Are a bunch of ambitious MOFOS!

Just got done depriming about 250 pcs of range pickup - figure I can reload it for blasting ammo with that box of 55gr FMJ blems I recently picked up. But jeez is this looking to become work. Now I need to remove the crimp and trim and......

Anybody that is doing this to resell this crap deserves every stinkin' penny they are asking for it!

Kaiser Norton

Agreed. I wouldn’t bend over to pick up a piece of brass for what some sell it for.

Glad for you that you have more money than sense, if it wasn't for guys like you I wouldn't have the ammo supply I do. No, it don't bother me at all to reload or pick up your brass. But god damn it quit being a cheap ass and stop buying that steel cased crap. Have a nice day. MB

+1.

It makes me smile to come home from the range with more brass than I got there with. I will even look through the trash cans sometimes.

+2

No need to trim it.

Dillon is your friend, for both their primer pocket swager, and progressive presses.

Reading comprehension seems to be even lower than normal today on the fire.
I didn't say I don't pick up brass, I said I wouldn't bend over and pick it up for what some sell it for.
I’ve sold about 6,000 pcs. of .223/5.56 brass here in the past few weeks.
How many have you go-getters picked up and made available?

Just finished converting 556 brass to 25-45 brass.

300 pieces that needed to be de-crimped with the Dillion and then trimmed.

I use a Lyman trimmer that i have turned down the shaft to fit my 1/2 drill.

Turn it slow and just get them 10 or 20 at a time.

Thing is to take breaks so you don't screw up.

Last time i got tired of trimming was when i was doing a 1000 for someone.

over the years......

I've gathered more 223 brass than one man needs.....

Sold some..passed some along.......

My two 223's......a Savage Predator..and a heavy dog gun in 223 Ack Imp...yep Savage target action

Much of my 223 brass went into my 20-223 (aka 20 Practical)

But thats another subject......

Got a half of a five gallon bucket of mil-spec brass all cleaned, sized, and decrimped ready for the Dillon 550. Meanwhile I have a little smaller amount of Lake City stuff that I actually use.


And I still can't help myself from picking up more at the range whenever I see it laying there.

I have a thirty gallon drum of Lake city brass that needs prepping to reload. I get a hundred here and there when I have time. I enjoy fooling with it. I’ll have plenty to reload when I retire.

I agree, that's why I refuse to pick up LC and the like. I only pick up commercial brass, but then you also need to be aware of which ones crimp their primers. I've had good luck with PMC and FC range pickup, but have found some FC with crimped primers as well. I toss those in the scrap bin..

+2. I picked up 1200 pcs of good commercial 223 rem brass a few years ago and I'm still shooting that chidt. Works great, produces very accurate loads and the brass is FREE!!!!! Why not pick it up...??


There will be someone come along shortly saying we are stupid for picking up and using range brass because his buddy blew his face off or something along those lines. I say bullchidt. If his buddy knew what he was doing, it would have never fu cking happened...

Only complete case separation I've ever had was a .223 tracer reload during a evening MG shoot. Got it out jamming a .357 pistol brush pulled inside then pushing from muzzle. But range .223/5.56 pickups are less likely overstretched (which is why they separate) vs 7.62x51/.308 bulk purchased.

Judging from other threads/posts most folks use headspace dies to assess reloaded ammo or sized cases. You can use the chamber of your rifle for that. I use my Wilson headspace dies to assess bulk and/or range-scrounged unresized cases. Not so easy to do with your chamber. Looking for badly overstretched pieces to cull. Do it by feel while occupied with something else. Like a Hallmark movie your wife wants you to watch with her.

It's easy to believe you need a SB sizer if you're not culling badly overstretched brass. But that's begging for a separation.

There are many gizmos that will decrimp primer pockets. Used the Dillon, RCBS, but often all I need is Dad's ancient C-H. Swage, not ream.

The decision to load .223 is personal. No right or wrong answer for everyone. Too many variables.

If you have the right setup, You can process a 1000 pieces in about an hour.. But I won’t bore you guys with my setup, someone will be along say oh all you need is a rcbs press. I will say my setup starts with a Dillon 650.

There's some real nice attachments for the 650.

I wish I could get the primer pocket swagger for the 650 for my 550. From what I've seen, it's a really sweet setup.

Doesn't everybody?

MM

That swager is well worth the money.. I also use my buddies Dillon trimmer to.. so I resize, swage then trim all on the 650.

How come peeps don't leave the good stuff on the ground at the range? You know, .44 Mag, .38-55, .30-30, .45-70, 7x57, .250 Savage? Stuff like that. I NEVER see any of that layin' around. -sniff-

not only do i reload 223/556 but i form 300bo, and 25-45 sharps. lots of work but lots of satisfaction too.

I don't probably reload as much as most on here does, but that LC brass is very good brass. I ended up getting a primer pocket reamer that screws into my Frankford Arsenal brass prep machine and the crimped primers are really no more trouble to deal with than just cleaning normal primer pockets. But I do understand if people think they aren't worth the trouble. I've been prepping about 50 -100 a day every morning when I get home from work. Kind of helps me unwind.

What tumbler media are you using if you don't mind me asking. I've been using corn cob media I probably bought a large supply of 20 years ago and my brass never looks that good.

Heck yes I reload it! I picked up some Norma 223 brass a couple of months ago. I loaded it for my BIL's bolt action. I bought a Dillon 600 primer pocket swager.

Been loading it even when it was cheap to buy.

Reloading .223/5.56 ?? Like a possessed mad man. Let the revolution begin.

kwg

Tell it.

Lol.

If I order the RCBS primer pocket swagging Combo2, will I hate myself in the morning for cheeping out?

38 bucks vs 110 for the Dillon.

Yes, and I say that only because I have the RCBS and don't even bother to use it, because I still have to shave brass after running cases through.

Yes, as many have commented above. It is slow and tedious and after swaging many of the cases will still need to be chamfered. If you're going to cheap out use a drill and a primer pocket reamer like the Hornady.

I believe the RCBS does chamfer in the same step?

I had the original RCBS swager and it didn't do a good job of completely removing the crimp. Maybe the newer model will work better.

No, not yet but gearing up for it.

Hadn't thought about, but, with crimped primers do I need anything besides FL die, such as depriming in a separate opperation? Need spare pins?

(Got the crimp removal plan covered.)

I've avoided this until a certain price point which has become a reality!

Buy the Dillon 600 and save in the long run. I didn't. Gave the RCBS kit to a friend that just started reloading and bought the Dillon. The Dillon is much better IME.

Boomer, IME they usually come out easily. Sometimes it seems the foreign brass is crimped heavier, or that might be my imagination.

Spare pins are never a bad idea though.

I have been working on reloading a bunch of my range pick-ups for the increasingly likely SHTF Scenario.

How do you guys decide on a powder charge when running spherical propellants?

Start loads? Halfway between start & max?

I prepped a thousand pieces of LC brass, laboriously one at a time, loaded them with the CFE-223/55 Hornady the AR likes (on a single stage press no less), packed them in ammo cans and stashed them away for a rainy day. Haven't touched the AR in a couple years now. Actually thinking about selling the thing. If push comes to shove I think I'm more comfy with my Garand anyway. I'm too old and gimpy to run and gun with an AR- I'll hang back and lay down cover fire for those who can.😁

Most of my .223 shooting is with a Browning single shot. For that I stick with Lapua brass, Berger bullets and load with LE Wilson straight line dies in an arbor press. Takes all evening to load a couple boxes, but the dividend comes at the bench when that rifle regularly delivers insanely small groups.

An AR and 1000 rounds of ammo would make for quite the package deal right now! I'm sure you could at least recoup for the loading time.

Depends on what I'm trying to do. If I need NATO-spec ballistics I buy the ammo. JMO, trying to duplicate M193 strikes me as a fool's errand. Some of my surplus chronos 3400 fps from a 20". Not going to try that with bulk once-fired brass. For MGs, plinking, and nothing I'd want to get hit with ammo a starting to middle charge behind a 55 gr fmj is gtg. As for which powder, tough to beat H-335 behind 55 gr fmjs. 24 to 25 gr will reliably cycle any gun I'd bet my life upon.

748, BLC-2 would get the nod for 62s and up.

Old fart such as I am, not up on the latest/greatest copper fouling removing, temp-insensitive, cleans your dentures while shooting powders. Maybe they really are better?

I did classic load work up for my bolt gun, found accuracy in it and tested in the AR's; accuracy and function were both good enough for my purposes. IME 95% of maximum has been a good place to start.

Appreciate it. More stocking up than anything for now. I'll get a few spare die parts rounded up for the long haul.

The best thing I've found for crimped primers is the Lee Depriming die. That thing is tough. Mine has deprimed thousands of crimped .30-06 cases and a huge amount of 5.56 crimped brass.

It has survived the occasional Berdan-primed '06 case. Helps keep my Garand and O3A3 fed.

I think you should at least take a look at it.

Have one and will plan on comparing it to a single operation on different lots of brass. Getting a pretty decent collection, not quite a lifetime supply - if I go long - yet still no "mixed batches." All just in case.

Mentioned in a powder availability thread that lately I have been heavily mining old threads for information and dang there's a wealth here on the 223 and 5.56!

Thanks men!

I bought the RCBS swaging setup back during the Obamascare. Just in case I needed it. I recall trying it out, and being less than impressed with it's performance. At the time I was sitting on about 1500 new WW cases, and about 2000 bullets, so I felt that I didn't need to stress too much about reloading pick-up 5.56 brass - but I could if I had to. With the radical shift in today's political climate, I'm a bit more concerned about being able to utilize any case I have, so the RCBS unit is back out. And still underwhelming. I'd say I'll have to chamfer the pocket of at least 70% of the cases processed with it. I also have been running the RCBS primer pocket uniformer (made for their automated case prep center) in my cordless drill. It does the job of cleaning up the bottom of the pocket, but isn't cleaning up much of anything from the sides, which is where the main portion of the "swaged" crimp is. A couple quick twists with a neck chamfering tool seems to clean up the pocket's edge enough to seat the primer properly. Without that step, though, it's 50/50 as to whether the primer will seat.....

Kaiser Norton

Kaiser, thanks for the feedback.....

Spent a few minutes tonight counting brass that needs to be swagged,

More than enough brass to justify the cost of a good unit.

I've said it before, I'm too broke to be buying cheap crap.

You guys hyping the Dillon, I'll let you know, one way or the other.

Without looking at the Lee, I’m confused. Does it remove the crimp after the primer is pushed out?

I’ve sized/deprimed literally thousands of 5.56 cases without ever losing a pin to a crimped case. The problem is not removing the primer but removing the crimp afterwards so you can reprime it. This is where the Dillon Super swager comes in.

No, it does not remove the crimp but it is robust enough to punch primers out without the decapping pin needing constant replacement.

I've never tried 5.56 on a regular decap setuo, but the milsurp .30-06 cases would break numerous decap pins.

God forbid a Berdan-primed case...

I remove the crimp with a chamfer tool, but enough people talk about the Super-Swager that it's something I might think about, 'specially in auto-eject.

Like I said I’ve never broken a pin on crimped brass and I have been using the Dillon Super Swager for several years.

But I just wondered if I was missing something on the Lee.

Loading crimped brass is not taboo, buy good tools and use them. Most of the LC and especially IMI brass is good brass and you can load better ammo than you can buy, that’s why I’ve reloaded everything I shoot except rim fire. It’s never really been about saving money with rifle ammo anyway.

No, it's just a depriming die, and tough enough to survive a little mishandling, i.e., a Berdan primed case that had slipped in there.

I've had several RCBS pins give up on milsurp .30-06 brass, got the Lee die before I started loading 5.56 in large volume so just use it on both. I haven't had an issue with decap pins since. I've used it on thousands of IMI, CBC, and LC cases in 5.56, and they seem to deprime with a lot less effort than '06s, so I might could get away with using the Redding .223 dies I have

A secondary reason for the die was some of the '06 cases I used to get had corrosive primers, and the salts persisted enough I would wet tumble them to avoid corrosion in some out-of-the -way spots in my Garands. I haven't run into any of those cases in the last few years, most recent batches were LC late enough to be non corrosive.

After the initial deprime/decrimp operations, I go back to a normal f/l die.

I've not had any issues (thus far) decapping my 5.56 brass with my Redding .223 die - I can feel that it's taking more force to perform the task than your average .223 case, but the decapping pin seems plenty robust enough. I don't feel any "flex" in it or any other indication that it might break/give out. I've never done any crimped military brass for other cartridges, so I can't speak from experience as to whether the crimp on the larger casings is tougher to break through - though I do think i have a bag of 7.62 NATO stashed away somewhere......

Kaiser Norton

I pick through the range brass, keeping the commercial cases. I have more prepped cases than I will ever use.

Like it or not, LC is some of the best brass you can get. Just have to deal with the crimp, but that's a one-and-done thing.

I agree. It is high-quality stuff, once you prep it the first time.

I loaded 50 rounds today with CFE223 and 55gr Hornady SPs.

Are you referring to the press mounted or bench mounted RCBS swaging tool?

Seen hundreds of posts cussing the press-mounted unit. Had almost purchased such, almost, for a few years before researching. Don't see much negative about the bench tool.

I bought a LYMAN Universal de priming die.

It works on everything i have loaded so far and the only time i had problem was when some of those 2 hole primed cases snuck by me.

I broke the pin and when i called them for another they sent me 2 for no charge.

The die mounted swager has to be set up properly for it to work. If the swager goes too deep, it binds. If it doesn't go deep enough, it doesn't fully remove the crimp. I used fired primers to test the primer pockets. It took two or three small adjustments, but it was done. I tightened the lock ring and that was that.

Ocassionally, the swager binds slightly, but a light tap on the press handle frees everything. Mine is set for my Rock Chucker. If you use different presses, pick one and always use that for swaging. It saves messing with the depth adjustment.

That is a finger-pinching SOB!

One of the tricks is to feed the brass into the die with your hand, raise the swager up to it, then in the whole way. You won't pinch your fingers that way.

Definitely the way to go with the RCBS.

Steve:

You left out Step 2: ream primer pocket with some cutting tool to remove the brass that the swaging tool didn't, in order to be able to seat new primer.

I've been using this tool for many years and have removed the crimps from thousands of 5.56 and 7.62x51 brass. Never a hiccup. I just finished 1200 5.56 cases.

If I was having problems, and couldn't set up the die so it's at the sweet spot, the first thing I would look at is the swaging head. I would get another from RCBS.

i also have used this tool for years and have never had to use a cutting tool to be able to seat a new primer. the whole premise of swaging is to retain the brass, but move it to a dimension that is able to take the primer. if you are going to use a reamer the swaging is usless.

I have the Dillon bench mounted unit and a S1050. They both work better with sorted headstamps, the thickness of the case head web varies some and mixing some headstamps can cause some to be under swaged or bind. I shot HP rifle and needed a lot of cases ready to load so the better tools made sense.
Can't compete anymore, probably should sell some stuff in this wonderful covid economy....

That is a fair summation of my experience using the RCBS tool.

Great discussion. Pretty sure I will be able to pinch fingers in the bench tool also, so it's not a complete loss....

So you're going with the press mounted RCBS or such?

I already, and happily, purchased the RCBS bench tool. At the time I'd have gotten the Dillon, but, availability took me to the RCBS. Although reports here indicate the press mount unit works, I had literally read hundreds of curses of them and cool with the triple cost. LOL


For the apocalypse I have secured a pretty good stash of brass, primers, Speer 50gr SP and 52 gr HP, TAC and Xterminator. Have some long range bullets too. Going to try some Campfire approved generic loads and just KISS. I have 1 in 7, 8 and 9 twists, 223, Wilde and 5.56 chambers so figure hot 223 level loads aught work. Well, it's on my ample list of things to do.

I agree, you don't need to remove material with a reamer if you use the RCBS swager. That would be counterproductive. I use the RCBS swager for 308/7.62x51 and 223/556 and it works just fine. No problems with it at all.

Dan, I pick up some .44 mag, .30-30, and 7x57 from time to time. Not often, though.

I traded half a ziploc of the .30-30 brass I had for a Publix reusable grocery bag full of "almost new" holsters.

I pick up a bunch of 5.56 brass during the year. Prepping it is a decent hobby when it’s forty below outside.

I run a Dillon 600 Super Swager and about 1 in 10 cases still wont seat the primer. The primer starts but gets tight and then you cant get the shell out of the hand primer.... Is that because I should be chamfering the primer pockets after I swage them? I was wondering if I didnt have the Dillon set up quite right or if there was another problem. I use CCI Primers.

Oakster,
My comments regarding swaging were in reference to the RCBS press mounted swager. It just never quite did the job for me; too slow and not uniform results. I just acquired a Dillon 600 and processed some Lake City brass with it but I haven't had a chance to start reloading any of it yet.
I will say that while it is a faster process than swaging with the RCBS unit, it still isn't as fast as reaming and chamfering in one operation with the Hornady reamer chucked into a drilL, like I was using.
I did put a slight chamfer on the brass I swaged with the Dillon 600 using an RCBS hand-held deburring tool.

Hornady primer pocket reamer


RCBS deburring tool

I hate that Hornady tool - thing has too narrow an insertion angle and it will gouge the pockets. And it is cutting areas that it shouldn't as the crimp is just a little bit of metal at the rim of the pocket.
A 5+ flute chamfer tool makes the best cut to remove the crimp without mucking up the body of the primer pocket.

My research on using a cutter led me to believe this is the correct tool. 90 degree deburring tool. DB 18

https://www.amazon.com/PART-WEL98918-Weldon-DB-18-Deburring/dp/B07228QD34


https://www.dgisupply.com/product/WEL98918/

Got one off Ebay used for a song and a dance.

Rcbs swagging tool , three way cutter/ trimmer makes life easy
Some bitch and moan , pay .50 plus apiece and still can't find ammo , I collect and load and have several thousand rounds , enough said

I have loaded some range brass, some found, some from cheap milsurp I have shot, it sure is lot of work and you wind up throwing a lot away.

My sons bring their friends down to shoot at the farm, and the one thing I require is that I get all the brass. As a result, I've got a steady supply of it. Over the spring, I decided to try a loading of the mixed 5.56 brass, hoping to make blasting ammo for the Mini-14's.

Yikes! It was a chore! I did it on my Hornady LNL AP. I think part of the problem was that my RCBS swager is pretty well done in. I need to replace the mandrels. I've bought the Hornady reamers to try instead.

I didn't read the whole thread but I reload 5.56. I also turn some of it into 300 BO with a chop saw and a jig and also some into 6x45. I recently bought a WFT Worlds Finest Trimmer in 223.I had been trimming it with an RCBS manual trimmer and an electric drill. THE WFT is nothing short of a miracle.I have only trimmed about 150 cases but did it in about 1/3 the time.Here is a link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbkOaPodVi0

Bill

I haven't seen this one mentioned, but this is what I use and it works great. I chuck it in a drill and can go through a tub of cases rather quickly.

https://www.rcbs.com/case-prep/trim/trim-mate-military-crimp-remover-2/855.html


Seems Hornady 308 Match ammo also has crimped primers, so I use the large one on them and again it works just fine.

Just think of it as therapy 😀

That is the way i look at it.

I do it because i like it and when i am in my shop i don't get bothered.

This ^^^
I really like my time in the basement reloading ammo. I rarely get bothered.

kwg

OP needs some cheese. LOL.

When you shot up to 20K a year of match ammo who could afford that...

Its why we ended up with over 100K rounds of LC brass eventually... and learned how to deal with reloading. Plus it kept us out of trouble doing other things LOL.

I was just thinking again, I cannot recall the last time I fired a factory round. Probably a few years back actually when I bought a used 458 win mag that came with some loaded stuff, so I had to make empty cases to be able to reload good ammo with. Beyond that... might have been in the late 70s.

Other than rimfire and dove and duck loads....

You've been filming me.

Lol.

Dan, I occasionally am able to pick up a little .44 Mag, .30-30, and 7x57. But usually, the guys who are shooting that are picking up their empties themselves.

I traded off a bunch of pristine .30-30 for several nice LH handgun holsters a while back.


Now that I know you look for these, I'll send you some when I come across a good batch.

LOL, me neither.

OTOH, I got my first .30-06 a couple of years ago, went digging thru my misc. brass stash. Found 48 pieces of PMC I'd picked up at the range a few years back; killed a very nice buck later that year with it.

I will occasionally find and pick up 44 magnum brass. I scored big a couple months ago when a local ammo manufacture was at my range. He said he leaves his starline brass behind for members of the club to pick up. I was all over that 10mm, 357 sig, 300 blackout and yes, even some 44 magnum. It wasn't all starline brass, but was quality once fired stuff....and yes, he left a chidt load of .223 rem brass laying there too, but I didn't touch that stuff..

At the range last week someone left a box of Nosler 7-08 brass. Picked that up and resized to 243. So now have 20 pieces of Nosler brass. One the best finds ever.

Keep finding those acorns.

One thing nice about living on the border with California, is I see a lot of that stuff laying around...

when I use to go down to So Cal, to visit my folks, had a friend from another site, who'd invite me out to his range, when he was going to go...not only do people not pick up their brass, the range people picked it up.. nice concrete ground instead of out of the dirt.. each time I'd go, I'd come home with several hundred rounds of 6.5 x 55, 7 x 57, 257 Roberts, and plnety of 308, that I neck down to 7/08 or 260 Rem....

those people would laugh at me for doing so... I didn't care... I'm from Oregon, they laugh at ya just for that.. so WTF.. why not..

They come up here also.. last week, I came home with 300 6.5 Creedmoor cases, just having a conversation with some guys visiting for CA.. they were out shooting some sort of bolt action Rambo looking set up... each having those $2500 Vortex scopes that power range was something like 4 to 27.... one of those Razor models..they had a 100 boxes of store bought ammo with them...

they thought I was a pretty good shot, as they started the conversation... they were shooting some of the gongs at 600 meters..
with their scopes set on 27 power... I was hitting the same gongs with mine set on 6 power...

But hey, I live here...I know already were to put the elevation knob...have had plenty of practice...

they just thought I was real good...I picked up their brass.. they thanked me for that.. as they loaded up in their Lexus 460 SUV, and left as the range was closing...

Not all Californians are bad folks...

So what song did you sing, and what dance did you accompany it with?