I found a 219 in decent shape for sale. It has a 30-30 and 20 gauge barrel. The lever is quite a bit to the left with the shot barrel installed (didn't try the 30-30 barrel) and the lever feels mushy like there's play between it and the spindle. Everything is original and unmodified (no holes). The asking price is $495.

I always liked the looks of the 219 and the fact it is hammerless, but every one I see feels loose and spongy, and many seem to have problems with the lever. They appear to be of rather low quality. What do you guys think about them? Is this a decent deal? Are these guns worth owning?

price seems high

Have had a few over the years and I like them. Still have one. Triggers aren't perfect, but they can be accurate and are loads of fun to shoot. As far as the price, it does seem high to me as well....

Saw a minty 30-30 at the last Tulsa gunshow for $350. It was still there after the show.

I have a Sav 219D 30-30 in minty condition that I got ~ 4 years ago for ~ $125 [don't even think of competing with me or my brother for finding gun deals at a gun show].

The book "A Potpourri of Single Shot Actions" by Frank de Haas 1993 , chapter 19 is "The Savage 219 Single Shot Rifle"

I love de Haas' writings, and it seemed strange how much he seemed to dislike his Sav 219D.

I took mine apart, put in a new firing pin, and buy the time I got it back together, I hated that rifle.

And the bore was not made well.

He hints that earlier Sav 219s were much nicer.

I could see that it was built like the Handi Rifle I analyzed for strength. Twice as strong as the brass will ever be.

I worked up until no more powder would fit.
220 gr HNDY round nose moly W748 2.92" 26" barrel, 30-30, Sav 219L
Quickload prediction:
33 gr 51 kpsi 2176 fps
34 gr 56 kpsi 2232 fps
35 gr 62 kpsi 2287 fps
36 gr 68 kpsi 2340 fps
37 gr 75 kpsi 2394 fps
38 gr 83 kpsi 2446 fps brass and primer still look good
39 gr 92 kpsi 2498 fps primer very cratered, case full of powder, ball powder compresses a hair below 2.92"
39 gr 92 kpsi 2498 fps primer very cratered, case full of powder, ball powder compresses a hair below 2.92"


Here the stripped receiver sits on a copy of "Gun Digest book of Exploded Gun Drawings".

The trigger guard is made of sheet metal. Take one apart, and you will become aware.




Can you see the quality of design BEFORE the "L" model?
The earlier one's had the quality of a Stevens or Iver Johnson break action shotgun.
The L model has the quality of a cap gun.

-------------------------------------------------------

I did not like the rimfire type tip off mount, so I drilled and tapped and modified a Weaver #74 base [meant for a Sav 24, but has the same radius]



I got it all together, got a scope on it, but I just shot it into the dirt to do the work up, and I have not taken it to the range.

What does it all mean?
Take apart the L model, and by the time you get that sheet metal crap back together, you will hate that rifle, like de Hass in 1963 and me in 2010.

If you don't take it apart, you might like it.

I own two early, striker-fired Model 219's and one born a bit later, w/internal hammer, a Model 219-B.

All three are tight, and lock up with the top levers to the right of center.

I bought one of the ealy 219's with a broken FP, which took about 20 mins to replace (I've done it a time or two).

On the grooved .30-30 barrel, I simply D/T's one 6-48 hole atop the thick chamber wall for a cap scew, which abuts a scope ring to act as a recoil lug to stop scope slippage under recoil.

I've never paid more than $200 for a 219 - the last about a month ago - all found in brick/mortar gunshops.

This M219 Hornet was $100, in late Jan 2012



.

Couple of hundred dollars are all they are worth.

Hardly........... (although I just LOVE a seller with that outlook ! )

I just said I never BOUGHT one for more than $200 - selling is another story, indeed.

Since the ones I buy are usually primo, I've also been usually able to easily get $350-$400 for them.

.

I sold a 30-30 and 20 ga for $300. No spongy spindle on mine. I wouldn't pay that $495 for one

You stole that 22 Hornet.
There was one like that at Bill and Ard's Sporting good store, on the used rack, 50 years ago.

I got another Savage 219 30-30 today for $150.
The old guy I got it from at the gun show said he had been shooting coyotes with this rifle for 10 years in a field of sheep across the street from his house.

Per "A potpourri of single shot rifles and actions" by Frank De Haas, this is a later first model 219 with the alloy trigger guard, but still has the striker firing pin.

Still later came the 219B, then the 219C, and finally the dreaded 219L.

I got another Sav 219 30-30 today with alloy trigger guard and no serial number ~~ 1945


6 years and the price went up from $150 to $190, that is 4% compounded annually.

Neat little rifles, but with new, stronger Henrys now widely available for under $400, I can't see putting much into one of the Savages. Ya'll can have my share.

Stronger?

I can run Sav 219 at the limit of 30-30 brass.
I have many times bought a trunk full of guns, just to overload them.

The Handi rifle, sav 219, and ruger #1 are the best.

Win 1885 are ok.

Way down there in second place are the Rem 700, Win 70, Sav 110, Mauser 98, Mosin Nagant rifles.

SKS and CZ527 take real damage when I overload them.

The Marlin 336, Win 94, and Win 1873 are so weak looking, I am not giving them a chance.


About 15 years ago I tried to calculate the strength of a Handi rifle. My father, chief engineer of 150 engineers doing military and gun design, and another old guy, mechanical engineering professor explained to me how to calculate hoop stress, shear stress, and section modulus. These are easy calculations that I could teach anyone who got good grades in calculus. Von Misses calculations of when the case is going to fail are much much harder.

To be clear; are you saying the 219 is stronger than a 700 or 98? Regardless, any of them only need to be strong enough for the application they're used for. Another question is how they channel gas and shrapnel when things go South.

I know the Handi Rifles are pretty strong, also butt-ugly and cheap looking, and no longer available, so of little interest to me unless I stumble on a good one at a bargain price.

I have shot 32 gr Unique 405 gr cast, 45-70 in the handi rifle at what Quickload thinks is 87,841 psi, which destroys the brass as it flows into the extractor misfit.
I have shot 39 gr W748 220 gr, 30-30 in a Savage 219 that Quickload thinks is 92,000 psi, which wrecks the brass.
But when I shoot 70 gr Re17 180 gr 7mmRemMag in a VZ24 Mauser, which Quickload thinks is 108 kpsi, the brass is destroyed and the lug abutments deform and the bolt body deforms. The other bolt actions mentioned share very nearly the same bolt lug cross sectional area in shear.

I doubt your methodology is going to pass peer review, but the results are certainly interesting. Did you by any chance take any before and after measurements on the singles to see if there were any dimensional changes?

Wait a minute.
I had a paper for publication of high frequency power conversion that was peer reviewed in 1986.
But the new CEO from Rocket Research would not let me publish, because it would be giving away secrets.
I protested it was just a bunch of math I made up about the reset time voltage product across a transformer primary was possible to compliment with the time Voltage on time of a lossless snubber.
He did not care. He said it was a secret. But I was peer reviewed. The session chairman was not happy with me. One less paper delivered at his conference. The sessions notes book was getting thinner.

I took some parts off.



I planned to drill and tap



It is getting closer.

No doubt those are better-looking than any similar guns. I picked up an early 220 .410 a couple years back, purely on impulse. It had been nicely refinished at some point, and I couldn't pass on it at $145. Once I picked it out of the rack, I walked all over the store with it while I browsed just so someone else couldn't scarf it up. It's a fine walking-around gun for an old fat man.

15 years ago we were buying every broken break action 410 we could find at $50. We would epoxy and pin a broken stock, or make an new firing pin.

But those all had exposed hammers.
The inherit functionality of an enclosed hammer Sav 219 or Sav 220 is higher.

Most people do not see that, and so low priced 219s and 220s happen..... locally.

My guess is that the front half of a 410 gauge Sav 220 would go for $325 on ebay.

Which part number Lyman receiver sight is that?

I collect single shots, and do like the feel of the 219. The awkward scope mounting has always deterred me from acquiring one of them. I guess you could D&T for a receiver sight, and have a light handy .30-30 single shot

That is not a Lyman. Its a Redfield.

I`d rather put my money in a Ruger # 1 single shot

I have owned many of the earlier Model 219's and 220's. No trouble with any of them except for the trigger pull. They are getting harder to find in the rare calibers and gauges. I found a Deluxe 220 in 28 ga. a while back. It is in great condition and I paid $399.00 for it with no regrets. Anyone have one in .219 Zipper? I have been told they are out there. I met a guy that says he has a hang tag with that caliber listed on it. I would like to buy one. They are probably the best and most nicely finished single shots of the time.

My Dad had one rechambered to 30-40 Kraig by Bill Morrison. Came back in the house bleeding from putting his thumb over the top with ball ammo.

I've seen several .219s chambered to ,219 Zipper. All were rechambered .22 Hornets; Savage never made a Zipper to my knowledge, certainly never cataloged one. They tried a number of chamberings for the 219 at their R&D shop, including .357 Magnum AND Maximum, but they never sold them commercially. Numrichs bought all those R&D barrels and made up some guns from used receivers and some factory replacements they had also bought from Savage Utica after it closed. Those guns were sold out of Numrich's store in New Hurley NY and get resold occasionally as factory original products. They aren't.

I've seen 219s from that source in .22 Rem Jet, .256 Win Mag, .357 and .357 Maximum. Also 220 shotguns in .22 shot and 9mm rimfire shot. The .30-40s I've seen were all rechambered .30-30s. They work fine but they DO back right up on you! If you're shooting at an elk, you don't feel it, though. Had a friend in Idaho with one of these and he'd only bought one box of .30-40s for it nine years before I met him and had got a meat elk every year since he got it. Had 5 rounds left at that time.

Wish somebody would make the original Utica 219 again with an investment cast receiver, a D&T barrel, a steel trigger guard, and a rifle trigger. A tougher firing pin would help too.

Thompson Center tried the concept with their "Aristocrat" hammerless but it was just too complicated to operate for most of us peasants, and it balanced odd to me.

The 219 ergonomics are just right for me. All mine have had shotgun barrels/forends fitted to them, just for fun.

I made a forend for the Sav 219 I bought two weeks ago.

It has an extra sling stud far enough forward for a bi pod and shooting 30-30 long range.

Sav .30-30 came through LGS. Was clean. Priced right.
Goodness the trigger was HORRIBLE.
I passed.
Don't like .30-30 anyway.
Fleetig thought of redoing to something different.
Pops has a TCR83 in Hornet w pretty good wood.
I'll proly snag it, since he got a mini Sharps in hornet and the TCR collects dust.
But he's also got a #3 in .219 Donaldson wasp

I want em both, but aint got the funds for a double right now.