What is the effective range of the 7mm Rem Mag for elk? Also any bullet weight advice for this caliber. Thanks

Effective range is whatever your effective range is. You can't strech range if you can't shoot. Your practice range and the amount of practice is what will determine the effecitive range of any caliber. There is nothing that will work if you don't make it. HAPPY HUNTING

Everyone has there own criteria,

My minimum is 2,000 fps of striking velocity.

http://www.biggameinfo.com/

Skyline, this is a controversial question on any forum.

I've only taken one elk with a 7mm Mag, and that was a broadside shot at about 250yds. I managed to get three shots off before he folded. All through the lungs.

How far would you be able to kill an elk with a decent shot? Maybe 450-500 yds under ideal conditions.

I would not likely shoot an elk past 300-350 yds myself with any rifle, but a 7mm Mag with a 160-175gr bullet will kill one about as far out as anything you would want to shoot one with.

Depends on the bullet.Wouldn't think twice about elk hunting with a 120 TSX from a 7 Rem mag or a WBY,STW ect.As for range it's up to the hunter I suppose.

Don't know much about elk, but JBM shows a 140 XLC started at 3,250 should be still be clocking nearly 1,800fps at 800 yards. Same for a 160 Accubond with a 3,100 MV. I kinda doubt an elk would just shrug off a hit from either.

Speer 160g Grand slams were my bullet for 20 years, running about 2900fps at the muzzle. The longest shot I ever took was 350 yards and the 5x6 bull dropped at the shot. The bullet exited.

How far a 7mm RM is good for depends on a lot of factors and what you want from them: retained velocity, retained energy, maximum drop, etc. For myself, the drop problem was the determining factor for many years.

Pushing a 160g TSX to 3015fps and zeroing for a maximum 3" rise gives me 500 yards: 2181ps, 1690fpe, -31".

Skyline-I have taken and seen taken and been around a fair handfull of elk taken in the 500-650 (using Sierra's, NBT's, NPT's and TSX's, and Hornday's in particular) range and I've never found the big 7's or the 270 to be lacking for this work.

People will run out of ability way b4 the round will make no doubt about it.

In terms of good bullets there is about no end of them anymore for the big 7's and many other cals.

Good luck on your elk hunting.

Dober

About the same for 75% of the other popular cartridges out there.........

Depends on the bullet you choose. I would prefer something in the 150 or 160.


Casey

Know of 2 bulls killed by fellow highpower competitors, 7RM, 140 x bullets, both between 600 and 700 yards.

Gotta know what you are doing though, I suspect for most folks, regardless the caliber, its 200 yards or less.

Jeff

I agree 100%. Just because you have the tool that can do the job, doesn't mean you can. Most often, the shooter is the weak link in making a good shot at distances over about 300 yards. Unfortunately too many will just take pot shots anyway and end up with a wounded and lost animal. Know your rifle and the ballistics of the ammo you will be taking. Put some time behind the gun and not from the bench, from positions you expect to be taking a shot from in the field. And finally, make sure you have good shooting technique such as breathing, trigger squeeze and sight picture to name a few. When you practice, don't be afraid to get a recoil pad such as this PAST. It will allow you to practice with out developing bad habits due to recoil (esp when shooting a fair amount of rounds).

As usual Dober hits the mark.

You are starting with a question which is, at best, about 4 down on the list one should be addressing.

For me personally, as far as it is to the gun store door. I don't like 7mm Mags - except there was that one Husquavarna......and I know where it lives...

Anything a 7 Mag can do for all practical purposes, an '06 can do just as well, and a 300 mag will do it better.

But to each his own.... Just answer the following questions:

1. How well can the rifle in question shoot ( benchrest)? 2 inch groups are generally sufficient for most hunters, 3 inches are just acceptable - they can generally be improved on with glass-bedding and a trigger job. Circa 1 inch or less is pure gravy.
2. How well can the shooter shoot (various field positions, with and without rests)?
3. What's the range- how well can the shooter estimate? - better yet- does he have a range-finder and the time to use it when the game is "out there"?

Been a pile of game killed by sighting in the rifle (any reasonable caliber) at 2.5 to 3 inches high at 100 (assuming decent 2" or less groups), getting a good rest when crunch time comes, and taking the shot when offered. Believe me- a 300 yard distant animal is a LONG ways away, but it is still virtually a point-blank shot ballistically for the rifle if above conditions are met. Just hold on hair, but slightly high when way out there. The ballistics of the particular rifle are the least of your worries- though you need to know them- when shooting way out there.

Accurate ranging is paramount beyond 300 yards, as your bullets are dropping like a rock out there past 300 yards or so, with any caliber. Still perfectly capable of clean kills- the major problem is getting the bullet where it need go! Hence the accurate ranging via range-finders. Your eyes just aren't equal to a good laser rangefindere - and 20 yards makes a difference beyond 300 yards or so.

Yepper.

I agree with what everyone else has said... BUT.. Lets say the shooter is up to the task, and he has a MOA gun with a range finder. A good rest, lots of practice, and not much wind. To me, the 7MM is a true 500+ yard elk gun. With a good brodside shot on an animal that isn't moving it could easily take an elk at 600+ yards. I'm not going to get into the ethics, but IMO, If the shooter is up to the task, the 7mm will easily take an elk a long, long way out.

For me 250-300 is a long long shot...I suppose my rifle might be
good for longer but where I go it is awfully windy and at high
altitude and my judgement of range is not the best...so I would
probably opt for creeping closer some way some how...I don;t want to just hit him...I want a bang-flop if possible...

skyline,

The first elk I killed was a ranged 400 yards. I had a perfect rest. The 160 Nosler Partition made a six inch bruise on the way in and a three inch bruise on the way out. The muzzle velocity averaged 3,150 fps. I recovered a 160 Partition once and it weighed about 100 grains. So I switched to a 7 RUM and 120 TTSXs. I picked up about 600 fps. One can see the very noticable difference in time of flight.

How much energy do you guys like to have when said bullet arrives to elk? Myself I like to have around 1400 to 1500 pounds of energy.

Iv killed a lot of elk over the years and killed a lot that had someone else�s bullet stuck on the shoulder were the bullet failed to penetrate.

When shooting long range things happen and you need to have enough energy to get through the heavy shoulders.

So I would say for me the 7mm or any other cartrage will work fine but I would really look at were the energy starts to drop below 1400 lbs and really make sure everything is prefect before going too much below 1400 lbs but that�s just me�

Absolutely it is!

Dober

I've said this before. There are three guys over 60 in my elk camp. Between the three of them they have taken over 100 bulls. All three of them shoot and swear by the 7mm Rem Mag.

Warren Page and Bob Hagel proved many times over the lethality of 7mm mags, especially the 7MM Mashburn Super Magnum (one for you Dober). They killed tons of game all over the world.

There aint no magic cartridge. If you are concerned that the cartridge could be your limiting factor, that demonstrates that you are not competent to shoot at that range.
Anyone competent to shoot at extreme ranges knows what the limiting factors are.

Hey Sam now you're talking our language about the 7 Mashburn Super! Mines on the bench right now and needs a new barrel b4 it gets back into the game...

Dober

What bullet do they run in their 7's?

It'll kill 'em at a range longer than a "sportsman" should be shooting them.

Last year two were using 160 Partitions and one was using 160 TSX in the Federal Premium line. None of them reload.

Bear-are the fellas hunting on their own or outfitted? Also have you gone with them?

Thx
Dober

They always hunt on their own. Never been on an outfitted hunt in their lives. I have been hunting with them for 9 years now. I have learned plenty from these master elk hunters. One guy is 72 and I cannot keep up with him. He walks about 5 miles every day in the mountains to keep in shape. When elk hunting he might cover 10 miles or more in a day! Since they are locals, they have a good idea when and where the elk will be. For me, it's like going on a guided hunt for free.

Was at the range last weekend with a couple new .30-06s, a Savage 111 and a Remington M700. A few rounds to sight in at 100 and then it was off to plink the 500-yard steel. Far more hits than misses and from what I could see, with the exception of 1 round that was using a heavier bullet, all the misses were still in the kill zone.

At that range I'd rather use my 7mm RM but either will suffice. I agree with Dobr - the shooters generally fall short sooner than the cartridges do.

350 yards is plenty far if you have to ask.

Can you really shoot that far, in the field?

What bullet did they use, I don't know about Hagel but Warren page liked the 175 grain Nosler which back then was a semi spitzer design.

Rick-Bob (Hagel) used both the 175 in a semi and the 160 in the spitzer. I sort of got the opinion from him that for longer ranges he preferred the 160's.

I've shot a fair amount of game with both the 160 NPT and the 175 Semi NPT and they both work wonderfully! One of the most dramatic kills I ever saw was on a nice whitey I took with the 175 semi, wish I'd of had it on tape!

Dober

It'll take flies off the cement wall at the Clampett Mansion.

How much further would you need than that?

Ooooh doggy, and Granny's rhumatism medicine will peal the paint off the ce-ment walls too.

A guy I talked to who used to guide in Hells Canyon, where DRT kills "would be nice" to say the least, said that the 175 Partition from a 7-mag was their least favorite bullet for a client to be shooting at elk. They'd give that client to one of the new, young guides. Rodeo's (long tracking job, difficult retrievals) often ensued according to this gentleman.

Dunno.

-jeff

Jeff- I be the guide liked the 300's and perhaps the 06.

I've done a fair bit of guiding and this much I've learned. A lot of guides while being very game and country savvy are about clueless when it comes to rounds/ballistics/bullets etc.

Whenever I meet and or hear a guide say these kinds of things I quickly size them up for what they are....and it normally aint good!

The big 7's with a 175 NPT is one of the best pure plain killing machines ever made, periodo!

I'll only add that the idea of giving the guys with said combo to the new guides is an interesting move as well. Most of the new guides/young guides just don't have the savvy about people to be truly good guides. They don't put their client in a postition to win. A guides duties is to find the game and to be able to judge a clients ability (in many ways from physical to mental) and get them within sure fire 1 shot kill range of the game.

Dober

Surely you must admit that your attempt to steer folks away from the 175 Partition is based on zero experience with it yourself, and the "rodeos" could be explained by poor shot placement just as easily.

Get back to us when you "doono"....

That guide was full of [bleep]! Most guides don't know squat about ballistics. Probably had a couple of poor shot clients with 7mm mags, now all 7mm mags suck

The 175's in any 7mm mag will kill anything that walks, or crawls. Warren Page proved that, and so did Bob Hagel.

Les Bowman, one of the best elk guides of all time, prefered the 7mm mag to all others.

I wouldn't be too surprised if the guide in this instance isn't ol' dogzapper himself... IIRC he's made similar statements in the past. Besides, JO's been talking about the Hell's Canyon thing, conversations with DZ, and hunting with just two rifles for some time now...

I don't say this to be rude, just a point of fact. As others have said, if you have to ask than you probably should not be shooting much over 200-250 yards. Keep in mind "Most" hunters will run out of skill long before that 7mm Mag will.

I say this as a seasoned hunter with limited time to shoot a lot myself. For me 300 is a long poke, but do-able, even then I would just as soon get closer!

The rodeos I've seen with elk have not been associated with calibers or bullets, but have been directly attributable to bum shots.I have never used the 175 partition myself on elk, but suspect that any difficulties with it would be due to the fact that it did not land in the right place....

Same sort of idea, but 1400 foot pounds of energy or more, at the distance in question, eliminates wannabe elk rifles without attacking anyone's pet cartridge.

Wayne

In 1985 I witnessed a guy shoot a bull moose at 700m 0r 770yds. He used a sling and the window frame of his truck to make the shot. it was a 7mag but i do not know the load or bullet. At the shot nothing happened for about 5seconds then the bull put his head down ,turned and dropped.

turrets obviously, right?

Dober

Castandblast, calm the heck down. This isn't your party any more than it's mine.

I'd use the 175 Partition in a heartbeat. I was reporting something reported to me by a source I respect, as a point of interest. Nothing more, nothing less. I made that plenty clear.

-jeff

Until you've killed at least one elk, I could care less what you believe might work on them based on hearsay and Field and Stream. Same with Dall Sheep, and I'm plenty calm, thanks!

There's not one guy here who hasn't heard somebody with experience that they respect voice an opinion on such matters, the idea is to get that voice on here first-hand, not be their fill in. As in this example, it often backfires.

And I'm not interested in being lectured by someone who thinks they are the Kampfire Kop.

Talking about someone's else's first-hand experience is perfectly reasonable, as long as it's disclosed for what it is. That allows people to weight it appropriatly. As anyone without a chip on their shoulder could easily do here.

You got something even reasonably on-topic to add, or is this just all about attacking me? Again?

-jeff

Are you serious? Dogzapper didn't even get to decide how to present it so that it makes sense, or whether he wants it to be public info. Why didn't YOU weigh it appropriately and realize that it was predictably going to draw fire since it doesn't make sense to say that the 175gr 7mm is junk when the 180gr 30cal partition is a proven elk slayer? (I'd be astounded if DZ believes that anyway!)

As long as you are OK putting words in Dogzapper's mouth that have since been disputed by some experienced people here, go for it. It is highly likely that you failed to comprehend his meaning. I'm sure he is too nice of a guy to tell you to knock it off, but I think you owe him an apology.

I'm baffled! Why would you even give advice at all on a thread where you have never used the cartridge or killed the game asked about? We need to get back to the old "Experince trumps all" rule here. The whole problem never happens if you stick to your own experience, does it? Try it some time!

Can't speak directly about the 175g bullets, but...

My elk hunting mentor and most of his party used 7mm Rem Mags. They had been hunting Colorado elk for many years and they convinced me to get one as well. That was 1982.

The bullet weight they recommended was 160/162 grains. That bullet weight had worked for them and for the next 20+ years it worked for me as well. It also worked for the last decade for my hunting buddy. In the camps I've been in the 7mm RM/160g failure rate (lost elk, hard tracking, etc.) is exactly ONE and that animal was recovered the next morning. (It was neck shot by my hunting buddy, went about 120 yards and was recovered the next morning. It was NOT a problem with the bullet but rather placement.) Many animals have dropped in their tracks or taken only a couple steps. I can think of two that went about 40 yards (which I considered a long ways) and only one that went further (the one my buddy neck shot).

Given the proven efficiency of the 7mmRM with 160's, (and my experience with a .30-06 with 165's and a .300WM with 180's) all I can say about the 7mm RM with 175's somehow being inadequate is:

BS

Coyote:Emphasis is noted.... TF!

'Yote Hunter - I like your emphasis! That long 175 Partition at a bit over 2900 fps mv sure worked out well on my elk hunt a few years ago! Complete penetration, through and through. Dead elk in between, in short order. I've got a lot of faith in the combo.

Dunno what the max effective range is. I'd imagine 600+ yards based on good retained downrange velocity.

Regards, Guy

I've never killed an elk or shot a 7ReMag that I can recall. However, I have seen animals as big and bigger than elk shot with various other cartridges at ranges, altitudes, and temperatures which did not provide the right conditions for proper bullet performance.

I would expect that knowing where the chosen bullet runs out of adequate steam to work as desired - presumably to both penetrate, and, through expansion, to also create a reasonable wound channel- would be a minimum expectation, or maximum distance.

However, the most obvious criteria to consider first is whether the shooter's skill level is adequate not only to place a first shot properly, but also to be able to connect with a high degree of probability on second or third shots when the animal may be less cooperative. A minimal hole ideally placed is a pretty paltry expectation - not that that is being voiced here by any particular individual.

Since I hate long drawn out tracking jobs, I usually keep my shots to 300 yards with any caliber...I have shot elk at long distances but its a poor practice I assure you...

I killed a bull this past fall at a lazered 433 yards. 160 Accubond went in and took out the heart and then left a nice 1 1/4" hole on the way out. Elk went down within 10 yards.

Two years ago I killed a large cow at a lazered 380+ yards. 160 grain Accubond went in the on shoulder, jellied both lungs and took out the top of the off leg bone on its way out. Game over!

Killed a "normal" sized cow at a lazered 200 yards this past winter. Quartering towards me shot, 160 grain Accubond cut right through the on shoulder jellied the insides and never exited. Did the gutless method and never dug around for the spent bullet. The cow turned and walked about 50 yards before falling over. I didn't find a single drop of blood on that one in at least 12" of new snow. She was deader than a door knob though.

I won't hesitate to take the "right" shot out to 500 yards with my rifle and the 160 Accubond combo. I practice out to 537 yards at my local range. Great combo for me and I KNOW that the bullet will do its job if I do mine.

As Atkinson suggested, long drawn out tracking jobs are less than fun. I won't take that long shot unless the conditions are right and never at a Quartering animal after my "lack of blood" experience this past winter. At 200 yards, it was fairly easy to keep track of where she was. At 500 yards that could be a totally different situation.

Firehawk

Ray, if only you had added that "for you and your abilities it was a poor practice" I would totally agree as a man has to know his limits and stick to them.

But as a rule for others to follow, no thanks I know way too many capable of doing wonderful things on elk past 300 to concur with that.

Dober

Well, I have put a few Elk in the freezer via the 175 grain bullet. Nosler or Hornady out of the ole 7 mag.
It will put a hole in a Elk from a long way out.
It works.
HD

The 7mm Remington Magnum is, IMHO, tied with the '06 for the best all-around cartridge for the average North American hunter. Although I'm a big fan of the medium bores for larger game species, the 7 Mag performs very well and with much less recoil (30-06 levels--I can't tell the difference in the real world).

I've taken, and seen taken, many elk and other large game with the 7 Mag and both 160 gr and 175 gr bullets of various brands. Although I favor the 160'ish boat-tails for an all-around loading, the 175 gr Nosler Partition is pure poison on big bull elk, moose and bear.

In regards to the effective range of the 7mm Remington Magnum, I think it boils down to the individual shooter more than anything. The 7 Mag with a 160 gr boat-tail has the trajectory and energy numbers to easily dispatch an elk at over 400 yards (if the shooter does his/her part). The furthest shot I've personally taken on a bull with the 7 Mag was 420 yards (with the 175 gr load). The bullet broke the far shoulder when exiting and the bull took two or three stuttering steps and piled up.

It's a great, easy-to-shoot cartridge and any of the good 160s to 175s will do a number on elk out to about as far as one ought to be shootin'.

Wild Bill: Welcome to the Campfire and because you and I agree, I will say "Great Post" and +3!

About the same as my '06, give or take a couple of feet.

Thanks for the welcome, Bob. It seems that I'm far too busy these days to do much in the way of posting, but I truly like these forums and plan to hang my hat here for a while.

Max eff range for a 7RM?

The max range you personally are accurate and confident enough to effectively shoot one with the proper bullet and proper conditions.

I'm very confident to 400 yards and could hit one farther, but limit myself to 400 yards. 400 yards is a good distance and one you should be able to stalk within.

I shot a 6x6 twice at 325 with a 7RM loaded with 160 NABs at 3080 MV. First shot through the lungs leaving a 1/2 dollar size exit, bull just stood there. Second shot into the top of the shoulder, bang-flop.

Good Luck

Reloader7RM