I bought a DPMS Oracle a few years ago and am just getting around to playing with it. No prior experience with AR-15's. Found a couple loads that stay around 1". Fun to operate and I'm interested in refinements or possibly a Les Baer, or other custom.
So the rifle will shoot and might likely shoot better than I can. However, the trigger is terrible, don't like the hand guard and hate the collapsible butt stock.
I like the looks of the Les Baer in this link;
https://www.lesbaer.com/223varmint.html#$2290 for that one and being new I wonder if it's worth it? I see barrels for $400+, Triggers $200+, etc... . Adds up pretty quick and then I have to put it together properly. As a novice is this way too much or would I be paying an excessive premium for one built for me? Are there other reputable companies I should look to for a ready built, quality AR?
Love my Les Baer Super Varmit!!! It's truly one of the most accurate rifles I've ever owned! Bar None! And worth every penny, IMO.
I will look at WOA (WHITE OAK ARMAMENT) they sell good quality uppers and very accurate. I own two and they are SUB MOA. Just slap the lower and a drop in trigger and you are set, for a lot less money. My $ 00.02 cents.
Lou
2290 is worth it if you don't want to do anything but open a box and shoot.
For me, that amount of money will go to a full on custom build and a consultaion with a smith, White Oak is my preferred ,to get exactly what I want and need, not someone elses idea of perfection.
Eitehr way will work. Personally I'd take a gun from a smith, cheaper, as accurate if not more so, etc..
Thanks for the input. Wish I had more experience with different configurations. So far I only know what I don't like about the DPMS.
Got the White Oak site up. Might give them a call Monday. Can't find lowers on there site so that must need supplied by the customer?
I'm interested and with winter near it might be fun tinkering and learning. In the past I have paid premium tuition discovering what suits me.
What I'm after is a varmint rifle that will see a lot of range time. Enjoy shooting paper and trying new components. Hunting would be confined to groundhogs, crows, coyotes, and foxes.
Ring, welcome to the darkside.
$2300 buys you alot of customizing. Heck you can easily build 2 great AR for that. Do your research, have some fun, make it your own. About the only thing still original on mine is the lower receiver.
FYI,
My WOA upper with a ACE stock and nikon 2.5 x10 monarch weights around 10.4 pounds. A little heavy but I do not do a lots of walking.
I bought one pretty much identifical, but mismatched upper/lower that shoots well under an inch all day from gunbroker almost 6 years ago, $800 and am super pleased.
build it yourself. Take the $1000 that you save and buy a .22lr conversion unit for it, pay the $200 fed tax for making a silencer, do most of the work yourself, $100 pays for the local machineshop and welding parts of it. Still have $500 for Lee progressive reloader ( 500 rds per hour,about $200) and enough components to load 2000 rds of 223.
Where did all the stupid come from?
care to point out what is "stupid", or are you scared of what I'll show you up to be?
It all depends on how you want to go. I got a Les Baer Super Varmint. It's out in Missouri, with my son and grandsons now. It is easily the most accurate rifle of any kind I have ever owned. It has worked flawlessly from day one, no tinkering, no tuning, no fixing, fitting or frigging around. If you want one-stop shopping, want to just buy a rifle, take it out of the box and have a super rifle, buy one. You don't have all the options you'd have if you started with a blank sheet of paper but hey, an AR is an AR after all. You can get barrel length, twist, a few other things... If you want a varmint rifle, you're good to go. On the other hand, if you want to be the biggest tactifool at the local range....
build it yourself. Take the $1000 that you save and buy a .22lr conversion unit for it, pay the $200 fed tax for making a silencer, do most of the work yourself, $100 pays for the local machineshop and welding parts of it. Still have $500 for Lee progressive reloader ( 500 rds per hour,about $200) and enough components to load 2000 rds of 223.
This is stupid, all of it. Now show me...
It all depends on how you want to go. I got a Les Baer Super Varmint. It's out in Missouri, with my son and grandsons now. It is easily the most accurate rifle of any kind I have ever owned. It has worked flawlessly from day one, no tinkering, no tuning, no fixing, fitting or frigging around. If you want one-stop shopping, want to just buy a rifle, take it out of the box and have a super rifle, buy one. You don't have all the options you'd have if you started with a blank sheet of paper but hey, an AR is an AR after all. You can get barrel length, twist, a few other things... If you want a varmint rifle, you're good to go. On the other hand, if you want to be the biggest tactifool at the local range....
OTOH I've built I don't know how many ARs... with GOOD parts... and never had to tweak any of them....they all ran flawlesssy from the first round too.
So there are different ways to do it.
It all depends on how you want to go. I got a Les Baer Super Varmint. It's out in Missouri, with my son and grandsons now. It is easily the most accurate rifle of any kind I have ever owned. It has worked flawlessly from day one, no tinkering, no tuning, no fixing, fitting or frigging around. If you want one-stop shopping, want to just buy a rifle, take it out of the box and have a super rifle, buy one. You don't have all the options you'd have if you started with a blank sheet of paper but hey, an AR is an AR after all. You can get barrel length, twist, a few other things... If you want a varmint rifle, you're good to go. On the other hand, if you want to be the biggest tactifool at the local range....
OTOH I've built I don't know how many ARs... with GOOD parts... and never had to tweak any of them....they all ran flawlesssy from the first round too.
So there are different ways to do it.
And I would love to do it your way, Jeff, if I had a continuing need for AR's and if I had the time and resources to set myself up with a shop I'd be happy with, and the time to research who makes the best parts for particular purposes...as it is, like a lot of folks, I've got too much going on in my life to devote that kind of time and effort. It's probably more cost effective for me just to tell Les what I want, bite the bullet, and get it. My days of scratch-building rifles (and by scratch-building I mean from bar stock) are over. I miss that work, and I'd really like to get into being an AR mechanic/assembler (as opposed to builder) but life is what it is. And while we're on the topic, I want to thank you, my friend, for all I've learned about AR's, how they run, how to make them work, what works and what doesn't by reading your posts here. For me, you are one of the handful of people posting here who make this site really worth my time.
Putting the Les Baer idea on hold for now. Read and researched a bit and think I can build one myself. With winter coming it will be a fun project. Besides, Les will still be there if I'm unsuccessful.
Found Bushmaster stripped lowers last night on Brownell's sight for $49. Ordered that and a "lower receiver parts kit" for $48. Should be at FFL's later this week.
Thought about using the DPMS as a base and still might someday. For the money I'll leave it alone for now and use it as a model. Plus, I'm having fun shooting it.
Want to make it a varmint gun. Longest range might be 500 yards. Under 250 yards will be most common shots. Not interested in tactifool, in fact I need to find some good 10 round mags.
Thanks again for the opinions. Really opened my eyes to whats available. I wish more AR's were around locally to get a feel for the different options.
It all depends on how you want to go. I got a Les Baer Super Varmint. It's out in Missouri, with my son and grandsons now. It is easily the most accurate rifle of any kind I have ever owned. It has worked flawlessly from day one, no tinkering, no tuning, no fixing, fitting or frigging around. If you want one-stop shopping, want to just buy a rifle, take it out of the box and have a super rifle, buy one. You don't have all the options you'd have if you started with a blank sheet of paper but hey, an AR is an AR after all. You can get barrel length, twist, a few other things... If you want a varmint rifle, you're good to go. On the other hand, if you want to be the biggest tactifool at the local range....
OTOH I've built I don't know how many ARs... with GOOD parts... and never had to tweak any of them....they all ran flawlesssy from the first round too.
So there are different ways to do it.
And I would love to do it your way, Jeff, if I had a continuing need for AR's and if I had the time and resources to set myself up with a shop I'd be happy with, and the time to research who makes the best parts for particular purposes...as it is, like a lot of folks, I've got too much going on in my life to devote that kind of time and effort. It's probably more cost effective for me just to tell Les what I want, bite the bullet, and get it. My days of scratch-building rifles (and by scratch-building I mean from bar stock) are over. I miss that work, and I'd really like to get into being an AR mechanic/assembler (as opposed to builder) but life is what it is. And while we're on the topic, I want to thank you, my friend, for all I've learned about AR's, how they run, how to make them work, what works and what doesn't by reading your posts here. For me, you are one of the handful of people posting here who make this site really worth my time.
I TOTALLY see BOTH sides.
Funny part setting up a shop.. I have a small vise in one of the shops I used to do taxidermy in. A couple of reciever blocks and such, and a few wrenches... some punches... I"ve put them together almost in my lap a few times too...They are like leggos really.
The main thing is good parts, and thats for reliability. And IMHO the top thing, the best barrel with concentric chamber IE setup right. Screwing it on a monkey could do right and Im' proof of that.
I have had days and times where I had more money than time... well sort of but you know what i mean...
Jeff
Yeah, I know about more money than time, also more time than money. Right now I don't have much of either....My wife and I have moved 120 miles from "home" and now own two houses (one too many) and are just too busy. All my reloading stuff is packed up at the other place and I don't even know where I'll set up here. Also, struggling to find places to hunt around here, it's not like home where I could just go out the door and into the woods, or down to the river in front of the house. Also, I've got two stepsons, 12 and 13 to ride herd on....I'm retired and every time I talk about getting a job the wife just looks at me...you know, that look?
The Bushmaster with the Predator upper has my eye right now. Sportsmans Warehouse had them recently for $900 with a $100 rebate. With the difference between the Bushy and the Les Baer, I can buy a lot of ammo and a good scope. kwg
http://www.bushmaster.com/firearms/hunting.asp