I am considering picking up a 325 WSM as my newest Big Game rifle. I now have 8 bonus points for Limited Entry Elk in Utah and was thinking that I would purchase the rifle when I draw for certain, but possibly this year even if I don't draw.

So....I wonder how the accuracy has been with the 325s you all have experience with? Admittedly, I am an accuracy "snob" if you will and expect 1" or under 5 shot groups from the bench at 100 yards. My 7mm Rem Mag and 7mm-08 have both done terrific at delivering the needed accuracy with the proper handloads.

I am attracted to the Browning A bolts and also the Winchester Model 70s (both my 7 mag and 08 are model 70s), but the Kimber also looks really nice, but maybe a little too pricey.

So, how do they shoot? What do you wish they did differently? Pros and cons? I am ready to hear your responses and experiences.

Thanks!
Firehawk

FH, I have two of 'em, in the form of a Browning BLR and a Kimber Montana. The BLR is a consistant 1.25 moa rifle, and the Kimber shoots into the .7's with several different loads. I think the caliber itself is plenty accurate; your worry is more the luck of the draw as far the individual rifle YOU get.

I killed a buck and two elk with my Kimber this year. It killed the elk VERY decisivly with 200-gn Accubonds. I screwed up and shot the deer right through the hip joint ball at 40 yards and the bullet ended up under the bucks chin.

8mm bullet selection is adequate but not great.

Recoil is between my '06 and my .338, as you'd expect.

I think it's a wonderful caliber. Go for it!!

Jeff, I have been thinking about getting a 325 WSM.
How much FPS do you lose with the shorter barrel BLR ?

My Montana 325wsm shoots under moa with 180gr TSX and 200gr TSX. With 200gr Accubonds its shoots over a inch.....
180gr TSX @ 3100fps with RL19
200gr TSX @ 2950fps with H4350

The bad part of the 325wsm is that the 8mm bullet ballistic coefficient are not that great....

Would be a hell of a good lightweight elk gun 500yds and in....

The 325 needs a good 215/220 grain to put me in it's camp.

I load the 300 WSM/180's at 3,000 and 200's at 2,980. Higher BC bullets if that matters.

So what does a 325 offer over the 300 WSM?

I see Browning offers a takedown BLR in Stainless Steel in the 325WSM.
The 325 offers bullet diameter over the 300. Plus it gets a 200 grain bullet to nearly 3000 fps.

What does the 300 offer, besides infinite bullet selection?

I'm always amazed at how less bullet diameter gain in other places is a good thing yet means nothing for 8mm bullets over smaller diameters. I'm amazed that with Barnes TSX, Nosler partition, ballisitc tips and Accubonds, GS customs, Hornady interlocks, and other's available the 8mm is claimed to have "no bullet selection".

I have a Winchester Featherweight in 325 WSM that shoots 200 grain Nosler Partitions into 0.5 inch consistently with several different powders. It has harvested moose and elk so far with the 200 grain Partition and done so with authority. It shoots 220 grain Sierra BT into sub-MOA groups, as it does with 220 grain Swift AF, 200 grain TSX and 200 grain XLC. I have not worked up a load with the 180 grain TSX as my 300 WSM shoots a 180 grain quite well.

I think the calibre is a winner. Is it better than a 300 WSM? Probably not, but it is another calibre with which to play. It does offer more frontal section on big game, but that is probably not significant. It does not necessarily offer more velocity than you will obtain with similar weight bullets in .308, neither is the SD or BC sufficient to merit jettisoning the 300 for the 325. Ultimately, it is simply a new calibre with which to harvest game.

Fire Hawk- while I've never worked with a 325 WSM I have done a fair bit of work with a 338 WSM. Good rounds and totally capable of whatever you need done out to fairly long range (IE 500-600).

I'd have one in the stable in a heart beat if it turned my crank and if I had the need/want.

As for what it'll do that the 300 short will do and or vice versa. Well, I see it as I could micro manange points in favor of either one. But at the end of the day I want a rifle to be set to at least 500 yds and for me to do that I need a scope with either turrets and or my favorite dotz.

IME dotz and or turrets take out the this one is better than that one and either one is a darn fine round.

I see a 180 out of a 300 pushed to 2950 as a wonderful load as well I see a 200 out of a 325 pushed to 2900 as a wonderful load. Either one is incredibly capable if we are.

Bottom line, good luck in drawing that darn tag as that's a lot more important than any of this ballistic gack...

Dober

Dober,

Agreed on drawing the tag. I think what got me thinking about it a little sooner is that I saw a "used" Abolt Stainless with composite stock lying in the gun store the other day for $495. I almost pulled the "trigger" on purchasing it, but decided I would really want to find out how they are performing first.

I am sorely tempted just to pick up a .338 Winchester Mag and be done with it, but I love the idea of a shorter more compact rifle for toting in the steep and nasty.

SU35 asked what advantage the 325 has over the 300 WSM. My response to that is that the 300 WSM is not a huge difference better than my 7mag. The 325 seems like a likely step up in performance and still get a lighter and more compact rifle. I recognize that "light" sometimes comes with its own problems. Recoil in particular as well as the tendancy of lighter barrels to be a little less accurate (so they say, no experience personally with that, so maybe I am a bit unfair).

Anyway, I have been intrigued by the 325 WSM for quite some time and would seem to offer an improved advantage over the 7mm Mag I currently use. That said, I KNOW where that bullet is going from my 7mm so that is why I ask about the accuracy of the WSM. If I could get the groups Dr. Mike refers to, I would be a very happy camper.

Anyway, the biggest issue is drawing that dogon LE Bull Elk tag. But I wouldn't want to have a brand new rifle on a dream elk hunt. So I better get it soon enough to practice a little maybe even on a cow elk or two ;>)

Firehawk

Uh... I should know that, but I kind of stopped setting my chrony up because it was messing with my head! I don't remember ever shooting the two rifles over it at the same time, which would be the real test because reported velocities do seem to vary a little from setup to setup, with my chrony.

ANYWAY, that said, it's certainly not more than 50 fps difference, if that.

-jeff

Good discussion....

I believe the 300 WSM to be the practical choice.

The .325 is a little more powerful than the .300 WSM, and has a little more bullet. The SD and BC of the .30's is generally superior, though I have found the 200-gn Partition and especially Accubond to fly PLENTY flat.

There's no wrong choice; the 300 WSM is more practical while the .325 WSM is more... I dunno... fun?

Both WSM's kill the same Jeff just wish the 325 offered a premium 220 and 240 or 250 bullet.

So....should I just not worry about it and go after my elk with the 7mm Rem Mag and save the money to buy a youth shotgun for my almost 10 year old twin boy and girl?

I honestly have a hard time telling much difference between what a 7mm bullet will do versus a 30 cal. If you can't tell much difference between a 325 and 300 maybe I should not even worry about it and leave well enough alone. I have killed two cow elk and one spike bull with my 7mm and 160 Accubonds. Just thought I might like a little larger frontal diameter to create more initial shock and "knockdown" if there is such a thing.

Firehawk

Stick with your 'proven' 7mm...maybe play with 175 partitions for fun or even experiment with the 168 Berger VLD.

Or buy a 338 Ruger Compact Magnum and try to keep it from going extinct before it proves itself....

That little Ruger Compact Magnum has me intrigued as well. I read an article in one of the rifle magazines that suggested the accuracy was not what I would want. Seems that they were getting 100 yard groups in the neighborhood of 1 3/4" and larger. But....then again, I hadn't developed a load and floated the barrel and possibly even adjusted the trigger pull on that rifle either.

Anyway, does anyone have any experience with the 338 RCM?

I hear ya, though 240's would knock the SNOT out of me with my Kimber <g>.

However... I'm pretty certain there's a 220-gn Aframe. That's gonna leave a mark. And for that matter one has to think that the 200-gn TSX is going to penetrate, if nothing else <g>.

To the original poster: I wish I could say I've killed 25 elk with a 7mm and 25 with a .325, and give you a meaningful idea of whether it does or doesn't possess more "oomph" than your big 7. All I can say is that my .325 was very decisive on two good-sized elk this year; a huge cow and a raghorn bull.

Blabbing on a bit... to ME, the whole reason to own, say, a .325 WSM is for the nifty rifles available. My Kimber is a whole other animal than ANY 7mm mag. I'm kind of a rifle kook and perhaps get hung up too much on things like light weight, balance, etc but for the length and weight and "sprite", there is nothing (in my experience) that touches a .325 WSM Montana for killing power/ease of use ratio! Except perhaps a 300 WSM Montana <g>. Likewise, my .325 BLR is a pretty unique package. So that's about the only semi-rational reason to go with a WSM in my opinion- the rifles.

I agree, Jeff; the Kimber Montana and the 325WSM make a great team!

We gotta keep Fire Hawk on the hook here; he's nibbling but seems to be drifting away from the Mighty .325! <g>

Let's hope he gets a 325-add to the little fan club we have for that caliber here at the fire...

Best darn idea of this thread is to just use your 7, I've used one a ton load on elk and just can't imagine a finer round....

Save your money and buy a youth 870 BB gun for your twins I say!

Dober

Party pooper... <grin>...

Jeff O, I really like the idea of the 325 WSM because it is different than what most people like. A few years ago, hardly anyone had heard of a 7mm-08 let alone wanted to buy one. Now they are much more popular. I loved that I had a rifle and cartridge that others didn't have. Kept things interesting.

I think this is part of the draw to the 325 WSM for me. There are a lot of 300WSMs and 338 Win Mags around these parts, but I honestly don't know a single person with a 325 WSM. That is what is so fun about this forum. I can have a "unique" gun and still feel like I am part of a "fraternity" of sorts. I can draw on others' experience and learn from that. We certainly don't have a lot of experience around town here to draw from, so I rely on you guys.

So...don't count me out on the "fan club" just yet. Just weighing out my options. Definitely need to get a youth shotgun though, but I shouldn't stop there

Firehawk

buy a .325 for the twins. They will both appreciate it someday.

Last fall my then 8 year old almost 9 year old son accompanied me for a mulie doe hunt. We hiked together up the steep slopes and then we found the deer. We stalked together, slid on our hind ends together to get a good shot. He watched through the binos while I stuck a 140 Ballistic Tip through her lungs and he yelled "You got it" when she went right down. I was as excited as I ever have been, well close anyway. Way cool!

Anyway, after the field dressing chores, I helped him shoot a 140 Ballistic Tip into the mountain with the little 7mm-08. He thought that that was way cool. So....you know that it won't be long and he will want the 7 mag and his twin sister or little brother will want the 7mm-08 so I better get the 325 WSM just so that I have something to hunt with.

Now that would be sneeky....

Firehawk

Is your 7 mag set up EXACTLY like you want it to be? If not and it's not of extreme sentimental value I'd spend the $$ towards customizing your current one before going with a new rifle. Just my $0.02...

I got to say I agree. Use the 7 and spend your money on something worth while. I highly doubt you or anyone else could tell the diffrence between an elk shot with a 7mag and a 325WSM or anything in between for that matter. I've seen em tip over after taking a 6mm slug to the heart, and have seen them run for 3-400 yards after being shot through the ribs with 338cals. They're all diffrent. One thing that has remained constant in all the kills I've witnessed however... Put on through the ribs and you'll soon be packing elk meat.

Pointer,

I think that the barrel is about done on my 7mm. I have shot it a lot over the years and was considering getting a new Schillen or similar installed in the offseason. Some of my previous "best" loads are no longer shooting well, but I now have found this load with the 160 Accubond that shoots really good so I have held off for the meantime.

I have installed a Nutmeg Laminated stock from Boyds on the rifle, had the trigger adjusted properly and installed a nice scope. The barrel currently is free floated and a good member here on these boards sold me some bottom metal so that I could have a hinged floor plate which it didn't have before the Boyd's stock. So I really like this rifle with the exception of a new barrel which is in the plans.

My friend, Pay close attention.
You are in desperate need of another rifle to hunt with. If you won't think of yourself, think of the babies. One will need the 7/08 and the other, the 7 mag.

You definitely need a .325 WSM. If you are inclined toward the A bolt, then a stainless stalker so chambered and listed at a paltry 500.00 tariff would fit the bill for you marvelously.

Run. Don't walk, to that gunshop and buy that rifle to make for your own.

You and the kids need it.

There's something poetic about owning a pair of Winchester mm's - a 7mm (7wsm) for deer and an 8mm (325wsm) for the bigger stuff. It may not be necessary, but it sure sounds good.

This is Firehawk's wife.

What in the world.....!?! I do believe we have a gun safe in the basement that is FULL! Why in the world does my husband need ANOTHER gun!?????

For the babies! Sheesh!

Why does hee need another gun????!!!!! Why do you may him keep the gun safe in the BASEMENT?????????!!!!!!!

Women never understand..... No offense Mrs. Firehawk

This should be Firehawk, in response to his lovely wife's statement.

I LOVE YOU, HONEY!
And besides, baby, those other guns won't do what this one would. Anyway, it is a good investment....Did I mention that I Love you, HONEY?

I am sorry that she even caught wind of my discussions. Man I am in trouble now. May be a while before this project takes shape, but it will.

She is really sweet, but has a hard time understanding what all the guns are needed for. I keep explaining that each has its intended purpose and this "new" gun would definitely have a purpose.

Firehawk.

I have tried to explain that if I can't fit more guns into my safe, then the safe just isn't big enough now is it? Hasn't gone over so well.

In the interest of organization, I submit that another safe is needed so that long guns and short guns can be stored seperately.

I put another "overflow" safe out in my (recording) studio. It's for the microphones you see (cough cough)...

Fire Hawk, it is indeed fun having a little bit of an oddball like a .325 <g>. My two main rifles this year were my .358 and my .325. Both of those are about as potent as it gets, for the parent case anyway.

Dober has a pretty cool oddball- a 338 WSM wildcat.

I love it!


I am now on my 2nd gunsafe, it is a biggy-may take me a while to fill it.

My overflow safe has a gorgeous stainless Marlin 44 mag carbine... my turkey shotgun... a 1904 Winchester lever gun... my Sendero... my M700P in .223... a Springfield M1a... a Kimber 1911... a 7mm-08 Mountain Rifle... and probably a couple other things that escape me right now.

It'd make a pretty good REAL gun safe <g>....

Nice selection you got there, Jeff.

I need to pick up another Kimber 1911 one of these days...

You need a real German Mauser Timmy.

Yeah, that too!

Kliengunther?

Why not?

Fire Hawk,

My safe has 2 sides a devider in the middle of it one side long guns and the other side shelves for the wifes stuff.... My side is starting to get full. Thinken the wife will need to move her stuff soon.... So I can take the shelves out and make it a true 100% gun safe!! She will not be happey......

Would like to have one my self!!!!

I don't elk hunt myself, but saw the 325 wsm post and thought I'd share my experience with one. I sometimes really hate this site, I bought the scope on this rifle from a member here at an absolute steal even though I had no use for it. So then I had to buy a rifle from a member here so the scope had a home. RMEF Winchester 325 CRPF with S&B 3x12x50 Zenith.



I have only shot factory loads, 180 gr ballistic silvertips, in this rifle and it is a pussycat to shoot. Ammo is kind of expensive so I have not shot 5 round groups with it, just 3 round. I have never shot a single group over 1" , normal is .7-.8 inches at 100 yards, I'm fairly sure I would exceed 1" by a small amount if I fired 5 round groups. The factory 180 gr ballistic silvertips would make a fine varmint round, but are rather explosive on whitetail. In my case I don't care about meat loss using it to reduce an outrageously large overpopulation of deer at my house, I want them to go down fast so I don't have to track accross neighboring properties.
To give you an idea what this bullet does, here are a few pictures of the last deer I shot with it, live weight of deer was 105 lbs.
Yellow highlights the only spot cut with a knife, other than that the leg was 100% severed.


Entrance side behind the leg


Exit, bruised the deer down 2/3'rds the body.


Once I finally run out of all the factory ammo I purchased when I got the rifle, I will reload for it with something a whole lot less explosive.

Use the 7Mag!

Buy the shotgun for the twins. That's a MUCH more practical solution, and you definitely don't need more than a big 7 for elk. Those 160 AB's or a good TSX will do all you ever need done on elk.

Buy the shotgun - if you get the 325 you will make the rest of us jeoulous, and that ain't right.

Frontal area is an important factor in killing game, and if you have a 7mm then the 300 isn't really enough more gun to make a difference, but the step up to a 8mm is more significant.

Holy Snikeys Karl. Note to self "Never use Ballistic Tips in the 325 WSM for deer" Way too messy. Accubonds and TSX come to mind as a good option though. Hmmmmm, how can I figure this out? I NEED that gun;>)

Never confuse needs with wants.

I picked up an A-Bolt in .325WSM and really enjoy shooting it. The recoil is not too bad in the fairly light rifle and the A-Bolt shoots quite well with the Accubond and TSX loads I have tried in it. I have not hunted with it yet but plan on trying it out on some deer in the next six weeks. I will probably stick with my 7mmRM if I go after elk again in the near future.

Notropolis, why are you going to stick with your 7mm RM for elk?

Firehawk,

I just bought my son an 870 youth in 20 guage. I figure I will get more enjoyment out of it than a new rifle for myself.

I do have a Kimber MT, in 300WSM, and have no regrets. The 300WSM is a great round, that I can reload and produce similar results to factory. It is my understanding that you would not be able to do this with the RCM's. They use a Hornady proprietary powder to get the performance. I would stay away from that one, untill I could make sure that I could load something on my own that would at least match the performance that I purchased the rifle for. I'd bet the same holds true for the .325's.

I do think that it is funny that guys will say that "the .300 WSM isn't much more than the 7MM Rem Mag", and that "the .325 WSM isn't much more than the .300 WSM" but still won't hunt dangerous game with a 300 but would use a 325, so I guess that is what it all boils down to. The hunting community is filled with conflicting opinions that are both correct!

The .325 seems like such a more "single purpose round" than so many others out there. (Boy, is that gonna git me in hot water here or what?) The 7mm is still a great deer rifle, as is a 300, but the .325 is a bit much for deer. The BC's available for some of the 7mm boolits are amazing. I have friends that have taken a lot of elk with their 7mm's. If you like the round, and have everything to load with, I think I would tend to stick with it, but then again the 7mmWSM is pretty cool, and just out shoot my buddies, and spend the money on stuff for your kids and that new barrel.

BTW, I am in a quandry as to which caliber to buy a rifle in for my 11 year old son. It would be for deer, and he will really want to hunt elk with me. I am thinking .270, or 7mm-08. I do not think it would be a good idea for him to go out into the field during Elk season with a .243. He is a tall and lankey kid, but really strong for his age. Two questions here, one being possibly more rhetorical (sp.). How do you like the 7mm-08? and Why will we send our kids out with a .270 or something similar for elk, and yet we feel we need a "more bigger-better rifle for ourselves"?

Good luck,

5Points

5 Points. I built (or my gunsmith did) that 7mm-08 from an old Win 70 Westerner that was chambered for 243 Win. I bought the rifle used at a pawnshop, played around with the 243 a little bit, then turned it into a 7mm-08 with a Schillen barrel cut to 22". I love that gun. Is it perfect? No. Ideally, it would have a short action bolt, but this one is the regular length. But....the recoil is light, accuracy has been very good and I just like it alot. I have a buddy that hunts with a Model 7 in 7mm-08. He is from Iowa and was really surprised to hear that I had a rifle in the same caliber.

Anyway, I watched him anchor a spike bull elk last fall with one shot from his 7mm-08 and 140 TSX handloads. He is a large man. Probably 6'2" or so and strong. He has never said he wished he had a bigger gun.

So....I love my little 7mm-08 for target shooting, teaching my wife to shoot, practicing myself (same rifle essentially as my big 7) and I know my kids will like it too. I have killed three deer with it and look forward to doing it again. Ideally, I built it so that my wife would have a potent rifle for hunting without the punishment of recoil. She just hasn't wanted to go kill anything so I have pretty well adopted it. She does enjoy shooting it though.

I want something with a larger frontal diameter so that I have a better chance of getting a blood trail from a large bull if needed. I shot a cow last year that had NO blood trail, although the bullet performed perfectly and did its job well, I don't know if I would have found her if there wasn't fresh snow on the ground. That experience has me thinking that I want a larger caliber for more possibility of blood trail if needed.

Firehawk

This is from my BLR in 325 WSM.

61.0 grs. of IMR 4007 SSC, 220 Gr. Sierra Gameking, WLR primer velocity 2616 FPS.

My Kimber Montana 325 WSM, Note the spiffy Schmaltz TI bolt knob:




how it shoots at 100yds with 4 different loads including a factory:






A couple years back I bang flopped a Whitetail at 347yds, my longest ever on a deer.

Yea, I like it a lot..............................DJ

here is a 2 shot 100yd group with my 325wsm.... The 2nd shot was not needed at all <g>......

STA---how that's my kind of load developement testing...

Dober

dj,
thats some dam good shooting! What are you shooting in her now? 200gr tsx?

Thanks for the reply. I am very interested in the 7mm-08.

As for the blood trail. Can you get that with bullet selection? I understand your desire, and am just asking a question. I know that it can really matter with a big fat black bear, but the structure of the animal is so different. Heck, look at what those Berger VLD bullets do (in 7mm). High shoulder shot, jellie insides, drop like a rock. The 7mm 168's have a BC of .643 (from what I've heard, the quality varies a lot from bullet to bullet).

It is really interesting to go to Winchester's web site, and see how similar the 7mm mag and the .325WSM in the XP3 are in velocity and trajectory, but man is there ever a difference in foot-pounds. I would venture to say you are going to get a bigger blood trail more from the explosive energy departed on the tissue than from simply increasing the frontal diameter of the round. It would be very interesting to read more on this. Time to check out google.

It really sounds to me like you know what you want, and are now prepared to justify it to your wife. The .325 should perform a lot like the 7mm in the air, with more terminal damage. You should be able to shoot the heck out of it. It is almost as if you were meant to have one!

Good Hunting,

5Points

Dober,
the caribou would not let me get the 3rd shot in befour he went down....lol.... thinken I could of had a little smaller group if I was not shooting free hand....

If you know you are going after elk, then a 358 Winchester or 338 Federal would be better choices than the 7-08, and I say that as a 7X57 Mauser fan.

The 308 Winchester would be a better choice than the 7-08 too.

Elk and the related large non-dangerious big game animals Caribou, moose, eland, kudu) respond to the authority of wider, heavier bullets. The 7mm's are marginal for elk, as you already know, that is why you are considering the 325.

My son started shooting my BLR in 358 when he was 13, and used it to good effect, with 225 grain bullets and heavy handloads. It could be loaded down to 35 Remington velocities with 180 grain Nosler Partition handgun bullets for a couple of years too. This would be fine for shooting smaller game animals like deer.

I'm using the 4831/200gr TSX load. I can't think of anything in the America's this load wouldn't work for....................DJ

7mm is marginal for elk? Do they wear flak jackets down there? We have pretty big Roosevelt Elk up here and they die like everything else if you put some lead through the heart or lungs...chunk of lead doesn't really have to be that big either.

I guess they can 'appear' to be bullet-proof sometimes. I shot a medium-sized 6pt at 250y with a 300 Win Mag. I put two 180g partitions very similar to STA's caribou. He just stood there so I thought better safe than sorry...and he just crumpled like you would expect with a hole in the lungs. I'm sure my 260 could have done the same job. Been said a million times - put the hole in the right spot and they won't be standing long.

Well if THAT's the way we are showing off our .325's... <grin>... here's my Kimber:





And, like some kind of fargin' miracle, here it is again:



Here that damn thing is AGAIN! Look at that puffed-up leg. That's what happens when you shoot a deer through the hip joint at 40 yards with a 200-gn Accubond from said .325...



This is what a 8mm Accubond looks like after smashing the hip joint of a deer at 40 yards, traversing 39" plus of deer, and ending up under the chin. Final weight was right at 140-ish grains for 70% retention.




This is my other .325, carefully at rest in a bed of... fresh elk poop <g>. I've since de-glossed the stock.

A very wild Q here but have any of you guys farted around with a light load in your 325's?

I mean like a reduced load.

Thx

Dober

Hey DJ, I've got a Schmaltz Ti bolt handle... how do you like yours?

I haven't put it on yet... I kinda like the larger size of the factory original but the one ounce lighter weight is appealing.

I might put a 6x36 Leupold and Ti handle on 300WSM8400MT and get it down to 7lbs 1 oz "all-up" weight...

Mark, I have a 175-gn Sierra PH load that I run pretty light... but I wouldn't call it a REDUCED load, just light.

You mean like 8mm Mauser type light? 32 WCF light?

8 Mauser type I guess.

Thx

Dober

DJ, nice scope, which one is that? Why not Talley LW's?

Mark, you got me thinking that some flat points made for the .32 WCF (or is it .32 WS?) would be pretty hip, for blacktail.

They'd probably do less damage if I shot 'em in the ass anyways <g>...

Any of you guys shot the 180 NBT in your 325's yet?

Thx

Dober

I shoot the 180 TSX. There is a guy at the gun club that shoots a a-bolt 325wsm with 180 NBT and H4350 dont think he has killed anything with it but paper...

STA-is 3K a reasonable speed for the 180's in your short 8 mag mag?

Thx

Dober

yes no trouble at all getting 3000+fps. I run mine with a max load of RL19 @3100fps with that said 3000fps would be more reasonable speed thinken brass would last a long time.....

Thx and what do you use for primers?

Dober

Fed 215M

My load is MAX in my Montana....
180TSX
RL19 72.5gr
Fed 215M
.030 off the lands
3100fps
.5 to .8 MOA

Thx, whenever I've worked with the short mags I've always had the best of luck with the 215's as well.

In my 338 WSM I've tried about all of the primers made and 215's just make it perk.

Dober

Dober,
What speed are you getting with your 338 WSM?

I love the bolt handle, it feels good, looks good and didn't cost that much.

I'm using QR's because I overlapped the lightweights, they pinched the tube and made the scope fail. Swaro fixed it but I'll keeps sighted in spare ready on a big hunt.
I don't lap lightweights anymore......................dj

I'll try to remember to grab my load book tomorrow and post some speeds for you.

Dober

Good dialogue guys. This is great information with loads and velocities and real life experiences while shooting and hunting. Thank you very much.

Firehawk

Well, if you hadn't "overlapped them" they'd have been fine. I've lapped seven or eight pairs of Talley LWT's with never an issue!

As to the 325 WSM... neat cartridge. Does it offer anything on elk the 300 WSM doesn't? I SERIOUSLY doubt it, but choosing a cartridge you like is like choosing a woman... some like brunettes (me) and some like blondes...

Here's a dead elk from a Kimber 300 WSM:

Brad,
Is that your bull? From this year?? If so, congrat's!!

Nope... have only hunted three days... so far, bungled a shot on a bull and have worked nine days in a row... maybe I'll actually get to elk hunt this year

Gees you guys in Montana and Wyoming our elk rifle season is about 4 days over here...

Brad: At my age, I don't discriminate

That's why you use a 270

The thing about Lapping Talleys is this: If something is perfectly round an then you Lap it you make it not perfectly round. Talley's have tight tolerances and are usually about as round as you get, anything you take off is more likely to make them worse than better........................DJ

Brad, how did you know my wife is blonde?! <grin>

What does a .325 offer than a .300 WSM doesn't you ask? Why, 200-gn bullets at 2950 fps. And 180's at 3100 fps.

What difference will that make on an elk you ask? Probably none <g>. Sure does work though.

Brad, where'd you hit that bull and with what bullet and what were the results of the shot (I mean, death obviously, but what was the story? Cliff notes version is fine).

I'm sure I've mentioned it already on this thread- I always do on .325 WSM threads- but in my opinion the 300 WSM is the more practical, normal, (yawn) choice. :-)

Sure does work though.

So do little itty bitty .270 cal 130's@ 3450...see post below.

Lefty

Brad,

Don't you think it would look better with black scope rings and mounts?

Good Hunting,

5Points

Fire Hawk, I will probably stick with my 7mmRM because I have used it so much that I am very comfortable with it and know what I can and can't do with it.

In my Kimber .325, I am shooting 180 TSX at 3158 and .75" 5 shot group at 100. Plenty of thumping power there.

In reality though, my Kimber .308 will do anything I need it to, the .325 is just fun to have.

Yes on the 180 NBT`s. Shoot fine and kill deer really good. Have not tried them on anything larger.

Hey Ed, mind sharing your load, or at least what powder you are using? PM is fine if you don't want to publically publish it.

STA gets 3100 with those 180 TSX's... I pushed as hard as I was comfortable and "only" got to about 3060. Since that's 100 FPS behind you I'm just wondering if there's a powder I should try, there....

I keep hoping for either a 8mm TTSX, or an 8mm E-tip...

I can get 2800 from those 180 TSX's in my custom 8x57 and about .75" 3 shot groups (Shilen barrel). 3100+ ought to flat slap anything on the continent.

You'd think!!

Still not having drunk the X-bullet cool aide, I'd probably run the 200 TSX if I was in "slap anything on the planet" mode, though <g>.

I've driven the 100 TSX from a .257 Roberts through 28" of deer. One 80% heavier ought to reach China. lol.

I really like the 8mm bore, even in "lowly" 8x57 it knocks big holes in things with little fuss. Easy on the shoulder, easy on meat, it flat works, a fast 8 is just even better.

Careful now. The very mention that a bigger gun can have it's benefits just precipitated 8 pages of [bleep] over on another thread <g>. Culminating in me being accused by the high and mighty Castandblast of ruining the entire campfire for even suggesting such a thing! The horror!

I've thought 8x57 is just flat-out COOL ever since I got my brain around what it does... that's a cool cartridge you got there!

Jeff,

I must not have had enough coffee this morning. My posted velocity should have come out as 3058, 5 shot ave. I believe 3072 was tops.

Ed, that's exactly in line with my rifle; makes perfect sense now.

I'd not have been so curious, except that I felt like I was twisting my .325's tail pretty hard, to get where I got!

I ended up running 200's (accubonds) instead. They worked GREAT. Great caliber.

Firehawk,
I am at the age (50) where I think that if you have an itch you should scratch it. I have had an itch for a 300 WSM since the first time I fired one. However, I am very strong in the 7 Wby camp. If I buy the 300 WSM, it will only be a want and not a need. And I suspect it will definitely be a Kimber unless I can find a good Rem 700 that sparks my fancy.

Your 7 RM is likely your go-to shooter. Just because you opt for a 325 does not mean you love the 7 less, right? I would never turn my back on my 7 Wby.

With the .325, you have the fun of getting that blank look from guys when they ask you what you are shooting, too! <grin>

Hey Dj, I have the same cal in the montana, now for your best group load in the tsx 200 gr what was the seating depth of your bullets and how much imr 4831 did you use,and what kind of primers and brass?. appreciate any help .

I know that this is dredging up a really old thread, but I came across it and thought I should fill you all in.

I saved my money and purchased a Remington 870 youth model in 20 gauge. Been a blast watching the boys take ducks with it. Then...last year I rebarreled my 7mm Rem Mag with a 26" Shillen barrel. Used it to take my first branch antlered bull at long range.

And, just last week, I picked up a Kimber 8400 Montana in 325 WSM. I have decided to sale a few things to make it possible, but I couldn't pass on the deal I found on the used rack at the gun shop.

Anyway, I thought I would dredge this thread up and give an update. Twins are now 13 almost 14. Son missed a good muley this year with my 7mm-08 Rem and he is getting ready for a cow elk hunt in the next few weeks. That kid can flat out shoot and he doesn't seem to be bothered by recoil at all. Shot the 7mm Rem Mag last weekend and didn't even react like it was any different than shooting the 7mm-08.

His little brother took his first animal this year as he downed a nice Pintail with a shot from the youth model 870. Absolutely blessed to have these kids tagging along with me.

Wife is even on board with my endeavors too. She has done two years of Couple's 3-D Archery league and we are about to enter our third winter of that league. Way too fun!

Fire Hawk

I didn't read the whole thread, but if you have 8 elk points and are hoping to draw a decent unit, you'll have about 10 more years to think about your purchase....

Great Wapiti!

This thread was started back in 2008. So now, I have 12 points. Still might be a few years, but getting pretty dang close. My buddy drew a "Premium" tag a couple years ago with only 9 points.

Lucky son of gun I know, but he put the hammer down on a great bull first morning.

FH

Just razz'n ya a bit. Dang LE elk hunts here should be lumped into the same category as Once-in-a-Lifetime hunts, because that's pretty much what they are.

My hunting pard has 19 elk points and can't draw (he's holding out for San Jaun).

Nothing against the .325WSM but like a lot of other cartridges it has just never excited me, either.

Short action = good if it delivers on the promise of lighter weight. (Otherwise what's the point?)
(Not so good IMHO if it means seating bullets below the case neck - a personal preference thing.)

Fat bullet = good

Ballistic Coefficients = good

Factory ammo costs = high (Like most factory ammo these days.)

Factory ammo variety = low
(midwayusa.com count: 7mmRM = 69, .300WM = 89, .325WSM = 10, .338WM = 35)

Brass availability = low
(midwayusa.com vendor count: 7mmRM = 6, .300WM = 6, .325WSM = 2, .338WM = 6)

Bullet selection = low but adequate
(Midwayusa.com bullet selection: 7mm = 110, .308" = 265, 8mm = 32, .338" = 79)

Again, I'm not knocking the .325WSM, just doubt that with I'll ever own one. On the other hand, if I find a nice one at a screamer price, all bets are off.


YMMV

I thought you were Wapiti. San Juan would be a true OIL tag that is for sure. Then there are those dang lucky guys that draw Cache with 5-6 points and shoot a 400+" bull like happened this year. Lucky sons of guns that is for sure.

Me...I want a mature 6 point bull. I really don't care much about score, but that will change the longer I wait. I am more looking for the "experience".

My buddy drew the Pahvant with 9 points the lucky sucker. Anyway, I will just keep applying and see what happens.

As far as the 325 WSM goes, I have both a 7mm Rem Mag and a 7mm-08. I wanted something different. I handload and don't remember the last time I bought a box of factory ammo. I have played the "get lots of different bullets on my bench" game, and I am now starting to "simplify" my life. I have a few bullets for the 7mm RM and a few other bullets for the 7mm-08. I am selling off a whole bunch of other 7mm bullets so that I don't have all the distractions on my bench. I will try a few different bullets til I find "the load" and then I will stock up on those components as I am able to.

I have picked up one 50 count bag of Winchester brass and will pick up a few more as I go along over the next year or so. Eventually, I will have a bunch and most will be brand new.

Frankly, I like that I don't know a single person that shoots a 325 wsm. Like Jeff above, I love that they give you that look like "What are you shooting"? I used to get that here with my 7mm-08, but now I know three other people personally that are shooting 708s and loving them. Just like me and my boy.

FH

Yes.

I am curious what you all are doing with your 325wsm rifles these days ? I still have two of them and like to spark some conversation even though the cartridge has fallen by the wayside. To some this may be moot considering this thread was done years ago but I figure what the heck. I’d wager some guys still use and love them. No doubt there are some that will remind us of all the negatives or what cartridge is better.
Hopefully they won't comment. Maybe you 325wsm owners wouldn't mind posting your accurate loads and anything else that is interesting.

I have a Kimber Classic 325 - initial load work told me it didn't like boat tails, but I did shoot these groups back to back with 3 different flat base bullets and H4350.



My frustration now is I can't get it to group anywhere close to this now and I haven't changed a thing other than try different scopes that are proven on other rifles. I'm debating whether to turn it into a 6.5 PRC or sell it and be done.

I still have my Kimber Montana in 325. I have not shot it in quite sometime. I have only killed paper with it. From what I recall, it grouped the factory loaded DoubleTap 200 grain TSX's pretty well. I have swapped the 1.5-6x42 scope for a 1.7-10x42 scope, but have not sighted it in. I need to work up a hand-load for the 200 TSX.
I think it is a fine cartridge. And a reasonably lightweight combination in the Kimber Montana.

Mine has established a telepathic symbiosis with me. Almost every other day it tells me "we need to go hunt something!". Unfortunately I live in a fairly urban area and I'm at that stage in life of several young kids to take care of... so I gotta sit around and wait to get drawn with my dad if I want a valid reason to be away for several days. I love my 325- it's probably one of the most flexible cartridges ever devised, even more flexible than the '06 in my opinion.
My Load info / experience worth noting:
Winchester XPR - 24"
Firelapped break in with Tubb FF (to reduce copper fouling; not sure if it helped but figured why not)
Double Tap 160 Barnes TTSX: 3250 fps. This is my preferred general purpose hunting load.
Hodgdon 4895 (60 gr) - Speer HC 150 gr @ 3150 fps (website min load) - very mild kick, "Chock!" short impulse
Win760 (70 gr) - Speer HC 150 g @ 3200 fps (website min load) - also very mild kick, similar impulse

In the future I intend to down-load the 4895's as a cheap, effective mule deer / general load (as a backup to if I don't have or cannot get more Double Taps). I expect it to perform similar or better to federal blue box, 150gr HC 300wsm. For heavier game I have Accubonds, Gamekings, and Lapua Naturalis to develop if I have to but the DT's should cover big game handily out to 500 yards.

When the 325 came out I thought it would be an ideal elk gun, short action larger bullet diameter but not bad on recoil. At the time my 7mm RM was what I used for deer& elk. Since then I acquired a 300 Weatherby & it is my go to elk gun. The 325 would be a step back in my opinion. I get asked about elk rifles regularly & the 325 never occurs to me. Not because it isn’t a good choice but that it isn’t as readily available as the 300WSM that I think is great way to go for dedicated elk or all purpose hunting rifle.

It’s obsolete. Couple that with a general unpopularity of anything 8mm, as well as the fading of the WSM fad, and you have the recipe for a turkey of a rifle.

The WSM business was the solution to a problem that didn’t exist, IMO. No doubt the 325 WSM would be a terrific elk rifle - so long as you don’t part company with your ammo on the way to your hunting grounds.

The 8mm caliber never found a niche among American hunters, despite the fact there have been some terrific cartridges for it. The 8mm/06 is dead, as is the 8mm RM, and one seldom hears much in glowing terms of the 8x57 (compared to the 7x57, 6.5x55, or even the 9.3x62).

It was the last of the WSM series, designed to closely resemble the .338 WM in trajectory and power (I suppose why it was not a 338 WSM is that it couldn’t quite catch the 338 WM).

All that said, you could probably get a very nice rifle for a steal these days, as I see quite a lot of them on the used market. But you’d better be something of a bullet hoarder and crank in general to make up for it’s shortcomings. Go ahead, and get a rousing applause from the Rifle Looney Farm.

It’s not obsolete to me nor others that still use them.
Both my 325wsm rifles rock ! Reloading is easy for it
too. Any cartridge that drops a moose handily at 600 yards in a lightweight rifle isn’t all that bad. The developers weren’t trying to solve a problem that didn’t exist. They merely came out with a family of short magnum, non belted cartridges. I’m not sure, but has that even been done before? Four cartridges in five years based on the same case. Pretty cool. And a simple barrel swap to 300 wsm from a 325 is an easy option.300wsm has set 1000 yard records and is a fairly popular competition round. It is used by a respectable amount of hunters and still has very good sales. I bought the Kimber Super America and A Bolt just for fun. I enjoy adding rifles to my collection. This was the first time I bought an uncommon round and magnums. I was not disappointed to say the least. Funny how there are always people expressing negativity; and often they don’t even own the cartridge. LMAO

It's certainly not obsolete what with both guns and ammo in production.

It's a good cartridge for heavy bullets and I use the 220gr A-Frame for elk in situations where I expect there may be bear interest in my kill. The BC on the A-Frame is not great, but there's enough powder in the WSM case that it's reasonable. The load is Retumbo loaded to 2820 in a Kimber Classic.

One other thing I like is that 66.4gr of RL-25 with a 220gr game king second is an 1/2 MOA and dirt cheap softball load at about 2450 ft/s. Just throw out the seconds that are obviously mangled. A great load for stuff that doesn't require much reach when you want to avoid meat damage. Also a fun load to introduce newer shooters to light weight hunting rifles.

Other than the .338 RCM and various wildcats, there's really not much out there like the .325 WSM. If it didn't exist, we'd have to invent it or something very similar.

Poor quality brass.
Poor selection of factory ammo and that which is made is not widely available.
Great choice!

??? you can run any 300 WSM case through any reasonable sizer and be good to go. That gives you Winchester, Federal, Nosler/Norma and Hornady, as well as oddballs like RCC, Bertram, etc. That gives you options for cheap or expensive, weight sorted or not, and prepped or not. I wouldn't exactly call that a poor brass supply.

God I hope I'm sitting pretty the next time a Kimber Montana .325 wsm comes along.

Picked up an 1885 in 325wsm last year. Knew nothing about the caliber but the price was a give away.

So...some friends ( Randy and Miles) last year at the Armijo Springs helped me sight it in and I am thrilled with the results.

Will spend a bit of the summer developing my "go to load" for it. Have all the bits and pieces for several years of use.

Did I mention my kids that adopted me are purchasing some land very near a bunch of federal land that this J M Browning rifle will see some use on?

It shoots very well with factory loads and will be affordable with the "home grown" stuff.

What's not to like?

I agree

I've heard this argument about there not being enough bullet choice or poor bullet choice for years with the .270 Win. Yeah, not too many at the big long range matches or in the bench rest circuit, but there's plenty for what the cartridge is mostly designed for, hunting deer and other medium game. I've been hunting and shooting one for 54 years and never had occasion to use anything other than 130 or 150 grain spitzer bullets. How many bullets you need? And fhe .325 WSM is an 8mm. I have an 8mm Mauser and they make some fine bullets for it. Not a whole lot but plenty for what I use the rifle for. So for my part that's a Bull Sheit excuse to bad mouth a fine old cartridge. Same with the 8mm Rem. Mag. Too many people own those and say great things about them for them to be a BS entity. And like was said on this thread, most of the bad mouthing is done by people that have never owned or used one. I love the concept of the WSM. It has the performance of the big magnums in a short action rifle. If your hunting takes you to high elevation and where onces can make or break you, a lighter rifle is what is needed. But at those elevations you still could run into a big bear. It would be nice to know you're not under gunned. Also, if you're hunting elk a bigger rifle capable of taking big game at a distance is definitely a plus. As far as I can see the .325 WSM sounds like a God Send to an elk hunter.

You make good points Filaman. I couldn’t have said it better. I don’t quite get the “lack of bullet selection “ bit either. For hunters there are enough. I reloaded 62,63 and 64 grains of IMR 4831 with 220 grain Woodleighs and all were under an inch. Even 66 grains did that. But I’m going with the lower charges. I got some 220 Sierra Game Kings I’ll play with. I’d like to try AFrames ,Barnes and Accubond after that. Maybe a 4350 powder. As for brass everyone knows Winchester ain’t great but they are getting the job done. My Nosler and Bertram brass are better quality. I haven’t loaded any of those yet. Glad to see some folks standing up for the cartridge. Lots of naysayers out there. Maybe they don’t appreciate marketing hype. I certainly don’t. On the other hand without it, many things would have lackluster sales and likely not survive.
Anyhow, everyone stay safe with this COVID crap.

I know what you mean. I haven’t bought a gun I actually needed in 30 years! LOL. Yet somehow I have a fairly good amount in my collection. Let’s face it, if you got a 12gauge, 30-06(or something close) a 22LR and a handgun, what else does anyone really need? But shush please, don’t let the wife ever hear words like that. Or none of us would have a good collection beyond that. 😂 LOL.

While I do not own a 325 I do own and love an old 700 bdl in 8 rem mag. I think the 325 would be an absolutely top of the line elk slayer. Ballistics between the two or close enough no game animal would ever be able to tell the difference between them. Your 325 would be a shorter/lighter rifle than mine and I’ve hauled mine up several mountains and lived to tell about it. Although I never managed to shoot at an elk with my 8 mag, it has killed game from bobcats to eland and nothing has required a second shot. I’ve always used 180 or 200TSX and they have been pretty much perfect. I’m not sure if Sierra still makes their 220btsp but if you felt you needed a “long range” bullet but I’m sure that one would fill the bill. As mentioned, there aren’t 734 bullets to choose from but there are enough good ones to do anything you’d need to do with a 325. Good luck and I hope you get it!

Ben

Somebody should have warned him. 325 WSM? You'll shoot yer eye out, kid.