Which of the rounds listed below would you use in my 1987 Remington 700 BDL with a 24” barrel in .300 Win Mag with Bushnell 6500 2.5-16x50mm scope—as either a primary or backup rifle for elk, mule deer, and/or black bear in Colorado at altitudes between 10,000 ft and 11,600 ft?
 
The numbers in the charts below are based on my Labradar and on sighting in 1” high near sea level here in Virginia (that’s the way I do it), but firing it at 10,000 ft elevation.

They all seemed pretty accurate. But I didn’t not get to focus on that yet, as I was rushed to get this done in one less-than-an-hour range session, and the barrel was fairly-hot for some of these. I have shot the fairly-anemic Nosler 180gr AB loads before, and they make 3-shot and 5-shot single hole groups with this rifle. I’ll go back to the range in a week and begin testing all these for accuracy, but that has to wait. Based on less-than ideal conditions, they all were within an inch or close. So, I think that won’t be an issue with any of them.

Many thanks in advance for any comments.

Whichever is most accurate and give you confidence. The numbers matter so very little. Put anyone of those through the lungs and the results will be the same.

Why not shoot a lighter bullet like a 168g ABLR . 530 B.C. and flatten out the trajectory? 168 is plenty for all the animals you listed you will presently hunt with it.

The E-Tip w .503 BC would be close to that too, and have more retained weight to carry through.

Nosler 168 ABLR 3260 fps IMR 4350 / IMR4831 / RL22 /

0 3260 3964 (-1.5)

100 3068 3511 1.1

200 2885 3104 0

300 2709 2737 (-5.3)

400 2540 2406 (-15.3)

500 2377 2107 (-30.8)

600 2220 1838 (-52.4)

Plus, it would be easier for your oldest boy to shoot with less recoil as you break him into larger calibers…and when the kids talk trash at school during hunting season, and he’s asked what he shoots, he can deadpan….”a 300 WIN MAG”, and he wouldn’t be lying, because he did shoot it at the range…they don’t have to know the whole truth…and he’d be keeping with the spirit of telling tall hunting stories.

To answer your question though, whatever the tube likes is what will get loaded up.

Hard to beat the 180 or 190 grain Accubond. I've killed elk with the 200 grain version in my 300 mag. I'd also save my pennies for a better scope.

Thanks ElkSlayer and Godogs.



I’m on the same page, but, unfortunately, I don’t handload.

I killed the deer below in 2017 with the 168g ABLR out of a 20” .308.



It was devastating. Went through more than 2 feet of deer before creating that exit wound. I was impressed.

Later, when I was resurrecting my .300 Win Mag, I pulled up the currently-available ammo, looking for a nice load with the same 168gr ABLR. I figured anything putting that out at 3,200+ fps or so would be pretty good for my wants and needs. Alas, nobody apparently loads the 168gr ABLR in the .300 WM.



I am leaning toward the 190gr ABLR for the reasons stated above. I will settle only after I shoot a bunch of the ones I am leaning toward, and make a decision based on accuracy, etc ....

The 180gr AB loads identified above, along with the old, discontinued Fed. 180gr TSX loads would shoot 1/4” – 1/2” groups regularly from that rifle.

I’m hoping that, at least, the 190gr ABLR and/or the Fed. 180gr TC loads will do about the same, as far as options go. I will start to find out when I return home next weekend.



He and his little bro doing awesome on deer with the .243s. I have had him shoot the .300 Win Mag with the Hornady Lite loads (about the equivalent of a .308). He’s okay with that, but prefers the .243 for now. Given their success with the .243 on deer so far, I want to respect that preference, while noting to him that the .300 Win Mag (including with the light loads) is a good option for him to continue to get comfortable with. Also, the 2,800 fps Nosler AB loads (overstated, as they are supposed to be 2,950 fps) basically are a 30-06 load he can play with.



I have four of the Bushnell Elite series scopes and a new Forge since I bought one of them in 2009. They have been beat up and never fail to hold zero and have very good glass. I have had them on a .308/7.62 Sage EBR M1A, on which it took thousands of rounds, including numerous 20-round bursts in five or fewer seconds; and on a 7mm Wby; a 340 Wby; and a 375Wby. They have been rock solid and never lost their zero. For example, I removed the one on the .340 and put it on the .300 WM. I got the Forge and put it on the .340 Wby. Before that, it was firing hundreds of the same CorBon 225gr TTSXs at 3,140 fps for nine years, and I never had to re-zero that scope in 8 years.

I put the Forge 4.5-27x on it because I can get super tight 100 yd groups with that rifle (see below) and I just wanted to see what else I could do further out.



The last one below is still good, but is larger because I let the barrel heat up.


That being said, those Bushnell scopes are very impressive to me, which is why I keep buying them. Plus, they have been with me through some fond experiences:





I just can’t find anything, but good, in them after thousands of rounds of super-high-recoil punishment and hundreds of miles of banging around.

Thanks SDHNTR, I was, among other things, hoping for any credible info about some of the new bullets, like the Berger VLD or the Hornady ELD-X , which I have read some dubious, but inconclusive, reviews, along with the ABLR of any weight. My own experience with the ABLR has been more positive than some and equal to others; I have no experience with the Berger VLD or the Hornady ELD-X, but there are similar concerns about them. Just looking for some performance guidance.

I would go with the Accubond even if slower than advertised. This could be a plus for a young shooter as 30-06 recoil level is the point where it gets uncomfortable to many people and starts to affect shooting precision. I would have your son practice with the light 300 loads and then hunt with the slow 180 load. This only if he is comfortable with the combination, if he is not then he would be better off with the 243 at least for another season. I have seen several instances where people thought they needed a magnum to hunt Elk and then blown a shot due to poor shooting or a flinch. A 243 in the boiler room will be more effective than a 300+ around the edges of an elk.

Edge TLR, Trophy Copper(nosler etip) or plain Accubond

The200 grain AB was all that was available back in the day. The 190 ABLR might be a good choice for you. My experience with the ABLR’s is that they required a bit more load workup with respect to seating depth. I didn’t find that to be the case with AB’s. Also, I’ve read in several threads where ABLR’s were designed for (obviously) long distance shots, from 400 yards and out. They have a thinner jacket to aid in expansion at lower velocities at those 400+ yard ranges I’ve read. That might give me concern if you were faced with a point blank, or short range shot....would they hold together on a tough old bull?

Just something to think about. Best of luck with your hunt!

BTW: drop dead gorgeous bear in your pic.

1. 200g Edge TLR
2. 190g ABLR


In that order.

Tejano, I may have been overly-confusing during my posts above.

The question at the top relates to my (and my hunting partner’s) use of the .300 Win Mag during a hunt for three species (elk, bear, and mule deer) during two consecutive rifle seasons in Colorado.

I have had my older son shoot some reduced (.308-level) rounds out of the .300 MW just to see how it worked. That was about a year ago, and he has grown since then, but this year, they will again use their .243s, as they have worked well, and I just want them shooting well for a while without flinching.











The last one was a 140-yd shot (with a shooting stick) by an 11-yr-old right where it counts:

The deer always high-five them for their success.


No way I’m ruing all of that by pushing them to full-house .300 WM shooting this early.

Oldelkhunter and Coyote Hunter:

What do you like about the 200gr Edge TLR?

Seems like a nice choice, but was hoping to find out what you like about them.

Thanks Godogs.

I have read some reviews about the LRAB not working well at close range, and realize that it is a possibility. But I shot that deer with it pictured above at about 50 yards, and it went through several bones as it went through more than 2 feet of deer and created complete destruction along the way. So, I'm open to it as a possibility. I realize that my experience might be uncommon and/or that an impact to an elk shoulder might produce different results, which is why I appreciate your comments and any others with experience with it.

Its based on the trophy bonded bullet , bonded core with a tip . I have used trophy bonded on deer and elk and when they shoot well they do a number .

Hunting buddy has used TB's and I've used North Fork extensively, both having mono bases and bonded cores above. The TB Tipped was what I considered one of the best designs available until the Edge came out - same basic design but with higher B.C. levels. I trust any of these to work at any range at which I would use them - zero to 600 yards. That's not what I consider the limit of their functional envelope, just the limit at which I practice.

If I didn't handload the Federal Edge would my top choice for elk.

I shoot the 168 gr Barnes TTSX in my .300 Weatherby and it has been a one shot deal on deer and elk at various ranges. Recoil is a bit less than 180-190 gr bullets and is no big deal in a 9.5 pound Mark V. The .470 BC is adequate for a hunting round. I’m not sold on the thin skinned long range bullets whether they are bonded or not. Happy Trails

Depends on how they are bonded, The TLR is anything but thin skinned

My group has used TTSX, LRX (and now obsolete MRX) more than any other bullet type in the last few years. Not the highest B.C. values around, but at normal hunting distances that doesn't much matter. What does matter is that right around 50% of the animals shot with them have immediately dropped straight down and none have gone more than a few steps. No bullets recovered from animals shot, regardless of caliber or weight (.257Rob/100g, .308W/130g, .30-06/168g. .300WSM/165g, .300Win/175g and 180g). I've put two lengthwise through mule deer, front to rear.

Maybe not the best choice for low impact velocities, although the LRX addresses that concern to some degree. Under around 2200fps impact velocity I am more comfortable with a design featuring a bonded lead core ahead of a mono rear, tipped or not, but can't say I wouldn't take a shot if a TTSX/LRX is what was loaded.

I’ve shot em all and have settled on North Fork exclusively for elk since 2013. Their terminal performance is other worldly. That was expected. What wasn’t expected was their accuracy. Wow! It shoots as well as any other bullet out there in my 338.

Second tightest group of 3 I've ever shot was with my then 20-year old 7mm RM and 160g North Fork. Group measured .262" center-to-center.

They have provided outstanding accuracy in every caliber and cartridge in which I've tried them, admittedly limited to .280 Rem, 7mm RM, ,308W, .30-06 and .300WM. On-game performance has been flawless near and far.

I tried the 350g FP in my .45-70 and sent loads to Mike Brady (the original developer of the bullets) for test. Mike sent me a note stating my loads were the most consistent he had ever tested, which matched my results as well, which, time and again, showed E.S. and S.D. both under 5fps.

Someone on this forum once criticized my choice of North Fork bullets as (paraphrasing) needlessly expensive 'boutique' bullets they wouldn't use do to the B.C. values. I thought the criticism was pretty stupid considering a) my handloads were cheaper than many low-end Remchester factory loads, and b) they worked extremely well at all ranges for my use (0-600 depending on cartridge).

When Mike sold the North Fork business he sent me a big bag of 7mm 140g Hollow Point prototypes. I drove one from ham to sternum on a buck mule deer. Although I shoot a lot of TTSX, LRX and AB in various flavors, the North Fork remain a favorite in my 7mm and .308 caliber rifles. They don't just work, they work very, very well.

Ever seen a prettier bullet? North Fork's are the bomb. 1968 vintage Sako 338, Bofors steel barrel. Shoots 0.4" groups with this bullet and RL-19, 2800 fps. It's a magic rifle in my hands.

I don't think it matters all that much what you choose. They are so similar the end result will be the same. We all like to split hairs but in reality if you find one of those to be more accurate, go with it and get some practice in.

Some good info on the ablr

https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/nosler-lr-accubonds-bc-testing-results.137554/

I'd find a quarter, and start flipping it, narrowing down to the last bullet standing - that's what I'd use.

And indeed, my method reflects how much I think it matters

Got a question about the Trophy Copper: I have looked for info stating the TC is a Nosler E-Tip with a groove cut, but can’t find anything. Where did you get that info? Happy Trails

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/5943109/1

Many moons ago I loaded some 190 BTSPs for a guy. He shot an elk with them, I guess they worked fine.

Nosler Custom Ammunition.

300 WIN MAG 165g Partition.

They’re proud of it. $65.90 MSRP / Box

Scroll down, 4th from bottom on left:

https://www.nosler.com/nosler-custom-ammunition-4


Ballistics:

https://fusiontables.googleusercontent.com/fusiontables/embedviz?viz=CARD&q=select+*+from+1C5o2xk_hWmBsTsTUWwoZ262XZOtOsNloF2QDW28+where+col4+%3D+23320+order+by+col0+asc&tmplt=1&cpr=1


MUZ: 3,100 3520 -1.5 -1.5
100: 2863 3003 0 1.4
200: 2638 2550 -2.7 0
300: 2424 2153 -10.5 -6.4
400: 2221 1806 -24.2 --18.7
500: 2027 1505 -44.9 -38.1
600: 1843 1245 -74.2 -65.9
700: 1672 1024 -113.7 -104
800: 1514 840 -165.6 -154.6

ETA: It's still off the shelf, and won't be as good as custom handloaded.
But...there is a box out there around that 168g to get a decent BC, and that the .30's seem to like.

SIL got his first elk with a ,300WM 180g WW whitebox Power Point. Instant drop. 380-385 yards.

I was referring to tightness of grouping in my “off the shelf” vs. custom handload, not whether they will kill.

I have used the 6.5 ABLR on three deer so far with no tendency to blow up at closer ranges. These were all behind the shoulder shots. I like the Barnes for less shrapnel and chance of lead in the meat.

The original Trophy Bonded Bear Claw was a great bullet, one of the best really, as good as a Partition but usually with more penetration. The TLR should be a good one too.

The problem is that there are so many good bullets now it is difficult to pick just one.

No need to pick just one. Probably nor even a good idea to do so.

I shoot at least two different bullet loads in most of my rifles. Sometimes the same weight, sometimes different. If I can't get one I get the other.

You are correct, though, about the quality of hunting bullets now available. The selection today is the best it has ever been. The Federal Edge TLR may be the best hunting bullet ever, at least for my purposes, although I've yet to shoot any. Barnes TTSX/LRX/TAC-TX, North Fork FP/SS (and HP prototypes), Swift Scirocco II/A-Frame and Nosler AB/ABLR/BT all get loaded for one or more of my rifles. Not much into match bullets, but have a lot of Hornady AMAX.

That said, I contend that for most hunting, just about any hunting bullet will work most of the time.

Any 180 that will shoot well.

I’ve killed a bunch of bull elk w 180 accubonds. It is my preferred bullet for elk. I’ve used the same bullet on numerous big African animals up to and including eland. Works perfect every time if properly placed.

Hard to beat a 180 AB or BT for that matter.

I’m with the others. Use what shoots best and get some range time in. All of the bullets will work excellent. If I were rooting for one it’d be the TLR, Great speed, good shape and it’ll handle bone with the solid base. The Bonded front end should open wide and be a darned good killing SOB. The Tipped Bear Claws have worked well for us in 270’s against elk, your 300 will hammer them.

Thanks to all for the helpful comments.

I agree all should work fine.

My top three favorites, in order of preference, were the 190gr ABLR; the 200 Fed. Edge TLR; and the 180gr Fed. Trophy Copper.

Being in town for 36 hours, I went to the 100yd range and tried them out for accuracy. Unfortunately the first two were not giving me what I want (I know it’s more than I need) out of that rifle. A Rem. 700 BDL I worked hard through my 19th summer in 1987 to be able to afford above and beyond all of my other expenses. I worked 14-hour days, instead of 12-hour days painting houses to be able to afford it.

It shot the 180gr TC in half inch groups, and, given that it was in the running, I think I will use that for now.

I will reshoot the other ones later to see if it’s an aberration, but, today, I could shoot the 180gr TC loads much tighter than anything else today. I ran five 3-shot groups through it, waiting about 4 minutes in between each shot to keep the barrel from getting crazy hot, and some of the groups were all touching, and none were over 3/4”.

My 12-yr-old son and I are heading to my Colorado property tomorrow, and I will be play with it there at longer range (up to 700 yds).