Have a friend who is looking into buying a 7-08 Remington 700 for target shooting. He doesn’t hunt or load his own ammo. I’m trying to talk him into a 6.5 Creedmoor but he found a good deal on this rifle. Anyhow. What do you all suggest for factory target/ match ammo.?

7-08 is a very good hunting rifle, but ain't a target shooting rifle. He will have to reload to achieve accuracy.

Butch, I disagree with that statement totally. I would say if you had a .308 and a 7mm-08 built to same standards. The 7mm-08 would shoot just as good and probably better, at distance, due to bullets with better BC's. People shoot .308 to 1000 yards and it it plenty accurate. Why wouldn't the 7mm-08 be just as good as a target rifle?

How serious of competition?

I'll probably get savaged for this, but if the guy just wants to go to the range and punch paper with the kids, Remington Corelokt will shoot some pretty amazing groups in some guns. I have a 30/06 that will put 3 180s into 1/2" or less.
If those don't shoot for him, I'd try Federals with the Nosler ballistic tips.

What specific type of Rem 700?

What kind of target shooting?

Does he expect to shoot factory match ammunition?

Well, you are entitled to disagree. Never seen any body use a 7-08 in competition. 308 can shoot well. You ask why, BULLETS.

Wasn't the 7mm08 popular with the metallic silhouette crowd?

Question for you Butch. Which should shoot better at 1000 yards? 7mm, smaller bullet, better bc, faster speed, effected less by wind. I understand there are better calibers for 1000 yards. Just asking on paper which should shoot better between the two. I don't have a ballistic calculator to run the numbers. The reason more people shoot .308 is because it has a specific class, doesn't mean it shoots better.

Well, as I said, a lot mo betta 30 cal bullets. If you follow competition you will find more 30 cal winners and probably 6mm. Most comps aren't caliber specific. I will say in windy conditions the FClass guys like the 284.
Here is a pretty good 30 cal group shot by a friend, Stuart Elliott in Australia.

I just asked a simple question that I know you can answer. Which would be better at distance, 7mm-08 or .308?

I would do my best to talk that guy into a 308 or if he was interested in really long range the 6.5 Creedmoor. Those recommendations would be based only on availability and price of factory loaded target ammo. There's no reason the 7-08 can't be a very accurate choice but he would need to load his own ammo.

Start your discussion with him by getting him to find good target ammo on the web and pricing it.

Hornady Precision Hunter 150ELD-X has very respectable BC and velocity. Federal Premium has a 140NBT load that looks pretty good.

You know the answer.
There is absolutely NO reason other than rule compliance that someone would choose a 308 over a 7-08 for long range shooting. There are plenty of good bullets in 7mm and, the last time I checked, I could only shoot 1 bullet at a time no matter how fast I pulled the trigger. LOL!

Once you are freed of the NATO rules, the only reason you don't see 7-08 more is because it is neither fish nor fowl.

I have recently convinced him to drop the 7-08 idea and either do a 308 or 6.5 Creedmoor based simply on the fact that he was doing strictly factory loaded ammo. Not that the 7-08 isn’t capable as it was initially designed and came to being as a silhouette round. It’s just that it’s primarily a hunting round now and has fell out of fashion as a target round with all the 6 and 6.5’s out there now. Thanks for the help as I wasn’t finding ANY prefab target ammo in 7-08.

^^^This^^^

I know, I just wanted to hear it from someone else........grin

I was hoping you could move things in that direction. This is coming from an owner of many 308's which I do enjoy: Now push him toward the 6.5.

Yep.

For a guy who doesn’t reload, hard to beat a.6.5 CM. Factory ammo is not that expensive and shoots great.

I have all three and for the nonreloader, 6.5 CM would be my pick.

DF

I have all three as well and I concur! 6.5 for the win!

308 of course. And no I do not have one at this time.

I know who I wouldn't get info from for now on.

You might want to check out Butch's bona fides before making that statement.

Ed

Everyone needs to buy their first.

Yes.

If I were wanting to shoot some small groups or, have a rifle I could have some great confidence in. It would be this Bad-Boy

Must be a millennial.

Too funny!
I'm way too old for that.

I had a young fella at church, tell me that rifle was the one to have. I don't take anything too serious anymore. Time is too short. Enjoy life, have a good day.

I love my 7-08s, but I don't shoot factory ammo. If you don't reload, stick to the 6.5 creed or 308 for a decent selection of factory ammo. Maybe the 6mm creed will join that list, but so far the factory loads are limited but good.

Now as reloads go, my 7-08 shooting the 162 ELD-M at 2800fps makes my quite happy.

I have and on occasion still do use a 708 for match shooting, and I know quite a few shooters that d0 to

Where are the results posted?

what results they shoot I use them in matches with good results have two 708 that will shoot with the best of them, trued 700, Hart sendero taper barrel, McMillian stock, they both wear Leopold 6.5x20 lrt they shoot one hole groups not benchrest groups but out to 600 yards my favorite 708 will shoot 1 1/2 groups

Could care less about Butch's bona fides!

Chuckle, chuckle, chuckle

There's a guy out of Canadian Texas that used to shoot a 7-08 in Highpower Rifle Competition. He even won a thing or two with that caliber (before he moved on to the 6.5-08 and later the 6X and 6XC.

David was smart enough to recognize it and change.

...just addressing the statement. If I had to recommend something to the OP for a shooter that didn't reload, with an unknown sport, with an unknown budget, I'd say 6.5 Creedmoor. If he continued to be locked onto the 7-08, I'd tell him to chase down HSM or other outfit to load up some ammo for him.

Notice he went to 6.5 mm and 6mm, not to .308................ummmmm..................grin

SIR, to give you credit, he may be using whatever. If you go back and read the choice of 7-08 or 308 I recommended the 308. I don't think David uses factory ammo either. Let's get back on topic, OK.

if you have enough money don`t buy just a Remington rifle or a Remington receiver,buy a Bat action/receiver have a good machinist that does build 1000 yd. bench guns .you will have a much more accurate rifle and the rifle will be the right weight for the light rifle class . 6.5 creedmore,6.5x284 "which has won a lot" but don`t forget the littler 6B.R. wins plenty too has no recoil and very little barrel wear. if you need a machinist who builds these bench rifles that do win plenty P.M. me. you do need to learn to reload your own ammo and use only lapua brass. niteforce target scope 42 x, your looking at $5000.00 probably to shoot well ? good luck Pete53

I do get what Mr Lambert is getting at. He's a benchrest guy, and the cartridges in the past to his standard were limited by the quality of the bullets. It was basically 22, 6mm and 30 cal for his game back when. Even in my game, there wasn't a lot of options until the bullet design and quality improved. When Jimmy Knox, Walt Berger and Cauteruccio started putting out slippery Highpower appropriate bullets, we got the AR service rifle, the 7-08, 6.5-08 and the host of 6mms. All this of course was in the realm of handloading.

Today we are in a different place. I'm surprised no one has invoked Brian Litz in this discussion. He wrote a thoughtful article on the whole 30 vs 7mm discussion. Here's a summary;
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2011/07/30-caliber-vs-7mm-for-long-range-litz-offers-analysis/

Tubb could shoot a pellet gun and kick everyone's azzz.

When you get right down to it, a hand loaded "anything" beats a factory loaded "something".

While that is still a good rule of thumb, it is now less true than it was due to the intro of the 6.5 Creedmoor.

^^^^This^^^^^

Back on track, for factory ammo go with 6.5 Creed without question.

I can't imagine why anyone would consider competing with factory ammo !?!? I guess in a police sniper competition it would be required (and the taxpayers are footing the bill for the ammo). Getting past the economics of it is - handloaded ammo will always shoot better. And NO - it doesn't have to be Lapua brass.

I started competing at a time when Leg Matches had to be shot with issued ammo which meant LC Match. There are times when I will still shoot factory ammo by choice and keep a case of Black Hills and HSM 77's on hand for that purpose. It shoots right alongside my handloads, so I never feel disadvantaged. The AMU has won shooting Federal Gold Medal, Black Hills and Atlanta Arms factory ammo. I know that BH and AA provide loadings that yield qualities we civilians are unable to achieve with our stuff. Anyone try to knock off Mk262? Marines shoot BH too.

It's just a rule of thumb, Chris.
Although I could throw cost at ya.

What qualities are they?

...150 more fps with sub-X accuracy.

Tyrone, that was to help those that think in absolute terms. Yes, factory costs more, but in the calculus of juggling life's duties and shooting or not shooting a match, it's worth it for me.

Interesting points,all. I owned a 7-08 a few years back. Just a plain vanilla Remington 700 CDL,wood stocked. It was the most accurate hunting rifle I had ever owned at that point. I loaded 145 Speer BTSP with W760 and CCI250’s. It wore a mid grade Bushnell 3200 I think. Far from fancy or expensive. I adjusted the trigger but that was it. At any rate I could consistently put three shots into one ragged hole at 100 yards. I know that the Creedmoor is the darling of crossover cartridges and I’m one who will sing it’s praises as well. However the 7-08 is a fine cartridge and quite capable of fantastic accuracy. I know that it was designed originally for target and silhouette shooting but can’t believe that it has been completely thrown out of the target shooting circles and abandoned. I’ve shot plenty of 7.62/308’s and quite honestly would take a 7-08 with well loaded 162’s any day of the week for punching paper. Not sure what happened and why there isn’t any factory ammunition for it. I’m thinking that the Creedmoor has taken all the thunder and the 308 is sticking around because of it’s military heritage. All is moot though IMHO as none of the three are going anywhere. All are well established and are proven quite capable at the range and in the field. I’m just going to keep shooting my little Creedmoor until the barrel falls off and tell anyone who will listen how great it is.

+1

DF

Again, could care less!

CHUCKLE,CHUCKLE, CHUCKLE!

I have no clue, but is the 7x08 as inherently accurate as the 308? Plenty facotry ammo in 308. How much proven 7x08 match ammo is there out there? I have no clue.

Butch said to get the most out of the 7mm you would have to reload....Guy doesn't

I"d lean to the 6.5 or the 308. In that instance at least.

But there may be top notch berger/scenar/amax type stuff out there for the round.

I think they say a fool is born every minute. This probably proves it.

No points to be gained here, disrespecting Butch...

DF

Guys, he is entitled to his feelings.

Entitled to his feelings, maybe. After all, this is the Fire.

But, not fooling anyone who knows better.

IMO,

DF

fools abound and he can enjoy that as needed.

Ya,'ll get off his nutsack. We have disagreed on the subject at hand. I have not disrespected him at all, just trying to make a point. I have had this discussion since this thread started with some other local long range shooters and asked them the same question I asked Butch. They all said, "Out past 600 yards I would go with 7-08, inside 600 yards you won't see a difference. Why is it in F-Open, when you can shoot any caliber you want to, there are usually NO 30 calibers? At our match's, a straight .284 usually is 1st or 2nd place. I guess there are some good 7mm bullets. The best long range shooters around here only shoot 30 caliber when a class requires it; Palma, FTR or the like. They all go to 6mm or 7mm when they have a choice.

Bottom line: No one would EVER choose a 308 for long range shooting if they had the choice of nearly any other cartridge.

The trend seems to be in the other direction, i.e. 6.5 and 6mm. With those, lower weight, high B.C. bullets seem to work very well. Very accurate, good LR performance, low recoil.

DF

brinky,

If he just wants to shoot targets, why not a .223? Low recoil, and good ammo selection. A heavy .223 is a hoot.

Jason