced, sounds like it was time to add some life back. I'm anxious to see the end result.. Tell your buddy to hurry and post those damn pics..

LOL BSA, old 'Smith buddy said that was real elephant ivory under that black paint he was thinking 'brand' that some Western cattle ranchers would have used back in the day to identify one of their rifles, serial numbers can be filed off, but who the fu-k has a chunk of real Ele ivory in 1937, i'll tell ya who, the same sombitch that owns this 15 thousand acre cattle ranch!

Riflecrank is a busy man, but, i've known him to post very late, my happy ass is up this late waiting on a sat cc, maybe he'll post pics before he sacks out tonight.

BTW, that happens to be the second damn accurate rifle you've sold me Buddy, What's Up with that?

gunner500's latest precious, for his comments:















Front sight still looks like this ?

I sell good accurate rifles... I won't sell a rifle that doesn't shoot well. I've sold 79s here a few rifles as well.. Your old rifle looks beautiful man !! Yeah, a buddy of mine thought that was real ivory as well. He said the same thing as you did, about rich cattle ranchers. It was a good identifier, like a brand... I'm sure that old girl rode around a few miles in a saddle scabbard too... Hey speaking of accurate old rifles. I shot a buddies 1990's Marlin 336 38-55 with long octagon barrel. That rifle was damn accurate. He handloads cast bullets with New correct length and neck thickness Starline brass with correct diameter bullets for the rifle and that thing is a damn tack driver. He has 3 38-55's, but this one is the best shooting one of the lot. He said he wanted me to shoot it to see what it was capable of. You know I have to shoot right handed with irons, the reason I sold you the model 71. When I shot that rifle, he was spotting for me and the first 2 shots were touching. He said they went into the same hole, but I didn't believe him. He said "6 o'clock 1" low, but in the same hole". So I held the same spot on the bullseye and fired again. The third one made a 3/4" group (at 100 yards). That's the only lever rifle that I know of that is more accurate than the 71 I sold to you... My buddy has a scoped 71 that he can shoot 1" 3 shot groups with, but a scope on one of those is like cheating.. .

Wow, that turned out great Gunner, congrats! I think that this is a perfect excuse for you to go shoot those 250 Barnes bullets into something large!

Sir Ron, many Thanks for posting the pics Sir, and yes, the rifle still has it's front sight and hood, but, the hood didn't get re-blued, my dumb butt forgot to take it to 'Smith, that's okay, i'll still have a piece of originality left ; ] he put new springs, firing pin and anything else that had heavy wear, as said, that things ready for another hundred years now.

Thanks buddy BSA, and yes you sure do sell accurate rifles, that pre-64 375 H&H thinks it's a varmint rifle, sounds like your other buddy has the 38-55's figured out, me too, i shoot a 380" 265gr Beartooth hard cast in my 94 lever 38-55, it's a hole puncher too, hard to see the group i fired on the box yesterday, i took the rock out of the box and threw it back in the creek, damn wind blew the box as i was taking the pic, it was about to rain, i had to haul ass back to the house, cant be getting your brand new old rifle wet!

8point, Thank you too Sir, iirc the old Barnes' are about pure copper and lead, leaving at an easy 2188 should let the old bullet work as it's penetrating, that said, and money paid, traveling for a hunt, i'd have to load it with the 250gr Bonded Kodiaks i have, or use the big Woodleigh's or A-Frames, still wish Swift would make a 250 grain A-Frame, another fine hammer to add to the 348 Winchester tool box.

As per gunner500, here is the original front sight hood on the refinished barrel.
That old patina on the hood is a good thing, looks sorta-like color case hardening:



I think a hardcast 250-gr FNGC sized to .350" diameter after PC paint would do nicely in any .348 WCF for smokeless loads
befitting that rifle and cartridge.

That is a great rifle and cartridge to have in ones hands when creeping though the North Woods looking for moose and knowing old Griz is some where around. Yours is a beauty and thanks for sharing. I Ackley Improved a new Miroku Mod. 71 Deluxe last year and had a few other things done to it and it is the best looking rifle I own. My favorite sling for my lever guns is the quick adjusting Montana sling, they look better with age.

My other beauty is my old Mod. 70 Featherweight 30-06 made in 1958. At my age I appreciate what I grew up with, blue steel and walnut. Been using them here in Alaska for 55 years.

I hope to slay a moose and brown bear with my Mod. 71 Ackley this year. May you make many gut piles and memories with your great rifle.

I'm no fan of refinishing old classics, but when they're in need and it's done right, it's beautiful thing. That sure came out nice gunner!

Sir Ron, you're exactly right, that old hood indeed looks like case colors, i'll take it, can also see where the old scabbards polished the edges on that hood, never thought about hardcast in my rifle, a good hard gas checked bullet with the largest flat meplat that would reliable run in the action would be a heck of a load, would need to check twist and bullet lengths, if stable, a 280 grainer would be a toughy.

1Akshooter, Thank You for the kind words, as said and thought by me many times, i think the 348 Winchester with a good bullet would indeed be a fine big bear rifle, i had forgot how light, nimble and fast pointing the rifle is, dusk or dawn would call for a simple unscrew up the aperture and complete the hunts with the ghost ring, i like the old guns too Sir, something about blued steel and walnut that wont let me go, closing in hard on 60 years of age, i dont think it ever will, i plan to roll out many gut piles with this rifle, fun hunting it will certainly be.

tmitch, Thank You too sir, and i fully agree with leaving the old guns be, we can ask our friend BSA here who i got the rifle from, it had a hell of a hard working life, the scabbard [left] side of the rifle barrel and mag tube was ate up with pits from moisture, the side of the action had some pretty good scars from a horse wreck or possibly rock slide fall while hunting, that buttstock done the heavy lifting for a lot of years, it was getting weak and time to go, plus, my old 'Smith Buddy is getting old too, thought i'd better get it done while i could, my survivors can argue gun values if they care too, i wont be minding that a bit.

.348 WCF Accurate Molds moulds designed for the .348 WCF:

250-grainer most popular, 1.04" long without GC, might be stable in 1:12" twist at 860 fps MV or faster, lead bullet



300-grainer, 1.25" long without GC, might be stable in 1:12" twist at 1250 fps MV or faster, lead bullet



All I have for those is a midget Browning M71 with 20" barrel, never been shot:







SAAMI twist is 1:12", one reason the .348 WCF is such a good killer with jacketed bullets.
Might work OK with the heavier and slower hardcast FNGC.

I definitely need a peep for the safe queen.







http://www.skinnersights.com/winchester_26.html

Neck the .348 WCF up to .458 and blow it out and shorten it a trifle (from 2.255" to 2.145") to make the .450 Alaskan: Same gross case capacity as a .458 WM.
Amazing. Tempting, but short COL is required to work through the M71 even if it had a .458 WinMag throat.
So I better not rebarrel, with so many fabulous bolt action .458 WM rifles about.

Amazing amount of beauty here. The model 71 that is.

Sir Ron, ho lee damn that's a beautiful carbine, i'd not put that aluminum williams on that rig, would search high and low for an old/older steel Lyman or Redfield, and certainly not drill it for the skinner, that 300gr cast bullet would be a hammer, you could easily drive it 1800, bet it wouldn't lead with Lyman #2 alloy.

Theoldpinecricker, Thank You, indeed, plenty of 71 beauty to go around in this thread.

I'd agree with that! They do sell a reproduction 98a bolt peep that would be killer, but it's a fair chunk of change.

Ive got that exact same Browning rifle as above but i had mine punched out to 348 AI

Good advice on the sights. I am too seriously into the .458 WM+ to go get a $440 bolt peep and pay a gunsmith to install it right now.
I bought the Browning M71 High Grade Carbine thinking I might have a 50 Alaskan done with it.





I wised up.
Happy to keep it as a much more useful .348 WCF which came from a .50-110 WCF to start with, so why undo the perfection ?
It does seem that many have found the .348 WCF very accurate with cast bullets:

"I have a few M71 Browning repro's. they have virtually no throats to speak of and like .351"-.352" diameter cast bullets. i use a LBT 250gr. LCFN with RL-15 for a little over 2100 fps. the shank of the bullet protrudes into the case so the powder is topped off with shotshell buffering which protects the exposed sides of the bullet from the powder gas. these rifles are the most accurate lever guns i have ever shot."

more here: https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?90799-348-Winchester-with-cast-boolits

Gator Gas Checks might be required for the .348 GC bullets.
Hey, I have gotten Gators before, using the .40-cal on my .395-caliber wildcats galore.

I have 200 rounds of 200-gr Silvertip loaded ammo to burn and a 100-count box of Hornady 200-gr FP Interlock before I need the cast bullets.
The Williams "Fool Proof" aluminum might survive long enough to see if the rifle will shoot,
and at least it does not cover the elk's golden hind end.

.348 WCF-AI, yep, some claim 500 fps more velocity with the AI. Whatever it adds would probably more than make up for the 4" shorter barrel's MV loss.
Near straight taper of the .450 Alaskan-AI can cause feeding problems.
Not so much with the .348 WCF-AI, and adds case life ?

You got it going on Sir Ron, and imho made the correct decision leaving that little carbine be, i had a '71 in 450 Alaskan, fireformed 348 Win brass with 200gr hornady bullets, i shot 350gr Hornady round nosed bullets at Warp10, that rifle kicked like a mule.

That'll work tmitch, a man could keep an eye out on ebay for one too.

Don't price the original bolt peep that is on your rifle. You might have a heart attack

Damn, i would have never thought one of those could even be bought, damn sure not in the market to replace it, people will laugh, and say it isn't so, and that's okay, but they wouldn't laugh for long squatted down with an ear pressed up against the backside of my 300 yard gong when those 250gr Barnes landed!

Your 71 really came out nice....

I have a very similar post war and to really add sex appeal, I installed a Montana Sling as they really seem to go with that rifle.

Just about impossible to retrofit a Winchester 98A bolt peep on a M71 that doesn’t have a bolt that has been factory milled to accept one.

When I picked up a Mirkou Mod. 71 Deluxe .348 from a friend I did so with the intention of turning it into a Ackley Improved version. I changed a few things, like chopped the barrel to 22 inches and had t he smith drill and tap it for the XS peep sight, which is small, sturdy, adjustable and unobtrusive. Got a bunch of 250 grain super bonded Kodiak bullets and H4350 and Federal 215 primers to stuff in Starline cases. The barrel is Dyna Bore coated and with the weight of the rife the recoil ain't bad.

Just when I get it all done I took another look at the .375 Alaskan and 270 grain bullets at 2,500 fps mv and 250's at 2,600 fps mv and thought dang, why did I not go that route. I only hunt Alaska and either one makes a good moose and big bear round and Irarely shoot past 150 yards. It never ends does it and I should be content with the beauty I have.

I am a fan of peep sights, but I will have to see how my old eyes do with them this fall in low light compared to other barrel mounted open sights. I am thinking a barrel mounted "ladder" sight is another option. Besides, they look cool.

Gunner - the makeover of your original 71 looks great. You should be very happy with the result.

Originals down here are rare and very expensive. I got to handle an original pre WWII, 4 digit serial number deluxe model many years ago at a local auction. It was really nice and had all the gear: checkered stocks, super grade swivels, sling and bolt mounted peep. It was hardly used, if at all. The early originals with the long tang had much better ergonomics compared to the short tang models.

When selecting moulds for this calibre watch out for the front drive band, if there is one - make sure it’s short and that ideally it’s tapered, as there is no throat. Most bullet weights over about 230gr will likely protrude below the neckline. I haven’t found that to be an issue as the 348 GC’s have a solid crimp on the GC shank, unlike some other calibres.

I am now skeptical of the .348 AI-WCF:



I guess a 4" longer barrel would do more for my carbine MV than reaming it to AI, if pressure and throating are constant.

The 458 WCF looks like a great conversion. A friend has an early 71 with a terribly pitted barrel. This cartridge looks to be the perfect solution. Who does this conversion? Hopefully they can use the original barrel. Is there a 40 caliber version of this non blown out conversion?

That .458 WCF is just a figment of wildcat fever dying slowly within me.
Somebody has probably done it before, since the .348 WCF has been necked up to all larger calibers including .510".

Actually you have to blow the case body out a little to form that shoulder where it is.
Surprisingly it is almost the same capacity as the .450 Alaskan, which is just a few grains smaller than the .458 WM in gross water case capacity.

Start with a .50 Alaskan from Starline use some Imperial Sizing Wax on it and work it far enough into the .45-75 WCF FL die to produce a caliber-length neck.

Dave Manson could make the reamer. Custom reloading dies.
Even if the COL is limited by the lever action,
I would have that reamer throated like a SAAMI .458 WM, for many reasons.

All the .348 AI and 45/348 AI and 45 Alaskan and 50 Alaskan reamers drawings I have seen have very short/tight throats.

The .348 WCF has basically no throat.
The SAAMI chamber is only 0.010" longer than maximum brass length, with a 45-degree chamfer down to 0.346" diameter before the leade starts.
Therefore any throat beyond the chamber mouth is smaller than groove diameter and bullet diameter.
You would see partial rifling starting right at the end of the chamber case mouth !
Basically no throat.
Trim that brass religiously for a .348 WCF !
maybe the AI is good for something, reducing case stretching and need for trimming.
It would really be a humdinger if it had a longer throat.
The Dave Kiff/PT&G reamer for the .348 AI is leade-only starting at 0.349" diameter right at chamber mouth and tapering to bore diameter at 1*30'00" angle,
zero parallel-sided freebore, again, basically no throat.

Ron - I’m surprised you haven’t mentioned Winchester’s experimental 46 WCF, which was based on the 50/110 case.

Wow Gunner, that rifle turned out awesome!




I will have to remember that for my Browning! What powder are you using with the A Frames? I was fortunate to end up with a bunch of the old 200 grn Barnes X bullets some years ago and they shoot pretty well too...so well, I'm regretting not picking up the 220s as well.

Hey Gunner, I saw a 1937 exactly like yours yesterday. It was in all original condition, but at about 70% condition. The guy wanted $6,200.00 for it!!! It also had the original bolt peep like yours has. I think his price was way high. There was a lot of 348 win ammo there too. My buddy bought some for $40/box. It was very old ammo in good condition. The original box was probably worth the asking price. Keep in mind this is a very small town gunshow with 43 tables. My old gunsmith had 5 of those tables and 2 were just old ammo. These tables are 8' long. Old hard to find ammo galore. He had at least 10 boxes of 303 savage. I ended up buying $160.00 worth of reloading components. Funny thing, 3 hours into the show and 2 old guys started pitching stuff into a "free" box. I had already bought 3 boxes of matchgrade bullets from them, but they were drastically reducing prices. Ready to go home. I bought 2 more boxes of sierra 200gr matchkings, from them, for $25.00/box ad a new RCBS 7x57 die set for $20.00. You should have seen the 1886 winchester there for $11,000!! There was also some new Starline brass for the 38-55. $14 for 25 pcs. I dont know if that was a reasonable price? It was the good stuff with thinner necks and correct 2.125" length.

Excellent rifle, Gun. You will be happy with it. My 1936 M-71 is the Deluxe version with original bolt peep. Have a 450 Fuller also on a Deluxe pre-war M-71
that was done in the 1950s by Bill Fuller in Johnson's Kenai Rifle shop. The 450 AK-450 Fuller are almost identical except for shoulder
angle. Johnson was a WWII Marine who talked with Elmer Keith about his Alaskan design. It was original and anything to the contrary
is moose caca or bear scat. The 348 Ackley is an excellent cartridge-I have owned 2 of them on M-71s and still have one.
They are first rate moose medicine with the capability of handling anything short of 2 charging brown bear. If its real close with claws , the 450s are the way to go.

The 50 AK that I had was done by Harry Mc Gowen years ago, but it was not as accurate as either the 450 AK or 450 Fuller
that I still own. So, the 50 AK went to a guide on Kodiak Island. The 50AK is very close to the 50-110. Fred Huntington saw
Harold Johnson's original "50"-so Johnson gets the credit for that one too. He was way ahead of his time.

Just remember that the 1886-Model 71s are lever actions that are faster in action than any bolt gun-and they can be reloaded
with a round still in the chamber ready to fire....try that with a bolt gun in a bear tussle. Also- cast bullets are good for practice, but the better
custom premium bullets by Kodiak-Swift-Hawk-Barnes-Woodleigh do the business on game when it counts.

Go here for all I've got on the .46 WCF: https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...hould-own-one-at-least-once#Post15973647

And then some about how James Watts did the .450 Watts Rimmed (.458/.348 WCF) on an old M1886 .40-65 WCF (rebore) and a new M71 .348 WCF (re-barrel) in 1950.
In 1951 he showed it to Harold Johnson at Cooper Landing.
In 1952 the .450 Alaskan that everyone knows and loves was born.
And Harold "Bill" Fuller who was Harold Johnson's machinist/gunsmith started making the .450 Fuller when ?

It seems that the taper on the .450 Alaskan of Harold Johnson is problem free for feeding, seems to be consistent specs wherever you look if you call it by that name,
for reamer and dies to match.

I do like the look of the 46 WCF. From a design perspective it looks more practical than the 450 Alaskan with its short neck and short case. I understand why the 450 Alaskan was built the way it was at the time, but these days with good 50/110 cases available, if you want more than a 45/70 or 45/90 has to offer the 46 WCF seems like an interesting design. It’s a pity Winchester never went into production with that cartridge.

Late to the party...but really like how your M71 turned out!


Tim

Thanks for all the well wishes and compliments Gents, that old rifle should do all i need doing with the 250gr Barnes' at an easy 2188 fps, as said, if a money/traveling hunt comes up, i have plenty of brass to load a few of the bonded 250gr Kodiaks for that occasion, sure glad i have 4 boxes of those, will be plenty for hunting, will also grab any of the 250gr Woodelighs when they are in stock.

BSA, holy damn, that's expensive, but glad you made some good buys on those components, i grab them too, they certainly wont spoil.

I need to take this old but refreshed rifle out hunting this fall, it's waiting on nothing but frost covered dead leaves in the fall.

That's a great old rifle. I packed it around on an elk hunt one year. I think I told you the story. I ran into this old cowboy twice that year. He kept commenting on the rifle. Saying he used to have one just like it..

Yessir, i remember, that old Rawhide may have peeled you off a roll of hunnerts if you'd have leaned it against a tree and grinned at him ; ] wish you could have busted a bull with it Buddy, aint an elk that ever drew a breath of air i wouldn't punch with it out to a long 200 yards.

I did a 450 AK conversion on my M1985G 45-70 just recently, and it has been wonderful. Feeds flawlessly, only needed to lengthen the loading gate slightly, to be able to load 2.64" COL, if I stay with 2.55" COL then no mods at all.
It feeds them as fast as I can move the lever, never jams. I did all the work myself, including smoothing out the action, I have the tools and mills to do it all, so for me it was a no brainer.

People have asked why do it, including my brother..basically this is the only way to get more MV without excessive pressure. Keep the load within the 44.5K and you can push a 400 grainer to 2100fs which is 450/400 NE loads. This is about 3900 to 4100 FPE. If you match the P+ 45-70 loads, you keep the pressures down below 40k..which is easier on the gun, and why I mostly did it, to save the gun.

577nitro

I agree. That cartridge is more than capable of taking a big un down. That year was a very memorable year, hunting with your rifle. It was so wet and miserable that year. I remember jumping some cows and they just looked up at me with those eyes so big as if they were saying put us out of our misery. They were so soaked from the rain we were getting. When they saw me, they didn't even run off. They just kind of walked off, looking back at me. I waited in that spot in the manzanita hoping there would be a bull to follow them, but no luck.

LOL, dang buddy, wish a bull would have stepped out too, iirc the old Winchester adds had the '71 348 in Alaska around bear and moose, if they got it done with those bullets, we can surely get it done better with the big bonded 250 Woodleighs, Kodiak's and 200gr A Frames, even the old 250gr Barnes' that i'm shooting now may have be a bit better than the bullets back when the cartridge was new.

This might have been posted before. old video promoting the M71 .348

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7qgsPQmcZM&t=16s

tmitch, that's it, also saw some magazine photos posted here and there, would be great fun to bust a timber bull elk or big Alaskan moose.

Enjoyed the video tmitch, thanks for posting. I got to get me some of them Silver tips!

Looks like the one I picked up a few years back. I had a standard grade that I foolishly sold during a weak moment, then minutes later, kicked myself for doing so. I lucked out and replaced it a short while later, picking up a deluxe model, in very nice shape, at a local gun show. Made in 1953. No bolt peep but I did get a set of original sling swivels with it. This one I keep !!

Here is a 1940-year Model 71 Standard Rifle that has been Deluxified with
checkering on forearm and pistol grip, plus artwork on the right side of butt.
Carving on butt must not have been done at the factory, you think ?
Looks like a mama polar bear in grizzly country, or a microcephalic Kodiak boar about to eat a cub with fish.
Otherwise nice rifle.

The bore is strongly rifled but otherwise so dirty and dusty I could not tell anything else.
Condition would be at least 70%, eh ?
How much of a deduction for the butt art ?

Riflecrank,
I'm no expert at all but I don't think that's a Deluxe model.

The checkering is wrong,there are no super grade sling swivels the swivel mounts are not correct no grip cap either.
I have a 1940 Deluxe also.
Cool 71 though.

Yup!

OK, I fixed it above, changed it to:

1940-year Model 71 Standard Rifle that has been Deluxified with
checkering on forearm and pistol grip, plus artwork on the right side of butt.

Still lacks the grip cap, and may have some variant kind of sling studs.









Standard Rifle priced like a Deluxe.

Great thread and pics of what I consider the "Holy Grail of American Hunting Rifles"!
The 71 is a deluxe in any form!

I paid $3000 for my 1940 Deluxe this past winter at a gun show I messed around for a good 40 minutes looking at it trying to justify spending that kind of my till my wife said just buy it you've wanted one forever,that's all it took to write the check.

Ditto. About time I got up to speed on the fraternal twin brother of the Winchester Model 70.

The long-tang/short-comb began to peter out in 1940, as parts inventories got used up and depleted during WWII.
Apparently Winchester had decided to start making the short tang by late 1937, but still had some long-tang receivers left over.
From 1935 to late 1937, both the Deluxe and Standard Rifles were all long-tang/short-comb:

"This is from serial number 1 through serial numbers c. 12,500, with a very few long tangs appearing as late as serial numbers c.17,000."
(pre-1941 for the last of the long-tang, pre-1942 for the better QA, though all are of same metallurgy)

After WW-II the Deluxe and Standard were all short-tang/long-comb,
and might not have been as carefully fitted and finished, on average, as the earlier rifles,
according to the below excerpt from here:

https://www.leverguns.com/articles/model71_info.htm

Winchester wanted the stocking and the strength of the stocking - I emphasize the latter, the strength of the stocking - to be absolutely right. They wanted the Model 71 to be built like a battleship (this was also the period of the ultimate battleships), but not to handle like a battleship. The original, "long tang" Model 71 was their first "go" at this. They wanted dampened recoil, excellent balance, and absolutely NO stock cracking!

From the first manufacture in late 1935 through late (September) 1937, the Model 71 was the "long tang, short comb" model. This is from serial number 1 through serial numbers c. 12,500, with a very few long tangs appearing as late as serial numbers c.17,000. Why the spread on the end date? It is because, as always with Winchester, available parts were used up to fill new orders. There is no clear, absolute cut-off point. The upper tangs of these earlier guns are 3 7/8" in length. The later (post-September, 1937) Model 71's have the "short tang, long comb" configuration. The tang is 1" shorter.

Collectors love the original "long tang, short comb" variation for at least two reasons. (1) It is the "rare" variation, and rarity affects collecting value. It is also the "original" variation. (2) The checkering, finish quality, wood-to-steel fit, etc. are all superior on these early rifles, when compared with the postwar (1945-1957) Model 71's. BUT, the superior "build quality" (factor 2) is NOT because these early rifles are "long tang, short comb" configuration rifles. It is because they are PRE-WAR rifles. The drop-off in build quality (which is not tremendous; the 1945-1957 Model 71's are still excellent rifles) takes place when production is resumed after World War II. You can see the transition in the (relatively) few rifles finished during the war (doubtless from existing parts). I believe that the magical moment in time passed, when many of the Winchester production people either did not come back after 1945 or returned to a different business & production climate.

I hope you are being patient with me, as I am only now coming to why Winchester changed to the "short tang, long comb" configuration.

This is my own view, based on handling many different Model 71's. You will see much "received wisdom"/uncritical praise for the original "long tang, short comb" version. I believe that is due to the better finish & attention to detail. I very humbly & respectfully DEFY anyone to shoot a long string with the short comb (necessitated by the vaunted long tang!), in comparison with the longer, second style comb, and tell me that the first version handles better. It doesn't - the end.

For the Winchester people in 1937, the handling of the Model 71 was everything. Why would you buy a 71 over a 70? The levergun handled better (especially when compared to a scoped 70); that's why. Fantastic handling was the 71's raison d'etre. So, when reports from the field came back on the original version of the stocking, the Winchester folk needed to make a choice. Do we really need that long tang to reinforce the neck, as was done on quality Purdey or Holland & Holland dangerous game double rifles? Or will the 71 work with a more conventional tang, so that we can put on a longer comb? In the result, they went with the latter, and, I believe, rightly so. Also, the "short rifle" (mistakenly termed "carbine") 20" version appeared in 1937 (and lasted only until 1947). Consider the appearance of that "short rifle" with a long tang & short comb. Ooooh! Aesthetics is at least something, after all.

Therefore, I said, that "the pick of the litter" on the Model 71's are those rifles (and "short rifles") made from 1937 through 1941. This group has the rifles with both the superior stock design and the superior pre-war finishing of wood, metal, fit, etc. I regard those rifles as absolutely the apogee of Winchester's big game lever rifles.

There are two very good analyses of the Model 71 that I highly recommend to you. You can still order them, as back issues or photocopies, from Wolfe Publications. Perhaps you already have the first: Ken Waters, "Classic Rifles: Winchester Model 71," in "Rifle," September-October, 1976, pages 51-53. Ken Waters (the model of what a gun writer should be!) includes in that article a very thorough discussion of the mechanical changes that make the Model 71 superior to the Model 1886. (In answer to your other question, there were, to my knowledge, no mechanical changes that accompanied the change-over from the "long tang, short comb" to the "short tang, long comb" c. September, 1937 and thereafter.

The second article is Jim Scott, "Model 71: Golden Jubilee Winchester," in "Rifle" also, May-June, 1974, pages 16-19 & 52-53. This second article has many very helpful photos (by Les Gard), which show the differences between the "long Tang, short comb" and "short tang, long comb" versions. Please remember, though, that all pre-war 71's are not "long tangs."

Imagine finding one of these safe queens at the local emporium: The short-barreled Standard Rifle

Winchester never catalogued a M71 Deluxe Rifle, it was catalogued as a M71 Special Rifle.

My "holy grail" right there!

I found that by "googling."
Already sold, for how much I do not know.
Best condition of any rifle from 1936 that I have googled so far.
The short barrel is supposed to add 150% to the value, according to Blue Book.
So, a Standard Rifle worth $2250 loses 4" of barrel and becomes a $5625 Short Rifle,
unless Bubba is the guy who chopped the barrel.
Provenance by Bubba.
Reminds me of the microcephalic Kodiak boar about to partake of surf & turf,
carved on the buttstock of a 1940 Standard Rifle.

And coming up, I found the greatest "Special Rifle" aka Deluxe Rifle for the money on the internet,
only $4995, a long-tang made in 1936 also,
like the Short Rifle above, that someone might have paid more for.
This M71 SPECIAL RIFLE is claimed to be in 95% condition, and includes the fold-down sight in the barrel dovetail, bolt peep,
front sight hood, and supposedly original sling and swivels.

Serial number 5581 at Schwandt Classic Arms, Schwandt, WI.
Good deal.
Others on the net are asking more for lesser rifles, epecially those with 4 inches less barrel.
Yesterday I did not know how to spell "expert," and now I are one, almost.
Blue Book says to "Add 30% to 40% for early variation long tang, depending on condition."
I gotta study up on that.
Blue Book I have says to "Add $250 for bolt peep sight."
Another book said to add 10% for the bolt peep sight.

I wonder why the fold-down rear sight... given the bolt peep is on it. Mine (1937) has a blank in that dovetail...

-Chris

I’m a fan of the 20” 71s!

Actually I’m kind of a fan of the 24” length too!

JSG
Factory matted barrel, that’s very special.

Special indeed ! More than just gilding the lilly like that fold-down buckhorn with bolt peep.

Tidbit from my googling:



And from the local emporium:



IIRC, my sole BACO/Miroku 20-incher has a rounded/radiused muzzle, the common sporter crown.
These M71 rifles are a nice craziness.

The transition from flat, uncrowned, in-the-white muzzles to the crowned and blued muzzle began in 1941 and continued through mid-year 1948.

Thanks Jack, it took me the better part of a decade to get it but it was worth the wait!

Beautiful rifles! It only took seconds of me handling an original long tang deluxe 71 about 10 years ago to fall in love with them. I’m about to get it’s cousin a Miroku 1886 extra light out of lay away. That 71 was so smooth, fit like a glove a swung like a light bird gun. Hope to one day pick one up to go with the 45/70 1886. John M Browning was one hell of a gun maker.

What happened to the crowns after 1948 ?

Bubba must have had his 1940 model crowned as part of his post-1941 deluxification package,
along with the buttstock carving, checkering and swivel base additions.
Not surprising since Bubba's crown looks crudely done.
Well, at least the rifle appears to have come with the bolt peep,
but that alone does not add 1K to the price, not to mention the deductions for Bubba's deluxification attempts.
Minus another 1K.
I would, however, pay $899.99 for the bubbafied 1940 Standard rifle with bolt peep.
No more than that !

Damn nice rifles Mossyoak and jsgwoodsman, what a collection.

Riflecrank, keeping an ear to the ground for a clean fair priced '71.

Gunner500:

Your rifle turned out beautifully!
I especially like the buttstock and touches of case color hardened finish.
I like seeing (although less and less often these days) older lever guns with the case color levers still vibrant.

I posted the incorrect date of mfg. of mine it was made in 1941

Mossyoak195,

Your 1941 Deluxe Rifle seems to be as good as it gets for $3000.
It is in the "sweet spot" of pre-WWII quality building that possesses the bolt peep as well as
the short tang/long comb that some would prefer for handling characteristics.
Don't try to convince a long tang collector.
However, the tangs started being shortened by one inch in late 1937 for some reason ...

Yep, never can have too many pre-'42 Winchester Model 71 rifles, except for the ones Bubba has gotten to.
Offer $2000 less than Bubba wants for those.

Ten Fo Sir Ron, i sure love the '71's.

Thanks JSG, i would have prefered mine to be untouched, but as BSA will tell us, that old rifle may have spent 40 years in a saddle scabbard, i was very happy my 'Smith was able to get rid of the small pits in the mag tube and barrel, will also admit to wanting to get a bit of his color case work, he brought that idea up, said ""you better get it on your mind son, i'm getting old and tired, hell, i don't even buy green bananas anymore!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7qgsPQmcZM

"you better get it on your mind son, i'm getting old and tired, hell, i don't even buy green bananas anymore!" grin

😂😂😂

Hell of a video G12, thanks, just drive straight through Canada with model 12's and 71's, shoot birds for the pot and a moose, what times those must have been, the world has largely gone to chit in the last 80 years.

He's a real dandy JSG.

i could watch that film over and over again Gunner

You bet Big G, good, good stuff gone forever, politicians and their greed on both sides of the border have insured that.

Very nice!

One of my favorite Rifles, and Caliber! The Winchester Model 71 , in 348! The Winchester 1886 is absolutely phenomenal, in all of it's Calibers, but the 71 is outstanding!

HS58, agreed, i have a couple original '86's in 40-65 and 45-70, they both run on home cast lead and blackpowder, just something xtra special about a '71 in 348 Winchester, working the lever alone will tell anyone paying attention all they need to know.

Great point! Boy those are some of the smoothest actions that I've ever experienced! Silk kinda comes to mind when I think about it. Matter of Fact, Hold my Scotch, I'm gonna go pull one out!

LOL! fine idea indeed, i just put my glass down to make another post, having 96 Drams of Famous Grouse tonight.

Mmmmmmmm!

Don't recollect that one! Gonna have to get up to speed on er!

J.B., Dewars, But My Absolute Favorite, is Chevits!(Chivas Regal)

Now, don't get me wrong A little Scotch on the Rocks, will Definitely, take the edge off.
A good friend of Mine used to give me a Bottle of 12 yr. old Glenlivit, every Christmas. It was good, don't get me wrong, but I favored the Chevets over it, so I'd share that with Company!
Always give Company the Best!!!

I did pull a 71 out last night! SMOOTH!

Yes, my favorites are 12 and 16 year Glenmorangie, awhile back a bud gave me a 1.75 liter of Famous Grouse, it is blended, but very smooth and reasonably priced, iirc around 33 bucks for a 1.75, the perfect everyday sipping scotch.

Shoulder sighting and working the lever of a '71 is the perfect way to end an evening.

That Famous Grouse is the best selling Scotch in Scotland!
Yeah, it won't be long and I'll be reporting back on what I think of it.
Just when I thought I had enough, of one thing, I found another! LOL!!!

LOL! Good to know HS58, gotta be a dna draw, you see, i'm scotch/irish crossbred with missouri osage injun, that's a free puppy bloodline, no way to paper trash like that!

Matter of fact, that's three pretty good reasons i dont need to be drinking anything ; ]

Lol! Yeah, I had a friend with some similar blood lines,(from Oklahoma originally), still a friend, just loose touch every now and then, but when he gets a taste, and he does like his tastes, it's like fire water to him! lol
Good guy, lot of fun! Loves his Tequila.
He gets lost every now and then, but he's due to show up I'm sure. Has a Big heart!

Pulled a 71 out tonight just to rub her down, and make sure she wasn't lonely!
They get that way when you don't give em the attention they deserve! lol!!!

I just recently picked up a '71. It is a '56 short tang deluxe with the Lyman steel sight. Very nice condition. It is all there with hood, swivels, butt plate, grip cap, and sight plug. Very pleased with this oldy but goodie. You are correct about just getting it out and holding it. It is so smooth to cycle.
Have a great day.
Jim

Can't let this sink. Mod 70's are special, but 71's are "The Holy Grail of All Guns!"

Dang, i missed these posts, Thanks Jim and Windknot, enjoy that new to you rifle Jim, and you bet Windknot, the 71's are in a class by themselves, a lot very special about them.

That rifle sure is beautiful buddy. I remember leaning it up against the corner in my shop, just to look at it. That was when it was old and patina looking, ha ha.. I'm the one that painted the ivory black, as the white stood out too much to me. Had to dull it down. Then my buddy, that also has a 71 told me about guys that placed ivory in their stocks like that to mark their rifles like a brand. I was not surprised to hear it was actually ivory. That is pretty cool. I think I told you, but I ran across another 71, just like this one, a few months ago. The guy wants $2,800.00 for it and it also has the original bolt peep. Its a 4 digit serial # rifle, making it a 1937 as well, I think. Its all original and beautiful. I dang near bought it, but like I told you when I sold this one, I can't hunt with it because of my left eye not being good. Might as well let it go to someone who can actually use it. I'm glad you are taking good care of this old rifle. It sure does look nice!!!

LOL, i sure appreciate you selling me that old '71 big Buddy, it'll never leave here as long as i'm above grass-line, old 'smith agreed on the 'Ranch Brand' deal ivory stock inlay, a '37 Special Rifle in top shape with long tang and bolt peep would be a fair deal at 2800, really special rifles.