First it was brass scarcity for our Model 71s, now quality bullets in .348 diameter are getting harder to find.
Part of this problem is due to manufacturers closing or discontinuing their bullets:
Hornady quietly discontinued their 200 gr FP bullet in .348. This was a reasonably priced go-to
bullet for hunting use in the Model 71. It worked well for deer -sized game and larger to include moose.

North Fork**, Woodleigh, and Alaska Bullet Works 230 and 250 gr bullets respectively- are no longer presently in business
or making their fine bullets. These covered a hunting range to include the big bears.

Currently, we have the following bullet makers and some smaller custom shops:
Barnes, Hawk and Swift. Smaller gun shops and dealers may have a supply of the discontinued or unavailable 348 bullets.
I have salted away .348 cartridges loaded with Kodiak, Barnes, North Fork, Woodleigh, and Hawk or Hornady bullets. No Swifts as yet.

North 61 in 2016 provided an in-depth quality review of the performance of most of these .348 bullets. It is discouraging to see Hornady discontinue
their series 3410-.200 gr 348 bullets. They discontinued these like they stopped making the .33 WCF 200 gr flat pt bullets for use in the 1886 Winchester.
That rifle was the predecessor to the Model 71 made by Winchester that is still in use today in some parts of Canada and Alaska-just like the M-71.

For we band of Model 71 aficionados, best acquire bullets and brass where and when you can.

** North Fork is now marketed under Reloading International-They have a USA office but are based in Sweden. The warehouse office in USA is in Pendleton, OR. and their site offer
200 and 230 gr .348 bullets. Be aware that their current prices are app. twice their original price per box. They also feature Swift bullets in .348 but list those as OUT OF STOCK**

450F said
North Fork, Woodleigh, and Alaska Bullet Works 230 and 250 gr bullets respectively- are no longer presently in business
or making their fine bullets. These covered a hunting range to include the big bears.

Did you not get the Memo on NF? Their machines are in Sweden making bullets and exporting them to America and other countries as of many months ago.

https://www.northforkbullets.com/

You can check and see if they have the bullets that you need.

However, it is possible that niche bullets will continue to be less available as demand drops off.

I watched Lever Guns 50-110 on You Tube sizing 180 grain Speer .358 bullets down to .348 with no apparent problems. I laid in a supply of the 220 grain FP .358 bullets a year ago and got the sizing die etc. I will try and resize that bullet to .348 size.

If you hear me cussing it didn't work!

Damn that is interesting. How many of you guys run cast bullets in your 71's. Is that a consideration? Someone with a lot of lead and time should start pumping those out and selling them? No?

Keep in mind that cast bullets do offer potential as target and fire-forming options. They are not particularly suited for hunting applications.
At higher velocities, gas checks are required to prevent leading in barrels.

Gas checks work fairly well in straight wall pistol cases and in rifle cases like the 38-55 and 45-70. In bottle neck cases like the .348,
another issue raises its head. If the gas check should become detached for ANY reason in the loaded cartridge, pressure excursions WILL occur.
Lever action rifles like the Model 71 Winchester and Browning DO NOT TOLERATE excess pressure well. (They are not bolt actions.) A word to the wise.

When I got my .348 maybe 15 years ago, I bought what I thought I'd need and not be left high and dry. Now, I don't see much even on Gunbroker anymore, other than brass. Occasionally some 200 Hornadys.

Sure glad i bought 4 boxes of the 250gr ABW Kodiaks from Karl, wish he was still alive for more reasons than just buying his bullets, real pleasant guy to talk with on the phone, if Woodleigh gets back up and running we're all set, guess i have around 150 rounds loaded with the old 250gr Barnes, they fly through deer and a pig like they're made of cardboard, kill pretty quick.

Even not having done so, i'd indeed hunt the great brown bears with the 250gr ABW or Woodleigh, if one is paying attention to his rifle, you can feel the HELL you are loosing when the trigger is pulled on the M-71 in 348 Winchester, no critter is going to survive that with a well placed shot.

Wise move. I still have some Kodiak 250 boxes left. Along with Heavy Hawks and 200 gr Hornady. Most of my good bullets are loaded in cartridges-in GI boxes-safe and secured.

There is a small Idaho company called Cutting Edge Bullets in Boise. Their bullets are $$$ except for a 200 gr offering, which is reasonable.
These bullets are somewhat like North Forks, like modified solids. Might be just the ticket for an irritated grizzly encountered on a moose hunt.

I obtained some 350 Sierra Pro Hunter RN bullets in .358 that I size down with an NOE push through sizer. Takes some significant effort. They shoot well enough for a plinking load and inside of say 75yds I would shoot them at medium game. For anything more than that I would take the 220gr. Barnes. I do have to say that I am thinking very hard if I should exchange my 71 for an 1886 just because of the ammo cost.

I’ve been looking at 71’s for a while. Bullet availability has held me back. This thread is interesting and informative….
One idea I had was to buy a 71 and have it re-bored to a caliber in which there are more available bullets.
Is it feasible to bore 348 to 358?

A couple years ago I laid in a supply of cast bullets from Montana Bullet Works and from Rim Rock Bullets. They look nice, haven't had time to try 'em yet, though...

-Chris

I had more bullets and brass than I needed but have given some up to help others get running. With items as scarce as they are for it, tough to give too much more up to make sure I don't end up short. Seems others who have them might be thinking the same thing.

I don't think it'd be too difficult to do a JES rebore to .358.

I just now did a web search there was a thread in the 24hourcampfire Alaska forum a couple years ago regarding 35-348 and 35-348AI. The guys posted - there were plenty of bullets. But I believe the number of available bullets has diminished since then.
I read an article stating that the 33 Winchester could be loaded to similar power as the 348, but that seems unlikely to me.

I own a couple of 1886 Winchesters in .33 WCF and load for them as factory ammunition is rare as collector's boxes.
The 338 Hornady FP is rarer than their .348 200 gr. Both are 200 gr bullets.
The nickel steel 1886 barrels and actions are tough, but these are 100 year old rifles that still do not use the
Winchester proof steel of 75 years ago. I limit my 33 WCF loading to about 2000-2100 FPS though the 86 can be pushed to 2400.

The best answer for the Model 71 in 348 is to probably order premium bullets from Hawk or Barnes-Swift for hunting. Possibly cast
lead without gas checks for fire-forming or practice with reduced loads.

Any re-bore will require new RCBS dies and the cost of the re-chamber and re-boring. Then there is the value
lost for re-sale > If its a 348 AI or 450 Alaskan, no problem: a 35 wildcat is another story.

Huntingdon's just got their last shipment in of 250gr Woodleighs. Might want to give them a call to see if they have any left.

I’ve found bullets and brass on-line after doing an internet search. I was a little surprised at the cost. I have not found reloading dies other than Lee. Lee would work, I suppose. I found a rifle and I think I could start shooting for about $2k all in.

Yessir, i even thought just for fun ordering a couple boxes of Hawk 0.035" jacket 270gr bullets, i could roll on a couple extra cannelures towards the base of the bullet thanks to the canneluring tool our friend here mstevenson sent me, send about 20 bullets up to Big Buddy beretzs for one of his water jug tests with pics! 10 with extra cannelures and 10 left as is and see which ones do best.

Never hurts to have backup plans in these component challenged times.

More added info on bullets:

Buffalo Arms now has no bullets in 33 WCF or .348 WCF-may not carry any beyond current out-of-stock.. If the situation continues to deteriorate, casting may be the partial answer.
Gunner got some 270 grain Hawks from me and believe he will like their performance.
Scouring the net may produce results for components and dies.

Cannot Recommend going for re-barreling to 35 caliber in search of bullets.

450Fuller, I still haven't even a 71 or 86 yet. But I've been itching for both in my last 5-6 years since retirement. Seems since then everything about diving in says no, no, big mistake, so much going against them! Don't need either but an 71 in 348 and 86 in 33wcf are 2 I'd sure like to have. Thanks to you, N61, and several more regulars on this subject keeping us informed cause interest in these, finest guns ever made in America, is lot more than the posts shows! I sure hope the supply market revives! 👍

Graf's got some Hornady and Starline 348 brass in stock.

They had some bullets recently too, but those look to have sold out already.

Been shooting 348 since 1976 have only shot one box of factory ammo back then have shot mostly Hornady's 200 gr. until I found Cutting Edge Bullets....I shoot 175 gr. Raptors....the only animal on Earth I wouldn't shoot with one is a elephant.....

Like I said I don't have a 348, but in my 30-30 I've went to Hawk totally. I was doing fine on whitetails with Rem CL and Win PP's. Then all this mess hit, and I hadn't stocked on either. Kept waiting and waiting thinking they would show up. Completely ran out, used some Sierras to get by. Finally decided to splurge, called on the phone Feb 2021. Said the 250 i ordered I should have by May. Had them by late March. Fine people to deal with and I'll gladly pay more for their bullets now. If I had a 33wcf or 348, no one else I would consider besides Hawk. But I don't deal with Grizzly or Cape Buffalo.

I am going to lock up my ABW .348 bullets with my gold bars and diamonds, etc.!

I picked up a winchester 71 last year and ended up getting some hornady ftx bullets off of gun broker. I haven't had a chance to load any up yet, but while I was looking at Hammer bullets i saw that they make a .348 157gr bullet. Here is the link.

https://hammerbullets.com/product/348-cal-162g-shock-hammer/

I haven't used any hammer bullets before but they seem to be fairly popular. Just thought I was pass the link along incase someone is in need of bullets.

LOL, i have around 100 rounds loaded with the old 250gr barnes bullet, 4 boxes of the ABW 250gr Kodiaks, the box of 270gr Hawks 450Fuller sent along with a 4 box order at Hawk for the 0.035" thick jacketed 270gr bullets, that should do my old Model 71 for as long as i can carry it in the woods to hunt, speaking of, it's going out this season.

Natchez had the 250 grain Barnes in stock Tuesday at $54 a box .

There's options to keep an 348 running. It's been mentioned that swaging down 35 cal bullets can work. Casting 348 bullets survey can work. Another real possibility would be to paper patch 338 250gr roundnose bullets. If paper patching 338 work that would be amazing and make all those boutique hard to find bullets obsolete. I'd wager the 338 bullet is pretty tough at 348 win velocities.

Ten boxes of bullets available here:

https://reloadinginternational.com/product_info.php?products_id=24577

Graf has Barnes original 348 bullets in stock (1145am cst 4/22)

https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/27635

Ammoseek listing 200 grain hornadys @ SSM ?

Are they legit ?

Ammo seek is not one source . It is a search engine for ammo so it depends on who they show having the ammo as to whether it is legitimate or not. It just points you to a site that claims to have what you are looking for.

Thanks for reply Ed , I was actually referring to SSM .

Appears legit , per UPS I will have delivery Friday , not a bad find they had a decent selection of hornady bullets , I had never heard of them but when I searched they came back as ok .

Ammo Seek is a handy search engine .

I just ordered 2 boxes. They have 3 left.

I just ordered some cast from Montana Bullet Works

MidwayUSA has bullets

Gas checks DID fall off quite often before crimp-on checks were first introduced in the 1950s. It's a moot point now.

I am not worried one ioda about .348cal jacketed bullet availability. I have the knowledge and skills to cast a lead bullet of the proper alloy to shoot accurately and kill impressively. Powdercoating lead cast bullets has been a remarkable break through in cast bullet shooting technology. I now cast my bullets with only pure lead and enough tin (20:1 ratio) to get good mould fill. The PC makes leading a thing of the past. Bullets cast this soft are deadly!

Someone else will soon offer 348 jacketed bullets. I'm testing them right now. Once I've been given approval I will advertise it.

Thanks, Dinny

The cast bullet loads by Ken Waters in his pet loads have the cast bullets close to the same velocity as the jacketed. I'm getting a 348, now I need a mold.

Thank you Dinny .I been casting since the 60's and haven't had any issues with losing gas checks either.

If there is any interest for Win .348 brass I have 500 rounds of Winchester unprimed brass in the original Winchester sealed plastic bags of 50 each. I am no longer able to shoot my M71 so I might as well sell the brass. Unfortunately at some point probably selling the rifle, too. Yeah, yeah, I know, a brand new member / poster but have been a long time lurker.....

Just send them to me for safe keeping.

I’m very interested. I’ll send a PM

I’m new so you might need to PM me

BMiller, was your post directed to me?

I might be interested in some of that brass.

It wouldn't hurt your credibility one bit if you would post your location. Lurking don't count.

Northeast Kansas

I might be interested in some of that brass...

A newcomer to 348 caliber bullet making is about to release these, 200gr and 220gr, bullets for purchase.

Both bullets were loaded using H4895 and exhibited good accuracy at the short range I tested them to ensure I'd make solid hits in the bullet box.

Today he sent me a text stating he's able to bond the 220gr bullets and use the same jacket as his 358 bullets. I hope to have some of those bonded bullets to test in the coming weeks.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...dy-348-and-speer-35-bullets#Post17349903

I'll post a link here and in the classifieds as soon as they hit his website.

Thanks, Dinny

Assuming you can't send or receive PMs, do you care to post an email address or phone number so we can work out the sales details?

Thanks, Dinny

So there is no price???

Everything has a price...

Apparently as a"new" member one is not allowed to engage in PM's?? I must have missed seeing that, I don't know. I emailed a website bigwig asking a question about this but have had zero response. At any rate, no I'm not willing to advertise my phone number or email out on an open public forum. The price would be $60 per 50 round bags. I have ten bags. Again, these are Winchester manufactured new unprimed brass in the original factory sealed bags. Sorry for the mixup.....

I will take 2 bags. Email me.

Dinny, I will email you later today sometime. Thanks.

So why don't you share the price. Oh just forget it!

Uh, the price is as stated: $60 per 50 round count bag.

Anyone interested in contacting KKDD50 for brass may send me a PM and I'll share his info. He can't PM yet but we spoke the other day and he checks out as "good guy".

Thanks, Dinny

I was lookig at videos of resizing a .358" down to .348" but cannot find the Lee resizing die...
No sense buying a Model 71 without bullets

Well, my love of old lever guns and this thread has now resulted in my owning a Winchester 71 Deulxe. 1941. As a side deal I picked up 25 cases, 2 boxes of the Hornady 200 JFP bullets, a few reloads, and a tray of WLR primers. Going to try loading IMR4064 and H4895 unless I can find some IMR4895.
I guess I now have cause to sell my Marlin 336ER

https://leeprecision.com/custom-classic-bullet-sizing-kit.html

https://leeprecision.com/bullet-szr-punch-.348.html


You didn't look hard enough. Here are links to both versions. I'd get the classic version.

When I looked on the Lee site they were out of stock.
I got 200 Hornady 200JFP with the gun so I am good for a while. Bu I do have several hundred of the Speer 180 JFP in .358" in case I decide to try the 180 grain loads over the standard 200 grain bullet.

Available: https://www.furycustombullets.com/shop-2/35-caliber/348-220-grain-flat-point-bonded-50-pack/

They are out of the Classic kit because the size is a custom order . That's why it is $50 . I would take them 8 weeks to get you one made according to their site . I might order one in .349 or .350 today and see . They have traditionally delivered faster on anything custom I have ordered than their original estimate. I have my dads Lee cast classic press so I might order one of the Breech Lock sets also if I can determine which body I need. I currently have plenty of bullets to last a good while but I ain't taking any chances . I shoot two .35 caliber cartridges so I have lots of bullets on hand and they are in stock way more often than .348 . Gonna get some of the Fury bullets also but they are not cheap. Can use the resized .358's for early stages of working up a load then finish with the more expensive premiums.

Just ordered 6 boxes.

May want to take a peak at Northern Precision. They have been around for a while though I have never used their product.

I have factory Remington and Winchester listed in the classifieds

Have laid in some extra 348 new W-W brass along with ABW bonded 250 gr bullets. Those Fury 220 gr bonded bullets might just
be the cat's meow as the weight is about perfect.
Don't forget Hawk in NJ-there heavy bullets work on game. Killed a large Alaskan moose with a 270 gr Hawk a few years back. This was in 270 gr Ackley Imp,
one heck of a cartridge in the Model 71.

One last piece of golden advice for handloading the .348 WCF: obtain a Lee factory crimp die for jacketed bullets. You will be glad you did.
The M-71 has a strong magazine spring. Bullets must stay in place, which the Lee FC die insures. ( Just got 3 boxes of 33 WCF from HAWK-1886 rifles.)


Khe Sanh-1971 5th Special Forces Gp(ABN) MACVSOG

I just acquired 3 (100ct) boxes of Hornady 200gr JFP bullets. PM me if interested. I certainly won't shoot them all now that I have loaded up all my extra brass with Fury 220s.

Thanks, Dinny

What powder are you loading your 220 Furys with ?.....How fast are you running them ? Just wondering ..........

Funny you should ask....I need to post up some data but just haven't taken the time.

I shot 200gr Hornady and 220 Fury into gallon water jugs to compare. 348 AI.


The Hornady impact velocity was 2,600 fps. Ended up in 4th jug. Ave dia .70". Retained 68%


Fury impact velocity was 2,450 fps. Ended up in 5th jug. Ave dia .53". Retained 57%. Could go faster with the Fury, but these were the first I loaded so went conservative. After seeing the results, would not push them faster for short range impacts.


So the Hornady impacted at 125 fps higher velocity, held a larger mushroom and retained more weight, vs the bonded Fury.

Go figure.

Not saying the Fury won't kill smaller stuff as well or better (a number of fragments captured in the jugs), but the devastation to the first couple of jugs was certainly more obvious from the faster and larger mushroomed Hornady.

Just based on this, I would keep the Fury 220 for deer. I have 250 ABW and Barnes for larger game. I have asked Fury if they will do a 250gr. They said "maybe". I am going to recommend they thicken the jackets, and if they are not pure copper, perhaps make them a little more malleable. They seem to shatter.

Also just for grins, did a 150gr Woodleigh from the 30-30. Impact velocity 2,500. 4 jugs, dia .675 weight retention 91%. It was perfect.

Sorry about the pic orientation. I am an old Luddite - that's my story and I am sticking to it.

I was using IMR 4350, but the load date is specific to my Ackley improved...so not really interested in putting it out there in the public forum. PM if you want specifics.


Tim

EDIT: I had the chronograph screens a few feet in front of the jugs....so velocities are actual impact.

I did load up a few more 220gr Fury at a little lower velocity to see how they will do in the jug test.

If I can get that ruptured hydraulic hose replaced and enough dirt moved, I might have time to play in the water tomorrow. lol

These early reports lead me to think the 220 grain Fury will work well on deer and lung shot elk. I have never used my .348 AI, but have a bunch of heavy jacketed 250 grain bullets from the long gone Alaska Bullet Works company that I got to use on Alaskan moose and bears.

Should hit like a heavy loaded .35 Whelen and the super bonded ABW bullet has a reputation for high weight retention and deep penetration, that's a good thing.

It sure seems that for whitetails, the Hornady 200 is the way to go.

I am still shocked that the Hornady hit the jugs at 150fps faster than the Fury, yet still retained 68% vs the Fury at 57%!

The Hornady 200s are a FINE bullet in the 348. Our own North61 flattened a very nice moose at close to 200 yards with one shot with that bullet and the recovered pill held together really well.

Agreed!

I am sitting on a little over 800 of them, and would not sell them for a dollar each.

I sure wish they would bring them back.

When I acquired my Browning 348, I found some Hornady 200 grain bullets. But I found more Barnes 220 grain bullets. It seemed wise to me that the load development would be with the Barnes. I lucked onto a good combination right away. With iron sights I was getting 1” groups at 50 Meters, that’s good for me and my old eyes.
I loaded up 40. I hope to shoot a doe with it this fall. I’m also taking a 35 Remington Marlin and a Mauser 98 375 Whelen AI, all with iron sights. The 375 will be shooting 235 grain SPEER’s and the 336 will be shooting 200 grain Interlocks. The GF&P’s allowed more doe tags for this area so I have four tags. I’ll be giving away most of the meat to some one I know who will put it to good use - he often gets extra mouths - from the reservation - to feed.

Here’s what a gas check load at 50 meters can do. My 71 has an aperture rear sight and factory front sight.

Bugger would you happen to know the speed you pushing them 200 grainers ?

My chronograph is a magnettospeed and I am not knowledgeable on how to make it work with tube feed rifles, darn it. (Yeh, I know Dirt Farmer and MDhave a set up to do such a thing with their magnetospeed chronographs.)I wish I had bought the Labradar unit. However, a fellow member sent me a spreadsheet with this load on it:

Bullet Make Powder Charge wt. Load Density Case Primer OAL Ave. S.D. Eff. fps/gr. Accuracy Source


RCBS 348-200 H 4198 27.0 42% Win CCI 250 1,721 63.74 100yds. 1.5" Big Bore Rifles and Cartridges / Wolfe


So according to this the velocity is close to 1,721 fps

Thanks Bugger

I have about 800 Hornady bullets laid away both FTX and FN. While I think they are good up to moose I have some 230 grain Northforks on order. In my mind the 250's are a bit slow at moderate pressures. Really interested to try the 230's.

Are those the current manufacture Northfork, or from before the sale?

I Sent an email to Hawk about a trial pack of their 180 grain fjp. No response

Dennis at Fury caters to 95+% of his customer base who are lower 48 deer hunters. He is very busy but may have time to do a special order run of 348cal 220gr bullets with a harder core alloy and/or a thicker jacket. I wish I lived closer to him so I could learn the trade and do some short runs for him.

He did say he might consider doing a run of 250gr for guys who want bullets for stuff larger than whitetails.

I have a 24" Ackley, so I think the 250gr are a little more useful than they might be in a 20" factory .348.

Not desperate though...I do have three boxes of ABW 250gr bonded...if I ever get to do that dream Moose hunt.