Well, here goes nothing. First-timer posting here. I actually joined this forum because I stumbled across it while I was researching the things I am going to ask about in this post. I am a classic central Minnesota whitetail hunter. All of my life I hunted whitetails with a bow, shotgun and muzzleloader. I don't pretend to know a great deal about rifles as I didn't grow up hunting with them. However, over the past couple years I've read a lot about them and tried to educate myself on the matter.

I ended up buying a Browning A-Bolt .30-06 with a Vortex 4-18X scope. I bought this setup as its a very versatile caliber, of which I can put to use here in MN for whitetails as well as use it in the future for moose and elk. And its the latter that I am going to ask my questions around. I am headed to Colorado this coming fall on an elk hunt. I will be using my .30-06 and am curious about 3 specific bullets and the ammunition that they come factory loaded in.

I have narrowed down my selections to the below for my gun. Any comments are appreciated:

1. 180 grain Nosler Accubonds - Nosler Trophy Grade (BC .507)
2. 180 grain TTSX - Barnes VOR-TX (BC .484)
3. 185 grain Berger Hunter - HSM (BC .549)

I know these are suitable, well constructed bullets for elk. My question is mostly around how important is Ballistic Coefficient in my .30-06. Knowing that my .30-06 is no 6.5 CM, I want to get the best performance out of it as possible.

If I intend on keeping my shots within 500 yards, is a high BC bullet (Berger, Accubond) as important? Will my 06 be more accurate at 300-500 yards with a BC of .549 than .484?

Lastly, I've heard that in order to get best performance out of the Berger the bullet needs to hit bone..."you need to hit the shoulder to get performance, otherwise the bullet will pencil through the body cavity and won't expand." Is this true?

I just want to make sure that since I have this opportunity to get on a hunt I've been dreaming about I have the proper bullets. Certainly I will need to see if any of these three will shoot well out of my Browning A-Bolt.

You will be fine with all mentioned.

Please define "performance" first. In hunting it DOES NOT mean how well it flies and bucks wind. It means WAY more about how well it expands and yet doesn't come apart so you can get an exit wound. Oddly it's more important in elk hunting then deer OR moose hunting. Moose don't often run full out when shot,and deer fall to the old 06 very very well. It's actually more power then needed for deer.....but so what?


For the issue you mention (elk, moose and deer too) BC is nearly meaningless. If you can judge the range or measure it, you simply hold for the drift and drop of your round and forget all the hoopla about one bullet shooting flatter or bucking wind better. It's 98% about you the shooter, and 2% about the round you shoot.

The 30-06 is the standard by which all others cartridges are measured and it's been doing a wonderful job making meat out of all 3 animals you named since 1906.

If you want to make a choice from the 3 you listed only, I would flip a coin between #1 and #2 and leave #3 out of the race.

For target shooting or varmint shooting, the issue of BC makes some small difference, but not in hunting and especially not in hunting game as large as elk and moose. If you are looking for long range shooting on targets or varmints you should look hard at the Burger too, but it's not going to be as good all-around for hunting elk and moose as the X or the Accubond.

First, welcome to the Fire...This place is full of talented hunters and shooters, as well as funny dudes with a wild streak of smart-ass and piss and vinegar mixed in. Hope you enjoy it here...There isn’t any place like it for good information and pure entertainment.

Don’t feel bad if at some point some members want to give you schit over what you’ve posted if you decide to stick around. For some hazing is their specialty...As for the 06 and the above bullets you’re asking about.

All 3 will do nicely. I’ve hunted both the 180g AB and TSX bullets in the same weight, different chambering. The AB have been very impressive on deer and elk mushrooming properly, and retaining their weight. Nasty suckers when they hit bone. I’ve had more pass through an animal then catch one even out to 600 yards.

The Barnes TSSX bullet is stout and will hold its core intact a little better with good penetration. I used to use them exclusively, until I tried the NAB’s. I changed to AB because all my big fur rifles showed better accuracy with them then the TSX.

Your choice of scope may be more important to you if you are dialing up 500 yards for a shot on a bull with an 06. Drop with a 180g 30-06 will be 46” inches with a 200 yard zero. Energy at 500 yards is in the neighborhood of 1483. Which IMO isn’t very much unless you punch the heart. Could make for a long track on a hit elk otherwise. Just my opinion. 😎

Welcome to the fire. I probably have more questions than answers. Im curious how youve "educated yourself" with a rifle in the last few years, as you state, you havent used a rifle much. To make consistent 1 shot kills at your proposed 500 yard distance, you are going to need a lot of trigger time, shooting at that distance and beyond. I have no idea what type of terrain you will be hunting in, but generally a big percentage of elk are shot inside of 100 yards. How much hunting have you actually done with your 06? The reason i ask is because shooting at an animal with the intent to cleanly put its lights out with 1 shot is different than punching paper or ringing steel. Ive seen guys fu ck up a 30 yard shot, because of lack of experience. My best advice to you is to find out which factory round shoots the best in your rifle, get it dialed in and properly zeroed and practice field positions. Practice shooting off of your pack too. I see you list the bc of those bullets, which isnt a bad thing, but its not the most important part of the equation. All of those loads will suffice, unless they dont shoot well in your rifle. Even the highest bc bullet you can find for the 06, wont save your bacon, if you or your rifle arent dialed in. That doesnt just apply to shooting longrange either. You have to be able to bring your A game at short range too. Id worry less about the bc of the bullet and make sure you and your rifle are up to the task. Dont let all the longrange gak here convince you that all of your shots are going to be from one county line to the next, because the majority of elk are shot up close. Yes, even here "out west".

I'd pick the Accubond first every time out of those 3, OP. There will be no worries about bullet performance out to 500 at least.

Go shoot them and let your rifle tell you which one it likes. Any of those will do the job on elk. But pick the one that is most likely to go where you want it to, if the others don't shoot worth a crap then you don't have much choice.

Good Luck,

1) IMO any 180 gr hunting bullet at -06 velocity will do the job on deer, elk or moose. Yes, even common cup and core bullets, that said, your choices of ammo are very good indeed. Use which ever shoots best in your rifle.

2) Pay careful attention to what szihn and bsa1917hunter have said there is much truth to their opinions. They are experienced hunters and often offer good advice here on the 'fire. Despite all the LR hoopla on TV and the IN, most game, including elk even out west are shot at much closer ranges. You are the biggest variable.

3) Good luck on your CO hunt in the fall.

I appreciate the feedback from all of you, as well as the welcoming comments from some of you. I am going to do more exploring with the NAB as it's one I haven't shot and am curious to see how it groups out of my rifle. Seems like a very well constructed bullet and like many have been happy with it's performance on elk.

I am also curious to see how the Hornady EDL-X 178 grain bullet shoot.

bsa1917hunter - looks like you're a Hornady guy from your profile display. Do you have thoughts on the EDL-X and if they're suited well for elk hunting? Anyone have experience with the EDL-X on Elk? Does the bullet stay together? Decent weight retention? Let say it shoots like a dream from my rifle.....do I use it for elk? Can I trust that even if it hits a shoulder it'll get into the vitals?

I’d lean towards the Accubond and TTSX myself but I have 0 experience with the Berger, so its my tendency to use what has worked well for me in the past. The other nailed it. Once the rifle is on paper at 100 with a good zero, I’d wanna check them all out at distance to see how they hold up. As BSA mentioned you’ll have to spend some trigger time just getting good yourself out to the extended distances.

Unlike BSA though I’d bet my average elk ranges have been in the 250 yard mark.. maybe I need to get better at tracking though..

I think you’ve got a solid plan, I’d address the trigger and make sure it’s light enough to shoot well off of a pack and get to shooting. I think you’ll find with some dedicated time it’ll work just fine for everything you mentioned.

Shots to 500yds on elk...I hear a lot of guys from the east talk of such things. Generally it is guys that have never hunted elk, and don't really know how far 500yds is. Elk are big, and thus have a big vital zone to hit, but bad shots I've seen (and done) at elk have been largely because of nerves (elk fever). Elk aren't hard to kill if you hit them right, but they will run for miles up and down mountains and valleys if you hit them poorly.

My advice: don't plan on taking a 500yd shot, particularly if you are fairly new to rifles. Plan on taking a maximum-point-blank-range shot (for the 30-06, about 300yds, if sighted in for a 260-270yd zero). Don't shoot farther; get closer. The time to start shooting that far at animals isn't on elk in unfamiliar country. Plan to hunt, and enjoy the hunt. Elk hunting is addictive!

Regarding your ammo choices, I've used the Berger 185's in a 30-06 quite a bit with a MV of 2730, and have never failed to have an exit on deer or elk broadside and quartering from 70-450+yds. I'm confident in that bullet (and many others) to handily do what is required. I've been around elk killed with a few various 30 cal Barnes bullets and with several weights of Accubond from the 150's in a 308 to the 200's out of a SAUM. They all seemed to work well without failure. I personally prefer "softer" bullets of heavy-for-caliber weights when hunting where elk are a possibility. Some guys prefer the opposite.

My young nephew killed his elk this year with a 243 (in a Savage Axis!) and Hornady 105 BTHP, an old cow at 300yds, off sticks. The first bullet squared her shoulder on a slightly quartering shot, busted the humerus, and didn't get into the ribs. Shot two passed through the ribs and out, and was likely the clincher. He finished her in the neck because she was still on her feet. It doesn't take a cannon, but you have to know your limitations. She was the second-largest cow I've ever seen killed. I suggest that in whatever situation you find yourself when the shooting starts, keep shooting until the elk is down. Admiring a shot is for TV shows.

More good stuff for this greenhorn! I’m sure you’re exactly right, HuntnShoot; I don’t really know what it’s like to shoot at 500 nor shoot an animal at 500. I’ve never done it! However, I’m going to push my limits at the range and take your advice to keep the shot around 300 on the real thing when I’m out in CO this fall. I currently have my rifle zero at 200, putting me 8” low at 300 and 22” low at 400. Again, I need to spend more time at the range working on getting comfortable at those longer distances.

I'll second the "you have to practice" voices. I recently got a range to shoot to 400. Been shooting at 200 prior. All I can say is the first time at 400, same gun, bullet, scope, rest everything, was an eye opener, those 3 inch groups at 200 blow WAY UP. Heck between a 24 inch drop, add a small wind and we had trouble hitting an 8 inch gong.

Not sure if it was the bullet just sort of drifted at that distance, or the trigger puller, but groups opened up WAY MORE than what I thought.

Given that, I'm happy to shoot animals at 200 but would even try an elk at 400.

its not the rifle or ammo thats critical, its your physical condition,
your persistence and ability to locate game and get into reasonable range,and your knowledge of the game and its terrain,
that will make or break most hunt success
.a good shot with any decent center fire rifle from a 257 Roberts to a 458 win mag can kill elk,
if they get into decent range and can accurately place shots in the games vitals,
thats not the hard part, its finding the elk and getting into range,
and making that accurate shot rapidly from a field position thats the difficult part.
ask the guys that were not successful, youll find it was not having the opportunity,
not seeing elk in range,never seeing game,and lack of physical endurance,
that kept them from checking the next canyon, or walking too the next bunch of aspen on the next ridge,
to make the shot or for a few missing, not the rifles lethality that was the problem.

(1) most people can,t hit crap shooting from field positions ,
bench rests are great for setting your scope zero and sighting in,
but if you don,t spend the vast majority of your time learning to shoot accurately from field positions,
your drastically reducing your chances
you need to practice with a sling , and a decent bi-pod, and sitting as thats how youll make a great many shots




HB25CS 25C Model S -13.5-27" Swivel Bipod
by Harris Engineering
(2) in 50 plus years of hunting elk , I've spent a respectable time in the field,
I've shot and seen shot, a good deal of deer and elk, the vast majority were killed at under 250 yards,

(3) most people can't judge range accurately, in fact most people are terrible at it at distances over 300 yards

(4) your 30/06 with any of the bullets you listed, is fully capable of killing any elk at the ranges your likely to actually see elk in the field.

Welcome to the fire.

I only have experience with the Accubonds. But you'd be fine with any of them. I do have a good friend that likes the Bergers but in 168gr. He's used them on elk plenty out of a .308 and he has the dead elk to speak for them. I wouldn't hesitate to use them at all if they shot out of my rifle.


Good luck on your hunt.

As a fellow MN hunter who hunted west for the first time this year. 500 yds is a loooooooong ways compared to what we're used to. I practiced a lot, or what I'd consider a lot at 300 yards. It wasn't enough. A deer at 300 yds is a small target. An elk isn't but thats still a long ways when you're used to shooting 10-100 at a 200 pound animal. I need more practice, so do you.

With 30-06 velocities with a 180gr bullet, just about any bullet on the market designed for big game hunting will do the job.I am surprised the Nolser Partition wasn't in the original group.

My pick would be the accubond out of those three but if it doesn’t shoot well then maybe another. Winchester and federal also probably load an acuubknd load of 180gr in 06’. I know Winchester does and federal should in their premium line. Try all three and see which load the gun likes. Keep shooting distance reasonable and within your skill level. No bullet is magic. I shoot lots of begers and I think your research mislead you. It’s a rather lightly constructed bullet and I actually would avoid bone unless you needed to anchor the animal right there due to terrain and recovery. Don’t focus on BC for your purposes. Won’t matter much at 400 or so yards and closer. Beaver stated the core on the Barnes will stay together better than the others. This is a false statement as well. The barnes have NO core. They are a monolithic bullet. Some good advice and some people talking above their pay grade. About on par with life. Sort through the advice here as you would anywhere else. A lot of so called experts that don’t know [bleep]. Have fun and enjoy your hunt. Your weapon choice is perfectly fine for your hunt. Start practicing and get in shape. The shot is the easy part in an elk hunt. As a guide I much prefer a client with an 06’ and in shape to a fat know it all with the newest magical cartridge.

Saddlescore - I agree a lots of fine bullets left of the list but it appears the OP is chasing that magical BC. Partition should not be overlooked.

What ever groups the best. I am partial to the AB but all will do fine.

Spend time shooting a bunch. Once you pick a factory load, buy 5-6 boxes of it and get comfortable shooting it over the summer. Then buy 3 more boxes and start adding challenges to your shots. Off hand, coming down on the rifle after running gassers behind the range, etc. All of these are directly applicable to elk hunting and making it part of the routine is probably more important than 1 vs. 2 MOA.

It’s fun to discuss, but not all that significant.

It’s where you shoot them than matters, much more than with what.

And as others have said, 500 yards is farther than you think. Unless you practice, and a lot, from field positions at that distance, you’re asking for trouble.

Find the load your rifle prefers and buy a case of it, then shoot every week. I’d spend more time picking your boots that picking your bullet.





P

#truth

First off-
Any of those bullets in factory loadings will work.

If I were you, I would try to get over the notion that you are going to take your '06 elk hunting with 500 yard targets in mind. Unless you are planning on hunting on total windless days, which are rare in most elk country, wind drift must be taken into account, and understood. i would suggest finding a big prairie dog town, hit it on a windy day, and get a sense of what wind actually does at ranges of 200, 300, etc. ranges. It will make you a better big game hunter, in my experience. If your quarry is found in deep timber, then it's a whole different game- I've killed more elk in timber than in wide-open meadows or fields, especially later in the season when they have been pressured.
I would also ditch the 4-18X scope, and mount up something with less magnification and lighter weight. You don't need Mt. Palomar to go elk hunting.
If you prepare for shot opportunities out to 300 or so yards, in my own personal elk hunting experience you will be ready for the vast majority of situations afforded to you, if you are lucky. I have hunted and shot elk for most of my fairly long big hunting career, and can only remember two that were taken at ranges in excess of 300 yards, with the rest all taken from 50 yd. to 300. In that time, I have never had to track a wounded elk, but I always take what I regard as a certain shot.

Colorado is a great elk state, but keep in mind that hunter success is around 20%- if an opportunity presents itself, you'll want to make the best of it, and a lot of factors are way more important than bullet selection.

Welcome to the fire. There’s a lot of good information here. I’ll add the following:
• It’s hard to find bad 30-06 ammo, but some of it is better than others. Test a bunch of loads for accuracy and velocity, then pick the one that gives you the best combination of the two.
• You’ll definitely want an accurate load, but remember that the vital zone of an elk is as big as a toilet seat.
• Chronographing is vital. Some loads WILL run slow in your rifle but you won’t know which ones until you clock them.
• Don’t ignore standard load like the Remington CoreLokt. There’s a reason that they’ve been around for decades.
• Shot placement matters. Some bullets need to go into a shoulder to do their best work.
• Barnes bullets penetrate deeply but they need velocity to expand. You can drop 1-2 weights (down to a 150 or 165 from the 180) in the 30-06 and still get plenty of penetration, plus you get more velocity. The 180 Barnes might be best in a 300 magnum.
• Knowing your drops beyond about 250 yards is important, but you also have to know how to read the wind.
• Whatever physical condition you’re in now, improve it.
• A 165- or 180-grain Nosler Partition is never wrong in the 30-06, but chronograph them first. Some factory loads run on the slow side.
• Once you choose a load, buy an entire case so you get the same lot number. Ammoseek.com finds the best ammo prices.
• Check out the elk on display at Cabelas and compare them to the deer you’ve killed. Nearly all of them are trophy animals, but they’re not as big as you may have been led to believe. Study them and get a feel for shot placement.
• If you’re really serious about shooting past 300 yards, get a rangefinder. When you look across canyons and mountains, things look different than they do when you look across farm fields and rolling hills covered with deciduous trees. 300 yards is a long poke, and you need to know the exact range.
• Get good at fast offhand shots inside of 100 yards. The only shot you get may be in the timber.

Again, welcome to the fire.

Keep us posted.


Okie John

That was horrible reading.

Shoot, Thanks for pointing out the incorrect nomenclature of the TSX...This is what I meant by being a stout bullet (not core) 😎

I've shot elk up to 435 yards (rangefindered) with a 165 grain partition. I personally feel that the 165gr bullet and the 30-06 is a match made in heaven. A lot of folks go heavier, 180 gr and up, but I don't see a need for it. If you feel the need to go heavier then go 35 Whelen or get into the 300 mags. A lot depends on your sensitivity to recoil. Heavier bullets, heavier recoil. Less flinch is a big deal when you get out to 3-4-500 yards. Everybody already knows this but few really and objectively think about it.

^^This^^.

168TTSX out of my 06 in my preferred Elk medicine.

Thanks to all of you for your constructive feedback. I have gleaned a great deal from you all and intend on applying a fair bit of it. I'm going to hit an indoor range and shoot 4 different loads I've picked at 100 yards. I'll pick the one that groups best out of my gun and then buy a case of it (resounding them here) and then shoot every week (or as much as possible) this summer and into the fall to get comfortable at various distances. I am going to shoot off-hand, off my pack and I think I will invest into shooting sticks as well, of which I will practice with.

I think the quote that took the cake on this thread was both comical as well as very thought provoking. That quote was

I'd suggest picking the best flying bullet at 200 not 100. At least from what I've seen, that's where I see things get more visibly not grouping.

For example, my wife's7-08, with 3 different bullets the groups at 100 were roughly the same. At 200 one of the bullet groups exploded WAY out of whack. Consistently niether of us could hold tighter than a 6 inch group at 200 off a bench with sand bags with that one bullet type. The other 2 stayed tight.

That's also good feedback. I assume though if I cant get good groups at 100 I will certainly see even worse groups at 200...or am I assuming incorrectly? I was thinking the indoor 100 yard plan would help me vet the list and then take the ones that group well at 100 and shoot them at 200 and then 300. Once I find "the one" then try getting comfortable with 400 yard shots.

Of those 3 bullets, the only one I've used is the AB. I shot a bunch of deer and elk with them, then quit using them because they blew up and wasted too much meat. They were highly accurate, though. I was later assured here on 24 Hr that it was a factory problem that had been fixed. So, I gave them another chance this fall. I shot a cow elk and left a good amount of ground meat on the hill when it blew hell out of the rib cage. It's highly effective in putting an elk on the ground but the meat waste is large.

+1, ..... but someone will compose a lengthy essay.

I've only killed 3 cow elk here in Utah. My "average" is 190 yds! One in medium aspen (135yds) one in fairly open timer ( 200yds) one high up on a knife ridge (250yds). The wind is my biggest boogerman, and he has "got me" several times, ha. As mentioned, a few days out on a prairie dog shoot "will educate a man quicker than you can say skat!", ha. Antelope hunting? My furthest shot was 347yds, but it didn't need to be. The rest I have shot from 50yds, 150yds, 300yds and I "missed" one old confused doe antelope around 500 yds with a hot, 6mm/284 wildcat. "Four times", the wind blew it over, and under and one way off to the side! I quit before I gut shot the poor thing, went around the end of the ranch and shot one at 150yds. I have also had the wind blow my bullets 6 feet to the side on 5 different pronghorn bucks (300-350) one day. Where I was at, the wind was "slight on my rosy cheek". Out where they were at, on that short grass prairie, there were "no wind indicators". That was with a 280 AI and a 150NBT. I finally slipped up on a 15 1/2" buck behind a snow fence and popped him at 250yds. So, I think you should "re-think" shooting 500yds...with anything, ha But that's just "me". You have fun though, that's what's really important here.

PS The Vortex 168TTSX shot under an inch in my friends Browning BAR 30-06. I was with him when he shot a Eurasian hog ( 200#) right at 50yds and it opened fine yet didn't ruin any meat, and boy, do those things have some good meat...its "almost " steak, not white pork. The 165s are waaaay plenty in the old 30-06. Just my .02!

I regularly shoot my 06 at 400 yards.

Taken elk at about 60 yards and then at about 70 yards. Used a .45-70 on the second one.

Practice practice practice. And be ready to shoot from awkward positions while physically exhausted.

Have fun

-jake

Only one person mentioned it, but I second the opinion: ditch the 18x scope and get something smaller and lighter. Elk hunting is a rigorous activity, and lighter weight will benefit you. Also, the possibility of having it set for a very high magnification when an elk appears at 60 yards is one point of failure I would, for one, prefer to avoid.

If you're determined to use that particssular scope, set it for 4x, 5x or 6x and put a piece of tape on the magnification ring to remind you not to change it! Then practice at that chosen magnification and get used to how things look. You can do very well at 400-500 yards with 6x magnification...indeed, some very experienced elk hunters go afield with a fixed 6x scope, which is lighter, simpler, and less likely to fail under tough conditions.

Best of luck!

That's true...IF your eyes are still young. Mine aren't. The rifle I hunted with this year has a 4x scope. I was working in to a large herd and wondering if I could see well enough for a 300+ yd shot when a cow came out from behind a tree at about 75. I quickly decided that she's was the best eating one in that whole herd. I've done some shooting at 300+ with that scope and it's not easy. A 4" bullseye at 300 is pretty fuzzy with a 4x.

pretty much what i would have written, but this excellent summary was posted first!

Agreed... and I'd skip right on past Berger.

I'd also look at 165 Accubonds, 180 Hdy BTSP, 180 Partition's, and a plethora of other factory offerings including the 180 Federal Blue Box. The 30-06 isn't especially hard on 180 bullets, and any decent Cup and Core bullet will do fine. I'd not worry about BC inside 500 yards.

If going TTSX, I'd drop down in weight to a 150 or 165 at most.

The 30-06 is the classic elk round... good luck.

I did a cull once and used a .270 and .30/06 side by side on many dozens of animals using a range of factory and handloads for each.
In the end I found the .30/06 had the higher percentage of instant drops between the 2 cartridge but the surprise for me was that it didn't matter weather I was using pip squeek factory loads shooting 2-300fps under hand loads, the results were still favoring the .30/06.

I put this down to a caliber difference and wound size being the distinguishing factor.

This simply means I don't care what the bullet and load is, if I have a .30/06 in my hand, I have already been impressed.

To me the first consideration for hunting should always be terminal ballistics over aerial ballistics - just because you can hit something at six or seven hundred yards, doesn't mean squat, if the bullet doesn't consistently and quickly kill the animal. So if you are concerned with long range, I agree with JG Raider - both Barnes and Nosler have long-range versions of their respective 'flagship' rounds, the TTSX and the Accubond.

After speaking with a Barnes tech rep, I was surprised to learn that the mettalurgy/bullet composition of the TTSX and LRX is relatively unchanged and differ only in the shape/BC. Further, I was told that the minimum impact velocity across all caliber for both the TTSX and LRX is in the range of 1750-1900fps (smaller caliber to larger caliber) so I would assume 1850 or so for the 308 bullets. My personal experience with Barnes TSX-TTSX-LRX has been mixed in that I'm of the opinion, their expansion performance is just as dependent on impact resistance as impact velocity - in other words, I've lung shot a deer at calculated impact velocities of 2500+ consistently resulting in clean pass-through, even after impacting rib bones; however, when shooting through the shoulder(s) the bullet always performed as designed.

Nosler states the impact velocity for In the regular Accubond, as well as the Partition and Ballistic Tip is 1800fps. However, for the long-range Accubond (LRAB) the minimum effective impact velocity 1300fps with no maximum velocity listed. That gives you a lot more versatility - and much more effective range than the Barnes. I (or family members) have shot two deer with LRAB bullets (6.5-142gr) but more with regular AB's in 25, 6.5, 284, and 308 and all mushroomed well with soft-tissue hits as seen by the significant wound channels. I have not heard or read anywhere that the 'softer' LRAB's have performed any less than the traditional.

I can not speak for the Berger bullets as I have not done enough research to be comfortable with the "grenade" effect of their bullet line - not putting it down, it's just not something I know enough about to put my reliance on; however, it goes without saying that everything being equal, the Berger line of bullets are very accurate and many swear by them.

To summarize, I would recommend the 168 Long Range Accubond - it's 1.39" long with G1 BC of .525. If your rifle has a twist of 12" or quicker, it should stabilize well in your 30-06 if you are handloading. If you are looking for loaded ammunitions, Nosler sells this in their Trophy Long Range line with the ballistics below:

Yards MV (FPS) Energy(FT-LBS) Drop(Inches) with 200-yard Zero
MUZ: 2800 2924 -1.5
100: 2652 2623 +1.8
200: 2504 2338 0
300: 2360 2078 -7.5
400: 2222 1841 -21.7
500: 2088 1625 -43.5
600: 1958 1430 -74.1
700: 1834 1254 -115.0
800: 1715 1097 -167.9

How many elk have you shot?

None Brad. I was not speaking from any position based on experiences shooting elk; I clearly said than my only experience with two of the bullets mentioned was with deer. I offered an opinion based on the ballistics involved. Sorry if I'm out of line with that.

Two things: Maybe 3.

1. Fire your rifle for group and drop (don't depend just on the charts) out to what you consider acceptable range (500 is a loooong way- I've done it on the open tundra) under simulated field conditions and positions). Then recalibrate your thinking to what you and your rifle can actually accept ethically, from field positions.

I have an '06 that bench shoots 3 into an inch at 300 yards. with a good rest - that's a thousand yard gun - in my hands, with a good field rest, on game it is a 500 yarder....

2. Get a good rangefinder. Nothing below an "800", and waterproof. 1,000 or more is better yet. Those are generally the maximum ranges they will work on reflective targets under very good to perfect conditions

And remember the rough drop rule for most big game cartridges. With a 200 yard zero (or a bit more), It is 8, 24, 48 in hundred yard increments, 300-500 yards. You likely won't have time to consult a chart taped to your butt. Stock, that is.... . 8,24,48 is real easy to remember, and an inch or two either way from the chart/actual shooting trials isn't going to make much difference in the field, on game. And it is almost perfect for the '06 cartridge. 8, X3, X2. (From here o. out, everything is roughly X@ for drop - of course, the farther out, the more "loose" it gets - don'tgo there....

3. If you can, get a chunk of freezer, refridgerator, or other large piece of cardboard box and make yourself a life size cut-out of an elk and play with it at all ranges. This includes using the duplex (if you have one) of your scope for quick and dirty range estimations.. shot placements for familiarization.

It is unlikely you will be taking an elk beyond "point-blank" range of 300 yards anyway, but every little bit helps.

I killed my first elk (bull) this last Nov. with a 30-06 and Nosler 165 AB at 225 yds. I was so excited I completely missed on the first shot but the second shot he went down like a rock. I had shot 200+ rounds out to 300 yds that spring & summer getting ready for the hunt. I like the 165 AB and will use the same load come this fall.

I hunt elk with a 30-06 and 180 grain Nosler Partitions with Spitzer points, hand-loaded to perform like a .300 magnum (61 grains RL22 – 2,870 fps). It might seem simpler to just use a .300 magnum but I already have the '06 and the hand-load has a trajectory that is close enough to factory loads Federal Premium 30-06, 150 grain Sierra Game King BTSP that I can switch loads without adjusting my scope.

I've only shot 4 elk, 3 bulls and a cow, 2 with the 300 Win Mag and 180 NPT's and 2 with the 35 Whelen and 225 gr NPT's all under 200 yds. I could have used a 30-06 with blue boxed Fed 180's bought on sale at Walmart for all the difference it would have made. For a new guy at elk hunting I think you are over thinking this a little. AS others have pointed out You should not be thinking of taking a 500 yd shot period, it's usually windy in elk country. Last fall Walmart was running 180gr blue box stuff out at $11.97/ a box. Could have bought a 10 box case, sighted the rifle in at 200 yds checked the zero at 300 & 400,burned 4-5 boxes on a dog town, and used the rest on elk and deer for a couple of years. That's probably a hell of a lot more ammo prep than 90% of what the others hunting elk do. KISS principle and yeah I think you need a simpler scope too. Good boots +10, Physical conditioning for rough terrain and high altitude + 100. Best of luck and most important of all enjoy the experience for what is. MB

you have gotten great advice

i have an a-bolt 30-06

i use hornady 165g superperformance these days
i have gotten 6 elk in the last few years, none went far, 3 at 400y others much closer
the abolt shoots 2 -2.5" groups at 300y w the 165's

get a chronograph
a bipod
a rear rest
a laser range finder rated to 800y +
try out at least 5 brands of ammo for accuracy
understand how a dirty or hot barrel effects accuracy
make sure there is no wind when testing for accuracy

pick the ammo from your test results

zero at 240y

practice at 300y

don't forget to use a ballistics program to see how altitude effects range and drop

when you get out west, test at 300y at altitude

limit your "on purpose" shots to 400y, you may need a follow up at longer range

if they are out past 400y, get closer, 300y (the distance you practice to) would be ideal

you will knock em dead

Of the 9 elk I have taken, 7 of them were with a 270 and 150 gr Nosler partition. The other 2 were taken with an 06 one with a Sierra boat tail cup and core, the other with a Hornady spire point. Off all of these the longest shot was 350 yards with most 150 yards or less. I have no experience with Bergers but have mixed reports from trusted friends if the shot is high velocity and short range. No personal experience so I'm sure the Noslers and Barnes would be great

How was your penetration on the hard angling shots, with the 150PT? How fast were you pushing it too? I'm just getting back into the .270W so am very interested!

Jim_Knight. I only recall two of those shots at any significant angle and both were anchored just fine. Both of those Noslers were recovered on the far side plenty of penetration. I pushed them with IMR 4831 at 2800 fps from a 24 inch Weatherby MkV

Great info everyone. Thanks for taking the time to drop in your 2 cents. Many things mentioned have been very thought provoking. Can’t wait to hit the range this spring!

30-06 is never wrong".

Some like it, some don't.

I like it.

Well, I doubt it can be considered too light, nor too much. The cartridge has earned the respect to be considered the standard. My own whim is to pair the 30-06 with a 180 Partition. Something very right about that combo to me.

I haven’t read all the replies.
But I’d go to 168 ttsx overthe 180.
Monos work better when going faster.
I’d also look at federal trophy bonded over the bergers

I shoot the 165 TTSX in my .30-06. Speed is everything with monometals. Most factory 180s don’t actually make 2,700 fps when chronographed.

Agreed. Most are 2,600-2,650 but a few will surprise you especially in a 24" barrel. Federal's 180-grain Partition load (P3006F) has clocked 2,550-2,600 in several of my rifles, even those with 24" barrels.


Okie John

I checked the velocity on factory TTSX 168 in 30/06 from a tikka.
IF my memory serves me right, it was 2770/2760 fps

If I were to use the 30-06 again, for elk, I'd use either the Nosler 200PT or 168 TTSX. If I was limited ( or just chose to use them) to factory loads, I'd try out the Superformance 165 GMX, or Vortex 168TTSX. If I could get my hands on them, some of the "boutique" factory loads; i.e. Double Tap, Buffalo Bore, some HSM loads, etc. Elk are "just the right" animals for monos, then Premiums, then heavy for caliber cup n core. This is only my opinion as I too have killed a lot of game with Remington/Winchester/Federal factory loads, mostly in 30-30 and 30-06. East Texas deer are more to be compared to pronghorn as far as being, what I call, 'delicate". Now hogs...now we are getting back into the physiology that is "perfect" for Monos. If a load won't shoot all the way through a big hog on a hard angle, you are better off using it later by shooting any elk through the ribs ( heart/lungs) on hogs, I'm not talking "Hogzilla either", nor small ones, but full grown ( preferable 250+) "To my observations", if a man is "itching" to see how his elk load ( of any suitable caliber) will do, go pig hunting (or shooting) but examine the bullet wound, penetration, etc. Its fun, plus very educational. Whats hard for me is I was raised to "only shoot that hog behind the ear, Son!" ha Its hard for me to intentionally take out both shoulders (or at least one on a bad angle).

At one time, in my first "rebarreled semi custom" ( I chose 30-06) a 23" Douglas Premium, Mod 70 FWT PF I used only two factory loads. The Hornady "Light Magnum" 180SP was available to me first. It clocked 2910fps ( 300 H&H territory) into 1 1/4" 3 shot groups. I killed my first cow elk with it. The 2nd one ( and settled on) was the Federal High Energy with 180 partition.It clocked an amazing 2970fps ( "good" 300WM speeds!) into 1" for 3 shots! Events were such that I ended up giving that rifle and 100rds of the Federal's to a missionary friend in South Africa. He ( and as a loaner to other missionaries over there) used it on Plains Game, including Cape Eland!

Now we don't see those loads ( heavy sigh) but with better bullets, we don't need them going that fast, though I "want" them to go fast, ha! In every 30-06 since ( more than a few!) for a heavy game load, I hedge my bet, so to speak, and load that 200 partition over a case full of R22...I haven't seen it use don elk, but it is one mean "hog thumper"!

Whoops, typo. The old Federal 165 load is a TSX not TTSX and it clocks 2,810 fps in my rifle. Down to my last box. My 168 TTSX handloads are 2,800+ and still trying to fine tune them.

for me, the 06' (and 308win) shooting 180gr partitions works perfectly. of the 3 the op mentioned, i'd go with the accubond. if willing to try other brands, i'd suggest factory loaded hornady interbonds or fed premium 180gr partitions. while some are confident taking longer shots, i can't remember shooting an elk past around 325yds, and the vast majority have been under 200. ymmv.

Heavy bullet for caliber plus reliable expansion and weight retention equals elk on the ground. If i shot a 30-06, I would try every way possible to make a 180 PT shoot. For that cartridge, the small bc advantage comes at a cost of case capacity. I’ll take the faster 180 PT over the “longer”, and slower high bc round. The minor bc advantage probably doesn’t even show itself until you get past 400 yds. I didn’t bother to calculate, but it’s probably 2” hold difference at 500 yds

True that.